15 minutes ago, austinfan said:

Everyone keeps saying they should have given Wentz help instead of drafting Hurts, well, the three guys starting after he was picked are a safety and two RBs. Obviously, if we're not using Sanders/Scott, another RB wouldn't have been a big difference maker. And that was high to pick a OG given at the time, we had two solid starters, and added Driscoll in the 4th round to develop behind them. So that whole argument falls apart - the only value that pick would have had was on defense.

I'm happy to see Hurts start, I don't expect much, but he was drafted to provide a backup who could win off the bench, and getting a few starts at the end of his rookie year is great experience in that role. Unless a new QB coach really revamps his mechanics (quicker release and more velocity) he's not going to start for long in the NFL, but he has the skill package to steal games off the bench.

Man, there are so many players taken in the next 20+ picks that I’d much rather have than Hurts: V, Jefferson (didn’t like him going into the draft, but he’s looked good in limited snaps), Dobbins, Chinn, A. Davis, Mims, Fulton, Wilson, Ojemudia, Duvernay, Burgess. 

2 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Its the Phillies.  You come to expect it.  They werent the first professional franchise with 10000 losses by accident you know.  They've perfected ineptitude and malpractice.

They make me embarrassed to be a fan. Like the Eagles just make me mad. The Phillies are embarrassment. I feel like every 15 years they get on a good run for 5 to 6 years. And then for like a decade and a half they can’t do anything right.

Just now, ManuManu said:

Man, there are so many players taken in the next 20+ picks that I’d much rather have than Hurts: V, Jefferson (didn’t like him going into the draft, but he’s looked good in limited snaps), Dobbins, Chinn, A. Davis, Mims, Fulton, Wilson, Ojemudia, Duvernay, Burgess. 

He also could’ve traded up a couple picks and got some guys that they could’ve need it. Like jaylon Johnson could be starting on the opposite side of Darius slay right now and you have two good corners.

Yes that is an offensive help but it helps because now your defense doesn’t look like complete crap when teams just target maddox. So that helps Carson Wentz by the defense getting off the field or even possibly creating more turnovers because their secondary is much better

5 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

People complain when its Alshon Jeffery and his impressive 15 yards on the season. No one would be complaining about a guy with over 1,000 yards 3/4 through the season.

Did i miss something?

1 minute ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

I was all for not trading for Darius Slay if it meant they could’ve traded for DeAndre Hopkins. I thought DeAndre Hopkins had at least 5 prime years left. his game does not rely on speed and he is a great route runner and can go up to get the ball. To me if they had the chance to get (in my opinion) the best wide receiver in the NFL instead of Darius slay I would’ve chosen go get DeAndre Hopkins even if it cost us the 20th overall pick. I would’ve had the best wide receiver in the NFL

I know they said we talk to them but I don’t know what they asked for. However I would’ve even considered trading a 3rd round pick a Miles Sanders if they came to us and said we want Miles Sanders and a third round pick (assuming obrien wanted a RB) because Bill O’Brien was an idiot. And I would’ve just went into the draft and got myself another running back like Dobbins at 53

Yup. And the excuse was "it sets a bad image to the locker room to trade for someone and give him a big deal." even though they did exactly that with Slay. And I have a hard time believing they took the Arizona offer and it was drastically different than what they were asking from the Eagles. A second round pick was probably the center piece. I doubt David Johnson had that much sway in it. 

1 minute ago, Asg 15 said:

Did i miss something?

Apparently people would complain if we traded for Deandre Hopkins instead of drafting Jalen Hurts

1 hour ago, Desertbirds said:

Currently, the Eagles hold the tie breaker based on strength of schedule. The best outcome would be for the Bengals to beat the Cowboys and for the Cowboys to beat the Eagles.

🤮 🤮 

4 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Yup. And the excuse was "it sets a bad image to the locker room to trade for someone and give him a big deal." even though they did exactly that with Slay. And I have a hard time believing they took the Arizona offer and it was drastically different than what they were asking from the Eagles. A second round pick was probably the center piece. I doubt David Johnson had that much sway in it. 

Probably. I don’t know I think obrien is kind of an idiot so I wouldn’t be surprised if he overvalued David Johnson thinking that he was still good. frankly I thought he overvalued Duke Johnson who really is a third down back when he traded for him. At least O’Brien if you would’ve went after Sanders he was on a rookie contract so you will be clearing a bunch of Cap space doing that deal then David Johnson’s contract  

 

You have to wonder if Howie said no to the Deandre Hopkins trade because he was specifically targeting Hurts in the 2nd. That's not some spur of the moment decision and it's not like he was a first round prospect dropping into the late second. 

