13 minutes ago, EagleJoe8 said:

I’ll give you the Cliff notes version. Easy Eagles and T-1000 seem to have problems with the idea that I don’t believe the team has no issues with Hurts, and despite what they said publicly, I had the audacity to claim they will have discussions about other options. 
 

Now, I never said they would get anyone else, just discussions will take place. 
 

That’s when the butt hurt commenced. 

Well lots of people say that including Didinger, Seth Joyner, etc. 

2 minutes ago, NOTW said:

Well lots of people say that including Didinger, Seth Joyner, etc. 

Right. I wasn’t even claiming it was any grand statement. I said it on the heals of the OP thinking it was settled based on Howie’s statements. 

1 minute ago, EagleJoe8 said:

Right. I wasn’t even claiming it was any grand statement. I said it on the heals of the OP thinking it was settled based on Howie’s statements. 

More deflection

Just now, Bwestbrook36 said:

More deflection

Trouble maker!

1 minute ago, EagleJoe8 said:

Trouble maker!

Name them!!! 

10 minutes ago, Bwestbrook36 said:

Name them!!! 

The trouble makers?

Ok!

Bwestbrook36!

 

HA!

4 minutes ago, EagleJoe8 said:

The trouble makers?

Ok!

Bwestbrook36!

 

HA!

Never heard of him! 

3 minutes ago, Bwestbrook36 said:

Never heard of him! 

Look him up. 
 

Good dude. 

12 minutes ago, EagleJoe8 said:

Look him up. 
 

Good dude. 

Probably a beanbagger

9 hours ago, Cochis_Calhoun said:

Sam Darnold isn't vastly superior to any other starter as a QB or a passer, neither is Daniel Jones, I can agree Hurts hasn't been consistently good enough this year but some of you lot need to dial it back a bit because stuff like this really is horseshit.

Sunday was horseshit.

On 1/19/2022 at 2:29 PM, T-1000 said:

Common sense reasons why bring back Hurts for at least another year is the obvious move

1. He is 23 years old, has been in the league for two years, and a starter for one. He could develop and get better

2. Hurts counts very little against the cap

3. The team has multiple holes to fill across the roster so assets and cap dollars are important

4. The team is FAR from a great QB away from being a contender

5. To trade for a great QB would take multiple high level assets and high cap dollars

6. If they trade multiple high level assets and tie up a lot of cap in a QB they can't fix the rest of the roster

7. Wilson and Rodgers, and probably Watson as well aren't going to want to come here

8. Trading lesser assets and spending 25 million on a slightly above average QB like Carr or Jimmy G. doesn't move the needle much

9. This is a bad QB draft class

10. The Eagles pick 15, 16, and 19, which doesn't position them for one of the top QB's in this class anyway

11. Giving up multiple assets to trade up for a QB in a bad draft class would be terrible asset management

12. Going with a rookie QB would be restarting a rebuild with a total unknown, when Hurts has already proven they are a playoff team with him

Do I need to keep going.....

trading for Carr moves the needle down.
 

otherwise, pretty much agree with almost anything.

However,  the Eagles should consider Malik Willis to be the starter in 2024.   Hurts in 2022 and 2023 does well, and the question becomes "do we want to pay Jalen Hurts $40 Million a years starting in 2024"?    If we don't, we're screwed, we're between a rock and hard place, we're forced to spend and wreck the cap again.   Or,  we have Malik Willis, who has made an acceptable transition to the NFL from Liberty.  In 2022 and 2023,  the Eagles could use Willis in a number of innovative ways, and the Eagles could put Willis in quicker if Hurts injures his ankle again.    I suspect that Hurts ankle was not 100% in the playoff game and that's why he didn't run all that much,  when Hurts running was really the best thing all game. 

What the Eagles should be looking for from Willis is 1) raw 2) better athlete - compare the combine numbers, stare at them closely, and 3) bigger arm.

