Jordan/Bulls Doc

[DaEagles4Life]

I feel like this doc just re-cements him as the GOAT 

[Agent23]

On 4/21/2020 at 9:57 AM, 4for4EaglesNest said:

I honestly don't remember the Pippen injury/holdout storyline.  I loved Pippen's game.  I do remember him pouting in a playoff game (while Jordan was out playing baseball) cause Jackson called the last game winning play to go to Kukoc.  But I didn't realize Pippen acted like that.  He still got a raw deal.  

 

 

we didn't have 24/7 news and media and internet coverage

[Jenkins27]

He's no LeBron. LeBron carried teams, Jordan needed Pippen to get anywhere close to a title. 👀

[DaEagles4Life]

7 hours ago, Jenkins27 said:

He's no LeBron. LeBron carried teams, Jordan needed Pippen to get anywhere close to a title. 👀

Hot take alert 

 

[vsptroops]

On 4/21/2020 at 9:57 AM, 4for4EaglesNest said:

I honestly don't remember the Pippen injury/holdout storyline.  I loved Pippen's game.  I do remember him pouting in a playoff game (while Jordan was out playing baseball) cause Jackson called the last game winning play to go to Kukoc.  But I didn't realize Pippen acted like that.  He still got a raw deal.  

 

 

Did he though? He was the one who wanted and signed a long term deal in 1991. Hell, Reinsdorf himself told him it was a bad idea but he wanted "security" for his family. Hey, that's fine and all but realize that 2 or 3 years into that deal that you will be severely underpaid. I enjoy this doc though. I enjoy those days of basketball better than now simply because they weren't all buddy buddy with each other back then. Lebron wants to be everyone's friend where Jordan hated your guts and wanted to humiliate you. 

[Jenkins27]

2 hours ago, DaEagles4Life said:

Hot take alert 

 

I’m just saying. Bron took teams with Boobie Gibson and Delly as his #2 option to the finals. Jordan got swept in the first round without Pippen. 😁

[DaEagles4Life]

8 hours ago, Jenkins27 said:

I’m just saying. Bron took teams with Boobie Gibson and Delly as his #2 option to the finals. Jordan got swept in the first round without Pippen. 😁

And how did James win his first two rings? 

A top 20 player of all time and a fringe HoF

 

Not to mention you just can't top 6 for 6

[Jenkins27]

46 minutes ago, DaEagles4Life said:

And how did James win his first two rings? 

A top 20 player of all time and a fringe HoF

 

Not to mention you just can't top 6 for 6

I’m not saying he didn’t get help for those rings, all players get help. It’s just most people use that as a knock against him when Jordan was swept without Pippen.
 

As for the 6 for 6 argument, he also didn’t run into teams as good as the Spurs or Warriors in the finals.

[swifty]

Jordan's rep would be so much different if he had played in the social media era.

Love his game though and his competitiveness. 

[DaEagles4Life]

5 hours ago, Jenkins27 said:

I’m not saying he didn’t get help for those rings, all players get help. It’s just most people use that as a knock against him when Jordan was swept without Pippen.
 

As for the 6 for 6 argument, he also didn’t run into teams as good as the Spurs or Warriors in the finals.

I mean one of James losses with his loaded Heat rosters was against an average Mavs team with one guy, Dirk and old Kidd/Peja

You beat who is in front of you. 

Those Jazz teams were really damn good, two hall of famers. 

[Bwestbrook36]

2 hours ago, swifty said:

Jordan's rep would be so much different if he had played in the social media era.

Love his game though and his competitiveness. 

It would have. Kobe did the same sheet and got labeled selfish, arrogant and a horrible person to play with and hated by most fans. Only difference really was Jordan waited a little but before ripping his teammates apart for not playing hard enough. Kobe did it as soon as he stepped on the court at 18. 

[Jenkins27]

1 hour ago, DaEagles4Life said:

I mean one of James losses with his loaded Heat rosters was against an average Mavs team with one guy, Dirk and old Kidd/Peja

You beat who is in front of you. 

Those Jazz teams were really damn good, two hall of famers. 

Didn’t even remember Peja was on that team lol. They had a ton of solid guys Marion, Terry, Chandler among the ones you named. Aside from that he went up against two dynasties better than any finals team Jordan went up against. Yes you beat who is in front if you but it’s different circumstances between the two. Finals record can’t be the deciding factor imo. The Jazz were good but not Warriors or Spurs good.

