13 minutes ago, just relax said:

There are reasons for that. In college tackles are, in general, better athletes than guards. In college, guards often graduate to tackle. Latham is one of those. When you get to the pros, the speed and power of edge rushers demands greater athleticism from tackles, whereas guards can get away with more power and less finesse. Not the good ones, of course, but a lot of lesser ones.

However,

The best guards, and here I include Larry Allen and Zach Martin as examples, are tackles who switched to guard. Allen, in fact, played RT, then RG, the LT for the Turds before settling in at LG in his sixth year. He was great at all four positions but at LG he was a monster. Martin too went from tackle to guard and has been a perennial all-pro. Shawn Andrews and Todd Herremans were both drafted to play tackle but we had two tackles who were really good as tackles but, because of stature, were ill-suited to play guard, so Shawn and Todd played guard. They remained plenty good enough to play tackle but, as I say over and over, you put your best five guys out there and then sort them out.

Latham is probably as close to Shawn Andrews as any OL I've seen in a while. 

Rather have a Larry Allen than a Shawn Andrews. Best G play I have seen and I was watching Mike Munchak as a young man. (Imagine a 260ish G nowadays.)

15 minutes ago, just relax said:

There are reasons for that. In college tackles are, in general, better athletes than guards. In college, guards often graduate to tackle. Latham is one of those. When you get to the pros, the speed and power of edge rushers demands greater athleticism from tackles, whereas guards can get away with more power and less finesse. Not the good ones, of course, but a lot of lesser ones.

However,

The best guards, and here I include Larry Allen and Zach Martin as examples, are tackles who switched to guard. Allen, in fact, played RT, then RG, the LT for the Turds before settling in at LG in his sixth year. He was great at all four positions but at LG he was a monster. Martin too went from tackle to guard and has been a perennial all-pro. Shawn Andrews and Todd Herremans were both drafted to play tackle but we had two tackles who were really good as tackles but, because of stature, were ill-suited to play guard, so Shawn and Todd played guard. They remained plenty good enough to play tackle but, as I say over and over, you put your best five guys out there and then sort them out.

Latham is probably as close to Shawn Andrews as any OL I've seen in a while. 

You like Latham at tackle and don't have concerns about his athleticism? That seems to be the concern about him. I haven't seen any draft pundits say they think he won't be a good tackle. Just that it's a concern.

I do think it's notable the Eagles have been focusing on the great athletes of this class though in their visits and interviews.

15 minutes ago, BigEFly said:

Interesting the Eagles seem to be showing interest in OLB sized edges. Only some 260ish DEs. I think the lineup for the base D is shaping up to be DE, DT/NT, DT, OLB that can drop, MIKE, WIL, either an OLB or S depending on O, two CBs and two deep Ss.  Really could see DeJean as one of the wildcards.   Looking for athleticism at LBs, both OLBs and ILBs.  The CBs seem to be late rounders but ones that can tackle.  

If we want the OLB/edge to be able to drop in coverage, Jalyx Hunt is the #1 prospect for that position, for our team, in this draft.

If you had a need for a true SAM he can be that guy. If you want the Josh Sweat edge guy who can actually cover, its Hunt. 

He will have to develop pass rush moves because right now its all athleticism. But this guy has great measurables, and still possesses safety like movement skills from his safety days at Cornell. He is a unicorn. He will contribute in other ways right away while developing as a rusher. 

My player comp for Hunt is Connor Barwin. And for those who really remember Barwin as an eagle, he was a playmaker in various aspects of the game. Not a dominant, but a good pass rusher. But tons of tipped passes at the line, or PDs in coverage as well. Guy was just everywhere. He could play 4-3 SAM, or 3-4 OLB as well. Hunt is that guy. I believe Hunt is also still more agile than Barwin. His change of direction is fantastic despite his sizeable frame.

8 minutes ago, BigEFly said:

Interesting the Eagles seem to be showing interest in OLB sized edges. Only some 260ish DEs. I think the lineup for the base D is shaping up to be DE, DT/NT, DT, OLB that can drop, MIKE, WIL, either an OLB or S depending on O, two CBs and two deep Ss.  Really could see DeJean as one of the wildcards.   Looking for athleticism at LBs, both OLBs and ILBs.  The CBs seem to be late rounders but ones that can tackle.  

The nice thing about DeJean is that we can probably just play a ton of nickel then and leave him on the field almost all the time even if he is our "nickel CB".