It is possible that Willis could be as good or better than Hurts at the beginning of the 2024 season.  Also possible he isn't.  At the beginning of the 2024, hopefully,  Hurts as done so well that he deserves that $40 Million but it might not be best to be the ones who are paying him $40 Million.  Cap and all.  Willis just seems perfect for that particular role of backup and versatile situational weapon (what are his height and weight and 40 time and 10 split and everything else.   Hurts is a top athlete, top rushing yards for a QB.   But Willis might be better.   He played QB a bit at Auburn, and he ran extremely well, a yards per carry over 10.  A lot of big runs.   We look very closely at the combine numbers.   Is he as good, physically, or better, than Jalen Hurts?   There aren't many running QBs every year as good as Hurts.   You watch for them, and take them when you want them.   D'eriq King is a good choice for the Reid Sinnett spot.  Take a long look at the combine numbers.   How do Willis, King and Hurts compare to the Eagles running backs? 

4 hours ago, eagle45 said:

Sunday was horseshit.

Sunday was completely expected.

Tampa Bay won the Super Bowl last year.
The Eagles went 4-11-1.

A rational observer would expect Tampa Bay to win big.  And they did.

Other QBs to lose in the same weekend include Kyler Murray, Mac Jones, Dak Prescott.

Quick analysis says that Jalen Hurts is about as good as the QBs that lost the same weekend.

You find out how much defense matters in all this by adding new quality to the defense. 

9 hours ago, Random Reglar said:

Sunday was completely expected.

Tampa Bay won the Super Bowl last year.
The Eagles went 4-11-1.

A rational observer would expect Tampa Bay to win big.  And they did.

Other QBs to lose in the same weekend include Kyler Murray, Mac Jones, Dak Prescott.

Quick analysis says that Jalen Hurts is about as good as the QBs that lost the same weekend.

You find out how much defense matters in all this by adding new quality to the defense. 

I say this respectfully, but your quick analysis is so absurd that it reveals the rest of your perspective on this just isn’t worth discussing.

8 hours ago, eagle45 said:

I say this respectfully, but your quick analysis is so absurd that it reveals the rest of your perspective on this just isn’t worth discussing.

I wish the chargers FO is doing the same quick analysis as this guy. They will then see the clear upgrade Hurts offers over Herbert (no playoffs and all) and offer us a one for one trade!

Hurts numbers against the Defending Champs wasn't the best and analyzed heavily. Because it was playoff game everything is magnified.  But I look around the playoffs and Dak, Aaron, Jimmy G, Tannahill, Kyler etc.  All of these QB's have been playing longer in a starting position yet putting up average to below average QB numbers this playoffs. It's not about Hurts being better than them, it's about him getting to a chance to develop like they did and a chance to fail and grow from it.   People need to understand, the playoffs is a different energy.   The Lights got too bright for a Young QB like Jalen and a young Coaching staff against the Defending Champs.  He will learn from this.  I'm excited to see Hurts in the same system next year.  

54 minutes ago, KINGnabb said:

Hurts numbers against the Defending Champs wasn't the best and analyzed heavily. Because it was playoff game everything is magnified.  But I look around the playoffs and Dak, Aaron, Jimmy G, Tannahill, Kyler etc.  All of these QB's have been playing longer in a starting position yet putting up average to below average QB numbers this playoffs. It's not about Hurts being better than them, it's about him getting to a chance to develop like they did and a chance to fail and grow from it.   People need to understand, the playoffs is a different energy.   The Lights got too bright for a Young QB like Jalen and a young Coaching staff against the Defending Champs.  He will learn from this.  I'm excited to see Hurts in the same system next year.  

 

1 hour ago, KINGnabb said:

Hurts numbers against the Defending Champs wasn't the best and analyzed heavily. Because it was playoff game everything is magnified.  But I look around the playoffs and Dak, Aaron, Jimmy G, Tannahill, Kyler etc.  All of these QB's have been playing longer in a starting position yet putting up average to below average QB numbers this playoffs. It's not about Hurts being better than them, it's about him getting to a chance to develop like they did and a chance to fail and grow from it.   People need to understand, the playoffs is a different energy.   The Lights got too bright for a Young QB like Jalen and a young Coaching staff against the Defending Champs.  He will learn from this.  I'm excited to see Hurts in the same system next year.  

