The vote will be something like 26-6 against the ban. It'll be overwhelming.

2 minutes ago, DEagle7 said:

Sign Simmons and pray?  My biggest issue in these locks is unless I go safety early I don't really like the available options. I'm sure that's mostly lack of knowledge on my part though

Yeah I get it. This is why I am hoping we bring Goedert back. I'm going to be arrgavated if two of the first 3 picks go to offense. 

Jordan Davis was known to be a raw project as a draftee - in part because of the low snap count on that great Georgia D and DL. He was also physically in need of maturing, so its not a surprise its taken him time to show his stuff. I don't think Rocker was ever capable of getting the best out of Davis; one year of Hurtt and the finish to that awful season made an impression.  The kid needs to show is he more than just a NT though.

At worst, if you have a NT that can stop the run and open up opportunities around him, is that such a bad thing? All depends on the cost

Marcus Williams has more upside than Simmons. The only thing Simmons has going for him is familiarity. Williams had a bad 2024, but he's still only 28. I think there's less of a chance he's washed than there is for Simmons who is several years older. Williams was really good in 2023.

And of course Blackmon.

 

19 minutes ago, Waiting4Someday said:

Cross train Adore Jackson?

I doubt that. I guess Brown but I'm not much of a fan especially as a starter. Simmons or Blackmon on the Tuesday after the draft could be a fall back option. I think Simmons would wait to sign like he did last year but no idea if Blackmon would. 

1 hour ago, Sack that QB said:

I'm torn on what's a bigger need right now Edge or DT. I lean Edge, but the case for both.

Edge: you lost your #1 Edge in Sweat. Signed two guys who are boom or bust, but let's be real, taking the Eagles rose colored classes off, they are more likely to bust than boom. Uche hasn't produced in a couple years and Ojulari had little interest around the league for a reason. That's not to say neither can surprise like Baun did, but if I'm going by what is likeliest? Both being meh is most likely. Then that leaves you with Nolan and Hunt as your main guys who are still somewhat unproven with very little behind them. And as long as you have Carter at DT you'll never be awful there. And you have Ojomo who I like and Davis who is solid.

DT: Carter is amazing, but even though I like Ojomo, he's still not a sure thing. And Davis is solid, but he's never been trusted to handle major snaps for a reason. He hasn't developed as hoped. You pair Carter with a stud DT and that line is going to be so nasty even without a blue chip guy on the Edge. And there's still lingering veteran guys on the market you could add at Edge later if you really wanted to like Za'Darius Smith and Von Miller. The DT market is pretty depleted. So you might have more of a luxury to gamble at Edge in the draft, because there's a safety net waiting for you after the draft in free agency, where at DT there really isn't. If you strike out at DT in the draft, your guys are what they are and it's good luck.

I still lean Edge, but I think it's pretty close. And of course depends on the player. If a guy like Walter Nolen is there, he may be too good to pass up even if you think Edge is a bigger need.

They’re both needs, but if neither Davis nor Ojomo can handle 60% of the snaps as a starter, my vote would go to DT as the "bigger” need 

 

 

2 hours ago, T-1000 said:

I just started to do some research on the draft this week and will likely go into "full draft mode" starting this week. However, from the little bit of stuff I have gathered this seems like the type of draft where there will be a ton of surprises in the 10-40 range with a lot of guys going much earlier or later than consensus.  As you said a lot of people had Nolan Smith had a top 15, and possibly even top 10 pick and he fell to us at 31. Jahmyr Gibbs was supposed to be a late first/early second round pick and he went 12th. Things like this happen every year and this appears to be the type of draft where it could happen quite a bit. I wouldn't rule out any edge rusher or DT possibly falling to 32 other than Carter and Graham. Obviously you look at guys like Walker and Williams and they are less likely to be there than someone like Stewart or Ezeiruaku but who knows. It just drives me up a wall when people who cover the draft every year make stupid statements like "that guy has NO CHANCE of making it to pick so and so." The other day I heard John McMullen say that there was "no chance James Pearce Jr. will be there at 32" which while unlikely is far from "no chance." 