When you want an extra LB, Blankenship can come down in to the box as that S/LB hybrid, while DeJean slides back to a safety spot. But when you want the nickel CB, Blankenship can play his safety role and you have DeJean out there. If teams try to motion some shifty slot guy, Gardner-Johnson can also rotate down to the slot as well. 

Youd have so much versatility with those 3 players as CB/S, and LB/S versatile guys, youd almost never have to come out of that personnel package and youd get a ton of usage out of your 1st round pick even if you stick him at "nickel". I put that in quotes, because he will be doing so much more than just being a nickel. 

 

Now if you get DeJean, AND Jalyx Hunt, the versatility really becomes even more fun because Hunt is another guy that can do almost unlimited things on the field for you.

If you want to play light boxes, then you need DTs + CBs who can stop the run. Too many teams run outside zone, so your CBs better be able to tackle. 

Ringo + DeJean as CBs are physical enough to let us play that way.

Gotta be honest, I have no confidence the Eagles will pick the right CB. Not saying they shouldn't take one because of that. At some point they're going to have to invest first rounders there. But I just lack confidence. Even in 2021 word is they had Horn rated over Surtain(although they liked both a lot). If they take a CB in round 1 and the guy turns out to not be a quality starting corner, I'm pretty much never gonna have confidence in them drafting that position again lol. If they go that route by the gods they better get it right. So badly need young top level guys at that position.

20 minutes ago, EricAllenPick6 said:

It's a strange call, but maybe?  Who's gonna sign a big $$ deal between now & August?  

This is all pretty typical moves for Howie.  Reward players who perform.  Sign them before it's necessary. 

It's a double edged sword - if you have a Carson Wentz situation, you end up with a ton of dead $$ (Carson benefitted financially by signing when he did...)  but we get to get used to the idea that we're building around DeVonta for the forseeable future.  The only question in my mind is would a move like this upset AJ Brown, who's really been the team's #1 receiver the last few years.  If DeVonta gets paid more (or similar) money, AJ Brown is gonna want a raise and an extensioj.

Well, you are suggesting that Smith should sign between now and August, are you not? 

 

20 minutes ago, RLC said:

Well, he's small and doesn't rely on athleticism so one major injury could cost him a big payday. He can't afford to lose a step.

Agree.   But he's 4 months away from any contact.   He's got no incentive right NOW to sign for less than he thinks he's worth.

9 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

Gotta be honest, I have no confidence the Eagles will pick the right CB. Not saying they shouldn't take one because of that. At some point they're going to have to invest first rounders there. But I just lack confidence. Even in 2021 word is they had Horn rated over Surtain(although they liked both a lot). If they take a CB in round 1 and the guy turns out to not be a quality starting corner, I'm pretty much never gonna have confidence in them drafting that position again lol. If they go that route by the gods they better get it right. So badly need young top level guys at that position.

They probably wont all pan out. But there doesnt really seem to be a wrong choice at CB.

I suppose some fans will grow tired of Wiggins tackling ability. But hes not a guy like Samuel who would dive out of the way. He has the mentality to tackle and does lay a big hit from time to time. In the meantime, youre going to get DRC type stickiness in man coverage so its not a horrible trade off. If thats as bad as you can do, thats not bad at all.

McKinstry might seem underwhelming at this point. But hes a carbon copy of Joey Porter from last year. A guy who was so damn good but got knocked down to the later part of round 1 and turns out hes a beast. Just lacked INT production. McKinstry lacks that because teams stopped testing him. They preferred to throw at Arnold, as good as he is. Think about that. McKinstry is lock down. If hes not going to get INTs but shuts down a side of the field, its a trade off. But its not a bad one. If thats as bad as you can do, thats not bad at all.

 

I supposed a couple weeks ago there was some smoke the eagles liked Rakestraw. He was oddly being mocked to them when no one actually seems to have him ranked high enough to justify that. He seems good but hes a tier below the rest of the actual deserving 1st rounders. If they try to outsmart everyone and take Rakestraw over DeJean, Wiggins, and McKinstry then I guess youll be right. In that case they likely picked the wrong guy.

6 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Agree.   But he's 4 months away from any contact.   He's got no incentive right NOW to sign for less than he thinks he's worth.

True. He does have mini-camps but the likelihood of injury is very low. Training camp is the real risk zone.

This is embarrassing. I think AI has trophies bigger than that.

 

5 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

This is embarrassing. I think AI has trophies bigger than that.

 

Its a very Commanders thing to do which sorta makes sense now that Harris owns them too. Even though that ridiculous Sean Taylor thing came under Snyders ownership.

