4 minutes ago, RLC said:

Using Ertz to sneak into the playoffs is my nightmare.

Thank god Arcega-Whiteside is back!

2 minutes ago, Ace Nova said:

Err... the CB was playing the pass and didn't break inside until Hurts handed the ball off.  Assuming it was a "read option"... Hurts would have needed to completely sell the play action in order for it to have been a big play to Reagor.  And that's assuming the CB gets blocked on the screen.  (He was playing the pass so he likely wouldn't of broke "as hard" inside if it was a screen).

Could have been a decent play if it was played "perfectly" (and if it actually was a "read option")....but how often does that happen with a rookie QB who has a total of 3 passes in the NFL?  

What? The guy covering Reagor moved in before the ball was even snapped and didnt even attempt to play the pass.

24 minutes ago, phil77 said:

 

 

Yes but we weren't looking at where they ranked in the NFL we were looking at big differnces I thought?  

I think the initial Rappaport tweet had more to do with QB's essentially "falling off a cliff" vs just a "drop" from being "elite" to "very good".  But I appreciate your research. 

I think the Favre comparison (especially because of similar playing style to Wentz) is the more telling out of the two.  Would be interesting to see if he had any major coaching/scheme changes or injuries during that time period.

 

17 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

I tend to think NRC and the onslaught of nickel corners was Jims call. 

Then that's a bad call. I mean in a passing league where offenses use multiple WR sets inside corners are at a premium, know what else is at a premium?

Outside corners.

The eagles won the super bowl allocating the least amount of money in the league to corner and one of the highest to safety, and it worked.

Then they go away from that and spend on corner and less on safety.

Which is fine except the money to corner is going to an overrated older nickel, NRC and am aging over paid Slay with nothing else at corner or safety.

Mcleod makes about 10 mil a year and while he's not a problem he's JAG. 10 mil is a bit much for JAG.

Whether it's howie making the personnel decisions or Schwartz or a combined effort it hasn't worked outside of 2017.

 

Cheesers 37- Epitome of 2020 17

@In2football

16 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Thats it? Easy fix.

I actually agree with Zach Berman who discussed this on the podcast and on 975 yesterday. There is no quick fix for what’s going on. You are probably not seeing a light at the end of the tunnel until after 2021. You’re expensive, you’re not very good and youre old. I would add in bad contracts with multiple players. The Eagles hit the we are really bad trifecta. This is not gonna be in 2021 we could just fix all this and we’re gonna be good next year. Even if you get Carson Wentz playing well this roster is not good and you can’t make all necessary changes next year because of your cap space situation and you don’t have enough draft picks to infuse enough talent through that way to get yourself back on the right track in just one offseason. And that’s if the Eagles choose the right players which has been another issue. 

I wish I save the post I made on the old board because I went into how certain teams take about 2 to 3 years to actually turn it around. This theory teams turn around quick in the nfl. Yes you can go from 4-12 to 11-5 in one season but usually those teams that make that jump that one year it’s because they have been bad for 2-3 seasons to accumulate good draft picks and good young players. When I did that exercise I showed about 70% of the league falls into what I am saying. The outlier is more of the 30% that hasn’t been bad for more than one season and those teams were like the Steelers, Patriots and the Packers. For instance before the Seattle Seahawks got Russell Wilson they were 7-9, 7-9, 5-11 and 4-12. So they were bad for four years accumulating talent and just needed the quarterback to get them from 7-9 to 11-5 in one season. then look at the saints. Before getting back to 11-5 in 2017 they had 3 consecutive 7-9 seasons. Those are just two examples but I could go into about 20 to 22 teams that it’s been similar to that. The jump from 5-11 to 11-5 in that one year is because most teams in the previous years weren’t very good and they got talent infused over those years to make thay big jump. 

5 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

What? The guy covering Reagor moved in before the ball was even snapped and didnt even attempt to play the pass.

Watch it again.  He takes 2-3 steps back pre-snap (playing the pass) then when the RB breaks and extends his arms towards Hurts, he makes a hard break to play the run.  Like I said, if Hurts sells the play action, it could have been a decent play...and that's assuming "everything" from my previous post.

Just now, Ace Nova said:

Watch it again.  He takes 2-3 steps back pre-snap (playing the pass) then when the RB breaks and extends his arms towards Hurts, he makes a hard break to play the run.  Like I said, if Hurts sells the play action, it could have been a decent play...and that's assuming "everything" from my previous post.

He takes a half step back and he's practically next to the DE and a good 6 yards away from Reagor. Its not as complicated as your making it. Hurts didn't see it, it's as simple as that. 

6 minutes ago, Ace Nova said:

Watch it again.  He takes 2-3 steps back pre-snap (playing the pass) then when the RB breaks and extends his arms towards Hurts, he makes a hard break to play the run.  Like I said, if Hurts sells the play action, it could have been a decent play...and that's assuming "everything" from my previous post.

I see him moving to the slot guy, is then engage by the wide WR with a block, and if Hurts pulls this Reagor is 1 on 1 with the deep safety.

