4 minutes ago, Joe Ball said:

I can get behind what you are saying being a Marine myself...but I can't hate a team and fanbase, it's just not in me. I am competitive, but I can't hate a team or fanbase over a game.

You haven't met enough Cowboy fans.  

24 minutes ago, RememberTheKoy said:

Jalen checked to that play when he threw it deep to DeVonta.

 

https://www.crossingbroad.com/2023/11/nick-sirianni-says-jalen-hurts-actually-checked-to-deep-bomb-for-devonta-smith.html

 

Sounds about right, that play isnt in Brian Johnsons 8 play tecmo bowl play book...

35 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

I still can’t believe Reid punted from their own 39. It’s baffling to see how so many teams coach so gutless against this team. 

I don't think its about going gutless against this team... I think its that they just don't play the analytics game like the Eagles do.  I see things like this in games around the league all the time.  A lot of teams aren't aggressive on 4th down, even now.

17 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

There's nothing wrong with punting from midfield.  As a coach, your players will make you look smart or dumb.  An NFL punter and coverage team should be expert at pinning the other team inside their own 10 yard line from there -- then your defense can apply huge pressure to the opponent.  A punt from the 50 that pins the other team at their 5-6 yard line is excellent.  It's good special teams work and complementary football.

Having said all that, punting from the 39-yard line was dumb.  Didn't make any sense there unless it was 4th and 12 or more.    

Oh there is. Big Reid did us a massive favor by BigRedding that call. It was absolutely the wrong decision in that situation. The upside of punting is ~35 net yds, the downside is 20 net yds. The upside of going for it is maintaining possession, with less than 35 yards to score a TD, the downside of a failed conversion attempt is 0 net yards. It's a simple equation to translate the frequency of these outcomes into win probabilities, and I'll give you a hint for what the math tells us, it's to go for it. 

1 minute ago, we_gotta_believe said:

Oh there is. Big Reid did us a massive favor by BigRedding that call. It was absolutely the wrong decision in that situation. The upside of punting is ~35 net yds, the downside is 20 net yds. The upside of going for it is maintaining possession, with less than 35 yards to score a TD, the downside if 0 net yards. It's a simple equation to translate the frequency of these outcomes into win probabilities, and I'll give you a hint for what the math tells us, it's to go for it. 

You're trying to argue that the 39 yard line is the same as the 50 yard line.  It isn't.

24 minutes ago, we_gotta_believe said:

Yeah it is crazy how the size of OL have changed over the decades. There was a cowboys game on thanksgiving where an older cowyboys lineman stood next to one that had retired recently at midfield, and the size difference was comical. I'll see if I can find a pic of it.

Yeah I think that's a fair way to frame it. 

A lot of those guys stop the vitamins that make them so big after they retire as well.  Joe Thomas isn't that big anymore.  And he's not alone.

 

Certainly not a 'small guy' now by any means, but likely a lot closer to 250 than his playing weight of 315.

6 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

You're trying to argue that the 39 yard line is the same as the 50 yard line.  It isn't.

The equation changes slightly at the 50 yard line, but with the same down and distance (4th and 4) the math still comes out in favor of going for it. The win probability bump you get for maintaining possession on the opponent's side of the field is too large to overcome with a 40 net yd punt. That's more indicative of the way the game is played these days, where the rules favor the offense so heavily. I think it comes down to the fact that a lot of coaches are still stuck in a mindset from an era when offenses weren't as potent.

19 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

There's nothing wrong with punting from midfield.  As a coach, your players will make you look smart or dumb.  An NFL punter and coverage team should be expert at pinning the other team inside their own 10 yard line from there -- then your defense can apply huge pressure to the opponent.  A punt from the 50 that pins the other team at their 5-6 yard line is excellent.  It's good special teams work and complementary football.

Having said all that, punting from the 39-yard line was dumb.  Didn't make any sense there unless it was 4th and 12 or more.    

It depends on the yardage needed (as you say).   4th and 4 or less... you go for it.   4th and long...  Punt the ball and hope to pin them deep.

1 minute ago, Iggles_Phan said:

A lot of those guys stop the vitamins that make them so big after they retire as well.  Joe Thomas isn't that big anymore.  And he's not alone.

 

Certainly not a 'small guy' now by any means, but likely a lot closer to 250 than his playing weight of 315.

