Well, that's one way to open schools, I guess. 

29 minutes ago, Mike030270 said:

Wouldn't that include schools?

No. It's for anything that requires a city permit. 

4 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Well, that's one way to open schools, I guess. 

4-1? F

9 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Well, that's one way to open schools, I guess. 

Never mind the large number of experts who think that it's important that we do so.  

8 minutes ago, The_Omega said:

Never mind the large number of experts who think that it's important that we do so.  

Sure. Point is they plan on reopening with 0 precautions. 

1 minute ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Sure. Point is they plan on reopening with 0 precautions. 

The only reasonable way to get through this pandemic, and back to our normal lives, is to pretend that this pandemic doesn't exist. 

32 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Well, that's one way to open schools, I guess. 

That's absurd.

13 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Sure. Point is they plan on reopening with 0 precautions. 

Teachers can take their own precautions.  Were i one, I'd wear a mask, for sure. Students are, and are at, minimal risk.

Just now, The_Omega said:

Teachers can take their own precautions.  Were i one, I'd wear a mask, for sure. Students are, and are at, minimal risk.

Um....you know wearing a mask doesn't protect the teacher, right?

🤡🌎

1 minute ago, Paul852 said:

Um....you know wearing a mask doesn't protect the teacher, right?

Of course it does.  The greatest risk to teachers and faculty, will come from other teachers and faulty. If they all wear them, they will see greater protection.

1 minute ago, The_Omega said:

Of course it does.  The greatest risk to teachers and faculty, will come from other teachers and faulty. If they all wear them, they will see greater protection.

You say that without any evidence that it's true. Nobody knows how much transmission is coming from children.

asymptomatic children bringing covid-19 home to their parents/grandparents could be a nightmare. 

1 minute ago, Paul852 said:

You say that without any evidence that it's true. Nobody knows how much transmission is coming from children.

It's funny that that's the one thing you question.  There's a lot of things that nobody knows about when it comes to this virus, yet here's the only one that you question.  And yeah, there is evidence of it.

https://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/early/2020/07/08/peds.2020-004879

 

Quote

 

In this issue of Pediatrics, Posfay-Barbe et al⁶ report on the dynamics of COVID-19 within families of children with reverse-transcription polymerase chain reaction–confirmed SARS-CoV-2 infection in Geneva, Switzerland. From March 10 to April 10, 2020, all children <16 years of age diagnosed at Geneva University Hospital (N = 40) underwent contact tracing to identify infected household contacts (HHCs). Of 39 evaluable households, in only 3 (8%) was a child the suspected index case, with symptom onset preceding illness in adult HHCs. In all other households, the child developed symptoms after or concurrent with adult HHCs, suggesting that the child was not the source of infection and that children most frequently acquire COVID-19 from adults, rather than transmitting it to them.

These findings are consistent with other recently published HHC investigations in China. Of 68 children with confirmed COVID-19 admitted to Qingdao Women’s and Children’s Hospital from January 20 to February 27, 2020, and with complete epidemiological data, 65 (95.59%) patients were HHCs of previously infected adults.⁷ Of 10 children hospitalized outside Wuhan, China, in only 1 was there possible child to adult transmission, based on symptom chronology.⁸ Similarly, transmission of SARS-CoV-2 by children outside household settings seems uncommon, although information is limited. In an intriguing study from France, a 9-year-old boy with respiratory symptoms associated with picornavirus, influenza A, and SARS-CoV-2 coinfection was found to have exposed over 80 classmates at 3 schools; no secondary contacts became infected, despite numerous influenza infections within the schools, suggesting an environment conducive to respiratory virus transmission.⁹ In New South Wales, Australia, 9 students and 9 staff infected with SARS-CoV-2 across 15 schools had close contact with a total of 735 students and 128 staff.¹⁰ Only 2 secondary infections were identified, none in adult staff; 1 student in primary school was potentially infected by a staff member, and 1 student in high school was potentially infected via exposure to 2 infected schoolmates.

