10 minutes ago, downundermike said:

Could have taken Claypool instead of Reagor and it would have been better.

Loved claypool coming out and do you really think he does any better here in the dumpster fire offense than reagor?

3 minutes ago, Ace Nova said:

Did you bother to pay attention to his posts?  Statistically, the Eagles are right around "average" when compared to the rest of the league when drafting.  The only issue (in years past) that I noticed is that the trades affected their "expected return" as @austinfan just informed me.  That includes the Wentz trade.  I've learned something new today and I appreciate his insight.

That crap he posted is a ranking of return vs capital.  Has nothing to do with the production of the players.

7 minutes ago, Godfather said:

Reagor isn't as good as Agholor 

GTFOH with that nonsense.  Agholor put up 283 yards in his first season with far more opportunities than Reagor has had — and Reagor is actually visible as a PR 

3 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

There wasn’t any trade partner for Lamb; just wanting to trade up doesn’t make a trade.

As soon as SF and TB traded at 13/14 there was no other available trade.  DEN needed WR at #15 and took Jeudy, ATL needed a CB at #16 as badly as the Eagles needed a WR and took A.J. Terrell, then DAL drafted Lamb at #17.

 

Exactly.  You need two to trade, and you listed the exact reasons why there was no trade partner.

Just now, Alphagrand said:

There wasn’t any trade partner for Lamb; just wanting to trade up doesn’t make a trade.

As soon as SF and TB traded at 13/14 there was no other available trade.  DEN needed WR at #15 and took Jeudy, ATL needed a CB at #16 as badly as the Eagles needed a WR and took A.J. Terrell, then DAL drafted Lamb at #17.

 

Yeah i made this point on draft night. Tampa as soon as one of the olinemen fell wasn’t trading out of 13. 14 i believe the niners would’ve dealt out of except kinlaw was there and they just traded buckner. So that was excellent value. Denver wanted one of the WRs and weren’t willing too. Atlanta you’d have had to overpay to get them to move. Do i think a 2nd and first does it? Idk. That is debatable. Either way it is a lot to pay to go up and get lamb. And i loved lamb and thought he was the best receiver in the draft. 

Just now, Alphagrand said:

GTFOH with that nonsense.  Agholor put up 283 yards in his first season with far more opportunities than Reagor has had — and Reagor is actually visible as a PR 

Did they draft Reagor in the 1st to return punts or make plays at wr?

5 minutes ago, Utebird said:

What about that flavored icee drink they have at camp, is howie responsible for that, those seem to be a success...

Your are right!  Let's call it even then.

4 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

There wasn’t any trade partner for Lamb; just wanting to trade up doesn’t make a trade.

As soon as SF and TB traded at 13/14 there was no other available trade.  DEN needed WR at #15 and took Jeudy, ATL needed a CB at #16 as badly as the Eagles needed a WR and took A.J. Terrell, then DAL drafted Lamb at #17.

 

I can see that but doesn't excuse him for passing on Jefferson

2 minutes ago, downundermike said:

That crap he posted is a ranking of return vs capital.  Has nothing to do with the production of the players.

I'll ask @austinfan but wouldn't "the return" include the production of the players drafted?

 

2 minutes ago, Godfather said:

Did they draft Reagor in the 1st to return punts or make plays at wr?

Both to be honest. I think he got an extra boost being a dynamic punt returner as well. Kind of like how Mack hollins also got a boost on where many projected him due to being a special teams stud

Name one single thing about the 2020 Eagles that argues for the retention of Roseman.

2 minutes ago, Godfather said:

Did they draft Reagor in the 1st to return punts or make plays at wr?

Both — and apply the same standard to Agholor, who returned punts at USC.  The difference is Agholor never gave any effort on PR with the Eagles 

Just now, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Both to be honest. I think he got an extra boost being a dynamic punt returner as well. Kind of like how Mack hollins also got a boost on where many projected him due to being a special teams stud

Well he sucks as a wr and hasn't done anything to show me otherwise. He doesn't get separation and his route running is poor

1 minute ago, Godfather said:

Well he sucks as a wr and hasn't done anything to show me otherwise. He doesn't get separation and his route running is poor

I never said you were wrong to have that opinion but oh asked did they draft him to do one or the other. They drafted him with the assumption he would do both. 

3 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

Both — and apply the same standard to Agholor, who returned punts at USC.  The difference is Agholor never gave any effort on PR with the Eagles 

I'm an SC fan. I've watched a lot of him. He never gave a whole lot of effort there either. He benefited from good st play

1 minute ago, downundermike said:

That crap he posted is a ranking of return vs capital.  Has nothing to do with the production of the players.

Judging a draft by the production of players 3 years later is easy and lazy.

It's easy to say so and so drafted after so and so out produced so and so drafted before him therefore it was a good or bad pick without considering the circumstances that led to those players drafted.

One can look back and say every player drafted before tom brady in that draft was a bad pick as he's easily the most productive player of that draft class yet no one makes that claim because it's ludicrous.

