11 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Yeah their defense was worse than the Cowboys defense in every statistical category last year. The eagles defense might not be great, but they weren’t worse than a historically bad cowboys defense last year. And the Texans still had a worse oline last year then what the eagles had last year with the rash of injuries we had. That’s saying something. 

I would also add on there’s been a report from a book that recently came out that O’Brien was trying to get fired last year.

The Texans have a multiple pro bowl LT, and have been consistently in the top half in yards per attempt rushing. Watson's sacks are as much due to his tendency to hold the ball as his OL, and while he lost Hopkins, Cooks is a 1000+ yard WR.

I don't put too much credence on QB W/L record unless they have a history of 4Q choking, Stafford will look much better in LA than he did in Detroit. But I do put a lot of credence on team offensive production b/c that's the QB's job. If you have average talent (which Houston has had on offense, not great, not awful) and you have average results, then the QB is at best good, but a far cry from elite.

This forum has historically not wanted people with massive character flaws so it shocks me more aren't against Watson.

I don't care about QB stats, look at Houston's points and yards ranking the last three seasons under Watson.

11th, 14th, 18th in points, 15th, 13th, 13th in yards.

And he had average talent, not great, not awful (better than the Eagles):

RB:  Miller/Hyde/Johnson

WR:  Hopkins/Hopkins/Cook

WR:  Fuller/Fuller/Fuller

WR:  D Thomas/Stills/Cobb

TE:  Griffen, J Thomas, Akins/Akins, Fells/Akins, Fells

21 minutes ago, austinfan said:

The Texans have a multiple pro bowl LT, and have been consistently in the top half in yards per attempt rushing. Watson's sacks are as much due to his tendency to hold the ball as his OL, and while he lost Hopkins, Cooks is a 1000+ yard WR.

I don't put too much credence on QB W/L record unless they have a history of 4Q choking, Stafford will look much better in LA than he did in Detroit. But I do put a lot of credence on team offensive production b/c that's the QB's job. If you have average talent (which Houston has had on offense, not great, not awful) and you have average results, then the QB is at best good, but a far cry from elite.

Do you really want me to go into this again with you. Because I keep bringing it up and then you disappear because I keep showing you that the rest of the oline was BAD. Legitimately PFF (along with a bunch of other scouting web sites have it similar) has had there in Watson’s years 32nd, 23rd, 20th and 23rd. So cause they have a really good left tackle and the rest of the oline stinks it makes up for the fact that 4 out of the 5 position are bad? You keep bringing up tunsil and seemingly forget the rest of that oline was freaking bad 

Also average rushing attempts per game they were 12th in 2019 and 31st in 2021. So 31st is constantly in the top half of the league? They also had the 31st most yards rushing last year and middle of the pack 4.3 yards per rush. Which really was cause watson had good rushing numbers.  And their rushing total the previous years was 14, 8 and 9. And they were really that high in 2018 and 2019 cause watson ran for 551 yard and 413 yards which without that they drop to middle of the pack

So Deshaun watson isn’t going to have devonta smith here? Is he just gone now? I thought according to you reagor was a hit so he also has reagor. you pretend like Dallas Goedert, Zack ertz, Smith and Watkins aren’t capable of being as great or good with watson. Or that miles sanders isn’t a better back that he’s had over the last 3 years in Houston. the lead backs he had in Houston the last 3 years were a broken down David Johnson,  breaking down lamar Miller and journeyman Carlos hyde. Sanders is better than all three of those guys. 

is he Patrick mahomes or rodgers or brady elite? No. However he is a top 7 QB in this league and has proven so over the last 4 years.  The only QBs I’d argue are definitively better than him right now are mahomes, rodgers, brady, Wilson. Possibly Allen, Dak and Herbert. 

20 minutes ago, Diehardfan said:

This forum has historically not wanted people with massive character flaws so it shocks me more aren't against Watson.

I'm surprised to hear lurie apparently green lighted a trade?

I mean I guess when it comes down to it owners care more about winning than they do morals.

Ray Lewis was accused of murder, Ben Rothlisberger paid off multiple sexual assualts.

One could include Vick except he did his time paid his dues.

I mean unless it's on video where it will have a negative affect on the public like ray rice knocking out his wife or Adrien Peterson spanking his kid with a switch owners just don't seem to care.

Unless of course a player gets flagged for smoking pot then he gets suspended.

