1 minute ago, Random Reglar said:

Totally wrong.

This is a coaching problem.

The coaching problem is that the coaches don't put Covey on offense. Or,  more specifically, they don't spread the snaps out to a variety of players. 

It's like they have a pecking order.

Brown and Smith are at the top.
Watkins is next and he's not good.

So, the coaches go "well if Brown and Smith are good, and Watkins is not good,  well, there you have it.  Brown and Smith never come off the field."

But the answer is "you are ranking Watkins too high.  Give everybody else snaps and targets.  Move Covey up and Watkins down."

 

He is valuable, great year returning punts. You don't even have to say "He's moved up on the depth chart". Just get him in the game on third downs, 2nd and long a dozen times a game...Welker, Edelman, Beasley type of receiver possibly? I am not saying get him that many touches, but he has to be accounted for and it could open up other options. I know he might be a tad smaller/lighter but he can contribute more than they have allowed him to so far on offense. 

2 hours ago, eagle45 said:

Facts:

1.  Hurts played like an MVP last year, including the SB.  
2. He’s 25
3.  They have $250m invested him.
4.  He has been a turnover machine in 2023.
5.  He has regressed and hasn’t been very good in 2023.
6.  His passing yards per game is low relative to other quality starting QBs.

Debates:

1. How much of 2023’s regression is Hurts versus coaching?

 

Now I’m going to say the same quote for Hurts that I said for Wentz, which is alarming.  You do everything you can to support him and get him back to last year’s level.  He has to be your guy.

 

But what happens if 2024 is a carbon copy of 2023 for the passing offense?  Then how are you looking at Hurts?

One of the issues with hurts this year is often when the play breaks down, he doesn’t know what to do. I think that goes way beyond read progression. One of those late ill-advised QB scrambles to the right, it was stonewalled so he tried to push left. He momentarily looked upfield to try and dump the ball, and then just tucked it. As he went left, you could see Devonta Smith on the opposite side of the field just standing there blocking; where the play isn’t going. There was no outlet pass.

Brian Johnson expected that it is more likely successful to reverse course, run all the way across the backfield to the other side than to turn and pass. That is a stupidly designed play. That is a play designed to fail.

Here's a few scenarios:

Option 1: The Eagles hire a new OC next year.  He comes in with a new scheme, works with Hurts, and calls the plays.  It's a smashing success.  Hurts is great, offense is back to 2022, team is great...now 5 teams are lining up to offer him their HC job.  What do you think about this?  Do you really want Siri, who...at this point...definitively brings nothing schematic or tangible to the table as the HC of this team?  Would you promote this guy to HC and fire Siri?  Do you let him walk and invite another 2023?

Option 2: The Eagles hire a new OC (or maybe even HC) next year.  He comes in with a new scheme, works with Hurts, and calls the plays.  Nothing changes.  Same turnovers, inconsistencies, and frustrations with the passing offense as 2023.  How many years of that do you tolerate before hitting reset?

Option 3: Same HC, new OC.  In 2024, things are less excruciating than 2023, but not close to the dominance of 2022 either.  Fall short of making the SB.  The same group comes back for 2025, which is a clone of the 2024 season.  How many years of this do you tolerate before hitting reset?  Just wait for either a lightning in a bottle good year or a wheels falling off year, whichever comes first?

 

Keep in mind option 3 is the most likely scenario.  Things get better, but just sort of fade away over time without re-capturing 2022.  How long are you...are Howie/Lurie...happy to sit on that track?

 

8 minutes ago, Random Reglar said:

Totally wrong.

This is a coaching problem.

The coaching problem is that the coaches don't put Covey on offense. Or,  more specifically, they don't spread the snaps out to a variety of players. 

It's like they have a pecking order.

Brown and Smith are at the top.
Watkins is next and he's not good.

So, the coaches go "well if Brown and Smith are good, and Watkins is not good,  well, there you have it.  Brown and Smith never come off the field."

But the answer is "you are ranking Watkins too high.  Give everybody else snaps and targets.  Move Covey up and Watkins down."

