9 minutes ago, aptosbird said:

I can go on all day about schemes and talent...I have many questions but not enough answers for how to move forward into next year. My biggest takeaway was the lack of effort and not playing with sense of urgency...that is just inexcusable at this time of the season. 

I didn't see that much in terms of a lack of effort. The defense is exhausted. Bradberry looked lost and I would have liked to see him jump on that sideways pass that wasn't a fumble but at the very least, if he jumps on, maybe they get a review and with these refs, ya never know. 

The problem is what you mentioned fist, scheme and talent.

1 minute ago, judunno said:

The point is still going over your head. They built their current roster while having a 230 million dollar QB on the pay roll.

No, no it’s not going over my head. I stated an opinion that you can win without paying a ton of money to the qb and have a more rounded roster by paying other positions and add 3 or 4 better players than what you likely couldn’t afford because of the high price of qb.

I was told that’s not realistic. Then I gave examples of teams that are winning with lesser paid QBs. 

The Browns did pay their QB, who isn’t playing…they are winning with a 1.1mil QB.

I realize they have a lot of money tied up in Slay and Bradberry right now, but that is a true sunk cost. 

Slay may be able to offer something next year, but I really put him in the same basket as someone like Nakobe Dean (despite being different ends of the age spectrum).  Between age, decline, and age related propensity for injury, you really can't bank on much from Slay next year.  But given what he has been in the past and what he has shown this year, I don't think it make sense to just punt him either; he might be able to fill a spot next year.

Between the chances of Ringo developing and Slay hanging on another year, you can probably bank on one being a serviceable starter and the other not panning out.  And if it's Slay that pans out and not RIngo, then they still need a starting CB for 2025.

So at best, they need a starting outside CB and a nickel CB.  At worst, they need CB x3.

I think that means you need to plunk serious FA $$$ into the best CB available (no expensive superstuds, so they should be available to afford it) and then draft a CB very high...as soon as one becomes reasonably close to BPA.  

Anything less and I don't see how the secondary is less of a disaster next year.

If the Eagles drop the Giants game and then lose in the wild card game, they'll have finished the season losing 6 of their last 7. Looking at it through that lens, I actually don't think Sirianni being fired would be incredibly unlikely. That would have to be one of the greater collapses in NFL history for a team that started 10-1. Any time you do something historically awful, change is always possible.

This freshman QB for Tennessee is a smooth athlete all around. Effortless throwing motion, glides when he runs. Going to be fun to see him develop.

12 minutes ago, aptosbird said:

I can go on all day about schemes and talent...I have many questions but not enough answers for how to move forward into next year. My biggest takeaway was the lack of effort and not playing with sense of urgency...that is just inexcusable at this time of the season. 

We can call it lack of effort and urgency, but they haven’t had that effort and urgency since first quarter of San Francisco. I think we’ll get some lost in all this and it’s not an excuse, but they played the first 10 out of 11 games down to the wire. eventually expanding that type of energy and emotion for like 10 out of 11 weeks is going to catch up to you. I think that Buffalo game they expended whatever energy and emotion they have left into coming back in that game. That was their grand finale of whatever they have left in their tank. Add on you’re coming off a season where you went into middle of February and lost a Super Bowl, which probably was gonna give them partially a hangover cause most teams have that early in the year.

Imo at some point in time if you play that many consecutive close highly emotional games then you’re eventually gonna run out of steam. I rewatch the game from yesterday, we can call it lack of effort. But they’re getting pushed around by bad football players on the Cardinals. Personally i don’t think it’s effort or urgency issue when same issues from weeks 13-17 are existing  besides bad coaching and personnel issues, i think on defense they look like a team that’s emotional spent and physically drained   

 

Idk, but I think too much is being made of the defense being gassed. Sure, when they are on the field like they were yesterday (all day!), then they are and should be gassed. But even at the start of games (except the first two SF series) they are not stopping the run. They got run over yesterday from start to finish and it cannot be excused with being tired. There really isn’t a valid excuse for this defense anymore. They are just plain awful. Only excuse is the lack of talent.

