Just now, greend said:

So I'll ask you this, isn't it more "stupid" to not worry about having enough starting weapons , before you worry about the back-up quarterback?  Also in all honesty a second round pick quarterback probably isn't going to win you many games anyways if he has to start. But imagine a 2nd round d- back or running back or even a freaking guard?

In most circumstances I agree with you, but the Eagles have a starting QB who doesn’t finish any seasons — so, at the end of the season when the games count, the backup QB is the starting QB.

I would have doubled-up on WR at #53.  I’d have followed the Reagor pick by taking Denzel Mims.  I’m just more inclined than most to accept Doug and Howie’s rationale at face value than some others.  
 

No, I don’t agree with taking Hurts in Round 2, and it’s been very discouraging that Doug thinks plowing him into the DL is the best way to use him.  Like I said right after the draft, though — if Wentz goes down with injury and Hurts comes in and wins important games then the pick will be justified.  Or, if Wentz plays two more crummy games against CLE and SEA and Hurts comes in and gets a couple of wins in relief — that works, too.

6 minutes ago, dawkdaballhawk said:

Are we saying having Wentz as QB requires us to also have a #2 QB that is also considered a starter?

 

I'm not, if that's what you are asking

14 minutes ago, greend said:

I mean it could be but....................... 1 man was able to make it happen so in my book it can be done

We know it can be done. Or did we just see 1 great year like with so many. 

Just now, Alphagrand said:

In most circumstances I agree with you, but the Eagles have a starting QB who doesn’t finish any seasons — so, at the end of the season when the games count, the backup QB is the starting QB.

I would have doubled-up on WR at #53.  I’d have followed the Reagor pick by taking Denzel Mims.  I’m just more inclined than most to accept Doug and Howie’s rationale at face value than some others.  
 

No, I don’t agree with taking Hurts in Round 2, and it’s been very discouraging that Doug thinks plowing him into the DL is the best way to use him.  Like I said right after the draft, though — if Wentz goes down with injury and Hurts comes in and wins important games then the pick will be justified.  Or, if Wentz plays two more crummy games against CLE and SEA and Hurts comes in and gets a couple of wins in relief — that works, too.

Okay, at least we agree on this part. I don't think Hurts is winning us any meaningful games.

Just now, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

We know it can be done. Or did we just see 1 great year like with so many. 

Time will tell and hopefully it wasn't just 1 great year.

I don't think I'll ever like that pick. Might have even been the nail in the coffin for Howie IMO

41 minutes ago, Desertbirds said:

Most, if not all, of the RBs, LBs, DBs would start (or play significant minutes) for the Eagles.

Agreed.  The path to starting in our back seven would have been much easier.

2 minutes ago, greend said:

Okay, at least we agree on this part. I don't think Hurts is winning us any meaningful games.

Perhaps not, but I think the Eagles are better at the position with Hurts than they were with McCown or Sudfeld, and I think it would have been negligent not to bring in a new #2.

Near the end of last season I started a thread to ask who the #2 QB would be for 2020.  Andy Dalton was the only available alternative IMO at that time, and he might have chosen the Turds anyway, being from Texas.

50 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

QB is a more premium position than any of the others; it’s not a luxury.  
The Eagles decided they couldn’t draft a #2 QB in the 3rd/4th round.  They could have drafted Jake Fromm or Jacob Eason; they chose not to.

Winston threw 30 INT last season.  For all the griping about Wentz’s play this season, that’s who Winston has been his entire career.  We’ll see how he does the next few weeks.

There isn’t any romanticizing about having a #2 QB who can win important games.  The Eagles had one with Foles.  There wasn’t one moment in last year’s playoff game when anyone could seriously believe Josh McCown was going to win that game — and he is objectively a better QB than Sudfeld.  Howie has already said Sudfeld is gone after this season.  Wentz was the Eagles only chance last season, and when he went out the season was done.  The Eagles feel as though they’ve filled that void with Hurts — we will likely see for sure.

The Eagles needed a #2 QB.  You didn’t like how they went about it, but neither you or I make that decision.  There was rationale for it.

 

It is a luxury when you are paying a franchise QB and just use a 4th round pick the previous year and failed miserably, failed to develop sudfeld so you again missed an opportunity to draft another position cause you aren’t exactly good at identifying talent. Taking a backup QB in the second round to try and solve that problem you failed to do with developmental guys like thorson and susfeld and you created about 6 other holes because your GM can’t draft well enough is imo considered a luxury. Add on your roster isn’t good enough for your franchise starter to have consistent success week in and week out  but our backup is going to come in find it? I don’t buy that. If you didn’t waste picks and had a good roster around your QBs I’d buy it. They don’t. They are very likely to lose with a backup cause the talent around him isn’t good enough. They had success with foles cause it was a great roster and foles played well. I can’t say the first part is true right now.