 

Watkins played 1 total snap the last two games 

1 hour ago, DawkinsOwnage03 said:

Hurts has had bad games obviously this year but he has zero to do with yesterdays fail, you have an agenda or are just a flat out fing moron to put that one on him.

They've hated him from day one and take any chance they get to take a shot at him for whatever reason. He has to be perfect every play. Dude deserves criticism for sure but some people around here are absolutely ridiculous.

18 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Gotta protect Jack Stoll at all costs 

You know what I meant.  lol

41 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

Think this is more likely Daboll or another team's GM than Sirianni, but interesting nonetheless.

We’re getting Josh McDaniels for real this time 

1 minute ago, Ace Nova said:

You know what I meant.  lol

The best way to deal with this mess is just to laugh at it 

40 minutes ago, Joe Ball said:

3 firsts? He's #9 QBR and #17 RTG...#11 in yards, but he also ranks #3 in QB turnovers this year. Hurts does not need to be traded, he needs to be coached and developed a little bit and put in a position to succeed with an offense that is not so limiting. IF, a big IF, he is the one limiting the offense because of an inability to read pre-snap or in play progression, then that even further prevents him from garnering a trade that includes 3 #1 picks. I do not believe he is the issue here one bit.

First not suggesting we trade him. Second russell Wilson was not good his last year in seattle.  most thought he was declining and out of his prime at 33 and got 2 firsts+. Meanwhile hurts went to a SB last year, played arguably one of the best games an Qb could have in the Super Bowl and was second in mvp. This year he’s likely to get 40 total tds and even with the turnovers, he’d get a ton in return. You think teams look at josh Allen’s turnovers and say well he is always up with the league leaders in turnovers so we aren’t going to give up the draft capital for it. Not saying he’s josh Allen at all cause i think Allen would garner even more ridiculous offers. Dak was top 5 turnovers in 2022. You think Dak is destined to be that every year or is that the outlier? 

you are forgetting then nfl is desperate for good QBs. It’s why there’s rumors Justin fields could potentially get a first and another higher round pick. And he’s far worse than jalen hurts. Especially ones that got to a Super Bowl, was equal to if not better besides a fumble to mahomes, won playoff games and has shown he can play at the highest level. Then again you’re a cowboys fan who disappeared on here for a few weeks and all the sudden returned this week. Good coaches will think they can make him better than he already is. He’s easily a top 10 Qb. We’ve seen teams give up firsts for Carson wentz. So it’s not far fetched that hurts who was better than watson his last year he played in houston, then had legal issues and far less baggage would command a similar package if not more due to his age and less off the field concerns and a much better contract then watson 

1 hour ago, Joe Ball said:

SF is a great example. Purdy is not an elite level QB ala Tom Brady. When it’s time to sign him, he either takes what works for the team and is fair or trade him and get some draft capital. Then go find someone else who can distribute the ball and is coachable that can be easily developed. Kyle Shanahan could do this easily iMO.

I may be wrong and I’ll admit that. The league just cannot keep increasing QB pay to reset the market every time a winning QB is up for a new contract. It’s getting absurd and if I were an owner I’m trying to find a way to break the trend.

At worst you have a highly competitive team if you’ve taken that money/draft compensation and invested it in the right players elsewhere on the roster.

Edit: BTW, Cleveland fits what I’m trying to say…you don’t have to pay 50 - 60 mil to a qb to win games. Joe Flacco is getting 1.1mil. They can compete and outside of Baltimore being hot right now there is always a chance they could win it all.

You act like a Purdy grows on trees. If it were that easy the 9ers would have been as successful with the many other QBs they fielded to manage the offense. He's going to get paid nicely if he continues this upward trend and the 9ers will not let him go. Have you been watching the NFL since the salary cap era? The NFL is all about the QB. It's unbearable to watch when there is bad QB play. 

Cleveland does not fit what you say because they already have Watson on a huge salary and STILL built this 11-5 supporting cast for the QB is my point. Competing and actually fielding a SB team are two different things. Cleveland hasn't really beat anyone of merit as of late. Flacco will come down to earth as soon as he plays a good defense in the playoffs.

By EPA, we are now the 6th best offense in the NFL.
By EPA, we are the 30th best defense in the NFL.