Hurts is not throwing in that situation, so the nickle CB doesn't even think of playing the pass. Until the coaches are willing to let Hurts pass, those packages are dumb.

3 minutes ago, Mike030270 said:

The hype from each DT signing...

$69 million in 2 guys who rotate with each other, on top of Cox's $100 million.  I get loading up on the lines but this is just terrible use of money.  You signed Hargrave knowing that he never will play 100% of the snaps.  If you go through the game log Hargrave maxed at at 73%, Malik at 79%.  They both play 51% of the snaps if you average it out.  Cox plays 70%. 

I just don't like throwing that much money at guys who are on the bench for half the game.

1 minute ago, LeanMeanGM said:

He takes a half step back and he's practically next to the DE and a good 6 yards away from Reagor. Its not as complicated as your making it. Hurts didn't see it, it's as simple as that. 

He literally takes 2+ steps back pre-snap.  Watch it again.

Anyway, this is a silly debate.  You're right, Hurts didn't even seem to look that way which leads me to believe it wasn't even a "read option" and likely a designed run.

15 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

What? The guy covering Reagor moved in before the ball was even snapped and didnt even attempt to play the pass.

Seattle is bad at pass defense because they have too many coverage breakdowns and mis communication.

2 times in the game they failed to cover reagor and two times the qb once Wentz once hurts failed to even look at him.

That's poor awareness by the qb and also poor coaching, one has to ask why the heck aren't qbs throwing to receivers that pre snap are uncovered and post snap uncovered???

On the drop down the seam from goedert Seattle flat out forgot to cover reagor in the slot, post snap they leave him uncovered he sits down about 15 yards downfield with know one with in 5 yards of him and Wentz doesn't even look his way. Underneath reagor at the Z fulgham is also uncovered and wide open. Seattle failed to cover 2 receivers and Wentz instead stares down goedert and throws I to a double covered goedert😒

This play Hurts had reagor open on an RPO and doesn't even sniff his way. Though seems he didn't really have a chance and it looks like a run all the way

Seems in game where guys are uncovered pre snap and post snap and not looked at isn't a qb problem but a coaching problem.

27 minutes ago, Sturm said:

Doug and Howie Fired Yet? Just my hourly check.

Yes - Lurie hired Joe Banner. 

12 minutes ago, Utebird said:

Then that's a bad call. I mean in a passing league where offenses use multiple WR sets inside corners are at a premium, know what else is at a premium?

Outside corners.

The eagles won the super bowl allocating the least amount of money in the league to corner and one of the highest to safety, and it worked.

Then they go away from that and spend on corner and less on safety.

Which is fine except the money to corner is going to an overrated older nickel, NRC and am aging over paid Slay with nothing else at corner or safety.

Mcleod makes about 10 mil a year and while he's not a problem he's JAG. 10 mil is a bit much for JAG.

Whether it's howie making the personnel decisions or Schwartz or a combined effort it hasn't worked outside of 2017.

 

McLeod makes like a little under $5m per year. I wish they didn't guarantee next year but his contract is fine imo. 

 

4 minutes ago, Ace Nova said:

He literally takes 2+ steps back pre-snap.  Watch it again.

Anyway, this is a silly debate.  You're right, Hurts didn't even seem to look that way which leads me to believe it wasn't even a "read option" and likely a designed run.

Or he's a rookie QB who makes rookie mistakes.

The steps are meaningless, he only moved like a yard back from the LOS. He had no chance of covering Reagor from where he was.

1 minute ago, LeanMeanGM said:

McLeod makes like a little under $5m per year. I wish they didn't guarantee next year but his contract is fine imo. 

 

Maybe it's next year his contract goes to 10mil?

3 minutes ago, downundermike said:

I see him moving to the slot guy, who engages him with the block, and if Hurts pulls this Reagor is 1 on 1 with the deep safety.

I'm not disagreeing that it could have been a nice play if played "perfectly".  I literally said exactly that in my initial post.

I'm saying:

A. We don't even know if it was a read option

B. Hurts would have needed to sell the play action perfectly

C. We are assuming the CB continues to break hard for the run and is still being blocked by the time Hurts delivers the ball to Reagor.

Lot's of "ifs".

But yes, I agree, if it was a read option and if it was played perfectly, then it could have been a big play.

 

7 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

$69 million in 2 guys who rotate with each other, on top of Cox's $100 million.  I get loading up on the lines but this is just terrible use of money.  You signed Hargrave knowing that he never will play 100% of the snaps.  If you go through the game log Hargrave maxed at at 73%, Malik at 79%.  They both play 51% of the snaps if you average it out.  Cox plays 70%. 

I just don't like throwing that much money at guys who are on the bench for half the game.

