8 minutes ago, Ace Nova said:

It’s not just "blitz rate” it’s WHEN to Blitz, how to blitz, how you "disguise” your blitz’s, scheming how to get your best pass rushers through, etc etc etc.

 I’m not a defensive mastermind by any means but most people that have watched the game for decades would tell you the same thing.  
 

And I tend to agree that it’s most likely a combination of personnel and not necessarily "fitting in” with the scheme but if that’s the case, you need to do the best with what you have and PLAY to their STRENGTHS  NOT the other way around - which Fangio has been notorious for.  He’s a "my way or the highway” type of guy.

We won the Super Bowl with half the team injured and the backup QB.

Why and how?  Because we adjusted our scheme and played to their strengths.

If we want to win that’s what needs to be done - plain and simple. 

The one difference?  Gannon used press coverage a lot more.

Maddox played over DeJean b/c DeJean missed camp and had no clue what he was doing out there. Look for that to change after the buye week.

Fangio made a great adjustment against NO, but seemed clueless against TB, it didn't take a genius to figure against two high and 3 DL, TB would go to the short pass game. Those soft cushions are begging teams to dink and dunk to the red zone - but they couldn't stop them in the red zone.

This is pathetic. These are the Eagles 1st quarter drives. This team is so unprepared to start games.

 

 

I forget where I heard it but I think it was the Eagles have had the hardest schedule in the NFL so far in terms of DVOA and the rest of the season they have 5th easiest.

In no particular order:

Nick, Fangio, Hurts, Slay, Maddox, Dean, N. Smith, Huff, Sweat, Wilson, Gainwell, White, Rodgers, Burks, Calcaterra, Stoll and Ricks can all be shown the door/traded. 

Might throw Davis in there as well if we could get some value for him.

5 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

I forget where I heard it but I think it was the Eagles have had the hardest schedule in the NFL so far in terms of DVOA and the rest of the season they have 5th easiest.

NO = 3
GB = 10 (2 games with backup QB too)
TB = 14
ATL = 15

We've yet to play a bad team. 

Eagles are 21 in DVOA. 12 on offense. 26 on defense. 23 on ST.

46 minutes ago, D.WATSfromda757 said:

😂more selective nerd bullsht. Y’all dudes a trip

Nothing but emojis    But you know selective nerd bs that hurts has 5 fumbles and 7 turnovers already, defense has been bad majority of the year so far (statically proven) and the coaching being underwhelming yet again this through 4 games and that for past 13 they’ve been as bad as 2020 record wise and turnover wise…  but everything is just bullsht 

5 minutes ago, RLC said:

NO = 3
GB = 10 (2 games with backup QB too)
TB = 14
ATL = 15

We've yet to play a bad team. 

Eagles are 21 in DVOA. 12 on offense. 26 on defense. 23 on ST.

There is no such thing as a tough schedule in the NFC. Who's the best Qb in the conference? Goff?

17 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

This is pathetic. These are the Eagles 1st quarter drives. This team is so unprepared to start games.

 

 

It's been a weird approach. It feels like the "first 15" doesn't really exist, it's just Moore running basic plays to see how the defense responds to different packages. Then he makes the adjustments at half time which the Offense has been pretty good at. For comparison, the drives coming after halftime:

vs. Green Bay

2 plays, 70 yards, TD

3 plays, -4 yards, punt

vs Atlanta

10 plays, 64 yards, FG

18 plays, 70 yards, TD

at New Orleans

11 plays, 43 yards, turnover on downs (Thanks Nick!)

8 plays, 36 yards, punt

at Tampa Bay

5 plays, 70 yards, TD

8 plays, 58 yards, fumble 

 

I have a suspicion not really based on anything concreate that it's someone like Kevin Petullo whose responsible for the first opening script of plays. I mostly think this because it's a lot of the maddening issues we've seen over the years like not giving Barkley the ball at all or having bad RPO's and QB draws. It looks like nothing changed from last year besides a little more motion. 

4 hours ago, Iggles_Phan said:

I want to circle back to this notion of Lurie being a great judge of coach talent.   The proposed measuring stick being that every coach made the playoffs by their second year... But I wonder if that's the right standard to use.

