1 minute ago, Ipiggles said:

again- thats not what I said. I am not advocating bringing him here. I was comp[aring him to Hurts. It was an"imagine how good Foles would be in this offense Hurts is currently running" he would be better than Hurts. 

We know Foles is streaky, we know his limitations, and we now know Hurts limitations. My whole point is stop trying to sell me on Hurts, he isn't even Foles, and we knew Foles wasn't the long term answer. 

Nobody is trying to "sell you on Hurts". See my edit above. 

Just now, TorontoEagle said:

Nobody is trying to "sell you on Hurts". See my edit above. 

You aren't, but yes - a few in here are. My original post was not a reply to you. 

4 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

The benching IMO, was the final straw for Wentz.  The Eagles invested 5 draft picks and then $130 million to be their QB.  The Eagles then went out and drafted a QB in the 2nd round rather than a player that would have helped the Eagles be a better team.  Could have been Jeremy Chinn, JK Dobbins, Van Jefferson,  AJ Dillon, Antonio Gibson or a handful of other players who would have made the team better and helped Carson Wentz.  Instead they took a QB with the excuse you need a good backup QB when the same team has shown they can find backup QBs via FA and later in the draft.

Carson had a terrible 2020, no one argues that.  He also had a different O-Line for every game he played or close to it.  Think about that versus the O-Line Hurts has had.  While there have been injuries this year, they have been a top 3 if not the top O-Line in the NFL.  On top of that you had DP's train wreck of an offense.  

When he was benched, the smart move would have been to bench him and then bring him back in the next game.  Nope, the Eagles benched him and just handed the team to Hurts.  Yea, I'd be pissed too.  

There was also the Carson/Howie relationship.  We have no idea how it was but from the sounds of it, was a huge part in Carson wanting out.  As the GM who traded picks to draft Wentz and then give him a huge contract, you would hope that guy goes above an beyond to make sure he's happy here....not be a thorn in his side and make moves that everyone questions what he's thinking.  

The Eagles as a franchise quit on Carson more than he quit on them when it comes down to it.  They failed to build a team around him and said here you go, good luck with JJAW, Reagor and Ward. 

The popular argument is that Jonathan Taylor is making Wentz look good and Wentz is just riding his coattails to success.  Same could be said for Jalen Hurts.  This running game is keeping the Eagles going.  Without the running game and more specifically the commitment to it and the O-Line, the Eagles aren't in the playoffs. Yes, Hurts running ability has helped the team.

Taylor has 317 carries 1734 yards  18 TD

Eagles RB combined have 366 carries for 1,746 yards and 14 TDs

I'm sure Carson Wentz could have handled things better last year but at the same time there's a lot we don't know about the relationship between Wentz and the team.  Wanting to get away from a team that doesn't want you isn't quitting, it's doing what's best for you.  I'd bet my bottom dollar that Wentz would have loved to stay in Philly to win with his best friends had the FO treated him better.

 

In the end both sides wanted a change; blaming Wentz for seeking a trade is consciously choosing to ignore all the organization’s mistakes leading up to that point.  Wentz did what was best for his contract and his career.  Those who piled onto him for his play last year, then continue to pile onto him for leaving — even though logic says the team would be better with him replaced (?) — they just have a hidden agenda they don’t have the guts to come out and say

Wentz is completely irrelevant moving forward; his contract will be off the books next season, the Eagles acquired a 1st and 3rd round pick.  The 3rd round pick has already been used to trade up for DeVonta Smith.  The 1st round pick will be used at the draft (or as an asset before).  
 

The logical question in hindsight that few people ask is — given the Eagles’ lukewarm commitment to Wentz in how it all played out, why didn’t Howie have the foresight to trade Wentz for higher value and sign Foles to an extension when he had the chance?  Foles’ market value was only $22M per season, and the trade return for Wentz would have been much higher.