The draft is a crap shoot. One sets their boards based off scout evaluations and for the most part most top players are graded similarly by all teams, they may differ by a spot or two but it's close where there was no team that has tom brady as a 1st round pick while everyone else had him 3rd day.

Howie hasn't been bad at drafting he's had bad results which is a result of a myriad of things other than draft position.

 

4 minutes ago, Godfather said:

I can see that but doesn't excuse him for passing on Jefferson

I was here all day during the draft and spent a ton of time here in the weeks prior.

There was a small % of people that wanted Jefferson but it was the minority.  It was usually, "If we can't get so or so, then I want Jefferson".

And following the draft, the #1 complaint is that they didn't do more to trade up for Lamb.   Jefferson was already an afterthought by most after the draft.  

Now all of a sudden the "Everyone wanted Jefferson" narrative comes out and I assure you, that wasn't the case then.

 

3 hours ago, Desertbirds said:

Not enough is being made of the recent signing of Lavert Hill to the practice squad. This is demonstrably the greatest Eagles FO move of the 2020 season.

Nothing beats a slow, short CB with stiff hips and questionable ball skills. 

7 minutes ago, Desertbirds said:

Name one single thing about the 2020 Eagles that argues for the retention of Roseman.

He's got naked pics of lurie...

1 minute ago, Ace Nova said:

I was here all day during the draft and spent a ton of time here in the weeks prior.

There was a small % of people that wanted Jefferson but it was the minority.  It was usually, "If we can't get so or so, then I want Jefferson".

And following the draft, the #1 complaint is that they didn't do more to trade up for Lamb.   Jefferson was already an afterthought by most after the draft.  

Now all of a sudden the "Everyone wanted Jefferson" narrative comes out and I assure you, that wasn't the case then.

 

I was part of the minority because I didn't think Lamb would fall. I did say of we missed out on Jefferson I wanted Higgins

5 minutes ago, Ace Nova said:

Did you bother to pay attention to his posts?  Statistically, the Eagles are right around "average" when compared to the rest of the league when drafting.  The only issue (in years past) that I noticed is that the trades affected their "expected return" as @austinfan just informed me.  That includes the Wentz trade.  I've learned something new today and I appreciate his insight.

 

They are not average... they are below average when you factor in stupid trades.  The Wentz trade is the type of trade that a team makes, but then recognizes that it has to do better with the picks that they have left and not squander them.  It's a calculated risk, but it's a risk nonetheless... and for a QB, it's a risk worth taking.  However, from that draft (where they actually did fairly well especially given the lack of picks - coming away with Wentz, Seumalo and Vaitai) to today, they have NOT done well with the draft.  They took a flyer on Sydney Jones.. which is the type of pick you have the luxury of making if  you have a lot of other picks, or you have an amazingly good track record of good drafting...  the Eagles had neither.  So, they wasted a valuable pick on a very high risk decision, when there were very low risk options available at positions of need.  The RB position was a bare cupboard at that instant with an injured Ryan Mathews on the roster, an aged Darren Sproles and nothing else.  They brought in only Pumphrey, preciptating the Blount signing (which was good and cheap) which likely would have happened even if they had drafted a RB in Round 2, 3 or 4 not named Pumphrey, but also precipitated the trade for Ajayi, when Sproles got hurt (old RBs get hurt... not surprising) and Pumphrey sucked.

Then there's that Tate trade, which pushed them back about 45 draft slots over a year later... for virtually zero return.
Or the Avery trade which we will pay for this year for no return.
Failure to draft a young RB forced another trade for a rental player with Jordan Howard.
And now the Slay trade, which costs MONEY and draft picks this past year.  Teams desperate for talent need to spend money OR draft picks on a player, not both.  Which brings us the Desean, same deal.  Traded for and resigned to a bad contract.

 

This mess wasn't created overnight and it is the culmination of a series (a long series) of bad decisions.  When studying each one in a vacuum, the decisions don't look terrible... but when stacked together, they are an amazing pile of steaming poo.   

3 minutes ago, Utebird said:

The draft is a crap shoot. One sets their boards based off scout evaluations and for the most part most top players are graded similarly by all teams, they may differ by a spot or two but it's close where there was no team that has tom brady as a 1st round pick while everyone else had him 3rd day.

Howie hasn't been bad at drafting he's had bad results which is a result of a myriad of things other than draft position.

The draft isn’t supposed to be ‘a crap shoot’, though 

Your last sentence is really stretching the elastic of rationalization out beyond Mars ....

11 minutes ago, Desertbirds said:

Name one single thing about the 2020 Eagles that argues for the retention of Roseman.

Nothing

11 minutes ago, Desertbirds said:

Name one single thing about the 2020 Eagles that argues for the retention of Roseman.

It would fit pretty well with the rest of 2020.  Fortunately, the last game is actually in 2021, so he should be gone.  Gotta start 2021 off on a good foot.

19 minutes ago, Utebird said:

Loved claypool coming out and do you really think he does any better here in the dumpster fire offense than reagor?

Actually, yes.