That's definitely a factor too. The guy I was thinking of was in his 80's whereas the guy he was standing next to had retired in the last 5 years or so. 

16 minutes ago, Joe Ball said:

Hurts is a winner, simple as that. A lot of coaches would refer to him as a gym rat in basketball, he realizes what he needs to work on and gets better at his weaknesses, the transformation from '21 to last year was incredible. Because of his work ethic and his leadership he changes the whole dynamic of the locker room, yes he gets help from others like Kelce, but the team is his, because of his dedication to the game and the team first...guys are going to follow that all day, every day.

The next progression in his development as one of the best in the game will be pre-snap reads and audible calls, once he shows that ability at a high level and they give him the freedom to do so more often, he will kill opposing defenses IMO. I'm not saying he doesn't do it now, he just doesn't do it enough, from games I've watched.

Absolutely. You can have all the arm talent in the world but you don't have the intangibles you will not be successful. Leadership, winner attitude, calmness under pressure. Cannot be taught. You either have it or you don't. 

 

It’s kind of refreshing that Mahomes couldn’t get rid of the ball in under 2 seconds every drop back because our defense was too easy to decipher. I wish Desai was our DC in the Super Bowl. 

15 minutes ago, Joe Ball said:

I can get behind what you are saying being a Marine myself...but I can't hate a team and fanbase, it's just not in me. I am competitive, but I can't hate a team or fanbase over a game.

.  Thank you for your service.   I don't 'hate' the Cowboys or their fans... but it is very very close.   I'd rather spend time with a rabid dog than most Cowboys fans I have had the displeasure to meet in person.

9 minutes ago, Utebird said:

Sounds about right, that play isnt in Brian Johnsons 8 play tecmo bowl play book...

Which goes directly to my point about waiting until 1-2 seconds are left on the play clock. The defense had to show itself.

Also, if Brian Johnson doesn't include that play in the playbook, however did they check to it?

1 minute ago, just relax said:

Which goes directly to my point about waiting until 1-2 seconds are left on the play clock. The defense had to show itself.

Also, if Brian Johnson doesn't include that play in the playbook, however did they check to it?

Or that Johnson told Hurts if he got a certain look to check to it?

4 minutes ago, NCiggles said:

You haven't met enough Cowboy fans.  

 

3 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

.  Thank you for your service.   I don't 'hate' the Cowboys or their fans... but it is very very close.   I'd rather spend time with a rabid dog than most Cowboys fans I have had the displeasure to meet in person.

LOL...I am a Cowboys fan...I've met plenty. If you met me you would at least be able to put up with me. Hell, I got kicked out of the SF/Cowboy playoff game early in the 4th qtr year before last at AT&T because fans behind us (me, my brother and my son) wanted us to sit down...we were trying to get everyone to stand up and cheer during that a$$ whipping...SF fan starts cussing us out, we got tossed...stand your a$$ up and get into the game man...those are the Cowboys fans I can't stand.

8 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

I don't think its about going gutless against this team... I think its that they just don't play the analytics game like the Eagles do.  I see things like this in games around the league all the time.  A lot of teams aren't aggressive on 4th down, even now.

Yea, teams do it all the time around the league. My point is against THIS team, with THIS offense and THIS record, teams should routinely be going above and beyond to secure a win, yet, just don't. It's not even just 4th down. It's also going for 2 at end of games or not throwing challenge flags on iffy completions.

I mean if they want to make life easier for us, I'm all for it. I just don't understand why they choose to do so.

8 minutes ago, just relax said:

Which goes directly to my point about waiting until 1-2 seconds are left on the play clock. The defense had to show itself.

Also, if Brian Johnson doesn't include that play in the playbook, however did they check to it?

Yeah from what I understand, most of these checks are when two plays get called in via the radio, and the QB relays both of them in the huddle, then either decides to keep the first called play by calling for the snap at the LOS, or depending on what he sees, decides to check to the second play. But as you said, both plays are typically called in by the play caller (BJ in this case). Manning was one of the rare cases where he had almost free reign to audible to a much larger set of plays that might not have been necessarilly called in by the play caller or relayed in the huddle. Those types of audibles aren't nearly as common. McVay used to run a "check with me" system in Goff's first couple years, similar to what Chip had employed.