Rape, sexual assault murder are all acceptable as long as they can't be verified, pot though that's a big no no cuz there's a verifiable test for it that owners can point to and say a player is a bad dude👎

 

22 minutes ago, austinfan said:

The Texans have a multiple pro bowl LT, and have been consistently in the top half in yards per attempt rushing.

There is no correlation between yards per attempt rushing and sacks.  Run blocking and pass blocking are entirely different skills.

2020, Steelers had the lowest yards per attempt, but also gave up the least sacks.  

2020, Packers 7th in yards per attempt, game up the second least sacks.

Eagles were 3rd in yards per attempt, and game up the most sacks.

2019, Tennessee was 3rd in yards per attempt, gave up the 3rd most sacks.

This is a false narrative.

The "Watson is bad" takes are something. Just a Pro-Bowler who carried a dysfunctional franchise on his back.

40 minutes ago, goeagles5039 said:

I don’t think Watson is as good as everyone makes him out to be. He could barely win with the Texans when they had far more talent than what we have now. 

He put up 10 and 11 wins when they had an average defense. The Texans stunk last season mostly because their defense was 30th in the League.  

@LeanMeanGM

Chiefs 48-10

Bonus: Sirianni gets a beer thrown at him 

13 minutes ago, austinfan said:

I don't care about QB stats, look at Houston's points and yards ranking the last three seasons under Watson.

11th, 14th, 18th in points, 15th, 13th, 13th in yards.

And he had average talent, not great, not awful (better than the Eagles):

RB:  Miller/Hyde/Johnson

WR:  Hopkins/Hopkins/Cook

WR:  Fuller/Fuller/Fuller

WR:  D Thomas/Stills/Cobb

TE:  Griffen, J Thomas, Akins/Akins, Fells/Akins, Fells

Miller was breaking down in 2018. Hyde is a journeyman rb. Johnson lol. He was done before he got dealt there. 

He put up better numbers last year without Hopkins. Also many on the blog said Brandin cooks was done after 2019 and not worth taking a flier on when he got traded to Houston. Funny how his career got resurrected with watson. Fuller also missed a ton of games with injuries over those years. You pretend like fuller was actually fully healthy all those years

Those tight ends might be bottom third in the league. 

His oline was garbage even with tunsil. It’s not just PFF that has had the texans bottom 1/3 unit every year he’s been in the league. Literally every place that gave rankings that broke down film has. Just because tunsil was really good does not mean the rest of the unit was. Cause not only were they not average they were bad. 

17 minutes ago, austinfan said:

I don't care about QB stats, look at Houston's points and yards ranking the last three seasons under Watson.

11th, 14th, 18th in points, 15th, 13th, 13th in yards.

Could you share a link to the offense PPG stats you are referencing.  I actually came up with lower offensive PPG for Houston than you posted yesterday.

4 minutes ago, RLC said:

The "Watson is bad" takes is something. Just a Pro-Bowler who carried a dysfunctional franchise on his back.

And the team PPG argument is silly.  Rams with Goff

2020 - 23rd

2019 - 11th

2018 - 2nd

2017 - 1st

So is Jared Goff elite.

1 minute ago, RLC said:

The "Watson is bad" takes is something. Just a Pro-Bowler who carried a dysfunctional franchise on his back.

Not only that it’s come out this week that Bill O’Brien was trying to get fired last year to go back to New England. So he had a bad offensive line besides tunsil. A running back who was shot before being dealt to Houston. A historically bad defense that was worse than the Cowboys. Fuller who got suspended. Cooks who before they season everyone thought was toast on the blog.  But also a head coach that wanted to get fired. And a dysfunctional front office. But sure it’s all the Watson’s fault… 

2 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Do you really want me to go into this again with you. Because I keep bringing it up and then you disappear because I keep showing you that the rest of the oline was BAD. Legitimately PFF (along with a bunch of other scouting web sites have it similar) has had there in Watson’s years 32nd, 23rd, 20th and 23rd. So cause they have a really good left tackle and the rest of the oline stinks it makes up for the fact that 4 out of the 5 position or bad? You keep bringing up tunsil and seemingly forget the rest of that oline was freaking bad 

Also average rushing attempts per game they were 12th in 2019 and 31st in 2021. So 31st is constantly in the top half of the league? They also had the 31st most yards rushing last year and middle of the pack 4.3 yards per rush. Which really was cause watson had good rushing numbers.  And their rushing total the previous years was 14, 8 and 9. And they were really that high in 2018 and 2019 cause watson ran for 551 yard and 413 yards which without that they drop to middle of the pack

So Deshaun watson isn’t going to have devonta smith here? Is he just gone now? I thought according to you reagor was a hit so he also has reagor. you pretend like Dallas Goedert, Zack ertz, Smith and Watkins aren’t capable of being as great or good with watson. Or that miles sanders isn’t a better back that he’s had over the last 3 years in Houston. the lead backs he had in Houston the last 3 years we’re broken down David Johnson,  breaking down lamar Miller and journeyman Carlos hyde. 

is he Patrick mahomes or rodgers or brady elite? No. However he is a top 7 QB in this league and has proven so over the last 4 years.  The only QBs I’d argue are definitively better than him right now are mahomes, rodgers, brady, Wilson. Possibly Allen, Dak and Herbert. 