The Hargrave signing I can actually understand. I wouldn’t have done it but I can understand it. First analytics told them he was good. Second you have to go back to what was happening with Malik Jackson. In 2018 malik Jackson was not good. The Jacksonville jaguars benched him because he wasn’t good. So there was the possibility he was already on the decline. Then in 2019 he suffers a Lisfranc injury which at his age you don’t know how he’s going to return from it. Maybe he comes back and is the same player he was pre-2018 but there was a high chance he wasn’t going to be that player anymore based off his 2018 and the injury. So I get why they looked at it like we need somebody along side Fletcher Cox that could be a difference maker and not just cox and a bunch of jags cause you couldn’t exactly just rely on malik. 

1 minute ago, Utebird said:

Maybe it's next year his contract goes to 10mil?

No he signed a 2 year for $8.65M deal. Maybe you're thinking of his old contract?

3 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

The Hargrave signing I can actually understand. I wouldn’t have done it but I can understand it. First analytics told them he was good. Second you have to go back to what was happening with Malik Jackson. In 2018 malik Jackson was not good. The Jacksonville jaguars benched him because he wasn’t good. So there was the possibility he was already on the decline. Then in 2019 he suffers a Lisfranc injury which at his age you don’t know how he’s going to return from it. Maybe he comes back and is the same player he was pre-2018 but there was a high chance he wasn’t going to be that player anymore based off his 2018 and the injury. So I get why they looked at it like we need somebody along side Fletcher Cox that could be a difference maker and not just cox and a bunch of jags.

I didn't mind the Hargrave signing, I thought the malik signing was ridiculous.

I think hargraves PEC injury, tricep bicep whatever it was affected him more than the team is letting on. He's played better lately, I think his contract is fine and he's a good player but looks worse because of malik ridiculous contract at the same position 

2 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

No he signed a 2 year for $8.65M deal. Maybe you're thinking of his old contract?

Must be, that's a reasonable contract.

2 minutes ago, Utebird said:

I didn't mind the Hargrave signing, I thought the malik signing was ridiculous.

I think hargraves PEC injury, tricep bicep whatever it was affected him more than the team is letting on. He's played better lately, I think his contract is fine and he's a good player but looks worse because of malik ridiculous contract at the same position 

Same, I'm actually fine with the Hargrave signing and I think he can be a good DT for us for the foreseeable future. And we do need to build a rotation to allow Cox to get some rest during games as he's not getting any younger. I think it's certain we're cutting Malik this offseason and personally, I hope we draft a playable DT within the first three rounds to rotate with Cox/Hargrave/Ridgeway -- and increase his snaps after Ridgeway gets his annual season-ending injury sometime between weeks 2-6.

10 minutes ago, Utebird said:

I didn't mind the Hargrave signing, I thought the malik signing was ridiculous.

I think hargraves PEC injury, tricep bicep whatever it was affected him more than the team is letting on. He's played better lately, I think his contract is fine and he's a good player but looks worse because of cox ridiculous contract at the same position 

I was with you I didn’t particularly like the Malik Jackson signing. I didn’t think he was worth the money after his 2018 performance and was closer to being out of his prime then you want giving him that contract. The structure of that contract makes it almost impossible for you to get out of that contract next year unless you cut or trade him as a post June 1 contract. If you cut him prior to June 1 you save like a million off the cap due to a large dead money hit. Not that they’re gonna do that but if he wound up being in decline or bust there was no way for you to get out of that contract until after year three. You basically tied yourself to a guy that could’ve been done in year one for three seasons with the contract

18 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

McLeod makes like a little under $5m per year. I wish they didn't guarantee next year but his contract is fine imo. 

 

Or he's a rookie QB who makes rookie mistakes.

The steps are meaningless, he only moved like a yard back from the LOS. He had no chance of covering Reagor from where he was.

And that's why I said, "How often does that happen with a rookie QB who has a total of 3 passes in the NFL"

I also find it humerous that guys are dissecting film and criticizing a rookie QB when they don't even know if it was a read option and the play itself went for positive yards, regardless vs dissecting the myriad of other plays that should have/could have been executed properly by our starting QB.  

Is Jalen Hurts (with a total of 3 passes, all completions, btw) the reason this offense is struggling?  Give me a break and stop deflecting from the real issues. 

4 minutes ago, hoosierdaddy said:

Same, I'm actually fine with the Hargrave signing and I think he can be a good DT for us for the foreseeable future. And we do need to build a rotation to allow Cox to get some rest during games as he's not getting any younger. I think it's certain we're cutting Malik this offseason and personally, I hope we draft a playable DT within the first three rounds to rotate with Cox/Hargrave/Ridgeway -- and increase his snaps after Ridgeway gets his annual season-ending injury sometime between weeks 2-6.

I don’t know how you’re going to cut a Malik Jackson. If you cut him pre-June 1 it’s a $12.6 million dead money hit. You only save $967k. So if you do it post June 1 it’s 3.6 mil dead money and 10 mil savings. Same with trading him according to over the cap. So the problem is is you need to get cap compliant by the start of the new league gear and really you can’t cut him until June 1 to actually get cap space that you need. Like people praise howie for his contracts but that contract structure along with the DeSean Jackson contract structure were both bad.