 

Ray Rhodes... 10-6, 10-6, 6-9-1, 3-13.    Was Ray a great hire?   Nah.  He brought in really old players with one or two last hurrahs in the tank and when those vets fell off, the team went into a tailspin.  His 'leadership' style got old really quick and there wasn't much substance to it.  Limped into the playoffs twice, but were never contenders.

Andy Reid - I don't need to get into this.  Great hire, the only coach that lasted here.  Lots of playoff appearances, 1 Super Bowl appearance.  He had the Achilles heel of bad WR evaluations and never could seem to get that right.   Perennial contenders for a while, that always fell short in the playoffs... usually due to bad WR play and/or QB play, possibly due to bad WR play.

Chip Kelly - out of the box hire, leaving the WCO behind.  The innovative offensive revolution that was promised turned out to be 4 plays that he runs in fast succession.  Once the NFL DCs figured him out, it was over.   Good hire?   The scars left behind were real.  Yes, they made the playoffs once, but was never a contender.  And the team fractured.

Doug Pederson - Landed the only Lombardi trophy this team has won.  Great hire?   When you look at that as the outcome, the answer has to be yes.  But, if we are talking about whether or not Doug is a great coach, I think the jury says "No" and the magic sauce of 2017 was an aberration.   Wentz went downhill, Doug lost his lieutenants, and it came crashing down fairly quickly. 

And now we have Nick Sirianni - similar path to Doug, but fell short in the Super Bowl.  Great hire?  Once again we see that he's completely dependent on the coordinators around him.  Lost the coordinators, lost the locker room because its just not in him and they aren't able to cover for him anymore.

 

So, is Jeff a great judge of head coaches?   I'd say that he's really not great.   He really got it right one time with Reid, and even he had to go elsewhere to really put it all together when he got the all-world QB, as opposed to the almost great QB.   The rest of the time the success has been more talent related rather than scheme and the schemes have staled very quickly with each of the other hires.  As they were found out by the others around the league, they weren't able to adapt and fizzled out fast.  We are seeing that with Sirianni right now.

 

What we see with Lurie's hires is a quick uptick, and then just as fast a drop back to the mean of where they were when the new coach was hired.  Is that a function of the new coach, or just the breath of fresh ideas and the bump from that to the locker room.  But then the freshness wears off quickly and the bump is quickly eroded.   For me, a great hire should be able to land a second contract with the team, not be fired in 5 years or less.   I don't think there's a right answer to this, but its the bye week.   Why not delve deeper into the depths of the franchise's organizational philosophy a little more.

Bc howie has drafted poorly

19 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

I forget where I heard it but I think it was the Eagles have had the hardest schedule in the NFL so far in terms of DVOA and the rest of the season they have 5th easiest.

In the offseason they were calling it an easier schedule than 2023 IIRC

15 minutes ago, NOTW said:

The GA guys were high picks for a reason. Our own returning players yes there's a decline with age or injury. A free agent like Huff did more last year with the Jets in a part-time role, has done nothing here. Rodgers was on his way to being a starter in Indy before his suspension. Jordan Davis had a good rookie year, people were complaining they limited his snaps. The run defense last year suffered when Dean got hurt. CJGJ played better in his prior run with us, and he and Blankenship complemented each other well. Q is new, thank goodness for him. 

You're right that the problem is a mix of talent and coaching. So currently where things stand, you can't make major changes to the roster. But the experienced veteran coach can make changes to play to the strengths of the players.

You also have a GM that doesn't have a defensive philosophy other than try to load the D line in the draft. They have to decide if they want to be a 4-3 or a 3-4 team and what type of players. Because they now have all these small, weak pass rushing specialists. They should have drafted a traditional DE in the last couple years. 

There is enough talent to not be a bottom-of-the-league defense. The defense too often looks like they give up or aren't playing hard enough. They get demotivated easily, especially when the offense doesn't score or has a turnover or quick 3 and out. 

A lot of it is also philosophy, coaching, accountability from the top down at all levels.