42 minutes ago, HazletonEagle said:

I can't stand eating stuff off the bone,  and the cartilage,  and the veins and arteries.  Most people don't think about it.  But when you are a prissy pants it can be different. 

fyp

19 minutes ago, Original Sin said:

I don’t see him lasting to rd 2 , he is my favorite S of the class ,

Agreed - he’s a bit slim, but I haven’t seen Hill hang back DRC-style or anything.

 

Just now, Bacarty2 said:

You really care that much where a team practices? lol. 

And as your second part, no they wouldnt throw a fit. They dont care lol. Reporters may care if they practiced in south jersey, because most of them live in south jersey so it may make thier jobs easier. 

OF all the ridiculous hot takes, this has to be up there. A 12 minute bridge ride is a deal breaker lol. 

 

Didn't say it was a deal breaker, I just think it's best for a team to invest their facilities where the team actually is.  Not sure why it's such a bad take.  The Penguins invested in a huge practice facility in Cranberry Township.  Not only do the Penguins practice there they they are able to host events there, which drive tourism dollars and hotel tax revenue in to the community.  

There's more to it than just saying the team practices there.  

4 minutes ago, Bacarty2 said:

NS is terrified to throw the ball in the red zone with Hurts so he has to try and do anything to gain the last yard on the ground.

IIRC, he switched up between under center and shot guy most of the time in the redzone

To me this is the biggest issue Sirianni needs to work on this offseason; it is definitely the play calling in the red zone. I don't think he is terrified throwing the ball in the RZ, we saw many attempts earlier in the season. They just turn into a more conservative offense and try not to turn the ball over. Eagles are very efficient at getting points on the board when they do get into the RZ, but I'd like to see Sirianni improve the play calling and be more aggressive there.

 

 

8 hours ago, ManuManu said:

* @Iggles_Phan You and I discussed the QB draw from the game. Early in the game, the Eagles went empty (it ended up a short pass to Quez). The middle of the field was wide open. I think Sirianni and Co. saw that and wanted to use it for a potential chunk play later. They called the draw at midfield, and I assume part of the reason was if it hit, the Eagles would have had a first down in field goal range. Unfortunately they guessed wrong, and the linebacker never vacated the middle, limiting it to a modest gain.

I get why they did it.  I am just philosophically opposed to it, unless it is a dire need situation, or a wide open opportunity.  It was neither and lead to unnecessary hits on the QB.  Hurts was actually fighting for yardage on that particular play, making it all the more needlessly dangerous.   I appreciate you going back to check it out... but I just can't be in favor of a play call like that, especially in light of the results.  2nd and 6 to have the QB fight to gain 5 yards and set up a 3rd and 1, and still sit on the outside of FG range.  Risk/reward just doesn't add up for me.   

 

In that situation, I'd have preferred to see the call, and then Hurts to audible out of it when the LB stayed home.  Or, when he sees that he's not going to get the first down... just go down and avoid the extra contact.  It was going to be 3rd down and short either way. 

 

1 hour ago, greend said:

Wait, they made the docs appointments after they kicked him off the team? Otherwise those 2 statements don't go together

Before. It’s been a lingering ankle issue he’s had for most of the season that caused him to miss some games. I’m guessing the specialist was in New York and it’s just a coincidence that’s also where it all went down. 

14 minutes ago, Waiting4Someday said:

Agreed - he’s a bit slim, but I haven’t seen Hill hang back DRC-style or anything.

 

Pickens is a beast though.

1 minute ago, wussbasket said:

To me this is the biggest issue Sirianni needs to work on this offseason; it is definitely the play calling in the red zone. I don't think he is terrified throwing the ball in the RZ, we saw many attempts earlier in the season. They just turn into a more conservative offense and try not to turn the ball over. Eagles are very efficient at getting points on the board when they do get into the RZ, but I'd like to see Sirianni improve the play calling and be more aggressive there.