Hurts does not even remotely compare to Dak Prescott as a passer.  The comparison is completely invalid.  We make fun of Dak, as we should, and he is in a different stratosphere…both now and when he first came into the league.

You are exactly right…it is about Hurts getting a chance to develop.  He doesn’t deserve a chance to develop.  Josh Allen, 6’5” with one of the greatest arms in NFL history, deserved a chance to develop after struggling early.  Aaron Rodgers, one of the most talented QBs in NFL history, deserved a chance to develop.  Dak Prescott had one of the best rookie seasons as a passer in NFL history. When he struggled in year 2, he deserved a chance to develop.  Kyler Murray was the first overall pick and a completely different arm talent level than Hurts (I do think he’s overrated)…he gets a chance to develop.

Jalen Hurts…2nd round pick, should have been even later, weak arm, short, AND has no idea how to find an open target or read a defense.  If you want to give him a chance to develop, then that is just incompatible with giving a crap about the Eagles.  At that point, someone is a Jalen Hurts fan first and an Eagles fan second.

Hurts has the unique distinction of being completely bereft of physical passing talent AND being a completely clueless QB who cannot read defenses or go through progressions.  To say that he deserves a chance to develop is to say that every QB who has been drafted automatically needs 3 years as a starter to see how they can grow.  Some of them never get the opportunity because they don’t deserve it.  Hurts both sucks right now AND lacks upside.  I don’t want to see him develop.  I don’t want to see Hurts in the same system next year.  He’s destroying the system into a smoke, mirror, dink, and dunk show.  Siri’s system is "I know my QB sucks and I’m going to do my best to run, not pass, hide my QBs, and hope we don’t fall behind.”  You want to see Hurts in that system again next year?

4 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

 If you want to give him a chance to develop, then that is just incompatible with giving a crap about the Eagles.  At that point, someone is a Jalen Hurts fan first and an Eagles fan second.

Or maybe the answer is simply that you are a Hurts hater first and an Eagles fan second?

1 minute ago, jsb235 said:

Or maybe the answer is simply that you are a Hurts hater first and an Eagles fan second?

Being an Eagles fan has necessitated that I become a Hurts hater, since I care about the forward progression of the team.  

Can someone say something good about Hurts’ passing?  Anything.

Leadership, swag, mobility, and developing don’t count.  

Either raw talent and potential (as a passer) or something positive as-is.  
 

Just one thing good about his passing relative to other qbs.

1 hour ago, eagle45 said:

Being an Eagles fan has necessitated that I become a Hurts hater, since I care about the forward progression of the team.  

I think the opposite is true. What's the percentile of drafted QBs having a successful starting career? If I didn't know anything about football I could still pick any draft, poop all over every draftable QB as being unfit as an NFL QB with 0 chance of having a successful starting career and I would be right at least 80% of the time. probably into 90%. Knowing something about football is suppose mitigate teams failure rate but still ... JP Losman, Jason Campbell, Matt Leinert, Brady Quinn, Josh Freeman, Tim Tebow, Jake Locker, Brandon Weeden, EJ Manuel, Paxton Lynch, Mitch Trubisky, Josh Rosen, Dwayne Haskins. 

Peyton Manning / Ryan Leaf was suppose to be a coin flip. And while the Colts insist it was Peyton all along the Chargers still took Leaf. My point is that none of us amateur analysts know ish and you spouting off how inept Hurts is as if you know something doesn't impress anyone. And that's really all it's about - when/If Hurts fails (and the odds are that he will) you want to be able say "I told you so - look at me - see how smart I am". Sorry, but no one will be impressed then either. 

