Ongoing Ertz discussion thread (orig 9/15)

[Dwide Schrude]

Before I get into this topic, I want to be clear I’m not hitting a panic button on the season or advocating that we should trade Ertz mid season or after the season. When Philly drafted Goedert in 2018 and with his proven talent, we all knew the day would come when we’d have to discuss which TE to keep, who goes, or is there a way to keep both? 
So TATE please don’t crucify me too bad for this topic lol.

Ertz has been in my opinion, the clear best offensive weapon on the Eagles since Shady/Maclin/D Jax days. He is also one of my personal favorite players. 
Goedert is clearly a good TE, and I think has the potential to join the Kittle/Kelce/Ertz tier. He’s young, amazing after the catch, reliable, consistent. While I’d prefer to keep both TE, Goedert’s presence is the only reason I would be ok with trading Ertz from a team building perspective, depending on the trade value of course. 
That’s the next question, what would Ertz value be for a trade? 
You look at the Hayden Hurst trade earlier this year first, who Baltimore shipped out along with a 2020 4th for a 2020 2nd & 2020 5th. I won’t even compare stats of Hurst & Ertz, everyone who follows the NFL knows Ertz is several tiers above Hurst. So Ertz should at least net a high second, anything less and Eagles would lose that trade. But after comparing Ertz’s production last 5 years vs Stefon Diggs last 5, I was surprised to find out they had fairly similar production. 

Ertz (GP/Rec/yards/TD)

2019: 15/88/916/6

2018: 16/116/1163/8

2017: 14/74/824/8

2016: 14/78/816/4

2015: 15/75/853/2

Diggs (GP/Rec/yards/TD)

2019: 15/63/1130/6

2018: 15/102/1021/9

2017: 14/64/849/8

2016: 13/84/903/3

2015: 13/52/720/4 

So, Stefon Diggs I would argue has been a tad bit more productive but not by much. Factor in Diggs is 26 & Ertz is 29, also there is the position difference. Even though to me Ertz is more like a WR than a TE. Stefon Diggs was traded for a 2020 1st, 5th, 6th & 2021 4th. Is it really that far fetched that Ertz could land Eagles a 1st? Trading Ertz mid season could severely damage locker room & signal to us that Eagles folded for the year. But do you pass on an extra 1st, when you still have Goedert to keep that TE position stable? Who would make the trade? A few teams come to mind, Saints just lost Michael Thomas for most of season & are clearly in win now mode. Jets desperately need help for Darnold, have an extra first, and the Joe Douglas connection. Patriots have the history of valuing TE, and probably would like to give Cam some help. 

thoughts??
 

 

[EagleMatt]

Goedert is the future at TE. Maybe sooner rather than later.

[Redzonemadness]

Ertz dropped that 4th down catch... cut him already...

errr.. never mind

Good thoughts.. Eagles already have high salary players.. It might be in Eagles long term interest to get some draft capital, acquire some cheap labor, preferably along the O-line. 

 

[Dwide Schrude]

6 minutes ago, Redzonemadness said:

Ertz dropped that 4th down catch... cut him already...

errr.. never mind

Good thoughts.. Eagles already have high salary players.. It might be in Eagles long term interest to get some draft capital, acquire some cheap labor, preferably along the O-line. 

 

That’s the way I look at it too, WR/DE/S/CB/C are all positions I’m concerned about long term. We also have no idea what to expect from Dillard for another year. 

[315Eagles]

Since everyone is so quick to get rid of Wentz, here's an idea...

Since Indy has Rivers and his time is running out, the Colts will be looking to get a QB, most likely in the draft.  Why not send them Ertz and Wentz?  Reich knows them well.  Wentz had his best season under Reich.  Maybe we get 2 1st round picks back?  

That's something I think Indy would do in a hurry.  

[FitzIsAtTheAirport]

5 minutes ago, 315Eagles said:

Since everyone is so quick to get rid of Wentz, here's an idea...

Since Indy has Rivers and his time is running out, the Colts will be looking to get a QB, most likely in the draft.  Why not send them Ertz and Wentz?  Reich knows them well.  Wentz had his best season under Reich.  Maybe we get 2 1st round picks back?  

That's something I think Indy would do in a hurry.  

Great, so Howie can draft more Dillards/Agholors/Barnetts.

[315Eagles]

Or trade the picks for proven, preferably younger talent at WR, CB, DE or O-line.