First of all when I first heard of an AI statue I thought it would be at the arena. Thats embarrassing that its not there and no one will ever see it at the friggin practice facility.

This is the second embarrassing thing about it now, seeing the size. But they got it wrong to begin with, with the idiotic location they selected. 

They should stay in the sports complex and put the statue there for fans to see. And it should be a size that people would have expected. 

Gotta love Josh Harris' stupid face in that pic. One of the stupidest looking people I have ever seen in my life. 

1 minute ago, HazletonEagle said:

Its a very Commanders thing to do which sorta makes sense now that Harris owns them too. Even though that ridiculous Sean Taylor thing came under Snyders ownership.

First of all when I first heard of an AI statue I thought it would be at the arena. Thats embarrassing that its not there and no one will ever see it at the friggin practice facility.

This is the second embarrassing thing about it now, seeing the size. But they got it wrong to begin with, with the idiotic location they selected. 

They should stay in the sports complex and put the statue there for fans to see. And it should be a size that people would have expected. 

Gotta love Josh Harris' stupid face in that pic. One of the stupidest looking people I have ever seen in my life. 

Agree with all of this. 

Apparently all of the statues outside the facility are the same size.

The inspiration for the Iverson statue

 

25 minutes ago, RLC said:

True. He does have mini-camps but the likelihood of injury is very low. Training camp is the real risk zone.

Yup.   I think all parties want the deal done by the start of TC... which is why there's no rush right now.

Deniz was on PHLY today and actually made a compelling case to why the Eagles shouldn't go OL in round 1, and I don't entirely disagree with his logic.

I could basically take it as a direct counter to my post earlier about how hard OTs are to find, and if he would've made it in post form here as a reply, I'd definitely consider it a strong counter.

His point was basically, assuming we are minimum two years away from Lane retiring we have two more years after this year to find Lane's replacement. And while this seems to be a great tackle draft, unless they trade up really far, they'd still be taking a guy that the league consensus believes is not one of the top OTs in this draft. It's not like they're picking in the top 5 and can take Joe Alt. He argued for all we know the Eagles could have a top 10 pick next year or in 2026. Not even just their own, but for all we know Howie could make another trade for a future first and it ending up being a great pick again and they could find Lane's replacement then. And he argued that punting on the chance to get an impact guy who can play right now for a guy who will sit in two years is worth the risk of not being able to find that OT, because he thinks the chances are strong enough that they could down the road. And there's so many variables in two more years that could play out.

It's a fair point. Where I'd push back a little is just because the Eagles may take the OT the league thinks is the consensus 4th or whatever best in this class, doesn't mean he will be. For one, taking a project like Mims that other teams might be afraid to take, could end up the best OT in the draft, especially under Stoutland. Also, sometimes the league is wrong. Lane Johnson wasn't the first OT taken and turned out to be the best by far.

But his point is well taken. He also thinks taking OG in the first round isn't great value either. Wanted the Eagles to go defense in round 1. He was not high on what they did on defense in free agency.

1 hour ago, BigEFly said:

Interesting the Eagles seem to be showing interest in OLB sized edges. Only some 260ish DEs. I think the lineup for the base D is shaping up to be DE, DT/NT, DT, OLB that can drop, MIKE, WIL, either an OLB or S depending on O, two CBs and two deep Ss.  Really could see DeJean as one of the wildcards.   Looking for athleticism at LBs, both OLBs and ILBs.  The CBs seem to be late rounders but ones that can tackle.  

Yep. Fangio is big on light boxes and two-deep safeties. Plays some cover-6 (I learned what that is from you) and looks for speed underneath, which we should have with White and Dean. While I like Colson, he doesn't seem like the type of MIKE Fangio wants unless he truly believes he can stop the run with four guys, in which case a thumper like Colson would be useful.

5 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

Deniz was on PHLY today and actually made a compelling case to why the Eagles shouldn't go OL in round 1, and I don't entirely disagree with his logic.

But his point is well taken. He also thinks taking OG in the first round isn't great value either. Wanted the Eagles to go defense in round 1. He was not high on what they did on defense in free agency.

He's making an optionality argument, which is very reasonable. 

8 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

Deniz was on PHLY today and actually made a compelling case to why the Eagles shouldn't go OL in round 1, and I don't entirely disagree with his logic.

I could basically take it as a direct counter to my post earlier about how hard OTs are to find, and if he would've made it in post form here as a reply, I'd definitely consider it a strong counter.