 

 

The play calling is fine- the plays he can use are limited- Hurts is not a tight window quick read passer which is what is needed in the RZ, especially from the 10 yard line in.  From what I've seen Hurts either misses the open receiver, throws to the wrong/covered receiver, or has to throw the ball away when we are near the goal line.  Just the way it is.

BTW... not sure how many people saw this, but this was a fun play from D-I FCS.

 

3 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Pickens is a beast though.

Pickens in RD2🙏

1 minute ago, Freshmilk said:

The play calling is fine- the plays he can use are limited- Hurts is not a tight window quick read passer which is what is needed in the RZ, especially from the 10 yard line in.  From what I've seen Hurts either misses the open receiver, throws to the wrong/covered receiver, or has to throw the ball away when we are near the goal line.  Just the way it is.

For all his warts, it seems from a very high level view that Scam Newton is actually great in the red zone. Perhaps they could study what he does and run it with Hurts. It may have to do with Cam being much bigger/stronger, I'll admit I don't really know.

2 minutes ago, Bacarty2 said:

It's hysterical that you use that example. I know where that facility is. and my GF's cousin owns the bar next to PPG arena.

Cranberry is out of Pittsburgh City limits and is about 35 minutes from PPG Areana

Voorhees is out side of Philadelphia City limits and is about 20-25 minutes from the Wells Fargo Center.

Whats the difference?

Side note, The flyers host events there, bring in tourism there, Host tournaments, the Philly Wings(lacrosse) practice there, theres been 2 major hotels built next to the facility. ETC ETC. 

The main hub for flyers youth is also out of the Skatezone voorhees facility. My son and I play in voorhees as well as another south jersey rink

 

  

I like the tie-dyed stick blade in the bottom right of the photo.  Wish I had one of those growing up.  Roll after roll of black tape...

8 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said:

For all his warts, it seems from a very high level view that Scam Newton is actually great in the red zone. Perhaps they could study what he does and run it with Hurts. It may have to do with Cam being much bigger/stronger, I'll admit I don't really know.

In his prime I think Cam was a better QB than Hurts is today.

8 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Pickens is a beast though.

Yep , happens to the best of them , Evans does it in a regular basis 

too backers get trucked all the time , easy to pick one play , 

bottom line he is a 5 star recruit , tremendous athlete , with a clean bill of health , run like a deer , versatile , leader , he often gets his teammates in position, can get after the QB , IMO no weakness to his game 

17 minutes ago, Bacarty2 said:

NS is terrified to throw the ball in the red zone with Hurts so he has to try and do anything to gain the last yard on the ground.

IIRC, he switched up between under center and shot guy most of the time in the redzone

Or just maybe Hurts is really good in short yardage situation. 10 rushing TDs is off the charts - only 8 players have 10 or more TDs, 7 are RBs. So Hurts has more rushing TDs than 25 starting RBs! In that case, duh, do you try to punch it in with the RB or allow Hurts to do his magic.

What cracks me up are all the people here who state for a fact that a 23 year old QB who has all of 19 NFL starts can't improve. Even though he has improved this season, especially the last few games when Siri has called more plays from the pocket and off play action. If anything, Siri slowed his development the first half by trying to design the offense for him (which is what slows the development of most college QBs) instead of teaching Hurts how to be a pocket QB.

last four games:

M Jones:  58.2% 5-4  78.2 rating

Lawrence:  61.8%  1-7  61.8 rating

Tua 62.9%  5-4  81.1 rating

Wilson 54.2%  2-0  77.4 rating

Fields 58.0%  4-3  84.0 rating

Mills 68.1%  6-2  96.2 (#67 in the draft) - Watson who?

Hurts 66.7% 3-1  103.0  (last three games after the Jets, when Siri opened up the offense for him)

There's too much noise to take this seriously, but if these other young QBs can be expected to make a jump next year, same applies to Hurts, he's far from a finished product.

