2 minutes ago, mattwill said:

The gunslinger mentality and actions start long before the snap of the ball. If we use your definition, then Philly Philly wasn’t a gunslinger play.

The play call wasn't up to Hurts, it was Sirianni's call. Philly Special was Foles' call.

But, they are dramatically different for other reasons. The Dagger was against an already defeated opponent. It was 27-0, late in the 3rd quarter and the game was well in hand, in fact, they didn't need any more points.

The Philly Special was just before the half when the score was 15-12.

Apples and oranges to compare the two.

Fun conversation. But, the gunslinging I was referring to was about a game long thing, not a moment in time. Incidentally, I would say that Foles did gunsling against Brady in SB LII... Lots of big moment throws on BOTH sides, which is what makes it such. It wasn't a lopsided affair. Foles had the deep TD to Jeffery, Philly Special, TD to Clement, another deep pass that ended as an INT that should have been a completion to Jeffery, the 4th and 1 to Ertz, and then finally the go ahead TD to Ertz. Brady was the first to ever pass for over 500 yards in the SB, IIRC. That's a duel. Hurts vs. Mahomes in the first Super Bowl matchup could be considered one... sadly, one the Eagles lost. On the flip side, this most recent matchup doesn't have that duel relationship of back and forth, etc. And that's what makes the difference in my mind.

1 hour ago, paco said:

Rank the follow plays:

The Dagger

Vid

The Philly Special

Vid

The Strip Sack

Vid

#1 by a mile is Philly Philly. In the 272 games every season played by the 32 teams you see plays like the Dagger and the Strip Sack executed by other players, so neither are as unique as Philly Philly.

#2 for me would be the strip sack and #3 would be the Dagger. There is more drama in the strip sack. Much more time to watch it unfold.

JMO

5 minutes ago, BigEFly said:

Mahommes makes more of those mistakes than people realize. He’s got a bit of Favre in him.

lolwut? Mahomes averages an int for every 56 attempts which is comparable to Brady who was among the best all-time at limiting turnovers, whereas Favre averages an int for every 30 attempts.

22 minutes ago, mattwill said:

Regarding your second paragraph, very true, but Ronald McDonald never played for the Eagles.

Edit: Tose did preside over the Vermeil era that produced the Eagles first Super Bowl trip. So it wasn’t all bad. You are correct that the gambling problem resulted in a bad ending for the Tose era.

Ronald McDonald did not, but Fred Hill did. And it was a partnership between CHOP, McDonalds and the Eagles that got the RMHC started... because of Fred Hill's daughter and her leukemia diagnosis.

31 minutes ago, mattwill said:

It isn’t a zero sum game. There is plenty of room for both to be true. Super Bowl LII is a perfect example. Jim Bunning’s perfect game against the Mets is another example.

We will disagee in this case. That is disrespectful to say to Vic and the defense because they didn't give him time and were in his face constantly hitting him. They earned the right to call it domination vs someone playing poorly. Saying the latter waters it down. They deserve better.

26 minutes ago, mattwill said:

The gunslinger mentality and actions start long before the snap of the ball. If we use your definition, then Philly Philly wasn’t a gunslinger play.

I don't think you can use any definition to classify the philly special as a gunslinger play. It was a completely coordinated play with only one possible (positive) outcome.

2 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

The play call wasn't up to Hurts, it was Sirianni's call. Philly Special was Foles' call.

But, they are dramatically different for other reasons. The Dagger was against an already defeated opponent. It was 27-0, late in the 3rd quarter and the game was well in hand, in fact, they didn't need any more points.

The Philly Special was just before the half when the score was 15-12.

Apples and oranges to compare the two.

Fun conversation. But, the gunslinging I was referring to was about a game long thing, not a moment in time. Incidentally, I would say that Foles did gunsling against Brady in SB LII... Lots of big moment throws on BOTH sides, which is what makes it such. It wasn't a lopsided affair. Foles had the deep TD to Jeffery, Philly Special, TD to Clement, another deep pass that ended as an INT that should have been a completion to Jeffery, the 4th and 1 to Ertz, and then finally the go ahead TD to Ertz. Brady was the first to ever pass for over 500 yards in the SB, IIRC. That's a duel. Hurts vs. Mahomes in the first Super Bowl matchup could be considered one... sadly, one the Eagles lost. On the flip side, this most recent matchup doesn't have that duel relationship of back and forth, etc. And that's what makes the difference in my mind.

All true, and I agree good conversation. Gunslinging for me doesn’t have to be game long. Gary Cooper in High Noon is definitely a gunslinger but until the showdown actually happens and he slings his guns you would never know he was a gunslinger, and almost immediately after the showdown happens he reverts back to his non gunslinger persona, but there is no question that he was a gunslinger throughout the movie

JMO

Honestly, even if they wanted Grant, I'm glad it turned out the way it did. They obviously need a Lane heir apparent at some point, but I want to repeat, and if taking Grant caused them to miss out on Robinson(or another DT closely ranked) then I'll pass. DT is pretty thin. It was a bigger need. Grant wouldn't have played in 2025 barring disaster.

Also notable is while everyone focused on Cameron Williams, Hinton seems to be the OL that hyped Stout up the most.

27 minutes ago, RLC said:

There's just no way we got sniped there. Grant was always a late 3rd/early 4th guy. He could have just take him at 96. We traded back. If we loved him, he's an Eagle. We didn't.

Agreed 100%.

I suspect Stoutland’s assessment of Grant was that he was an outstanding athletic fit as a Stoutland University matriculation, but that he never would be big enough.

3 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

Yeah, I don’t think we loved him enough to pass on the trade down (obviously) but that doesn’t mean he wasn’t the guy they hoped to get at 101.

I think Ty Robinson was the target all along. Closest player to Williams in the draft. It’s like Milton with a dose of Big Nasty in him.

16 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Ronald McDonald did not, but Fred Hill did. And it was a partnership between CHOP, McDonalds and the Eagles that got the RMHC started... because of Fred Hill's daughter and her leukemia diagnosis.

Never knew that. Have no knowledge of Fred Hill ever playing for the Eagles. My bad.

12 minutes ago, Diehardfan said:

We will disagee in this case. That is disrespectful to say to Vic and the defense because they didn't give him time and were in his face constantly hitting him. They earned the right to call it domination vs someone playing poorly. Saying the latter waters it down. They deserve better.

Again you are seeing it as an either/or zero sum game. When an actor wins the Best Oscar for his performance, are the other nominees for Best Actor disrespected?

10 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

Honestly, even if they wanted Grant, I'm glad it turned out the way it did. They obviously need a Lane heir apparent at some point, but I want to repeat, and if taking Grant caused them to miss out on Robinson(or another DT closely ranked) then I'll pass. DT is pretty thin. It was a bigger need. Grant wouldn't have played in 2025 barring disaster.

Also notable is while everyone focused on Cameron Williams, Hinton seems to be the OL that hyped Stout up the most.

Agree on both points.

Additionally, Hinton may be an OT, and Williams may become a guard. Supposedly they talked to him about Becton's transition to G.

Thatd be huge, literally and figuratively if you have those 2 monsters as the future RT/RG combo.

6 minutes ago, mattwill said:

Never knew that. Have no knowledge of Fred Hill ever playing for the Eagles. My bad.

Just now, Iggles_Phan said:

You learn something new every day. @FranklinFldEBUpper would remember Fred Hill and be able to cite his statistics.

1 hour ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Easily the worst ever.

Jerry Wolman deserves consideration.

17 minutes ago, mattwill said:

Again you are seeing it as an either/or zero sum game. When an actor wins the Best Oscar for his performance, are the other nominees for Best Actor disrespected?

Because it is. That's not even close to the same thing, but if you want to use that then the actor who won only won because the others Anything other than the Eagles defense dominated is disrespectful. Saying he crapped the bed takes away from the Eagles.

Underrated moment of The Dagger: watch Devonta's ball flip to the ref after he pops up off the ground. Ref has his arms up signaling a TD and Devonta drops a dime directly into his hands 😆

2 minutes ago, hukdonfoniks said:

Underrated moment of The Dagger: watch Devonta's ball flip to the ref after he pops up off the ground. Ref has his arms up signaling a TD and Devonta drops a dime directly into his hands 😆

Holy crap, he didn't even have to adjust. Just close his hands around the ball.

45 minutes ago, paco said:

What a lot of people forget about Rodgers (or choose to ignore) is he won his Super Bowl with the Packers from the #6 seed, where not a lot was expected from them. They went into the playoffs hot (much like TB did with Brady) and carried that through. As soon as Rodgers had expectations on him he failed time and time again in the playoffs -- year after year. Every year, after that failure, he would blame others -- coach, GM, defense, kicker -- whoever he could throw under the bus.

The 2011 season where the Packers went 15-1 then one-and-done losing to the Giants in the playoffs was the beginning of defining Aaron Rodgers, at least for me.

9 minutes ago, hukdonfoniks said:

Underrated moment of The Dagger: watch Devonta's ball flip to the ref after he pops up off the ground. Ref has his arms up signaling a TD and Devonta drops a dime directly into his hands 😆

Everything about that play was perfect.

31 minutes ago, mattwill said:

Again you are seeing it as an either/or zero sum game. When an actor wins the Best Oscar for his performance, are the other nominees for Best Actor disrespected?

Does that even work? Usually the other actors aren't in the same movie/show. So I think you should have used something else

Offense was the way it was because the defense just absolutely dominated Chiefs offense

20 minutes ago, we_gotta_believe said:

lolwut? Mahomes averages an int for every 56 attempts which is comparable to Brady who was among the best all-time at limiting turnovers, whereas Favre averages an int for every 30 attempts.

Interceptions being all against the QB is a bad measure. A significant portion of interceptions are on the receiver. Favre didn’t run like Mahomes. So many of his interceptions were ones where Mahomes would run and Favre would throw. Be interesting to see as those ankle injuries add up if that begins to impact Mahomes and as Kelce retires. But gunslinger are the unscripted plays that Mahomes and Favre both would do. Mahomes is coming off a two interception/one fumble game. Mahomes ball placement is good but it is not as good as Brady.

2 hours ago, paco said:

Rank the follow plays:

The Dagger

Vid

The Philly Special

Vid

The Strip Sack

Vid

#1. Strip sack -- by a wide margin. The Eagles defense was so terrible in the second half we were almost assuming NE was going down the field to take the lead there. Big part of why I was so livid on the non-call against Van Noy on the Eagles 2-point conversion pass to Clement, which would have made it 40-33.

#2 -- Philly Special. Even though I was ultra confident the Eagles would win the game going in (unless, cheating) that TD gave me the feeling this was truly the Eagles' day.

#3 -- Dagger. I would actually put a few other plays ahead of this one. Because of how the Chiefs schemed to defend Barkley, this throw was there all day long. That was simply the moment the Eagles decided to call it. It was a fine throw and catch, but its value is celebratory more than contributory.