14 minutes ago, just relax said:

There's a lot to unpack here. Spagnuolo had some clever blitzes dialed up on the first half. He ran games with the DL and delayed blitzers, particularly on Lane's side. Stout made adjustments and there were no sacks in the second half. None. Coaching. I'll try to put something together when the All-22 comes out.

There is a reason the Eagles consistently wait until 1-2 seconds are left on the play clock - with so little time, defenses have to show themselves. It gives Kelce and Hurts time to read the defense.

Kelce helped Dickerson more than he should have and Jurgens less than he should have, IMHO. When Jones gets a clean shoulder, it's over unless you have help.

It did seem that way, but its good to know its true.   I look forward to the breakdown when you get a chance.   The adjustments made are so interesting.    

 

Side note:  Watching the Hannah highlights, I was reminded of the old blocking schemes... Watching Hannah slide out to take on edge rushers from the LG position was just fun to see again.   Remembering what I saw on the Crunch Course video from decades ago discussing how LT changed blocking schemes...  "They'd start by putting the RB on him.  Then they'd put the Guard on him.  Then they'd put the Tackle on him... and he'd beat them all."  

2 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

Or that Johnson told Hurts if he got a certain look to check to it?

Yes, Hurts didn't design a new play at the line.  All week they gameplan for certain situations and tell him to check to certain calls in certain situations.  Great recognition by Hurts but the coaches absolutely deserve credit too there

Glad to see the team came up ahead of the Chiefs.  It was rather disappointing in the 1st half when the offense was unable to advance the ball.  The defense did somewhat better, but could not put much pressure on Mahommes.  The contains at the edges were non-exisiting.  Even Mahommes is not a sprinter, it hurt to see our DL chasing him to no avail.

Things got better in the 2nd half.  The coaches made some changes, not sure what though.  Things began to improve.  Hurts had time to make throws and also gained yards on the ground.

The 2 Ss made plays.  Coverage on TE Kelce was good to limit his damage on the defense.  The funble was great to stall their advance.

Julio Jones has been with the team for a few weeks now.  He has not got many balls going to him.  With the injuries to the TE group, one would think Jones could see more action.  As a top WR for many years, he should be able to contribute more to the offense.  On the night when Brown was low on his production, Jones' stats were pretty thin.  The coaches better get him involved more and Hurts to look for him.

48 minutes ago, we_gotta_believe said:

lolwut?

If he's down prior to the pass, then it's not grounding at all, it's a sack.

Thank you. I wanted to say the same thing.

Eagles stole the meme from the blog! 

 

3 minutes ago, we_gotta_believe said:

Yeah from what I understand, most of these checks are when two plays get called in via the radio, and the QB relays both of them in the huddle, then decides to keep the first called play by calling for the snap at the LOS, or depending on what he sees, decides to check to the second play. But as you said, both plays are typically called in by the play caller (BJ in this case). Manning was one of the rare cases where he had almost free reign to audible to a much larger set of plays that might not have been necessarilly called in by the play caller or relayed in the huddle. Those types of audibles aren't nearly as common. McVay used to run a "check with me" system in Goff's first couple years, similar to what Chip had employed.

Coupled with the fact that audibles are really really difficult in that stadium. Had to be hand signals.

4 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Yea, teams do it all the time around the league. My point is against THIS team, with THIS offense and THIS record, teams should routinely be going above and beyond to secure a win, yet, just don't. It's not even just 4th down. It's also going for 2 at end of games or not throwing challenge flags on iffy completions.

I mean if they want to make life easier for us, I'm all for it. I just don't understand why they choose to do so.

Because the only teams the Eagles beat are teams that beat themselves... or so I've been told by some.   Therefore, they play it safe to not beat themselves, and in so doing... beat themselves.

33 minutes ago, DaEagles4Life said:

Again a dope point with the dropped passes because guess what the Chiefs have done all year and lead the league in, dropped passes so it wasnt an anomaly last night 

This team is 9 1 and what 23-2 with Hurts starting, at some point you come off as hater and with a loser mentality.

 

This was Mahomes 5th WORST game in his career according to success rate.  When he faced Johnny Gannon he had his 3rd and 7th best games of his career, but yeah this team is soooooooooo terrible.

I didn't say it was an anomaly last night and I didn't say they were terrible. Do you have a reading comprehension problem?

So you're going with the a-hole approach. Got it. Have a nice day