Just now, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Probably. I don’t know I think you’re Brian’s kind of an idiot so I wouldn’t be surprised if he overvalued David Johnson thinking that he was still good. frankly I thought you overvalue Duke Johnson who really is a third down back when he traded for him. 

 

Here’s a scenario. Say we finished with pick 4/5 and Atlanta finishes with 8-9 pick. If the FO really wants to upgrade WR this year, instead of drafting Chase and relying again on a rookie would you swap picks with Atlanta in exchange for Ridley. That would give us a great young receiver that’s just starting to get really good and would allow them to draft Ryan’s replacement. We’d also likely have to throw in a 3rd or something like that to balance the deal I would guess. 

3 minutes ago, wtfcares said:

Here’s a scenario. Say we finished with pick 4/5 and Atlanta finishes with 8-9 pick. If the FO really wants to upgrade WR this year, instead of drafting Chase and relying again on a rookie would you swap picks with Atlanta in exchange for Ridley. That would give us a great young receiver that’s just starting to get really good and would allow them to draft Ryan’s replacement. We’d also likely have to throw in a 3rd or something like that to balance the deal I would guess. 

I don’t think Atlanta does that. Julio Jones as great as he is has trouble staying healthy now. I don’t see them trading away a kid who is on his way to being one of the better wide receivers in the league just move up four spots when Matt Ryan still has imo 2-3 years left. I feel like Atlanta probably thinks they can fix their defense and protect Matt Ryan that they could be a Super Bowl contender within the timeframe that he is still a good quarterback

 

I want Hurts to do well; I just don't want him to do deceivingly well.  

Any team with aspirations of competing at a SB level for an extended period of time needs a great passer.  I don't think Hurts will ever be that.  I hope I'm wrong...but if I'm right, I don't want to see us make long term blueprints around him just because he breaks loose for a few 15-20 yard runs on 3rd down and sparks a league worst offense into a merely below average one.

I'm curious if the geniuses in the FO who wanted Hurts are trying to mold the offense in the image of AZ/Baltimore with Murray/Jackson or if they think he can be Russell Wilson.  It's an enormously important distinction.

12 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

You have to wonder if Howie said no to the Deandre Hopkins trade because he was specifically targeting Hurts in the 2nd. That's not some spur of the moment decision and it's not like he was a first round prospect dropping into the late second. 

Was going to ask this hypothetical the other day but didn’t. Actually originally had it as a 3rd but since we were talking i changed it  

would you have traded sanders and a 2nd for Hopkins instead of what you traded for Darius slay? If this was a 3rd and not a second I’d do it in a heartbeat  i felt like there were good running backs to be had at 53 (even before the draft)

I don’t think there’s a right or wrong answer. I just assume the Eagles are not going to give Miles Sanders a second contract so really the value for Miles Sanders is this year, next year then either running him into the ground or you’re gonna wind up trading him to get some sort of value for him in year 4 

2 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

I don’t think Atlanta does that. Julio Jones as great as he is has trouble staying healthy now. I don’t see them trading away a kid who is on his way to being one of the better wide receivers in the league just move up four spots when Matt Ryan still has imo 2-3 years left. I feel like Atlanta probably thinks they can fix their defense and protect Matt Ryan that they could be a Super Bowl contender within the timeframe that he is still a good quarterback

 

I guess it depends what their new coaching staff/gm thinks of Ryan but I’ve heard they want to move on from him this offseason. 

They probably wouldn’t do it just to move up 4 spots but if we throw in a 2/3 round pick, I imagine that would be enticing enough for them to get their new franchise QB. 

1 minute ago, eagle45 said:

I'm curious if the geniuses in the FO who wanted Hurts are trying to mold the offense in the image of AZ/Baltimore with Murray/Jackson or if they think he can be Russell Wilson.  It's an enormously important distinction.

I think there’s two things going on. I think they drafted him because they didn’t want to miss out on a player like they missed out on Russell Wilson. So they didn’t want that type of player to pass them by. The other thing is I think they saw Murray and jackson as the future of the league. And wanted in. 

1 minute ago, wtfcares said:

I guess it depends what their new coaching staff/gm thinks of Ryan but I’ve heard they want to move on from him this offseason. 

They probably wouldn’t do it just to move up 4 spots but if we throw in a 2/3 round pick, I imagine that would be enticing enough for them to get their new franchise QB. 

I like Ridley a lot but I think his standalone value is probably a high second round pick. So moving back four spots and giving up a second round pick doesn’t seem very good value for me at least .