The tale of the season.

35 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

Another thing to factor in. What if Jalen Hurts has lost faith in Sirianni? They have way more invested in Hurts than Sirianni. If Howie speaks to Hurts privately and Hurts tells him in confidence he thinks the coach is clueless, what would they do in that scenario? Could they really go into 2024 with a guy your most important player thinks sucks if hypothetically that was the case?

Or if team leaders like Kelce and Lane are telling Howie behind the scenes the coach has no answers and has lost the players.

This is something I was trying to type up earlier and couldn't find a way to say it.

They have 2 more years invested in Sirianni at about $6 million per year. 

-or-

They have a big 3 in Hurts, Brown and Smith:

-$250 million invested in Hurts.

-$100 million invested in AJ Brown.

-soon to be $100 million in DeVonta Smith (if he wants to stay after this mess).

Who do you have more faith in? The coach, who from what we can tell, has lost at least a portion of the locker room. Or the 3 players who produced despite the coaches complete inability to put them in the best position to succeed?

My money is on the players. Find a coach who knows how to use these guys and this offense should be unstoppable. 

 

 

My take on the Josina story is if Nick comes back then AJ is going to be asking out.  She's got the player connections.

26 minutes ago, Random Reglar said:

Totally wrong.

This is a coaching problem.

The coaching problem is that the coaches don't put Covey on offense. Or,  more specifically, they don't spread the snaps out to a variety of players. 

It's like they have a pecking order.

Brown and Smith are at the top.
Watkins is next and he's not good.

So, the coaches go "well if Brown and Smith are good, and Watkins is not good,  well, there you have it.  Brown and Smith never come off the field."

But the answer is "you are ranking Watkins too high.  Give everybody else snaps and targets.  Move Covey up and Watkins down."

 

In situations like the Eagles were in yesterday with the game on the line, I would argue that they should be spamming AJ Brown with targets. Especially on the slants. Damn near unstoppable. Once the defense adjusts to take him away then everyone else eats. They didn't and well we see the results.

3 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

This is something I was trying to type up earlier and couldn't find a way to say it.

They have 2 more years invested in Sirianni at about $6 million per year. 

This is not a big deal. 

37 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

Facts:

1.  Hurts played like an MVP last year, including the SB.  
2. He’s 25
3.  They have $250m invested him.
4.  He has been a turnover machine in 2023.
5.  He has regressed and hasn’t been very good in 2023.
6.  His passing yards per game is low relative to other quality starting QBs.

Debates:

1. How much of 2023’s regression is Hurts versus coaching?

 

Now I’m going to say the same quote for Hurts that I said for Wentz, which is alarming.  You do everything you can to support him and get him back to last year’s level.  He has to be your guy.

 

But what happens if 2024 is a carbon copy of 2023 for the passing offense?  Then how are you looking at Hurts?

 

He just broke the single season franchise records for TDs scored in a season.  He's only 25 and hasn't even entered his prime yet.  Hurts was not the problem with the team this season.  The coaching staff has been the primary issue and it's the coaching staff that has lost the locker room and players on this team.  

Yesterday is an interesting case study for the offense.

In the entire game, the offense had 6 true possessions.  That's an absurd number for a full game.  That means they'd have 42 points (a lot, but nothing crazy) if they scored a TD every time they got the ball.  It's important to keep this in mind when we scratch our heads how the offense only managed to put up 24 points against an absolutely awful bottom 2 Arizona defense.  The complete inability of the defense to get off the field really limited the offensive output.

But how did those 6 drives go?  3 TD's.  Touchdowns on 50% of the drives.  OK...statheads tell us how that compares to the season average for Arizona.  But let's throw out the TD drives and look at the imperfect ones.

Failed drive 1: Game opening 3 and out.  Meh.  This happens to the best on the opening drive.  A pair of mildly effective runs.  A screen to Gainwell (who is very good on tough yard screens) seems like a reasonable play call on 3rd and 2.  The Eagles block very poorly on screens.  They just do.  I blame the failure of this drive on screen blocking.  But this is sort of a no big deal one.

