March 3, 20223 yr 8 minutes ago, Mike31mt said: I think youre missing my point, in fact you just helped argue my point and countered the popular narrative in here NATO and Ukraind were allegedly weak during Trumps term. So why did Putin wait until now? No one wants to answer that question for fear of red pilling themselves cheeto was putin's useful idiot and spent 4 years weakening nato & trashing our relationships with nato & the west. if he hadn't gotten curbstomped by biden in 2020, cheeto would still be doing putin's bidding by continuing to crap on nato & our allies...so putin may have waited for 4 more years of damage before moving into ukraine. we'll never know because cheeto lost bigly in 2020.
March 3, 20223 yr Just now, Mike31mt said: I think youre missing my point, in fact you just helped argue my point and countered the popular narrative in here NATO and Ukraind were allegedly weak during Trumps term. So why did Putin wait until now? No one wants to answer that question for fear of red pilling themselves It's been answered dozens of times. Trump's presidency was actively benefiting Putin's position. It would've been incredibly stupid to invade when your enemy is weakening themselves and I'm told Putin's a genius.
March 3, 20223 yr 10 minutes ago, VanHammersly said: Pretending that NATO is weak right now is a really weird position to take. The response to Ukraine has been unprecedented. Russia's getting absolutely decimated economically and weapons and support are pouring into Ukraine. Keyword is response. Strength would have kept it from starting in the first place. You "guys" keep fellating Pop Pop and NATO like they've done something meaningful to stop Putin. They haven't stopped ish because the invasion is still ramping up. Leading from behind as always.
March 3, 20223 yr 3 minutes ago, Mike31mt said: Cry Almost as hard as you did when your mom tried to read you this book as a child.
March 3, 20223 yr 11 minutes ago, VanHammersly said: Pretending that NATO is weak right now is a really weird position to take. The response to Ukraine has been unprecedented. Russia's getting absolutely decimated economically and weapons and support are pouring into Ukraine. I agree that there is renewed enthusiasm from NATO members, but unprecedented? Do you remember 9/11? Afghanistan? Iraq? The response has been appropriate, but this isn’t anything extraordinary. Sanctions and arms is a pretty standard response. That’s been dialed up to 11 here, as it should be, but this is pretty much SOP for members. We aren’t very deep into the playbook.
March 3, 20223 yr 4 minutes ago, The_Omega said: Keyword is response. Strength would have kept it from starting in the first place. You "guys" keep fellating Pop Pop and NATO like they've done something meaningful to stop Putin. They haven't stopped ish because the invasion is still ramping up. Leading from behind as always. What the hell should Biden do? We can’t get directly involved. We aren’t risking WW3 over Ukraine. He’s honestly done a pretty good job post invasion.
March 3, 20223 yr 11 minutes ago, Mike31mt said: NATO and Ukraind were allegedly weak during Trumps term. So why did Putin wait until now? No one wants to answer that question for fear of red pilling themselves NATO was weakened during Trump's term. At minimum Trump signaled that America's commitment to the alliance was reduced. Putin is not going to jump to invade while his enemy is doing the work for him. Biden reaffirmed America's commitment to the alliance. I would also wager that Biden would have been more open to NATO's expansion than Trump, which probably also played into Putin's calculus that it was better to strike now than wait. All of this is speculation, we're trying to predict the reasoning of a man who has shown himself to be more irrational than he's ever demonstrated. For all we know his health is flagging and he wanted to make sure he "solved the Ukraine problem" before his successor could bungle it.
March 3, 20223 yr 7 minutes ago, we_gotta_believe said: Almost as hard as you did when your mom tried to read you this book as a child. To be fair that's AP material in West Virginia
March 3, 20223 yr 3 minutes ago, TEW said: What the hell should Biden do? We can’t get directly involved. We aren’t risking WW3 over Ukraine. He’s honestly done a pretty good job post invasion. It seems like damned if you do, damned if you don't. If he got fully involved, there'd be a large group crying out that he shouldn't have. Politics have just become way too tribal
March 3, 20223 yr 2 minutes ago, TEW said: What the hell should Biden do? We can’t get directly involved. We aren’t risking WW3 over Ukraine. He’s honestly done a pretty good job post invasion. Now? Cut everything off. That's about it. The Ukrainians, and everyone else are f'ed now. Claiming he's done a good job post invasion is claiming that they shut that barn door good and tight after the horse has already gotten out.