Meh.  High picks fail in the NFL all the time for a variety of reasons.  So, just because they were high picks doesn't mean that they are guaranteed to work out, OR that they were the right picks.   Picking a DT/NT in the top half of the first round needs to be a true game changer.  He needs to be Vince Wilfork level impact.  Davis isn't that guy.  He might have the physical talent, but he doesn't seem to have the drive or will to be in shape enough to be able to provide what Wilfork did.. which was to play 75+% of the snaps for his team for the bulk of his career.  Davis is topping out at 50%.  And that's after getting put on ice midway through his rookie year when they brought in Linval Joseph and Ndamukong Suh.  He rookie was underwhelming.

Rodgers is a guy that has never really been a starter, and then had to take a year off due to the suspension.  Is he the kind of player that can handle working on his craft without coaches to tell him what he's doing wrong and keep him improving, or is he going to regress because he's been away from the game for a year?   Given his ST play pushing a player into his punt returner because he doesn't understand the rules, that indicates that he's not the type that can do it on his own.

 

And Howie loves to bring in guys that the Coordinators can't figure out how to use, or refuse to use.  Gerard Avery... LJ Fort... and now Bryce Huff.  Brilliant.

 

But, I'm not sure how much real talent is on this defense.  I don't think its enough to be a top half of the league defense.  The DL is underwhelming.  The LBs are inconsistent and the secondary has one player with promise, one that's a solid but unspectacular safety... one that's undisciplined, and one that's overdue at the old folks home.   There's still hope for DeJean.  Hopefully we'll get to see him after the bye.  But, this defense doesn't seem to have enough talent to crack the top 15 defenses.  The question is can they scrape enough good performances to be outside the bottom 10 defenses versus falling into the bottom 5.   Right now, they are a bottom 5 defense as I look at them.  There can be improvement, I just don't see it getting much higher than about 18th-20th in the league.

3 hours ago, Joe Ball said:

Please no...for several reasons. Remaining contract and age being the biggest. Not to mention the lack of cap room over the next two years since the Dak contract debacle, I just don't see how DAL could possibly make this happen without a restructure of his remaining years...and they still need to attempt to extend Parsons, which I am not certain they can do without even factoring in this potential trade. I mean I am sure they could try and make it work, but at what cost and hamstringing the roster/cap for years. IDK. Maybe I am not understanding Adams' remaining contract hit. DAL has bigger issues to resolve and whomever they try to replace McC with will be stuck for a while with the results of these decisions, again IDK, but I don't think this would be a good move for DAL. 

With the remaining contract how does anyone afford Adams? What am I missing? Cap hits of 44 and 45 million?

 

Two things -- first, an acquiring team only inherits the salaries and the per game roster bonuses. The $7.85mm of deferred singing bonus hits the Raiders cap. Second, none of the 2025 or 2026 money is guaranteed, so you can just cut him or restructure/resign. It's basically getting him for just over $1mm per game in 2024.

40 minutes ago, Ace Nova said:

It’s not just "blitz rate” it’s WHEN to Blitz, how to blitz, how you "disguise” your blitz’s, scheming how to get your best pass rushers through, etc etc etc.

 I’m not a defensive mastermind by any means but most people that have watched the game for decades would tell you the same thing.  
 

And I tend to agree that it’s most likely a combination of personnel and not necessarily "fitting in” with the scheme but if that’s the case, you need to do the best with what you have and PLAY to their STRENGTHS - NOT the other way around - which Fangio has been notorious for.  He’s a "my way or the highway” type of guy.

We won the Super Bowl with half the team injured and the backup QB.

Why and how?  Because we adjusted our scheme and played to their strengths.

If we want to win that’s what needs to be done - plain and simple. 

The trouble is that Siri and the coordinators don’t seem to smart enough to be able to do that. 
 

Siri thinks he’s some mastermind but he’s a Fing dope with low iq, we’ve seen it to many times to think otherwise 

2 hours ago, EricAllenPick6 said:

Spotrac lists a potential out after this season, with a $16mil dead cap.  So, those 2025 and 2026 numbers are pure fantasy, designed to increase the AAV of his contract without actually paying him more money.  Nobody is paying him that.  So, in essence, this would be a trade for the rest of this season and the team he is traded to would have to release him and take that $16mil dead cap next season.

There would be no dead cap to the acquiring team if they cut him after this season. That dead money hits the Raiders cap for the deferred signing bonus when they trade him.