 

11 minutes ago, Bacarty2 said:

Side note, The flyers host events there, bring in tourism there, Host tournaments, the Philly Wings(lacrosse) practice there, theres been 2 major hotels built next to the facility. ETC ETC.  Also for connivence  and ease, a lot of teams will stay in South jersey rather than staying in Philly when playing Philly teams

It's an easier drive across the bridge to far South Philly than to drive down the Surekill Expressway.

And to the airport when leaving.

8 hours ago, ManuManu said:

Decided to rewatch the win over Washington. I watched all of Hurts’ dropbacks to see if he was actually a one-read QB. That really wasn’t the case.

Maybe it was an anomaly — I haven’t rewatched any of his other games focusing on his progressions — but he routinely went to second and third progressions when the first read wasn’t there. He didn’t really take off and run right away (not that he didn’t bail a couple of times from workable pockets).

Other random observations…

* @Iggles_Phan You and I discussed the QB draw from the game. Early in the game, the Eagles went empty (it ended up a short pass to Quez). The middle of the field was wide open. I think Sirianni and Co. saw that and wanted to use it for a potential chunk play later. They called the draw at midfield, and I assume part of the reason was if it hit, the Eagles would have had a first down in field goal range. Unfortunately they guessed wrong, and the linebacker never vacated the middle, limiting it to a modest gain.

* The Sam is an interesting position for our defense. Against teams that run 12 or 21 personnel, it’s a key position. Against predominantly 11 personnel teams, we don’t use one. I think Avery has played fairly well in that role. He sets the edge, he’s physical, and he has explosive straight line speed. I wouldn’t be surprised if the Eagles signed him to a cheap multi-year deal, but maybe because the usage is so small they decide to roll with Patrick Johnson and save some money. Perhaps ideally, the Eagles could find a guy who is more of 3-4 OLB who can play Sam in base and then rush the passer with his hand in the dirt. 

* I found it strange that coming out of the 2-minute warning our DEs were Kerrigan and Jackson. That made no sense unless Sweat and Barnett asked out. They were potentially stuck on the field because it was a hurry up situation. Kerrigan and Jackson stayed on even after Washington huddled following a complete pass that went out of bounds. Predictably, Jackson and Kerrigan weren’t effective.

I was Bishing on here during the game about Kerrigan being on field at the end as well. Gannon apparently was drawing off his inner-Schwartz for a few minutes. 

57 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Foles ship has sailed.  People need to give up on that.  He was third string for a good portion of this year.  It doesn't seem like he's been fighting to play in Chicago.  Yes, once he gets on the field he has glimpses...no doubt.  But I question his desire to be great long term.  He wanted to retire at one point.  Got hot with us during that SB stretch run and has done nothing relevant since.  Great dude.  Will forever be loved in Philly.  I never wanted him traded away from Philly the first time he was with the Eagles.  I loved him then.  But he's never lead an offense for an entire season.  In Philly or anywhere.  

Remember the initial reports were Foles for Bradford AND a second round pick. I was mildly annoyed with the news... I lost my mind when the actual trade had the Eagles giving up the second rounder.

(Also, Foles was absolutely terrible in St. Louis)

18 minutes ago, RLC said:

Pickens in RD2🙏

Rounds 2 and 3 of this draft might be loaded. I’m starting to get excited.

Metchie and Doctson might also be available in that spot. Any one of the three work for me.

8 minutes ago, Freshmilk said:

In his prime I think Cam was a better QB than Hurts is today.

Cam had one good year. And even then, as a thrower, he threw at least 10 picks every year he was the full starter. Sure, I guess Prime Cam is better than "rookie" Hurts....but that's not saying much, honestly. 

2 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Annoyed isn't the word I would have used to describe me.  

It was the most angry I’d been since the TB game.

3 minutes ago, SB52 said:

Rounds 2 and 3 of this draft might be loaded. I’m starting to get excited.

Remember, Howie’s in charge. Slow down a little.