Failed drive 2: first drive of the 2nd half 3 and out.  OK, there's a trend with the first failed drive.  Ineffective run followed by a nice short 5 yard pick up to create a manageable 3rd and 5.  Hurts underthrew Smith on a deep ball and never gave him a chance to make a play on the ball.  He was "covered" because he came back to the defender for the ball, but actually had a step.  When the defense can't get off the field and you only need 5, maybe you go for something more reliable than that kill shot there.  I'll put this one on Hurts.

Failed drive 3 (FG): They didn't move down the field much to earn this one.  Nice pass to AJ Brown to pick up 18.  Drive takes a major hit with a Mailata holding call.  Then the playcalling takes over.  Back to back ineffective QB runs and another failed screen to Gainwell on 3rd and long.

So we have the inability of the offense to set up a screen, one QB misfire, and a series of bad play calls as their only offensive deviation from perfection for the entire day.  That's not THAT bad.  It's actually quite good.  It shows you how downright horrific this defense is...they can take over a game to the point it impacts the other side of the ball.  If they could just give up quick strike 50 yard TDs it would actually give our own offense more control of the game.

Activate McKee for Giants game

Rest starters

Shake the Magic 8 ball

And see what happens in the WC Round

Chances are Josina is probably just making stuff up so when something happens she can put out "I knew this, I just couldn't put it out there just yet" or when nothing happens she can say "Guys, I wasn't implying anything big, jeez!"

The older I get the less I let losses by this team bother me because of just life. But I am still seething after that yesterday. Most likely Graham, Cox, and Kelce’s final home game, they blew the division and a home playoff game, and they probably ended DeVonta’s season having their 165 lb WR block on a useless effing screen pass on a 3rd and 20. I’m not trying to be a prisoner of the moment, maybe I am, but that is the worst regular season loss I can remember in years given the consequences. 

1 hour ago, Joe Ball said:

SF is a great example. Purdy is not an elite level QB ala Tom Brady. When it’s time to sign him, he either takes what works for the team and is fair or trade him and get some draft capital. Then go find someone else who can distribute the ball and is coachable that can be easily developed. Kyle Shanahan could do this easily iMO.

I may be wrong and I’ll admit that. The league just cannot keep increasing QB pay to reset the market every time a winning QB is up for a new contract. It’s getting absurd and if I were an owner I’m trying to find a way to break the trend.

At worst you have a highly competitive team if you’ve taken that money/draft compensation and invested it in the right players elsewhere on the roster.

Edit: BTW, Cleveland fits what I’m trying to say…you don’t have to pay 50 - 60 mil to a qb to win games. Joe Flacco is getting 1.1mil. They can compete and outside of Baltimore being hot right now there is always a chance they could win it all.

Wait, you don't think Tom Brady is an elite QB

 

3 minutes ago, RememberTheKoy said:

 

He just broke the single season franchise records for TDs scored in a season.  He's only 25 and hasn't even entered his prime yet.  Hurts was not the problem with the team this season.  The coaching staff has been the primary issue and it's the coaching staff that has lost the locker room and players on this team.  

That record is a bit of a technicality.  Kelce literally jokes with Swift and apologizes that he can't get any rushing TDs.  

Just now, BDawk_ASamuel said:

The older I get the less I let losses by this team bother me because of just life. But I am still seething after that yesterday. Most likely Graham, Cox, and Kelce’s final home game, they blew the division and a home playoff game, and they probably ended DeVonta’s season having their 165 lb WR block on a useless effing screen pass on a 3rd and 20. I’m not trying to be a prisoner of the moment, maybe I am, but that is the worst regular season loss I can remember in years given the consequences. 

How I feel, after the SB win I just care less after games, but told a buddy that yesterday was one of the dumbest games I have watched in decades. 

I guess it’s safe to say the Patricia experiment was a fail 

6 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

Yesterday is an interesting case study for the offense.

But how did those 6 drives go?  3 TD's.  Touchdowns on 50% of the drives.  OK...statheads tell us how that compares to the season average for Arizona.  But let's throw out the TD drives and look at the imperfect ones.

Zooming out, the offense was objectively good.