[PoconoDon]

Some men are born to Kick a**.

Some men are born to get their azzes kicked.

Howie drafts the latter.

[eggs]

I have been posting this for six months. For the eagles to get younger and healthier they need to monetize the TE position and give goeddert his shot. Ertz should be worth a first and a conditional pick that if he makes the next pro bowl, should be at least a mid round pick, maybe even a 2nd or 3rd. We can probably draft a starter with the first rounder and a back up with the conditional pick at positions of need and save $8 mm a year to pay another starter - all great to help the team fill holes like OL, DE, DB. For example, think what the $8 mm would buy for a quality second RB (melvin gordon, kareem hunt, jordan howard, etc)
 

If for some reason, you can’t get at least a 2nd and a conditional pick, you keep him and when he goes in free agency, you get an end of third round pick but i would think there is more of a market for him. 

[NOTW]

[Portyansky]

The problem is, Ertz wants WR money. Imo until we can prove he is not our best WR, he deserves it. Doesn't mean I think we should give it to him, simply he keeps us moving and has been our #1 WR. With that said. He is still under contract. Maybe they should just tell him they will work something out in the off season to keep him happy. 

[Br3]

You people want to trade ertz every season like he isn’t the only reliable target Wentz has every year 

what’s even more mind boggling is the fact that the people who want to trade him for picks never acknowledge how god awful this team is at drafting. Yea let’s trade a proven future hall of fame TE for a first so howie can select Danny Watkins little brother Dave who is also a firefighter.  

The less picks howie has, the better. 

[Dwide Schrude]

7 minutes ago, Br3 said:

You people want to trade ertz every season like he isn’t the only reliable target Wentz has every year 

what’s even more mind boggling is the fact that the people who want to trade him for picks never acknowledge how god awful this team is at drafting. Yea let’s trade a proven future hall of fame TE for a first so howie can select Danny Watkins little brother Dave who is also a firefighter.  

The less picks howie has, the better. 

Point to me in the post where I said wanted to trade Ertz

[Br3]

3 minutes ago, Dwide Schrude said:

Point to me in the post where I said wanted to trade Ertz

You literally asked "what would ertz value be for a trade” 

[Dwide Schrude]

4 minutes ago, Br3 said:

You literally asked "what would ertz value be for a trade” 

Nice reach, but read the first sentence. I know comprehension has never been your strong point, but just...try. 
 

even better yet, the part where I say "while I’d prefer to keep both”

[Godfather]

3 hours ago, EagleMatt said:

Goedert is the future at TE. Maybe sooner rather than later.

Boom

[weko]

2 hours ago, 315Eagles said:

Since everyone is so quick to get rid of Wentz, here's an idea...

Since Indy has Rivers and his time is running out, the Colts will be looking to get a QB, most likely in the draft.  Why not send them Ertz and Wentz?  Reich knows them well.  Wentz had his best season under Reich.  Maybe we get 2 1st round picks back?  

That's something I think Indy would do in a hurry.  

That's not a bad idea, at least for Ertz.  We are stuck with 2 top TEs and can't pay them both.  Ertz is on borrowed time and he may not be the only vet in that situation. He might get us a 2 in 21 and another pick, maybe a 3, in 22

[eaglesfan0075]

If Ertz lands the Eagles a blue-chip player at a premium position, I'd consider that move over just draft picks.

I don't think the Eagles will invest more money at WR with their youth movement currently, but from a talent perspective, Allen Robinson (rumored to request a trade, agent shot it down, but he deleted all Bears from his social media) would make sense.

This team doesn't really value LBs, but you could make an argument for a stud LB in exchange for Ertz.

If we're talking about OL help, Joe Thuney was rumored to be available via trade. This is the scenario that I think is most likely of the three. Thuney or another young veteran OL that can help us right away in exchange for Ertz.

[T-1000]

I love Ertz. This is an easy decision though. Goedert might not be the route runner that Ertz is but he is already a more dynamic and physical player and he's still getting better. Moving forward they can't afford to give Ertz a big contract. Not only that you can probably get something pretty good for him a trade. So you have Goedert ready to take over, a concerning cap situation, and a lot holes to fill which an Ertz trade can help. No brainer when you put sentimentality aside.

[Dwide Schrude]

1 hour ago, eaglesfan0075 said:

If Ertz lands the Eagles a blue-chip player at a premium position, I'd consider that move over just draft picks.