1 hour ago, RLC said:

By EPA, we are now the 6th best offense in the NFL.
By EPA, we are the 30th best defense in the NFL.

The tale of the season.

The offense (especially in terms of talent) is there.

The issues have been beyond questionable play calling at critical/very important moments of games.   
 

You can score the most points in the NFL but if you make mistake after mistake at critical moments of games, you’ll end up exactly where we are now.  

1 minute ago, Joe Ball said:

No, no it’s not going over my head. I stated an opinion that you can win without paying a ton of money to the qb and have a more rounded roster by paying other positions and add 3 or 4 better players than what you likely couldn’t afford because of the high price of qb.

I was told that’s not realistic. Then I gave examples of teams that are winning with lesser paid QBs. 

The Browns did pay their QB, who isn’t playing…they are winning with a 1.1mil QB.

It's not realistic because it only works short term with QBs on rookie contracts (like it did with the Eagles last year and 9ers this year) or if some vet guy gets hot. Eventually the QB either gets paid big bucks or they fall back to earth and you end up with a great supporting cast that has no one to get them the ball. Then they have to hope that they hit on a rookie QB before the window closes on the supporting cast contracts. A rookie that they probably won't be drafting high and the odds are against them.

I kind of posted this last night, but I want to take it from a different angle.  Assume Kelce retires.

Steen, Dean, Ringo, Blankenship, Brown.

Of those young players, which do you want to see start in 2024?  Which scare you?  

 

Opeta, Bradberry, Slay, Leonard, Cunningham, Morrow, Julio Jones, Watkins, OZ.  Of these embattled vets, which do you want on the team next year?  Would you be OK with any of them starting (counting WR3 as a starter)?  Regardless of what you want, which ones do you think the Eagles will hand starting jobs to?

 

Lastly, how many 2024 week 1 starters are not currently on the roster??  And what position(s) are they?

22 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Yes... and No.   Situationally, this team is brutally stupid on both sides of the ball. 

It’s week 17 and we have to use timeouts because Jack Stoll doesn’t know he’s supposed to be on the field and Julio Jones, a HOF WR, regardless if he’s washed or not, also doesn’t know what is going on. It’s coaching for sure, but it’s still why I don’t care about metrics. 

I remember some people thinking that they were "holding back” game plans for the playoffs. Was blowing the division and a home playoff game a part of that plan?

Just now, Ace Nova said:

The offense (especially in terms of talent) is there.

The issues have been beyond questionable play calling at critical/very important moments of games.   
 

You can score the most points in the NFL but if you make mistake after mistake at critical moments of games, you’ll end up exactly where we are now.  

Agree but even with bad calls we don't know what Hurts has done at the line. An example of that was when Kelce was like f no when Hurts went up to change something. He isn't that smart at times (not saying he's dumb but he has situational impairment). Between him not throwing the ball away, staying in bounds, always running out of the pocket vs stepping up, and playing hero ball BS at the end of games that cost them the Jets and Hakws games...I'm not sure he has a damn clue to be the one deciding anything at the line. If Kelce didn't shake his head and say no f'ing way they might have lost that one as well.

Yeah, Nick and BJ are trash but Hurts probably isn't too far behind them with his choices that he has to own.

2 minutes ago, Frankfurteagle89 said:

Idk, but I think too much is being made of the defense being gassed. Sure, when they are on the field like they were yesterday (all day!), then they are and should be gassed. But even at the start of games (except the first two SF series) they are not stopping the run. They got run over yesterday from start to finish and it cannot be excused with being tired. There really isn’t a valid excuse for this defense anymore. They are just plain awful. Only excuse is the lack of talent.

That is the LB problem. DL can get you TFLs on occasion but if your LBs absolutely suck ass you're not going to do well against the run. I see a DL that gets worn and tries to over compensate for the poor LB play putting them in an even worse position. They can't get off the field on 3rd down then it's a wrap.

Right now, this is our starting roster in 2024.

