For all the Howie moves that have been dissected and destroyed recently, I want to add a few that no one questions...moves that either directly panned out with the draft pick or were well-received at the time, despite being ill-conceived.

1.  Drafting Dallas Goedert with our first pick in 2018.  Everyone loved taunting Dallas about drafting a TE named Dallas after Witten retired.  He's also a very good football player and TE.  This was also a fork in the road for the Eagles...and Doug/Howie made the wrong turn.  This selection set the Eagles on a path that may have ruined Wentz.  The Z WR had been a revolving door of sub-par interchangeable parts for years.  DJ Chark was a prototype Z WR, who has shown major ability in the NFL and would be outstanding here.  Everyone says the Eagles run nothing but 12 personnel because they just so happen to have great TE's and no WRs.  They chose that path when they took a TE with their first pick despite having a 27 year old pro-bowler in Ertz and picked Mike Wallace off the scrap heap to be the Z wr...with multiple excellent WR prospects on the board.  The rest is history.  Now we have a QB who can't make reads or throws outside the hashmarks and has middle of the field tunnel vision...because he was coached that way and we are married to 12 personnel, a plodding, suffocating offense.

2.  Extending Brandon Brooks after his first achilles injury.  This was a well-received feel-good extension for a player who had a remarkably fast recovery from achilles surgery.  Brooks was 30 years old, playing on a surgically repaired achilles, and had 1.5 MORE YEARS UNDER CONTRACT at the time of his extension.  Why, why extend him and make him the highest paid interior OL in the NFL?  Guess what the biggest risk factor is for achilles injury is?  PREVIOUS achilles injury.  Forget that this blew up in Howie's face after another achilles injury.  Pretend it never happened.  In what scenario is a 32 year old OG with a surgically repaired achilles going to become the richest OG in the NFL?  Let the contract play out and then extend him.  This is quietly one of the worst contracts on a roster full of awful contracts.

3 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

I guess he just is a pot belly kind of guy.  A lot of images he seemed slimmer.  I hope he's a good Eagle, I really do.  I just look at needs on the team vs. where money was spent.  Keep in mind, one of the Eagles strengths for some reason is being able to find plug and play DT be it as UDFA, practice squads or off the streets.  Ty McGill has played very well.  I would be just as happy with Cox, Jackson, McGill and Ridgeway.

I thought Anthony Rush was fine.  Bruce Hector held his own in limited playing time.  They always seem to do OK in that department.  I understand the injury to Jackson but he showed no signs of having his career threatened.  Hargrave was a total luxury signing when there are so many holes on the team.

Hargrave is the future at DT. Cox and Jackson are getting old and probably won’t be here past next year. And no we aren’t going to rely on a bunch of no name undrafted players at DT like what happened at LB this year. I’m glad they’re actively working to upgrade the position before it’s too late like other positions. 

8 minutes ago, What The F said:

I hope we see about 24 of them. 

Yeah, I can't wait to see our 22 year old version of Tyrod Taylor tonight.

12 minutes ago, What The F said:

I hope we see about 24 of them. 

Don't hold your breath.

49 minutes ago, Mike030270 said:

Funny thing is this place used to not like pff

Honestly I still don’t particularly like it. But on this one they actually been spot on. That’s one of the worst grades for a Starting corner In the league. He’s been really bad 

10 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

I guess he just is a pot belly kind of guy.  A lot of images he seemed slimmer.  I hope he's a good Eagle, I really do.  I just look at needs on the team vs. where money was spent.  Keep in mind, one of the Eagles strengths for some reason is being able to find plug and play DT be it as UDFA, practice squads or off the streets.  Ty McGill has played very well.  I would be just as happy with Cox, Jackson, McGill and Ridgeway.

I thought Anthony Rush was fine.  Bruce Hector held his own in limited playing time.  They always seem to do OK in that department.  I understand the injury to Jackson but he showed no signs of having his career threatened.  Hargrave was a total luxury signing when there are so many holes on the team.

We are in cap trouble big time.  When the big contract guys are purged, and we still have a DT the caliber of Hargrave at his price people will be praising Howie for that one. 

Its a move for a few years in to the future while everyone is criticizing it as if it was a move for right now.

15 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

For all the Howie moves that have been dissected and destroyed recently, I want to add a few that no one questions...moves that either directly panned out with the draft pick or were well-received at the time, despite being ill-conceived.