I don't think the Eagles will invest more money at WR with their youth movement currently, but from a talent perspective, Allen Robinson (rumored to request a trade, agent shot it down, but he deleted all Bears from his social media) would make sense.

This team doesn't really value LBs, but you could make an argument for a stud LB in exchange for Ertz.

If we're talking about OL help, Joe Thuney was rumored to be available via trade. This is the scenario that I think is most likely of the three. Thuney or another young veteran OL that can help us right away in exchange for Ertz.

I disagree about WR. Alshon and Jackson are likely gone after this season. And while I don’t want to rush to form an opinion of JJAW & the rookie WR, I do have my concerns for the long term look at the WR position. 

[UK_EaglesFan89]

To me I think this one is actually one of the easier and more straight forward decisions that Howie needs to make. 

Trade Ertz. 

We all love Ertz and he is a Philly legend but the time has come. Not because he's on the decline. Not because of one bad game. But because he wants top TE money and we simply don't have the cap space to do it. And right now he holds value that will decrease in a year's time. 

Right now Ertz has no leverage. He's being paid well, he's got 2 years left on his deal and he's fast approaching 30. The team also has a seemingly ideal replacement already lined up. And that replacement just had a huge game when Ertz actually let the team down a little. 

Goedert is the future. He actually has a higher ceiling than Ertz. Goedert is a better blocker, is more dynamic and can get YAC.

The team have to pay one of them, they can't really pay both and so that is a no brainer. You pay the younger guy who as a TE is a better all around player. 

[EazyEaglez]

4 hours ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

To me I think this one is actually one of the easier and more straight forward decisions that Howie needs to make. 

Trade Ertz. 

We all love Ertz and he is a Philly legend but the time has come. Not because he's on the decline. Not because of one bad game. But because he wants top TE money and we simply don't have the cap space to do it. And right now he holds value that will decrease in a year's time. 

Right now Ertz has no leverage. He's being paid well, he's got 2 years left on his deal and he's fast approaching 30. The team also has a seemingly ideal replacement already lined up. And that replacement just had a huge game when Ertz actually let the team down a little. 

Goedert is the future. He actually has a higher ceiling than Ertz. Goedert is a better blocker, is more dynamic and can get YAC.

The team have to pay one of them, they can't really pay both and so that is a no brainer. You pay the younger guy who as a TE is a better all around player. 

The Eagles used to get rid of guys before they fell off a cliff. They remind me of how the Phillies held onto their start for too long still trying to create old magic. They keep telling us they’re trying to get younger, but they keep giving contracts to older guys. 

[nipples]

9 hours ago, Portyansky said:

The problem is, Ertz wants WR money. Imo until we can prove he is not our best WR, he deserves it. Doesn't mean I think we should give it to him, simply he keeps us moving and has been our #1 WR. With that said. He is still under contract. Maybe they should just tell him they will work something out in the off season to keep him happy. 

Do we even know for a fact that he’s still better than Goedert? I’m not so sure. And that isn’t a knock on Ertz so much as a statement to how good Goedert is becoming. 
 

Whether this opinion is popular or not, I was for trading Ertz this past offseason. He’s looking to break the bank, which we cannot afford. And let’s say they do give him a new deal... we’ll that means losing Goedert in a year because they won’t be able to pay both of them top tight end money. So essentially you would be opting to pay the older guy who is certainly going to start declining very soon, and giving away the young up and coming tight end. 

[Portyansky]

13 minutes ago, nipples said:

Do we even know for a fact that he’s still better than Goedert? I’m not so sure. And that isn’t a knock on Ertz so much as a statement to how good Goedert is becoming. 
 

Whether this opinion is popular or not, I was for trading Ertz this past offseason. He’s looking to break the bank, which we cannot afford. And let’s say they do give him a new deal... we’ll that means losing Goedert in a year because they won’t be able to pay both of them top tight end money. So essentially you would be opting to pay the older guy who is certainly going to start declining very soon, and giving away the young up and coming tight end. 

I think if they were gonna trade him it would have been done by now. He's still under contract and I don't he is the type of player to sit out.

[Bwestbrook36]

I'm going to say what I said before. I think they still need to make sure one of those young receivers can step up before we get rid of Ertz. If Reagor or Hightower or even Whiteside ( doubtful) show that can be a great option going forward then by all means move on from Ertz.