From an article debunking the NFL combine velocity score as a usable metric "Former Bears Director of College Scouting Greg Gabriel noted that such luminaries as Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, and Drew Brees improved their arm strength with mechanics work and weight training." Ball Velocity is Bunk

 

Hurts arm strength is never going to be in the top tier of NFL QBs but it can get better. I think it's strong enough now but for you doubters it is possible for him to improve into that "good enough" range by the start of next season. He can also improve his accuracy and timing and understanding of defenses / coverages. Will he? Who knows but I believe in karma and I believe it's healthier to have a positive outlook rather than a negative one.  No one should he a Hurts hater - I'm not suggesting that we should be Hurts fans at this point either. The best possible outcome for the Eagles right now is for Hurts to develop into a quality (or better) NFL starter. He is the Eagles QB whether you like it or not so you should be rooting for his development and future success - until he gets cut or traded.

 

 

11 minutes ago, Nivraga said:

I think the opposite is true. What's the percentile of drafted QBs having a successful starting career? If I didn't know anything about football I could still pick any draft, poop all over every draftable QB as being unfit as an NFL QB with 0 chance of having a successful starting career and I would be right at least 80% of the time. probably into 90%. Knowing something about football is suppose mitigate teams failure rate but still ... JP Losman, Jason Campbell, Matt Leinert, Brady Quinn, Josh Freeman, Tim Tebow, Jake Locker, Brandon Weeden, EJ Manuel, Paxton Lynch, Mitch Trubisky, Josh Rosen, Dwayne Haskins. 

Peyton Manning / Ryan Leaf was suppose to be a coin flip. And while the Colts insist it was Peyton all along the Chargers still took Leaf. My point is that none of us amateur analysts know ish and you spouting off how inept Hurts is as if you know something doesn't impress anyone. And that's really all it's about - when/If Hurts fails (and the odds are that he will) you want to be able say "I told you so - look at me - see how smart I am". Sorry, but no one will be impressed then either. 

From an article debunking the NFL combine velocity score as a usable metric "Former Bears Director of College Scouting Greg Gabriel noted that such luminaries as Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, and Drew Brees improved their arm strength with mechanics work and weight training." Ball Velocity is Bunk

 

Hurts arm strength is never going to be in the top tier of NFL QBs but it can get better. I think it's strong enough now but for you doubters it is possible for him to improve into that "good enough" range by the start of next season. He can also improve his accuracy and timing and understanding of defenses / coverages. Will he? Who knows but I believe in karma and I believe it's healthier to have a positive outlook rather than a negative one.  No one should he a Hurts hater - I'm not suggesting that we should be Hurts fans at this point either. The best possible outcome for the Eagles right now is for Hurts to develop into a quality (or better) NFL starter. He is the Eagles QB whether you like it or not so you should be rooting for his development and future success - until he gets cut or traded.

 

 

I’m not talking about ball velocity.  Hurts has a plainly obvious poor arm that impacts what throws he can make.

And if you, or anyone, believe a qb to be uniquely bad and damaging to the offense…and your team is misguided into patiently building around him…then yes, you should be a hater.

4 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

I’m not talking about ball velocity.  Hurts has a plainly obvious poor arm that impacts what throws he can make.

And if you, or anyone, believe a qb to be uniquely bad and damaging to the offense…and your team is misguided into patiently building around him…then yes, you should be a hater.

So i've decided to take some advice from Mark Twain - "Never argue with ignorant people. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." If your only take away from my post was about ball velocity then you didn't understand anything - and I'm not going to waste my time - Hate away - I hope it devours your soul.

58 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

Can someone say something good about Hurts’ passing?  Anything.

Leadership, swag, mobility, and developing don’t count.  

Either raw talent and potential (as a passer) or something positive as-is.  
 

Just one thing good about his passing relative to other qbs.

At times Hurts has shown the ability to be pin point accurate. He needs to develop those moments to a point of being routine but there is something to build on. He also has shown the ability to read the defense, move through his progression and find the right target though he is still too slow and consequently late with the ball but again it is something to build on.

4 minutes ago, Nivraga said:

Hurts has shown the ability to be pin point accurate.
He also has shown the ability to read the defense, move through his progression and find the right target.

 

 

7 minutes ago, Nivraga said:

So i've decided to take some advice from Mark Twain - "Never argue with ignorant people. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience."