1 hour ago, greend said:

I'm not for "tanking" and I won't root for losing. We have talent on offense that will grow with Wentz every year now. What we need is less injuries, someone figure that one out. Some guys need to go Alshon, D-Jax, Peters, and now I'm climbing on the bye Ertz bandwagon. But Wentz,  Reagor, Goedert, Sanders, and a couple of the new offensive linemen and receivers will be fine.

On defense another c.b. and a line backer or two will make all the difference. Not as bleak as it looks right now. 

Ertz's effort, or lack thereof Sunday was appalling.  

6 hours ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

You'd keep Howie? On what basis? From what evidence? The 2017 SB? Which is looking more and more like an outlier for a lot of players and coaches and Howie. 

It's not that I'd keep him permanently. Rather, I feel like some things really aren't his fault. Let me say a short thing.

After the Super Bowl, when everyone was celebrating, I was very happy...but more relieved than anything. Relieved that, despite the absolutely lights out performance that the offense played...the defense made basically one play the ENTIRE GAME LONG when it mattered. 

I think to me, that's probably when my strongly wanting Schwartz gone started. Right after the Super Bowl. It never faded. What I'm trying to say is that I think Schwartz is literally so bad that it makes it hard to evaluate the things around him. Like I mentioned in my past post, if Douglas and Jones are NFL players, then those aren't necessarily Roseman misses, despite them not producing for the Eagles. 

I'd like to see what happens with a coach that actually knows how to use the talent Howie acquires.

5 hours ago, MediterraneanDiet said:

Welcome back.  We've talked a lot about this: player development not just on D, but across the board.  Few players ever improve and many get worse.  We've been banging the drum of play to a players strength not to what the coaches want them to be.  Some in here have trouble with this but the evidence is indisputable.   This coaching staff is not able to help players get better rather they make them worse.  The one exception us Stoudtland and to a certain degree, Duce.  Those position groups do more with less.  

It's awful. Seriously, it's awful. The defense specifically. The offense has had some success in every position except Wide Receiver. But the defense...abysmal.

-----------------------------------------------

Speaking of developing guys. Let's talk Arcega-Whiteside. I've looked at whatever I can find about him, old stuff wise, college cuts that aren't taken down, targets from videos, and such.

And honestly? I think despite the non-existent production, I think there's some decent qualities if used properly. Let me start with this.

We really need to stay away from getting Carson "Alshon Jeffery" style receivers. Unless they are either absolutely trusted, or unknown enough to get a good chance, Carson will never give them a chance to make a contested catch up high. It is what it is. It's just not his type of throw. He did a better job with this 2017 when he often moved out of the pocket then gave them a shot - but not so much anymore.

Arcega-Whiteside does have some NFL traits. He has NFL strength. He has NFL hands, for sure. He does have very strong hands. I actually don't think he's missing many traits that he needs to be a decent NFL player. But for WR, he's missing something absolutely critical.

Some people say he's slow in straight line, and that may or may not be true with pads on, but he actually ran faster coming out than many receivers including the CeeDee Lamb that a lot of people were shouting about, who I always felt looked very slow on video. I think Arcega-Whiteside has a lot more of a problem with lack of quickness/sudden explosiveness than he has with straight speed.

This was actually illustrated when he was drafted. Whiteside has a 7.23 3 cone drill, while Alshon Jeffery, which many compared him to, reportedly had a much faster 6.71. This should have been the flag of 'these guys are different', because 7.23 is near DE time, between DE and TE. And it shows up when he tries to cut in and out of routes.

And that's kind of where I've had a few thoughts. 

I actually think he's a TE in the NFL because of that. First, look at his measurables. His 33 & 1/4 inch arm length actually puts him above the average for the TE position. When Trey Burton came out of college, he actually weighed about the same as Arcega-Whiteside does now. He's the same height as Arcega-Whiteside, too. He ran slower than Arcega-Whiteside. Smaller hands. Smaller wingspan. Whiteside is also both a good blocker and contested catches are his strength.

Basically, if you put Whiteside's measurables into a TE rather than a WR, he actually has the vast majority of what he needs to be successful there. But for WR, getting in and out of breaks is just too important considering CBs have the highest average change of direction in the entire NFL.

And I think, considering that Zach Ertz is probably on the way out of Philadelphia if he keeps playing like he is right now, and we got our third TE stolen, combined with the emerging of Travis Fulgham, this is the route I think they should be considering overall. He's just not a receiver in the NFL. That's the biggest issue, and the coaches need to realize that.

3 minutes ago, wtfcares said:

Exactly. People sit here and blame the DC for having undrafted players start at LB as if the DC actively chose that over signing a good FA or drafting a LB high. Obviously any coach would rather have better players starters if he had the choice. 

Schwartz of course gets input on what he wants or needs on defense, like every DC should, but people are acting like he hand picked every player on defense or told Howie to grab a project LB in round 3. 

For the sake of the argument, let’s say Howie does give Schwartz that kind of power. What does that say about Howie? He apparently has minimal input on the draft according to some. He has minimal say on who is on the defense. 

What does that leave? Meddling with Doug’s coaching staff and contracts?

4 minutes ago, Wentz_Era said:

Ertz's effort, or lack thereof Sunday was appalling.  

Yup, if he's this much of a bish about not getting a new contract and being paid as a "top 3" then he can go. You're still getting paid this year Zach, play like it.

1 hour ago, Bacarty2 said:

No ones "freaking out" but knowing this is a 6-9-1 team, why the F are we trying to be 6-9-1 when 4-11-1 gets us a better pick? moral victory lol. 

So they get a better pick and draft another JJAW

33 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

I doubt they will sell with Dak getting hurt. They’ll try to win the division and it will be to the detriment of the franchise long term.

Getting Wentz, our young OL and WRs experience in a playoff game is more detrimental than getting pick 21 instead of 13?

I dont know about that

16 hours ago, schuy7 said:

Cutting LJ Fort made absolutely no sense for this team. That one is really unbelievable. 

Fort does not fit this scheme, it's pretty simple.  He's a 3/4 ILB

I just don't get the angst directed at these coaches.  They clearly don't have the players.  How is Jim Schwartz going to make this defense great?  Bill Belicheat would struggle to top people coaching this defense, and that is assuming he has the offensive play call most downs.  Sure, the d-line will still make a few plays for you.  Overall, though, the talent is not there, and the difference makers aren't there.  The few remaining are older, declining players.  None of this should be that surprising.

I can't get myself upset at any of the coaches.  Or really any of the players.  The team has done a fair job getting through injuries and getting some contributions from younger players.  They deserve some credit for that.  The major issue here is the QB and what the heck happened to him, and what player he really is moving forward.  

The people responsible for the roster construct and cap situation right now must be held accountable.  A path forward must be identified to bring the team back into shape for future contention.  What we are on right now is a decline that is sloped to continue until changes are made, and will accelerate when/if one or more division opponents get their acts together.

I can't agree with Jimmy K any more right now:

https://www.phillyvoice.com/eagles-cannot-allow-dak-prescott-injury-to-set-them-back-long-term/

 

Having zero NFL line backers on this team is inexcusable and I doubt Schwartz told Howie that LB's were not important and he didn't need any this year. I am definitely on board with letting Howie go. I'm not 100% sure on Schwartz yet, but I wouldn't be disappointed if they went in a different direction on defense. 

19 minutes ago, Mike31mt said:

Getting Wentz, our young OL and WRs experience in a playoff game is more detrimental than getting pick 21 instead of 13?

I dont know about that

It worked out great last year...

I’m glad Wentz, Sanders and Ward got playoff experience last year. That was far more valuable than drafting Ceedee Lamb. 

2 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

I’m glad Wentz, Sanders and Ward got playoff experience last year. That was far more valuable than drafting Ceedee Lamb. 

You're assuming Howie would have drafted Lamb...

Just now, mikemack8 said:

You're assuming Howie would have drafted Lamb...

I’m confident he would have. 

Regarding Howie...

I tend to view personnel moves from a process perspective. For example, killing Howie for Malik Jackson getting injured in 2019(which, yes, I have seen multiple posters do on this board) is unfair because Malik has been an extremely durable player his whole career and is a great fit for this scheme. I'm also not going to kill them for letting Jordan Hicks go because he's had major injury issues since college and still signed for like $9 million a year. On the flip side, it's absolutely fair to kill Howie for relying on DeSean Jackson because DeSean has shown multiple times (Washington 2015 and Philly 2019 being the most glaring) that he is susceptible to nagging, season-altering injuries.

From a process perspective, several of the Eagles draft picks since 2017 have been inexcusable: Rasul Douglas, Donnel Pumphrey, Shareef Miller, and picking 2 project players on Day 3 in 2020. Douglas never, NOT AT ANY POINT EVER, fit this scheme. He was a solid player put in a position to fail. Pumphrey was 23 already, small, and not even that athletic; he had no chance from the jump. Shareef Miller was a complete waste of space; didn't have the size or athleticism to be a reliable NFL player and had the personality of a wet paper bag. Picking Jalen Hurts was not a great use of resources; drafting Jalen Hurts, a project QB, and Davion Taylor, a complete project LB, on Day 2 of the SAME DRAFT is inexcusable. Each move on its own is defensible (not sure I would defend either move, but there are some valid arguments for either), but together it's a flat-out joke.

And, finally, arguably the most egregious -- trading a 3rd round pick mid-season for Golden Tate, whom you had no intention of re-signing.

You add all of those indefensible moves together and you wonder -- couldn't one of those picks turned into a productive linebacker? You couldn't have drafted an actual outside corner who fits the scheme? You couldn't have drafted a mid-round DT so you didn't have to tie up $40 million to the position in 2020 and instead used that resource to sign a veteran LB or CB who fits the scheme? 