They need a backup cause the eagles are not good to developing decent backups (foles already developed when he came back and had success). it’s not like the eagles have done a bang up job at scouting the position besides Carson who’s regressed 

and I’d take Winston’s 30-30 season and 5000 yards as my backup cause i think he has more potential than jalen hurts and at least some success in the nfl. He was a better prospect coming out and I’m looking forward to seeing if Payton gets the most out of him. Cause if he does at the price they are paying him then it was an outstanding move  

and yes it is romanticizing about having a backup QB that can save you if wentz goes down. That is not the normal of what happens. The usual case is exactly what happened with mccown. If your starter goes down in a playoff game, your backup with no reps and coming in cold isn’t likely winning you a game. It is what happens about 9 times out of 10 in the nfl when your starting QB gets hurt. ESPECIALLY with a depleted roster of basically no talent on offense with ertz hurting, sanders out and Greg ward as your best receiver.  that’s the norm. The outlier is having a backup who comes in and is good enough to win consistently. That’s the reason why the eagles went QB in the second is hoping to find that backup if wentz went down who could carry them, win games and not fall completely apart. Otherwise why are you taking one in the second round unless it is to replace wentz. 

again i never said don’t draft a backup and develop them. There way of going about it and over drafting one was ridiculous and due to what foles accomplished when taking over and wentz being slightly injury prone.

However It’s more ridiculous to call yourself a QB factory when you wasted a pick the previous season on one who didn’t even make it through training camp, you failed to develop sudfeld over 3 years but hyped him up like he was going to be a competent backup. And wentz now seems to regress and you can’t seem to fix the issues. A QB factory imo would be able to fix wentz not be completely lost on how too. Theyve been bad outside of wentz at scouting them. Heck if wentz fails going forward then really what QB have they scouted that would justify them knowing what they are doing? And yet they fancied themselves enough to call themselves a QB factory and be smug about taking one in the second round 

just like there was rationale for the 6 other positions on offense and defense they should’ve have drafted because they would actually potentially start and make a 4 year impact. I’m pretty sure covering WRs in a passing league and pass rush is something that’s at a premium price when you go try and get it on the FA market or via trade. Idk having a potential starting cb or DE in the fold seems more valuable then the backup QB in the second round who you hope best case scenario only plays when doing gadget plays and with a poor roster likely not winning either  

I’d be willing to bet a lot of money jalen hurts isn’t nick foles because of a crap roster built around him. when he takes that field and isn’t likely winning much of anything with this bad roster if wentz gets hurt. 

9 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

Perhaps not, but I think the Eagles are better at the position with Hurts than they were with McCown or Sudfeld, and I think it would have been negligent not to bring in a new #2.

Near the end of last season I started a thread to ask who the #2 QB would be for 2020.  Andy Dalton was the only available alternative IMO at that time, and he might have chosen the Turds anyway, being from Texas.

We didn't need to throw a second round pick at the problem.  This team was clearly going through a transition from the Super Bowl roster to a much younger team.  It had already chosen to move on from Jenkins and Peters (at that time).  Indulging in what is merely a roster concept rather than adding talent to a position of need (i.e. mediocre starters) was seemingly an act of hubris.

I am trying not to join the Wentz hate train, but it's difficult. It is apparent the offensive line is a mess and he doesn't have enough time. But sometimes he overthrows or stands around too long. I don't know what to think.

Just now, dawkdaballhawk said:

I am trying not to join the Wentz hate train, but it's difficult. It is apparent the offensive line is a mess and he doesn't have enough time. But sometimes he overthrows or stands around too long. I don't know what to think.

I don't know....a bunch of new offensive coaches and concepts, a revolving door at WR, injuries at OL/TE/RB, and a shiny new 2nd round pick backing you up.  I can see why he may not be comfortable with the current environment.

That said, he needs to put on his big boy pants and do better.

1 minute ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

I don't know....a bunch of new offensive coaches and concepts, a revolving door at WR, injuries at OL/TE/RB, and a shiny new 2nd round pick backing you up.  I can see why he may not be comfortable with the current environment.

That said, he needs to put on his big boy pants and do better.

Especially when I compare Aaron Rodgers "down years" to Carson.

It is tough to dispute Rodgers' claim. Though his completion percentage in 2019 dipped to 62 - his worst performance in that category since 2015 - he still had 4,002 yards passing with 26 touchdowns and just four interceptions. His interception percentage of 0.7 was the best in the NFL.

5 minutes ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

We didn't need to throw a second round pick at the problem.  This team was clearly going through a transition from the Super Bowl roster to a much younger team.  It had already chosen to move on from Jenkins and Peters (at that time).  Indulging in what is merely a roster concept rather than adding talent to a position of need (i.e. mediocre starters) was seemingly an act of hubris.