4 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

I'm curious if the geniuses in the FO who wanted Hurts are trying to mold the offense in the image of AZ/Baltimore with Murray/Jackson or if they think he can be Russell Wilson.  It's an enormously important distinction.

Either way, it seems like Howie created a tough, unnecessary situation. You don't draft a gadget player in Round 2. And, if you believe in Wentz, why are you drafting a guy you think could be Russell Wilson when you have big money invested in Wentz? And, if you can't play this kid long enough to prove he has Russell Wilson type of talent, then you won't recoup the 2nd round value in a trade.    If he had Russell Wilson lust, then he shouldn't have signed Wentz to the big deal. No matter how you slice it, Howie made an illogical decision.

9 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

People complain when its Alshon Jeffery and his impressive 15 yards on the season. No one would be complaining about a guy with over 1,000 yards 3/4 through the season.

2nd round pick, $18.75 million per year over 5 years, no trade clause, huge dead money hit if cut before he's into his 30s. If something happens in Arizona and the situation is untenable, he's got them by the balls. Yeah, if he suffered a soft tissue injury here, you'd be coming for heads.

2 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Apparently people would complain if we traded for Deandre Hopkins instead of drafting Jalen Hurts

🙄 Was referencing the Slay, Lane/Brooks extensions, Malik Jackson, other older 28+ year old players they've signed/extended recently. But sure...you're right about everything except when you're not and then you just move the goalposts.

If Lurie entrusts the rebuild to Howie, I'm curious to see how much of the fan ire kicks up from Howie and settles on Lurie, much as the Klentak situation has done to Middleton.  

 

2 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Was going to ask this hypothetical the other day but didn’t. Actually originally had it as a 3rd but since we were talking i changed it  

would you have traded sanders and a 2nd for Hopkins instead of what you traded for Darius slay?

I don’t think there’s a right or wrong answer. I just assume the Eagles are not going to give Miles Sanders a second contract so really the value for Miles Sanders is this year, next year then either running him into the ground or you’re gonna wind up trading him to get some sort of value for him in year 4 

Easy to say in hindsight, hard to say in real time. Trading a 2nd and Sanders for Hopkins, not trading for Slay or signing Hargrave and just signing someone like Bradberry probably wins us more games. Then again Doug might have a hard time incorporating Hopkins into our offense. 

1 minute ago, Saltpeter said:

2nd round pick, $18.75 million per year over 5 years, no trade clause, huge dead money hit if cut before he's into his 30s. If something happens in Arizona and the situation is untenable, he's got them by the balls. Yeah, if he suffered a soft tissue injury here, you'd be coming for heads.

🙄 Was referencing the Slay, Lane/Brooks extensions, Malik Jackson, other older 28+ year old players they've signed/extended recently. But sure...you're right about everything except when you're not and then you just move the goalposts.

Would you rather have Hopkins and everything that comes with him or Hurts? 

3 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Easy to say in hindsight, hard to say in real time. Trading a 2nd and Sanders for Hopkins, not trading for Slay or signing Hargrave and just signing someone like Bradberry probably wins us more games. Then again Doug might have a hard time incorporating Hopkins into our offense. 

I think it’s much tougher with a second round pick involved. If it was a third round pick and Sanders I would’ve done that. I am of the belief if you’re going to spend big money in free agency I’m doing it at pass rusher, OL or playmaking receiver. While Bradberry has been good I think most of the time the best bang for your buck in free agency is if you could sign a guy in his prime at one of those three that I’ve mentioned 

3 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

I think there’s two things going on. I think they drafted him because they didn’t want to miss out on a player like they missed out on Russell Wilson. So they didn’t want that type of player to pass them by. The other thing is I think they saw Murray and jackson as the future of the league. And wanted in. 

I really hope it's not that last part, but I'm sure it is.

First of all, Murray and Jackson are vastly, vastly superior runners to Hurts.  They can flat out fly with the best of WRs.  Hurts is merely a mobile QB who ran for a ton of yards in college.  

Second, none of that matters anyway.  It's a gimmick that fails every time.  

1 minute ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

I think it’s much tougher with a second round pick involved. If it was a third round pick and Sanders I would’ve done that. I am of the belief if you’re going to spend big money in free agency I’m doing it at pass rusher, OL or playmaking receiver. While Bradberry has been good I think most of the time the best bang for your buck in free agency is if you could sign a guy in his prime at one of those three that I’ve mentioned 

Agreed but that’s where hindsight comes in. If your just wasting the pick on a gadget QB who cares what round it’s in?