[ShakeThatMonkey]

Definitely more respect for Jordan as I didn't realize just how well he conducted himself as a rookie/young player.

[swifty]

Enjoyed the two episodes last night. I've always loved Rodman so it was neat to get a bit of a look at him. The Vegas/Carmen Electra story is absolutely insane. Could you imagine that today? 

 

[DaEagles4Life]

On 4/23/2020 at 4:12 PM, Jenkins27 said:

Didn’t even remember Peja was on that team lol. They had a ton of solid guys Marion, Terry, Chandler among the ones you named. Aside from that he went up against two dynasties better than any finals team Jordan went up against. Yes you beat who is in front if you but it’s different circumstances between the two. Finals record can’t be the deciding factor imo. The Jazz were good but not Warriors or Spurs good.

We have no idea if the physicality of the 90s would have affected the Warriors as well. 

At the end of the day if you want to be considered the GOAT you need to knock him off and James hasn't. 6 for 6 and 6 Finals MVPs in any Era is remarkable. James needed two Stars to lose to a below average Mavs team and beat a YOUNG YOUNG Thunder team. Not to mention he needed a Draymond suspension to get back in another series. 

We can play this what if game all we want but you can't argue rings 

Jordan is still the GOAT 

[mikemack8]

Kinda silly to discount who Jordan beat - Lakers w/Magic, Blazers w/Drexler, Suns w/Barkley, Sonics w/Kemp & Payton, Jazz w/Malone & Stockton

Yeah - maybe none of them are on the level of the Warriors but they all had hall of fame players on the roster.  Good point on the physicality as well - case in point, how the Pistons beat the crap out of MJ.  If Lebron would face that level of physicality he'd spend the entire game complaining and get nothing else accomplished

[Khani1]

On 4/22/2020 at 2:10 PM, Jenkins27 said:

He's no LeBron. LeBron carried teams, Jordan needed Pippen to get anywhere close to a title. 👀

You are right.  He is no Lebron.  Lebron couldn't hold his jock strap.  First of all, teams played hard nose defense back then.  You could hand check, bump, get physical and that was standard play, no fouls were called.  Secondly, there weren't just 5-6 top teams like there are now.  The second tier teams were good and very competitive.  Games were not a 3 point contest.  Lebron would be good in that area but not nearly as good as he was in this era.  Jordan dominated that era and would be even more lethal if he played in this era.  Jordan >>>>>>>> Lebron.

[Jenkins27]

5 hours ago, Khani1 said:

You are right.  He is no Lebron.  Lebron couldn't hold his jock strap.  First of all, teams played hard nose defense back then.  You could hand check, bump, get physical and that was standard play, no fouls were called.  Secondly, there weren't just 5-6 top teams like there are now.  The second tier teams were good and very competitive.  Games were not a 3 point contest.  Lebron would be good in that area but not nearly as good as he was in this era.  Jordan dominated that era and would be even more lethal if he played in this era.  Jordan >>>>>>>> Lebron.

Jordan never carried a team full of bums to the finals like Bron has. If you (anyone, not specifically you lol) can’t admit he’s in the GOAT convo I don’t know what to tell you.

[Khani1]

15 minutes ago, Jenkins27 said:

Jordan never carried a team full of bums to the finals like Bron has. If you (anyone, not specifically you lol) can’t admit he’s in the GOAT convo I don’t know what to tell you.

Let me guess, you are around 30 years old?

[Jenkins27]

33 minutes ago, Khani1 said:

Let me guess, you are around 30 years old?

Doesn’t have anything to do with anything. I watched the game without anything clouding my judgment.

[Khani1]

23 minutes ago, Jenkins27 said:

Doesn’t have anything to do with anything. I watched the game without anything clouding my judgment.

Yes it does.  You did not watch him play nor that era.  Watching youtube highlight does not count.

[Jenkins27]

17 minutes ago, Khani1 said:

Yes it does.  You did not watch him play nor that era.  Watching youtube highlight does not count.

Watching games from that era count?

[c_u_in_tampa]

Jordon took some abuse, not like today's game when everything is a foul

[mikemack8]

Lebron will go down as #2 all time - behind Jordan.  Not saying he's not an all time great - just not as good as Jordan

[DaEagles4Life]

52 minutes ago, mikemack8 said:

Lebron will go down as #2 all time - behind Jordan.  Not saying he's not an all time great - just not as good as Jordan

Agree and nothing wrong with that.