On top of this, how is hurts going to come in if wentz gets hurt and win with a below average to bad roster? If wentz gets hurt, hurts likely comes in and also struggles and they likely aren’t very good cause the roster around him stinks. It would be one thing if the roster was good enough, you did it and had hope that he could come in and win a talented roster. No offense unless Mahomes, Wilson, and Rodgers and maybe a few others are our backup no one is winning anything remotely worthwhile with the roster we currently have due to poor decisions and less than stellar drafting  . 

20 minutes ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

We didn't need to throw a second round pick at the problem.  This team was clearly going through a transition from the Super Bowl roster to a much younger team.  It had already chosen to move on from Jenkins and Peters (at that time).  Indulging in what is merely a roster concept rather than adding talent to a position of need (i.e. mediocre starters) was seemingly an act of hubris.

I would say perhaps the folly of not having another pick until #103 ..... but they went off the reservation a bit with the Davion Taylor pick there as well.

injury report for today. Lots of illnesses. Pretty much all backup players though.

 

3 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

I would say perhaps the folly of not having another pick until #103 ..... but they went off the reservation a bit with the Davion Taylor pick there as well.

I hated the Taylor pick as much as the Hurts pick. In what world do the Eagles develop linebackers?  Using a 3rd on a project at a position you clearly don't know how to evaluate and use talent was just another wasted pick.  

3 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

I hated the Taylor pick as much as the Hurts pick. In what world do the Eagles develop linebackers?  Using a 3rd on a project at a position you clearly don't know how to evaluate and use talent was just another wasted pick.  

I think the other thing with that is... In what world can the Eagles afford the time to develop LBs? They needed help at the position from early in the year. And surely on this team with the LBs we have they could have found a starter at the position in the third round?

1 minute ago, bpac55 said:

I hated the Taylor pick as much as the Hurts pick. In what world do the Eagles develop linebackers?  Using a 3rd on a project at a position you clearly don't know how to evaluate and use talent was just another wasted pick.  

In fairness besides RB (some good and bad), OL and DL what positions have the eagles really drafted/evaluated and developed well? I’m hoping wallace pans out cause they haven’t drafted and developed a safety in what feels like over a decade  

 

23 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

On top of this, how is hurts going to come in if wentz gets hurt and win with a below average to bad roster? If wentz gets hurt, hurts likely comes in and also struggles and they likely aren’t very good cause the roster around him stinks. It would be one thing if the roster was good enough, you did it and had hope that he could come in and win a talented roster. No offense unless Mahomes, Wilson, and Rodgers and maybe a few others are our backup no one is winning anything remotely worthwhile with the roster we currently have due to poor decisions and less than stellar drafting  . 

Those guys would still have to deal with the bonehead play calling, the Oline, and the receivers

People act like we're just a QB away from going deep into the playoffs lol

Just now, Mike030270 said:

People act like we're just a QB away from going deep into the playoffs lol

Yeah you're absolutely right there. We are several players away. I mean off the top of my head... We are at least a couple of LBs away, and at least an outside corner away and at least a safety away. And that's just on D. 

So if we’re to believe the current injury report and guys who practiced there’s a good chance we will see an OL of Peters-Seumalo-Kelce-Herbig-Johnson, with Fulgham, Reagor, Jeffery, Ward at WR, and both Ertz and Goedert available at TE, and Sanders with Scott at RB?  
 

That seems about as healthy as it’s gonna get.  Time to start scoring points 

 

10 minutes ago, Mike030270 said:

Those guys would still have to deal with the bonehead play calling, the Oline, and the receivers

People act like we're just a QB away from going deep into the playoffs lol

The thing with the playoff game last year was if hurts is out there i still don’t think they win. So we were all in awe of Carson carrying that depleted roster of a kidney lacerated ertz, sanders out, Brooks out and ward as our best WR to get to the playoffs. Yet we think just a decent backup QB would have won and did what wentz did over the last month of the year with that roster and a defense that really any time seattle needed a play could get it. Then i guess what wentz accomplished the last month of the season wasn’t all that impressive if a backup could win with that depleted roster too 

17 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

In fairness besides RB (some good and bad), OL and DL what positions have the eagles really drafted/evaluated and developed well? I’m hoping wallace pans out cause they haven’t drafted and developed a safety in what feels like over a decade  

 

It's a problem for sure.  Who actually is being drafted and developed?  Not just guys who can suit on and play on Sundays but who is progressing every year from part time contributor, to starter to good/very good/elite.  The list is short if there is one.

They added Curry and Clement to the  COVID list

Just now, Mike030270 said:

They added Curry and Clement to the  COVID list

time to call up Ostman! Let the great career begin.