Hurts, AJ, Devonta, Goedert, Mailata, Dickerson, Jurgens, Steen, Johnson. Major holes: RB1, WR3, OL6, OL7.
Reddick, Davis, Carter, Sweat, Slay, Ringo, Brown. Major holes: LB1, LB2, S1, CB3.

It's really not that dire compared to most teams. 

2 minutes ago, Frankfurteagle89 said:

Idk, but I think too much is being made of the defense being gassed. Sure, when they are on the field like they were yesterday (all day!), then they are and should be gassed. But even at the start of games (except the first two SF series) they are not stopping the run. They got run over yesterday from start to finish and it cannot be excused with being tired. There really isn’t a valid excuse for this defense anymore. They are just plain awful. Only excuse is the lack of talent.

They have a clear lack of talent and coaching issue. However re-watching these games they are getting pushed around by inferior players and opponents. Either it’s a lack of effort or they seemed to be gassed. If you go watch from Miami game even through Buffalo that wasn’t the case. They played hard and were very physical. They were still the most physical team and ones pushing opponents around. Dallas it showed up at the end of the game. Either they’ve given up (maybe) or at some point in playing 10 out of 11 games down to the wire then having a ridiculous 92 snap game they’ve might have run out of steam to go with their lackluster personnel. 

Just now, eagle45 said:

I kind of posted this last night, but I want to take it from a different angle.  Assume Kelce retires.

Steen, Dean, Ringo, Blankenship, Brown.

Of those young players, which do you want to see start in 2024?  Which scare you?  

 

Opeta, Bradberry, Slay, Leonard, Cunningham, Morrow, Julio Jones, Watkins, OZ.  Of these embattled vets, which do you want on the team next year?  Would you be OK with any of them starting (counting WR3 as a starter)?  Regardless of what you want, which ones do you think the Eagles will hand starting jobs to?

 

Lastly, how many 2024 week 1 starters are not currently on the roster??  And what position(s) are they?

If I could answer my own question...

In the absence of better resources, I would give all of those young players a chance to start next year.  They could add multiple new starters at positions of need and still lean on all of those young kids.

Of the vets: Opeta is more than welcome for depth.  I'd like to see a proven LB1...and in competition with Dean for LB2, I'd sooner just recycle new parts instead of bringing back Leonard/Cunningham/Morrow.  Ditto WR3...just get some new spare parts and mid round picks to throw into the fray, no need for Julio/Watkins/OZ next year.

 

My hope, not my expectation, for new off roster starters in 2024: CB1, WR3, LB1.  That's a lot for one offseason.

2 minutes ago, BDawk_ASamuel said:

I remember some people thinking that they were "holding back” game plans for the playoffs. Was blowing the division and a home playoff game a part of that plan?

That was more hopium than reality clearly.

15 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

It’s week 17 and we have to use timeouts because Jack Stoll doesn’t know he’s supposed to be on the field and Julio Jones, a HOF WR, regardless if he’s washed or not, also doesn’t know what is going on. It’s coaching for sure, but it’s still why I don’t care about metrics. 

That’s why when you look at the Eagles offense the numbers look pretty good. Their biggest issue is that situationally they shoot themselves in the foot. It’s either a turnover, a bad play call or a penalty. It’s almost always one of those things that comes back and shoots them in the foot when things are going well. They can’t consistently stay out of their own way. They create their own problems on offense. And that goes to playcalling, turnovers, and penalties. The personnel on the offensive side isn’t the problem. (Remind me of the 2011 offense when vick was healthy. They had a lot of the same issues) 

The bigger issue to me is I look at the defense  I think they’ve a personnel problem, have a coaching problem and they draft and develop guys very well on that side. Since 2016 Carter, sweat, maddox and mills are the best guys they drafted and developed. So you got a multitude of issues and i think besides those issues while re-watching the game, they look exhausted and with not much fight left 

16 hours ago, LeanMeanGM said:

It must be good to be Eli Ricks to have people so mad they completely forgot he got his ankles broken harder than I can ever remember happening to an Eagles player. 