1.  Drafting Dallas Goedert with our first pick in 2018.  Everyone loved taunting Dallas about drafting a TE named Dallas after Witten retired.  He's also a very good football player and TE.  This was also a fork in the road for the Eagles...and Doug/Howie made the wrong turn.  This selection set the Eagles on a path that may have ruined Wentz.  The Z WR had been a revolving door of sub-par interchangeable parts for years.  DJ Chark was a prototype Z WR, who has shown major ability in the NFL and would be outstanding here.  Everyone says the Eagles run nothing but 12 personnel because they just so happen to have great TE's and no WRs.  They chose that path when they took a TE with their first pick despite having a 27 year old pro-bowler in Ertz and picked Mike Wallace off the scrap heap to be the Z wr...with multiple excellent WR prospects on the board.  The rest is history.  Now we have a QB who can't make reads or throws outside the hashmarks and has middle of the field tunnel vision...because he was coached that way and we are married to 12 personnel, a plodding, suffocating offense.

2.  Extending Brandon Brooks after his first achilles injury.  This was a well-received feel-good extension for a player who had a remarkably fast recovery from achilles surgery.  Brooks was 30 years old, playing on a surgically repaired achilles, and had 1.5 MORE YEARS UNDER CONTRACT at the time of his extension.  Why, why extend him and make him the highest paid interior OL in the NFL?  Guess what the biggest risk factor is for achilles injury is?  PREVIOUS achilles injury.  Forget that this blew up in Howie's face after another achilles injury.  Pretend it never happened.  In what scenario is a 32 year old OG with a surgically repaired achilles going to become the richest OG in the NFL?  Let the contract play out and then extend him.  This is quietly one of the roster contracts on a roster full of awful contracts.

I think it's fair to compare the Goedert and Hurts moves from a process perspective. Eagles had historic 3rd down/RZ numbers in 2017 and were losing Celek and Burton. Drafting Goedert seemed like a panic move to replace those guys and maintain the 3rd down/RZ production while not shelling out a big FA contract for a #2 TE. Then with Hurts, obviously with Wentz's injuries, the Super Bowl win, losing Foles, and not having the cap space to give annual 1 year, $6-8 million contracts to the Ryan Fitzpatricks of the world, they felt like the best course of action was to try to draft a playoff win caliber backup QB. From a process perspective, a questionable use of resources despite both players' talent.

The Brooks extension was weird. Never understood their urgency on that one.

1 minute ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Honestly I still don’t particularly like it. But on this one they actually been spot on. That’s one of the worst grades for a Starting corner In the league. He’s been really bad 

Like Boykin, they're both viewed positively based on a reputation built on a few good games early in their first season.  Both fell off a cliff quickly. 

It seems Maddox should have been moved to safety like ferris suggested.

I thought he sucked outside but would be good in nickel.

But I've wanted LeBlanc to be our nickel anyway. 

2 minutes ago, wtfcares said:

Hargrave is the future at DT. Cox and Jackson are getting old and probably won’t be here past next year. And no we aren’t going to rely on a bunch of no name undrafted players at DT like what happened at LB this year. I’m glad they’re actively working to upgrade the position before it’s too late like other positions. 

Hargrave is going to be 28.  This year is a wasted year of production.  Are the Eagles going to turn it around and contend again next year when they are $60 million over the cap?  Nope, another year of rebuilding.  2021, year 2 of his contract is up.  Maybe in 2022 the Eagles are back at it again competing and Hargrave will be 30 in the last year of his contract before a club option and you need to replace him.

So we have Hargrave at 29 and 30 with lord know what around him. The future at DT would be guys who are 23-25.  Hargrave is a very expensive stop gap DT.  He is eating up valuable cap space over the next few years.

2021, $15 million.

2022, $15 million.

2023 is a club option.

 

3 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

Hargrave is going to be 28.  This year is a wasted year of production.  Are the Eagles going to turn it around and contend again next year when they are $60 million over the cap?  Nope, another year of rebuilding.  2021, year 2 of his contract is up.  Maybe in 2022 the Eagles are back at it again competing and Hargrave will be 30 in the last year of his contract before a club option and you need to replace him.

So we have Hargrave at 29 and 30 with lord know what around him. The future at DT would be guys who are 23-25.  Hargrave is a very expensive stop gap DT.  He is eating up valuable cap space over the next few years.

2021, $15 million.

2022, $15 million.

2023 is a club option.

 

Yep. You want to call Cox old at 29 but 2021 Hargrave the future at 28? What?!

First of all, Hargrave is 27 -- can we at least start off being factual?

3 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

First of all, Hargrave is 27 -- can we at least start off being factual?

I said he's going to be 28 going in to next year.

2 hours ago, HazletonEagle said:

Game tonight. Ill be home for this one, finally! So expect a win. 

This the first all year? Good to hear. You've been working too hard brother. 

2 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

I said he's going to be 28 going in to next year.