If they trade for Watson, Ertz and Goeddert are gone after this season (money).

RBs:  Miller 973 yards, 4.6 clip, Hyde 1070, 4.4 clip, D Johnson 691, 4.7 clip. About as good as what the Eagles ran out there with Wentz. Wentz 2018-2019 is what you get with Watson.

As I pointed out, he had average talent, Hopkins is better than any Eagle WR since ??? Cooks is a consistent 1000+ yard receiver. Smith may be that in a year or two but not yet.

The talent here is going to be no better than Houston, given the OL injuries, the OL won't be much better, the WRs are worse, and the TEs are better this year. So he'd probably end up getting this team to 400 points in 17 games, similar to what Wentz did in 2018 and 2019. There's nothing in Watson's resume that suggests he can elevate average talent to top ten performance. Like most 3rd tier guys (7th-15th group), he can win with good talent and lose with meh talent. His best season he was 7th in QBR, 12th and 13th his other two full seasons.

If the Eagles had finished a rebuild, and like TB, had a deep young team with lots of spare cap room to pay a top 15 QB, this would make sense. At that point you trade 2 1st rd picks and a 2nd (in the 20s and 50s) and get a solid QB from a rebuilding team.

But all he'll do here is get them into the playoffs in a weak division and then lose the wildcard game. After that the wheels come off like they did in Houston and he'll be a malcontent.

 

3 minutes ago, DEagle7 said:

 

Now you know we are really gonna get smashed.

Just now, RLC said:

The "Watson is bad" takes is something. Just a Pro-Bowler who carried a dysfunctional franchise on his back.

It's the stupidest take on why we shouldn't trade for him.  The biggest concern is his character.  He is potentially a serial sexual predator.  His ego is so big that he is not playing because he has been trying to force a trade.  I mean the fact that he doesn't want to play despite having signed a very big contract is troubling. He basically is throwing a fit about not having a say in the coaching hire and is ignoring any obligation he has to do a job he agreed to do.  I mean that kind of ego, while not unheard of in sports, rarely plays out to a player having long-term success.  

5 minutes ago, downundermike said:

Could you share a link to the offense PPG stats you are referencing.  I actually came up with lower offensive PPG for Houston than you posted yesterday.

That doesn’t bother me nearly as much as his tunsil was a pro bowl LT so it means the rest of the oline was good. They’ve been a bottom 1/3 unit by almost every ranking out there the last 4 years. Tunsil is the only consistently good OL the Texans had year in and year out. 

5 minutes ago, Bacarty2 said:

The, totally over the top responses like yours is SOMETHING

No one... NO ONE called him bad. NO ONE. 

What has been discussed here is... IS HE WORTH THE DRAFT PICKS NEEDED PLUS TAKING ON HIS CONTRACT. The answer to that is no. he's not

 

Pre legal trouble...(knowing his contract)

I'd be ok with 2 first(this year and next) along with a 2nd. 

Giving his legal troubles... I'll take him for a first and a 2nd. 

So to say three first rounders, 3 second rounders is AWFUL and o ya the legal ish

 

Watson for Dillard or no deal.  

28 minutes ago, Diehardfan said:

This forum has historically not wanted people with massive character flaws so it shocks me more aren't against Watson.

If the Eagles trade for him, I am assuming they know more about the accusations and his character than I do.  I don't want him.  I would rather they try for Rodgers or another veteran in the offseason.  I don't care that Rodgers is 38.  Pay him whatever he wants and spread it out over 5 seasons with the hope he can play 3 of them.  

9 minutes ago, DEagle7 said:

 

Chip Kelly, all is forgiven!  DJack came back and played 8 out of 32 games and Shady is back for a day! 

5 minutes ago, downundermike said:

Now you know we are really gonna get smashed.

Is Lesean starting a fight at the game? 