In honor of this it must also be really good to be Milton Williams who celebrated a tackle! instead of trying to pick up a loose ball. I completely forgot about that until now. 

1 hour ago, eagle45 said:

Here's a few scenarios:

Option 1: The Eagles hire a new OC next year.  He comes in with a new scheme, works with Hurts, and calls the plays.  It's a smashing success.  Hurts is great, offense is back to 2022, team is great...now 5 teams are lining up to offer him their HC job.  What do you think about this?  Do you really want Siri, who...at this point...definitively brings nothing schematic or tangible to the table as the HC of this team?  Would you promote this guy to HC and fire Siri?  Do you let him walk and invite another 2023?

Option 2: The Eagles hire a new OC (or maybe even HC) next year.  He comes in with a new scheme, works with Hurts, and calls the plays.  Nothing changes.  Same turnovers, inconsistencies, and frustrations with the passing offense as 2023.  How many years of that do you tolerate before hitting reset?

Option 3: Same HC, new OC.  In 2024, things are less excruciating than 2023, but not close to the dominance of 2022 either.  Fall short of making the SB.  The same group comes back for 2025, which is a clone of the 2024 season.  How many years of this do you tolerate before hitting reset?  Just wait for either a lightning in a bottle good year or a wheels falling off year, whichever comes first?

 

Keep in mind option 3 is the most likely scenario.  Things get better, but just sort of fade away over time without re-capturing 2022.  How long are you...are Howie/Lurie...happy to sit on that track?

 

Another option exists,  however unlikely it may be...

New QB. Bring in an OC and run Siri's actual offense that we haven't seen yet since he's been handcuffed with Hurts as his QB.

1 minute ago, RLC said:

Right now, this is our starting roster in 2024.

Hurts, AJ, Devonta, Goedert, Mailata, Dickerson, Jurgens, Steen, Johnson. Major holes: RB1, WR3, OL6, OL7.
Reddick, Davis, Carter, Sweat, Slay, Ringo, Brown. Major holes: LB1, LB2, S1, CB3.

It's really not that dire compared to most teams. 

It's not that dire at all.  But is it SB material?

I also think Dean is as projectable to LB2 as Ringo and Brown are to CB2 and S.  I say that as a "don't give up yet" on Dean but also a concern that it's very premature to pencil in Ringo and Brown as starters.  A Slay/Ringo duo could be very, very painful next year.

I wouldn't write Blankenship out of the lineup just yet.  If he's surrounded by competent cover guys, he could theoretically be used a bit like Malcom Jenkins closer to the LOS and sheltered from more challenging coverage assignments.

1 minute ago, HazletonEagle said:

Another option exists,  however unlikely it may be...

New QB. Bring in an OC and run Siri's actual offense that we haven't seen yet since he's been handcuffed with Hurts as his QB.

They've got $250m in Hurts.  Hurts will get a chance to do his thing with a new HC, but Siri will never run his offense with a different QB.

5 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

They have a clear lack of talent and coaching issue. However re-watching these games they are getting pushed around by inferior players and opponents. Either it’s a lack of effort or they seemed to be gassed. If you go watch from Miami game even through Buffalo that wasn’t the case. They played hard and were very physical. They were still the most physical team and ones pushing opponents around. Dallas it showed up at the end of the game. Either they’ve given up (maybe) or at some point in playing 10 out of 11 games down to the wire then having a ridiculous 92 snap game they’ve might have run out of steam to go with their lackluster personnel. 

I think they are worn. The rotation is Fd up and they have played an ish load of snaps since the Bills game. A result of being one of if not the worst on 3rd down. Davis nor Carter have ever played this many snaps. Cox played a ton of snaps and so on.

9 minutes ago, BDawk_ASamuel said:

I remember some people thinking that they were "holding back” game plans for the playoffs. Was blowing the division and a home playoff game a part of that plan?

Bucs are in for a world of trouble when we unleash not only a brand new offense, but also Penny