Anyway, great post and I am glad you brought this up. It's like every year people's brains melt and they forget years of watching/covering the draft and all of the crazy stuff that happens. That's a major part of the reason that the draft is so amazing to watch because you just never know what's going to happen and things go sideways all of the time.

I think anyone who ignored the internet narrative on Gibbs and actually watched him knew he was a top 10 or 15 prospect by talent and the projections were all based on positional value.

I think it’s a bit different this year because the talent is more niche. Gibbs was a guy who would be successful anywhere, whereas this year most of the prospects are very scheme specific.

I think it’s fairly clear that Davis not only is disappointing for a 13th pick in the draft, but also someone that we burned other assets to secure him via trade up.

That doesn’t make him a bust or not a useful player, but you certainly would hope for more than a 1- and sometimes two-down player. He simply doesn’t play enough to be considered a hit at his draft slot. And he doesn’t play enough to have earned the fifth-year option either. Maybe that changes next season. 

In a way I hope they ban the play just so the Eagles can still convert short yardage with a QB sneak or RB play with the O line dominating so everyone can STFU about it, and other teams can still whine about not being able to stop the Eagles. 

If it is banned, the Eagles need to submit a rule that no ball carrier can ever be pushed from behind by other players, because that happens all the time too when guys are trying to get a 1st down. But then you have to take that to an absurd level and say only 1 defensive player can tackle a ball carrier, you can't get assistance from someone else. The whole thing is absurd and just crybabies who can't handle being dominated by a dominant O line and QB who is a strong runner.

I think people are getting hung up on position again when talking pick 32. No one cares what position got picked if the player doesn't turn out to be good.  For me the big qualifier is does the player have a reasonable path to being a starter in year 1 or year 2.  I wouldn't take a backup swing tackle with the first pick unless that guy played guard and then most often that guy is a guard and not really a tackle at all.  At 32 I'd say TE & S are on the table.  I don't think they'd invest that high a pick in a 2nd LB or 3rd WR which I guess counters my own argument but I don't think they'll see the value in those positions given the team makeup.

Thinking about it and Sirianni has the largest active HC tree in the NFL tied with Sean McVay currently.

I'm a fan of Josaiah Stewart, however, I'm not sure how or where he fits in with Vic exactly. He's under 6'2 with sub 32" arms. He seems like a pure standup outside edge, but not sure if Vic is going to want or need that style of guy.

I see him wanting the bigger longer guy that can set the edge. He already made comments on how Smith is undersized. I'd think Stewart is gone somewhere in round 2 so you would have to use a high pick on him. Just unsure with the state of the edge room if they want another undersized player especially needing to use a higher pick, and he'd be the smallest of them all... 

33 minutes ago, NOTW said:

The whole thing is absurd 

But... here we are talking about the NFL in March... which is what they really want.  So... either way, they win.

2 hours ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Well I would challenge the theory that only 50% of picks 1 through 16 in any draft turn into "solid NFL starters” and challenge what that even means considering the person that made the statement is creating his own scoring system. There was never any statistical proof presented to support the argument that the first round has a 50% hit rate either. Feels much more like a generalized assumption. 

If you believe the theory should be challenged, then absolutely you should challenge it. That’s what discussion on this board is all about. We go forward with various thoughts and ideas, and in most cases there isn’t just one right answer, but rather multiple right answers, which depend on how you frame the problem.

In terms of the underlying data that exists behind the article, all you gotta do is ask the guy who wrote the article for that data.  I would imagine he would love to be contacted.

Unlike RTK‘s situation in which the tweet poster had a first name and nothing else,  the guy writing the article has clearly identified himself, so there’s way to dig down and do due diligence

With that said, just like with PFF, there is a whole lot of subjectivity in the player assessments that are a key part of the data … lots of wiggle room and gray area.

2 hours ago, greendestiny27 said:

I doubt that. I guess Brown but I'm not much of a fan especially as a starter. Simmons or Blackmon on the Tuesday after the draft could be a fall back option. I think Simmons would wait to sign like he did last year but no idea if Blackmon would. 