On the basis of these data, SARS-CoV-2 transmission in schools may be less important in community transmission than initially feared. This would be another manner by which SARS-CoV-2 differs drastically from influenza, for which school-based transmission is well recognized as a significant driver of epidemic disease and forms the basis for most evidence regarding school closures as public health strategy.^11,12 Although 2 reports are far from definitive, the researchers provide early reassurance that school-based transmission could be a manageable problem, and school closures may not have to be a foregone conclusion, particularly for elementary school–aged children who appear to be at the lowest risk of infection. Additional support comes from mathematical models, which find that school closures alone may be insufficient to halt epidemic spread¹³ and have modest overall impacts compared with broader, community-wide physical distancing measures.¹⁴

These data all suggest that children are not significant drivers of the COVID-19 pandemic. It is unclear why documented SARS-CoV-2 transmission from children to other children or adults is so infrequent. In 47 COVID-19–infected German children, nasopharyngeal SARS-CoV-2 viral loads were similar to those in other age groups, raising concern that children could be as infectious as adults.¹⁵ Because SARS-CoV-2 infected children are so frequently mildly symptomatic, they may have weaker and less frequent cough, releasing fewer infectious particles into the surrounding environment. Another possibility is that because school closures occurred in most locations along with or before widespread physical distancing orders, most close contacts became limited to households, reducing opportunities for children to become infected in the community and present as index cases.

 

 

4 minutes ago, mr_hunt said:

asymptomatic children bringing covid-19 home to their parents/grandparents could be a nightmare. 

The long term effects of keeping children out of school, and away from their peers, could be an even bigger nightmare.  This isn't a right/wrong situation, but keep pretending it is.

4 minutes ago, The_Omega said:

It's funny that that's the one thing you question.  There's a lot of things that nobody knows about when it comes to this virus, yet here's the only one that you question.  And yeah, there is evidence of it.

https://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/early/2020/07/08/peds.2020-004879

 

 

WTF are you talking about? That's literally what we're talking about. What other questions do you want me to be asking? This isn't enough evidence to rationalize sending millions of kids back to school right now.

11 minutes ago, The_Omega said:

The long term effects of keeping children out of school, and away from their peers, could be an even bigger nightmare.  This isn't a right/wrong situation, but keep pretending it is.

even bigger than giving parents/grandparents coronavirus?  i'm not so sure about that one. 

tbs, i'd love for my kid to be able to safely attend school in person...remote learning sucked & i'm not paying for him to go to private school for a crappy education through emails. 

8 minutes ago, Paul852 said:

WTF are you talking about? That's literally what we're talking about. What other questions do you want me to be asking? This isn't enough evidence to rationalize sending millions of kids back to school right now.

Thousands of doctors disagree with you. You want to sacrifice the health and well being of children to your ignorance driven fears.

1 minute ago, The_Omega said:

Thousands of doctors disagree with you. You want to sacrifice the health and well being of children to your ignorance driven fears.

Thousands of doctors have said to open schools?

40 minutes ago, The_Omega said:

Never mind the large number of experts who think that it's important that we do so.  

The same experts that say protests aren't responsible for spreading the virus? 🤷‍♂️

TBH, in a vacuum I do feel like the kids need to go back to school, especially when reading this article below from Sick Kids Hospital in Toronto. It's a really good read:

https://www.sickkids.ca/PDFs/About-SickKids/81407-COVID19-Recommendations-for-School-Reopening-SickKids.pdf

Protecting teachers is another issue though, as is asymptomatic carriers bringing it home and infecting parents/grandparents. There several different elements at play here unfortunately.

2 minutes ago, mr_hunt said:

even bigger than giving parents/grandparents coronavirus?  i'm not so sure about that one. 

tbs, i'd love for my kid to be able to safely attend school in person...remote learning sucked & i'm not paying for him to go to private school for a crappy education. 

Ugh. It feels so dumb even having to say this. The Trump crowd makes us defend such obvious positions.  Yes, we want our kids to go to school. Yes, we want the economy to reopen. But no, we can't get there without doing the difficult, arduous, boring, tedious work that Trump is so blatantly trying to avoid. 

2 minutes ago, Paul852 said:

Thousands of doctors have said to open schools?

Yup.  There is nothing without risk.  The damage being done to the kids by keeping the schools closed is too great to not try to work around, though.

4 minutes ago, Lloyd said:

Ugh. It feels so dumb even having to say this. The Trump crowd makes us defend such obvious positions.  Yes, we want our kids to go to school. Yes, we want the economy to reopen. But no, we can't get there without doing the difficult, arduous, boring, tedious work that Trump is so blatantly trying to avoid. 

With Trump the problem isn’t just the irresponsible rhetoric.  It’s also that he operates in the dumbest way possible.

https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/06/29/884638999/u-s-pediatricians-call-for-in-person-school-this-fall
 

THE CORONAVIRUS CRISIS

U.S. Pediatricians Call For In-Person School This Fall

3 minutes ago, The_Omega said:

Yup.  There is nothing without risk.  The damage being done to the kids by keeping the schools closed is too great to not try to work around, though.

What # of deaths would you consider acceptable from schools being open?