Yes and, as HE said, Malik Jackson is going to be 31 going into next year and is just coming off an injury where he was lost for a whole season.  

The Eagles view DT (DL as a whole) as a premium position and they will invest $$ at the position.  Hargrave should have at least 4 years before any appreciable decline in his play.  There are quite a few areas where the Eagles have spent resources in a dubious manner -- the Hargrave signing is way down the list.

Hoping for  eagles win , the tension on the board has been off the charts.

48 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

I'd rather grow with Mailata making mistakes while improving and learning the game then continue down a deteriorating JP path watching a HOF LT get worse and worse every game while providing nothing for the future.  Even if Mailata is average, you stick with him and continue to let him develop. 

At this point yes but we can't have it be a turnstile out there either.  He has to be at least mediocre.

Excited to watch Hakeem Butler tonight

19 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

Hargrave is going to be 28.  This year is a wasted year of production.  Are the Eagles going to turn it around and contend again next year when they are $60 million over the cap?  Nope, another year of rebuilding.  2021, year 2 of his contract is up.  Maybe in 2022 the Eagles are back at it again competing and Hargrave will be 30 in the last year of his contract before a club option and you need to replace him.

So we have Hargrave at 29 and 30 with lord know what around him. The future at DT would be guys who are 23-25.  Hargrave is a very expensive stop gap DT.  He is eating up valuable cap space over the next few years.

2021, $15 million.

2022, $15 million.

2023 is a club option.

 

I didn’t hate the Hargrave signing as much as other people. Could they have used the money to put towards other positions that they needed help at? Of course. However you had no clue what you were going to get out of malik Jackson. First he wasn’t very good in 2018. The Jaguars benched him because he was bad. bad against the run and wasn’t exactly thrilling in the pass rush department either. The Eagles took a chance signing him , hoping he’d return to form. I still think that contract was a huge gamble at that contract (How it was structured) when you look at it for a guy that could’ve been on the decline and not very good anymore.

However he was also coming off a lis Franc injury So not only did you have a poor 2018  now you have him coming off a major injury. So the Eagles couldn’t just go into the season saying Jackson and Cox were going to be the guys. Jackson you have no clue what he was going to give you based off 2018 and then coming off this type of injury. The reality was  They overcorrected because they didn’t want to be in the position that they were last year where was Fletcher Cox and just a bunch of guys

DE is top priority for next year as of right now.  We need to see what Reagor can do to determine if WR is also key.  There is also going to be some spot on the OL for sure.  LT or C likely.  RG is also not locked down by any stretch.

3 minutes ago, DrPhilly said:

DE is top priority for next year as of right now.  We need to see what Reagor can do to determine if WR is also key.  There is also going to be some spot on the OL for sure.  LT or C likely.  RG is also not locked down by any stretch.

Something needs to be done at LB. Just wait and see what Kittle does to Gerry tonight

12 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

Yes and, as HE said, Malik Jackson is going to be 31 going into next year and is just coming off an injury where he was lost for a whole season.  

The Eagles view DT (DL as a whole) as a premium position and they will invest $$ at the position.  Hargrave should have at least 4 years before any appreciable decline in his play.  There are quite a few areas where the Eagles have spent resources in a dubious manner -- the Hargrave signing is way down the list.

Hargrave is already coming off an injury of his own and truth be told we have no idea how serious it actually is.  He won't even be here for 4 years.  His 4th year is a club option.

I understand that they spend on DT and invest.  I think Hargrave is at the top of the list when you consider all of the other needs.  If you want to invest in DT...draft a few.  When is the last DT they drafted?  Beau Allen in the 7th round?  Learn how to scout and build your team in the draft.  

10 minutes ago, DrPhilly said:

DE is top priority for next year as of right now.  We need to see what Reagor can do to determine if WR is also key.  There is also going to be some spot on the OL for sure.  LT or C likely.  RG is also not locked down by any stretch.

A disappointing, even horrible pass rush is not nearly as damaging to the future of the franchise as throwing Wentz out there with practice squad weapons for a 3rd consecutive season.  DE should continue to wait until they get better WRs.

Reagor, it seems, will be spending his rookie year in the tub.  

@In2football  Eagles 23 49ers 24

@In2football

Eagles 13

49ers 34

23 minutes ago, DrPhilly said:

DE is top priority for next year as of right now.  We need to see what Reagor can do to determine if WR is also key.  There is also going to be some spot on the OL for sure.  LT or C likely.  RG is also not locked down by any stretch.

Really, what may need to happen is a top 5 pick with a QB available at that pick, we trade for more assets.  Though I'd much rather a 13 game win streak starting tonight