5 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

I’m glad Wentz, Sanders and Ward got playoff experience last year. That was far more valuable than drafting Ceedee Lamb. 

Not to mention the severe concussion Wentz suffered by being in the playoffs.

1 hour ago, ManuManu said:

 

That statement makes no sense. It is just gobbledygook.  By definition, a priority is a placement of one thing above another.

Does anyone disagree that having CeeDee Lamb for five years is more valuable than that playoff appearance?

Any good will Wentz built for getting us there was wiped out by his unfortunate concussion and us stupidly drafting Jalen Hurts. 

Speaking of a terrible use of resources...

 

 

3 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

Does anyone disagree that having CeeDee Lamb for five years is more valuable than that playoff appearance?

Any good Will Wentz built your getting us there was wiped out by his unfortunate concussion and us stupidly drafting Jalen Hurts. 

Ugh. All we needed was Dallas to not no-show a game.

Or Eli Manning to not miss a throw that would have KOed us.

2 minutes ago, RLC said:

Ugh. All we needed was Dallas to not no-show a game.

Or Eli Manning to not miss a throw that would have KOed us.

And if we draft five spots higher in round 2, maybe we don’t take Hurts at all. 

1 hour ago, bpac55 said:

Mentioned this the other day.  He has Kelce in the middle and a bunch of bums around him.  D-lines can just tee off.  Everyone on the line needs help at this point.  

Step 1 was seeing if he belonged on an NFL field and he proved that.

Step 2 was not getting Carson killed.  He's done that.  Don't give me the Bud Dupree sack, they had to throw and Dupree knew it.  He's also a stud.

Step 3 is making sure he doesn't have mental breakdowns.  So far I haven't seen any major mistakes of him letting his man go.

Step 4 is growth to be a starting LT...I think we are witnessing this right now.

Step 5 is DP not getting feelings for JP and putting him back at LT once he is healthy.

Step 6 is finishing the season strong.

Then the fun begins.  If Mailata just continues to play at the level he's playing at now i want him at LT next year.  However this is the Eagles we are talking about.  Would they try him at RT since Dillard can only play LT?  Do you put all your eggs in Mailata and trade Dillard for a 3rd or 4th?  

The only thing we know as of now is Mailata is a player they can potentially build around.

A young, starting-calibre LT is worth much more than a 3rd.

36 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

It worked out great last year...

I mean, Wentz was out after like 2 drives

And its not like we didnt glean anything from our stripped-down roster with a 50 year old at QB hanging with the Seahawks into the 4th quarter

Thats great experience for everyone involved and being part of a winning organization means something.

18 minutes ago, Bacarty2 said:

I have confidence in them with a #10 and #40 pick

I think they try to out think themselves with purgatory picks .

I'd also bring in a "football guy" to help with the draft, Like Douglas. 

They need a GM with a cohesive vision who can communicate with the coaching staff.  I don't care if that person is a man, woman, wears a pocket protector and has a graduate degree, or if they are a HOF player.  

Howie ain't it.  Nick Foles, SB hero...it was so easy (for most) to understand that's not who he is.  He's a backup QB who had a magical run.  Howie is a bad GM who had a magical offseason.  That needs to be coming to light now.  I don't want Nick Foles as our franchise QB and I certainly don't want Howie as our GM.

There is no vision, no philosophy, just constant over-corrections and out-thinking.  2011 (draft before FA), try to get cute to out-smart the rest of the NFL by using your draft picks to get early low upside plug ins (Watkins, Jarrett) and use FA to take your big swings on talent (dream team).  

Go all in on NCAA production and stats, upside and fit be damned (Jordan Matthews, JJAW, Marcus Smith, Barnett)...then do a complete 180 and sort your entire 2020 draft board according to 40 times to compensate for the fact that you built the slowest team in the NFL.

Trade for players at the deadline who your coaches won't use.  Get in a highly visible fight with a star player on the practice field on the eve of a new season.

The guy has NO clue.  None.  He had one offseason where everything he touched turned to gold.  He was bad before, bad after, and will continue to be bad until they give the keys to the franchise to someone else.

28 minutes ago, Bacarty2 said:

You mean like 2018, and 2019 lol. 

Sure man,

Youre right we should just tank for 5 straigt years and then try to win the SB.  You know, like those winning organizations in Cleveland, DC, NYG, NYJ do. 

Thats the formula, definitely not what teams who are routinely in the playoffs are doing

25 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

I’m glad Wentz, Sanders and Ward got playoff experience last year. That was far more valuable than drafting Ceedee Lamb. 

Myopic

We got Reagor, he got hurt.  

Dallas has missed the playoffs and look what a juggernaut they are.  

7 minutes ago, Desertbirds said:

A young, starting-calibre LT is worth much more than a 3rd.

Indeed.