43 minutes ago, Ace Nova said:

It’s not just "blitz rate” it’s WHEN to Blitz, how to blitz, how you "disguise” your blitz’s, scheming how to get your best pass rushers through, etc etc etc.

 I’m not a defensive mastermind by any means but most people that have watched the game for decades would tell you the same thing.  
 

And I tend to agree that it’s most likely a combination of personnel and not necessarily "fitting in” with the scheme but if that’s the case, you need to do the best with what you have and PLAY to their STRENGTHS - NOT the other way around - which Fangio has been notorious for.  He’s a "my way or the highway” type of guy.

We won the Super Bowl with half the team injured and the backup QB.

Why and how?  Because we adjusted our scheme and played to their strengths.

If we want to win that’s what needs to be done - plain and simple. 

I don't disagree that the scheme doesn't need tweaking, but the talent just doesn't match up to 2022 either.

29 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

This is pathetic. These are the Eagles 1st quarter drives. This team is so unprepared to start games.

 

 

Well, partly because they have chosen to NOT take points on multiple 1st quarter drives.  

3 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Meh.  High picks fail in the NFL all the time for a variety of reasons.  So, just because they were high picks doesn't mean that they are guaranteed to work out, OR that they were the right picks.   Picking a DT/NT in the top half of the first round needs to be a true game changer.  He needs to be Vince Wilfork level impact.  Davis isn't that guy.  He might have the physical talent, but he doesn't seem to have the drive or will to be in shape enough to be able to provide what Wilfork did.. which was to play 75+% of the snaps for his team for the bulk of his career.  Davis is topping out at 50%.  And that's after getting put on ice midway through his rookie year when they brought in Linval Joseph and Ndamukong Suh.  He rookie was underwhelming.

Rodgers is a guy that has never really been a starter, and then had to take a year off due to the suspension.  Is he the kind of player that can handle working on his craft without coaches to tell him what he's doing wrong and keep him improving, or is he going to regress because he's been away from the game for a year?   Given his ST play pushing a player into his punt returner because he doesn't understand the rules, that indicates that he's not the type that can do it on his own.

 

And Howie loves to bring in guys that the Coordinators can't figure out how to use, or refuse to use.  Gerard Avery... LJ Fort... and now Bryce Huff.  Brilliant.

 

But, I'm not sure how much real talent is on this defense.  I don't think its enough to be a top half of the league defense.  The DL is underwhelming.  The LBs are inconsistent and the secondary has one player with promise, one that's a solid but unspectacular safety... one that's undisciplined, and one that's overdue at the old folks home.   There's still hope for DeJean.  Hopefully we'll get to see him after the bye.  But, this defense doesn't seem to have enough talent to crack the top 15 defenses.  The question is can they scrape enough good performances to be outside the bottom 10 defenses versus falling into the bottom 5.   Right now, they are a bottom 5 defense as I look at them.  There can be improvement, I just don't see it getting much higher than about 18th-20th in the league.

I agree with the problems you listed. It's personnel, scheme, players that fit the scheme, execution and coaching.

As we sit at the bye week after 4 games, the coaches can make changes that can improve the defense adequately. A lot can change after this season. Nick can get fired and a new HC will get a whole new staff so changing roster to fit Fangio may be moot. But if they do keep Siri and Fangio then they will at least evaluate the players in his scheme and see what that means for offseason changes.

So my point is, what does Fangio do about it now? Howie has not made good trade deadline moves, so I don't see a big answer coming via trade. I think he has to change some things schematically and also bench some guys. A lot of fans say bench Maddox and play DeJean, I agree. Bench Slay for Ringo, perhaps. Have the corners press at the line more, more single high safety, other ideas. Blitz more, etc. There are things the coach can do to adjust. But will Fangio do that, or be stubborn?

17 minutes ago, ToastJenkins said:

Bc howie has drafted poorly

Also true.

24 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Nothing but emojis    But you know selective nerd bs that hurts has 5 fumbles and 7 turnovers already, defense has been bad majority of the year so far (statically proven) and the coaching being underwhelming yet again this through 4 games and that for past 13 they’ve been as bad as 2020 record wise and turnover wise…  but everything is just bullsht 

Don't waste your time with that kid. He's a diehard qb1 squirter. He'll go down with his lover no matter how bad his play is

31 minutes ago, Swoop said:

In no particular order:

Nick, Fangio, Hurts, Slay, Maddox, Dean, N. Smith, Huff, Sweat, Wilson, Gainwell, White, Rodgers, Burks, Calcaterra, Stoll and Ricks can all be shown the door/traded. 