His point was basically, assuming we are minimum two years away from Lane retiring we have two more years after this year to find Lane's replacement. And while this seems to be a great tackle draft, unless they trade up really far, they'd still be taking a guy that the league consensus believes is not one of the top OTs in this draft. It's not like they're picking in the top 5 and can take Joe Alt. He argued for all we know the Eagles could have a top 10 pick next year or in 2026. Not even just their own, but for all we know Howie could make another trade for a future first and it ending up being a great pick again and they could find Lane's replacement then. And he argued that punting on the chance to get an impact guy who can play right now for a guy who will sit in two years is worth the risk of not being able to find that OT, because he thinks the chances are strong enough that they could down the road. And there's so many variables in two more years that could play out.

It's a fair point. Where I'd push back a little is just because the Eagles may take the OT the league thinks is the consensus 4th or whatever best in this class, doesn't mean he will be. For one, taking a project like Mims that other teams might be afraid to take, could end up the best OT in the draft, especially under Stoutland. Also, sometimes the league is wrong. Lane Johnson wasn't the first OT taken and turned out to be the best by far.

But his point is well taken. He also thinks taking OG in the first round isn't great value either. Wanted the Eagles to go defense in round 1. He was not high on what they did on defense in free agency.

Not bad points, but two counters to that:

1) Top OT in the class or not, we have Stoutland.  After what he did with Mailata, as long as he feels good about the player it doesn't matter for us if they're a consensus top-10 talent or not. 

2) Lane may *want* to play for two more years, but Lane also gets hurt a good bit lately.  We haven't really noticed too much because Lane is a beast and he plays through whatever is bugging him.  But should he get bit with something that he can't play through?

And now that I think about it, a third counter is:

3) We still have Steen.  He's always been a natural tackle.  Locking down a starting guard and having him move back to a backup tackle role is not the worst outcome. 

9 minutes ago, just relax said:

Yep. Fangio is big on light boxes and two-deep safeties. Plays some cover-6 (I learned what that is from you) and looks for speed underneath, which we should have with White and Dean. While I like Colson, he doesn't seem like the type of MIKE Fangio wants unless he truly believes he can stop the run with four guys, in which case a thumper like Colson would be useful.

Colson looks like a thumper but I think he's decently athletic

Zach also made a good point. He said everyone has kind of just assumed that the Eagles internally would put CB as their top immediate need or some other position on defense, but they may have RG as their biggest immediate need right now for all we know. Especially after Kelce retiring. So he would not be surprised to see them take an OT who could play RG in round 1.

4 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

Zach also made a good point. He said everyone has kind of just assumed that the Eagles internally would put CB as their top immediate need or some other position on defense, but they may have RG as their biggest immediate need right now for all we know. Especially after Kelce retiring. So he would not be surprised to see them take an OT who could play RG in round 1.

Funny everyone assumes they'll take a T that can play G. Maybe they just take a G if that's the need. 

3 minutes ago, hukdonfoniks said:

Not bad points, but two counters to that:

1) Top OT in the class or not, we have Stoutland.  After what he did with Mailata, as long as he feels good about the player it doesn't matter for us if they're a consensus top-10 talent or not. 

2) Lane may *want* to play for two more years, but Lane also gets hurt a good bit lately.  We haven't really noticed too much because Lane is a beast and he plays through whatever is bugging him.  But should he get bit with something that he can't play through?

And now that I think about it, a third counter is:

3) We still have Steen.  He's always been a natural tackle.  Locking down a starting guard and having him move back to a backup tackle role is not the worst outcome. 

What Mailata has become is incredible but at the same time, nothing became of Jack Driscoll or Sua Opeta and multiple other OL who have been brought in. I don't think Stoutland is going to just make any OL a good one.

Unpopular opinion, I think we overrate Stoutland just because of Jordan Mailata. Of course, Mailata will always be his claim to fame, but it also doesn't hurt when you have Pro Bowl, All-Pro and HOF talent to coach on the line. We complain an awful lot about the running game year in and year out. Stoutland is the run game coordinator. Surprised he doesn't get any criticism when it comes to that.

Jeff Stoutland is a top coach and his players love him. I just don't think it's safe to assume that any OL is going to be good just because he's here. 

 

1 minute ago, HazletonEagle said:

Funny everyone assumes they'll take a T that can play G. Maybe they just take a G if that's the need. 

My preference for Latham is based on my belief that he can play guard at a very high level, then move to tackle,, where I believe he can play at a very high level. Other than Latham, I have little interest in drafting a straight-up guard.