March 3, 20223 yr 14 hours ago, DaEagles4Life said: I probably watch that video once a year, it's so good. It was also staged
March 3, 20223 yr 6 minutes ago, TEW said: I agree that there is renewed enthusiasm from NATO members, but unprecedented? Do you remember 9/11? Afghanistan? Iraq? The response has been appropriate, but this isn’t anything extraordinary. Sanctions and arms is a pretty standard response. That’s been dialed up to 11 here, as it should be, but this is pretty much SOP for members. We aren’t very deep into the playbook. The word unprecedented is so overused anymore I just roll my eyes when I see it. But there's clearly been a recommitment to the alliance, and it has kindled interest in joining from states that previously were far from considering it (e.g. Finland) That's obviously more on Russia than anything Biden has done. But it cannot be what Putin had expected.
March 3, 20223 yr 1 minute ago, paco said: It was also staged Yes. Gamers parodying themselves. It's funny.
March 3, 20223 yr 4 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said: It seems like damned if you do, damned if you don't. If he got fully involved, there'd be a large group crying out that he shouldn't have. Politics have just become way too tribal Oh for sure. Doesn't matter what Biden did, the usual suspects in here would find a way to blame whatever part of the outcome on him.
March 3, 20223 yr 2 hours ago, JohnSnowsHair said: I actually think I saw an email from Zelenskyy that said it was from a blackberry. Was surprised. I do think blackberry's last bastion is in highly secure devices and messaging. Though I've not checked in on them in a while. They just started discontinuing key services, eg provisioning, in early Jan. The game is coming to an end.
March 3, 20223 yr 22 minutes ago, Mike31mt said: I think youre missing my point, in fact you just helped argue my point and countered the popular narrative in here NATO and Ukraind were allegedly weak during Trumps term. So why did Putin wait until now? No one wants to answer that question for fear of red pilling themselves Then why don't you tell us about Putin's intentions? It seems you know more about him than we do.
March 3, 20223 yr 5 minutes ago, The_Omega said: Now? Cut everything off. That's about it. The Ukrainians, and everyone else are f'ed now. Claiming he's done a good job post invasion is claiming that they shut that barn door good and tight after the horse has already gotten out. No. You keep doing what we have been: supply Ukraine with weapons and aid, as well as providing intelligence support. And of course continue to try and facilitate the escape of innocents. Keep the pressure on Russia and establish the line where NATO will get involved with boots on the ground (e.g. straying into Poland). Ukraine should be given everything they can to make this war bloody and embarrassing for Putin, and support Ukraine in whatever they need to make the subsequent occupation (assuming it happens which is like 95% likely) painful.
March 3, 20223 yr 20 minutes ago, mr_hunt said: cheeto was putin's useful idiot and spent 4 years weakening nato & trashing our relationships with nato & the west. if he hadn't gotten curbstomped by biden in 2020, cheeto would still be doing putin's bidding by continuing to crap on nato & our allies...so putin may have waited for 4 more years of damage before moving into ukraine. we'll never know because cheeto lost bigly in 2020. So Putin didnt invade when NATO and Ukraine were weak and he had a puppet in the office of POTUS But now that Biden won, he invades a year later Did I get that right? Is that your final answer?
March 3, 20223 yr 1 minute ago, Mike31mt said: So Putin didnt invade when NATO and Ukraine were weak and he had a puppet in the office of POTUS But now that Biden won, he invades a year later Did I get that right? Is that your final answer? no. you rarely do.
March 3, 20223 yr 21 minutes ago, VanHammersly said: It's been answered dozens of times. Trump's presidency was actively benefiting Putin's position. It would've been incredibly stupid to invade when your enemy is weakening themselves and I'm told Putin's a genius. Sounds like a great time to invade, NATO and Ukraine were weakened, Trump is Putins puppet...some of you guys said he would have actually helped Russia But he didnt invade then, instead he waited for Biden Your explanations all suck and make no logical sense. Try again.
March 3, 20223 yr Just now, Mike31mt said: So Putin didnt invade when NATO and Ukraine were weak and he had a puppet in the office of POTUS But now that Biden won, he invades a year later Did I get that right? Is that your final answer? Why would Putin not wait to see if Trump won re-election? Then he might be able to push a US president that wants to focus inward at the expense of EU allies even further outside the Atlanticist sphere thereby further weakening Europe and NATO's resolve to prevent Russian imperialism.
March 3, 20223 yr 2 minutes ago, Mike31mt said: So Putin didnt invade when NATO and Ukraine were weak and he had a puppet in the office of POTUS But now that Biden won, he invades a year later Did I get that right? Is that your final answer? So Biden became president, which in your eyes was the perfect time for Putin to strike, and he waited a whole year? Did I get that right? Is that your final answer?
March 3, 20223 yr 13 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said: It seems like damned if you do, damned if you don't. If he got fully involved, there'd be a large group crying out that he shouldn't have. Politics have just become way too tribal Putin has been very consistent that he would use tactical nukes against Western Europe. Getting involved in a direct confrontation was never even an option.
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