Might throw Davis in there as well if we could get some value for him.

Bradberry as well

49 minutes ago, Ace Nova said:

It’s not just "blitz rate” it’s WHEN to Blitz, how to blitz, how you "disguise” your blitz’s, scheming how to get your best pass rushers through, etc etc etc.

 I’m not a defensive mastermind by any means but most people that have watched the game for decades would tell you the same thing.  
 

And I tend to agree that it’s most likely a combination of personnel and not necessarily "fitting in” with the scheme but if that’s the case, you need to do the best with what you have and PLAY to their STRENGTHS - NOT the other way around - which Fangio has been notorious for.  He’s a "my way or the highway” type of guy.

We won the Super Bowl with half the team injured and the backup QB.

Why and how?  Because we adjusted our scheme and played to their strengths.

If we want to win that’s what needs to be done - plain and simple. 

I’d argue that broncos defense was absolutely stacked. They had Malik Jackson in his prime (we got him down side of his career and he got injured) Demarcus ware who was still great at that point, von miller in his prime, Chris Harris, talib, roby and TJ Ward. Doesn’t include solid starters of Wolfe, Marshall and trevathan. Credit to fangio cause he got them playing at the absolutely highest level and maximizing the talent. However having a stacked defense would make a lot of schemes and coordinators look a hell of a lot better. Imo eagles 2022 stacked pass rush made Gannon look better then what i think he is. 

5 minutes ago, Godfather said:

Don't waste your time with that kid. He's a diehard qb1 squirter. He'll go down with his lover no matter how bad his play is

I don’t really care if you are a hurts fan or not. He is not playing well right now. His fumbles and turnovers were an issue last year and eventually caught up to him. I much rather hurts be the guy and not even have to have the discussion. But if we want to just ignore it all and absolve him from any blame that’s just like he keeps saying "bullsht”  

Thoughts on bye week adjustments to try and save/salvage this season:

Offense:

- Feed Barkley more at the beginning of games to help get off to a better start. I'm over watching incompletion, 2nd and 10 predictable run stuffed for no gain, 3rd down short of the sticks, punt. Becton is a MUCH better run blocker than pass blocker at guard, so let's not overcomplicate things. Get Barkley going, and even rotate in Gainwell and Shipley. In 2022 I felt like we'd come out and run it until the other team adjusted to stop it, and that opened up the passing game

- If Hurts trusts Calcaterra more than Dotson, then run more 12 personnel. Get the opponent in base defense and open things up for AJ and DeVonta

- Just get rid of the RPO game. It's been solved by opposing defenses

- Bring back the TE and RB screens. I feel like Goedert is a massive weapon on TE screens when he gets moving in space

- More 2 back looks with Barkley + Shipley/Gainwell

Defense:

- Accept what Huff is, not what we paid him to be. He's a situational pass rusher who should be on the field in 2nd and 3rd and long only. Play BG and Nolan on base downs as they are the best run defenders at edge

- Use more base 5 DL looks on 1st down (BG/Williams/Davis/Carter/Smth). Gannon did this a ton in 2022, and it worked. Stops the run, and if they pass, someone like Carter or BG is likely to have a one on one look. Sorry BG, you're going to play a bunch of snaps out of necessity

- Cooper DeJean is the slot CB. Maddox is cooked and DeJean is more physical

- Mix in Trotter Jr. to split snaps with Dean. I wonder if Dean gets worn down at this size

- More press, especially on 1st down. If you have 5 DL, make the QB hold the ball if they are looking to throw. 

- Blitz Baun more often

1 minute ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

I don’t really care if you are a hurts fan or not. He is not playing well right now. His fumbles and turnovers were an issue last year and eventually caught up to him. I much rather hurts be the guy and not even have to have the discussion. But if we want to just ignore it all and absolve him from any plan that’s just like he keeps saying "bullsht”  

It's not his fault. Ask @jsb235. It's all the defense fault that qb1 is playing like he has been

Yikes