 

1 hour ago, ManuManu said:

I think it’s fairly clear that Davis not only is disappointing for a 13th pick in the draft, but also someone that we burned other assets to secure him via trade up.

That doesn’t make him a bust or not a useful player, but you certainly would hope for more than a 1- and sometimes two-down player. He simply doesn’t play enough to be considered a hit at his draft slot. And he doesn’t play enough to have earned the fifth-year option either. Maybe that changes next season. 

The option is a bargain for what he provides

1 hour ago, greendestiny27 said:

I'm a fan of Josaiah Stewart, however, I'm not sure how or where he fits in with Vic exactly. He's under 6'2 with sub 32" arms. He seems like a pure standup outside edge, but not sure if Vic is going to want or need that style of guy.

I see him wanting the bigger longer guy that can set the edge. He already made comments on how Smith is undersized. I'd think Stewart is gone somewhere in round 2 so you would have to use a high pick on him. Just unsure with the state of the edge room if they want another undersized player especially needing to use a higher pick, and he'd be the smallest of them all... 

I think the answer to where he fits is laid out in the video I shared with Just Relax on Thursday.  

 

30 minutes ago, mattwill said:

If you believe the theory should be challenged, then absolutely you should challenge it. That’s what discussion on this board is all about. We go forward with various thoughts and ideas, and in most cases there isn’t just one right answer, but rather multiple right answers, which depend on how you frame the problem.

In terms of the underlying data that exists behind the article, all you gotta do is ask the guy who wrote the article for that data.  I would imagine he would love to be contacted.

Unlike RTK‘s situation in which the tweet poster had a first name and nothing else,  the guy writing the article has clearly identified himself, so there’s way to dig down and do due diligence

With that said, just like with PFF, there is a whole lot of subjectivity in the player assessments that are a key part of the data … lots of wiggle room and gray area.

I don’t know what article you are referencing. You linked a message board post by someone named Tom who claims to have done the work but shows nothing concrete or even debatable. Just "I looked at the last 20 drafts and just trust me.” Must be some huge coincidence he landed on an even 50% work out and 50% don’t. 

And again, "he could be worse” isn’t a great argument about someone’s worth and what was used to get him.

3 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

I don’t know what article you are referencing. You linked a message board post by someone named Tom who claims to have done the work but shows nothing concrete or even debatable. Just "I looked at the last 20 drafts and just trust me.” Must be some huge coincidence he landed on an even 50% work out and 50% don’t. 

And again, "he could be worse” isn’t a great argument about someone’s worth and what was used to get him.

22 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

I don’t know what article you are referencing. You linked a message board post by someone named Tom who claims to have done the work but shows nothing concrete or even debatable. Just "I looked at the last 20 drafts and just trust me.” Must be some huge coincidence he landed on an even 50% work out and 50% don’t. 

And again, "he could be worse” isn’t a great argument about someone’s worth and what was used to get him.

It was an article on 247 sports which is a website much like SB nation that has individual team components much like bleeding green nation is one of the team components of SB nation

11 minutes ago, mattwill said:

It was an article on 247 sports which is a website much like SB nation that has individual team components much like bleeding green nation is one of the team components of SB nation

I think you should check again because it was literally a Browns message board and a post from a random user. There is no article. But hey he got 5 likes and some replies to his post, so good stuff. 

You could even just read the link which contains "Cleveland Browns” "Board” right in there.

https://247sports.com/nfl/cleveland-browns/board/105323/contents/odds-of-becoming-a-quality-player-in-the-nfl-by-draft-round-211678773/

All of this Jordan Davis back and forth is silly. It's actually quite simple. Davis has been the high level run stuffing NT the Eagles hoped he would be. However, he didn't develop into a pass rusher at all which they said they thought he would become. Therefore, he has neither been a bust or worth the pick/assets they traded to move up for him, but somewhere in between. Not every pick is a home run or bust in fact most are somewhere in the middle.

1 hour ago, mattwill said:

I think the answer to where he fits is laid out in the video I shared with Just Relax on Thursday.  

 

They also talk about DT Norman-Lott whom I like quite a bit. Could be a solid fall back option to Nolen.