10 minutes ago, Bacarty2 said:

The, totally over the top responses like yours is SOMETHING

No one... NO ONE called him bad. NO ONE. 

What has been discussed here is... IS HE WORTH THE DRAFT PICKS NEEDED PLUS TAKING ON HIS CONTRACT. The answer to that is no. he's not

 

Pre legal trouble...(knowing his contract)

I'd be ok with 2 first(this year and next) along with a 2nd. 

Giving his legal troubles... I'll take him for a first and a 2nd. 

So to say three first rounders, 3 second rounders is AWFUL and o ya the legal ish

 

Legal issues aside, what QB are you getting out of the draft that has near the talent Watson has?

32 minutes ago, austinfan said:

I don't care about QB stats, look at Houston's points and yards ranking the last three seasons under Watson.

11th, 14th, 18th in points, 15th, 13th, 13th in yards.

And he had average talent, not great, not awful (better than the Eagles):

RB:  Miller/Hyde/Johnson

WR:  Hopkins/Hopkins/Cook

WR:  Fuller/Fuller/Fuller

WR:  D Thomas/Stills/Cobb

TE:  Griffen, J Thomas, Akins/Akins, Fells/Akins, Fells

Hopkins is average talent?!

On 9/30/2021 at 8:00 AM, austinfan said:

If they trade for Watson, Ertz and Goeddert are gone after this season (money).

RBs:  Miller 973 yards, 4.6 clip, Hyde 1070, 4.4 clip, D Johnson 691, 4.7 clip. About as good as what the Eagles ran out there with Wentz. Wentz 2018-2019 is what you get with Watson.

As I pointed out, he had average talent, Hopkins is better than any Eagle WR since ??? Cooks is a consistent 1000+ yard receiver. Smith may be that in a year or two but not yet.

The talent here is going to be no better than Houston, given the OL injuries, the OL won't be much better, the WRs are worse, and the TEs are better this year. So he'd probably end up getting this team to 400 points in 17 games, similar to what Wentz did in 2018 and 2019. There's nothing in Watson's resume that suggests he can elevate average talent to top ten performance. Like most 3rd tier guys (7th-15th group), he can win with good talent and lose with meh talent. His best season he was 7th in QBR, 12th and 13th his other two full seasons.

If the Eagles had finished a rebuild, and like TB, had a deep young team with lots of spare cap room to pay a top 15 QB, this would make sense. At that point you trade 2 1st rd picks and a 2nd (in the 20s and 50s) and get a solid QB from a rebuilding team.

But all he'll do here is get them into the playoffs in a weak division and then lose the wildcard game. After that the wheels come off like they did in Houston and he'll be a malcontent.

Well if goedert is gone that’s on your howie for Fing it up. Cause if we had the money and didn’t piss it away having to restructure contracts he’d be here. 

he put up better numbers without Hopkins. You act like Hopkins is the sole reason he was putting up numbers. His numbers were better without him. 

again before 2020 Literally everyone on this blog said Brandin cooks was done and not worth the money. I know because I said the eagles probably should take a flier on him if they can get restructured his contract and get him on the cheap cause he was still young and talented. And everyone was against that. Because They thought he was done. So this cooks is 1000 yards consistent wide receiver meanwhile last year on the blog he was done before playing with watson and the texans were idiots for making that move. 

so we’re just making assumption that our tight ends are all gonna be gone at the end of the year. Our wide receivers of Watkins, reagor, Smith wont get better with time or be better with a good quarterback. And our o line is gonna be as bad as the Texans who were bottom third in the league with only one good offensive lineman. Are lane Johnson, kelce and mailata all Done for the year? Landon Dickerson is a complete bust now? Laughable. Kelce, lane and mailata is better than the 1 olineman the texans have. Even the eagles backups I’d argue are as good as the texans starters besides tunsil. 

I brought this up earlier just because you want to do a rebuild and then get your quarterback does not mean at that point in time you’re gonna be able to do it. There might not be a quarterback on the market you can trade for. You might not be picking High enough to get the quarterback you truly covet.  you might not have the picks to trade up to get the quarterback you truly covet. or you might not be have a team to trade with so you cannot move up to get that quarterback. Just because you want it at that time does not mean it is given youre going to get that quarterback. Even if you get that QB he might just be a bust. It’s not like the eagles nailed their QB picks. Wentz is the only one who’s played at a high level for longer then 2 seasons. Foles had one and then got hurt and then had a good playoff run and 3 game stretch. Thorson was a complete bum who didn’t even make it to the end of preseason. Hurts would have to not be the guy of a trade went down.