9 minutes ago, Dave Moss said:

He called George Conway a moonface last night.  If you told me that the President after Obama left office would be tweeting out racial slurs I never would have believed it.

 

 

 

 

C’mon. He was talking about Cushings Disease and definitely not about Conway being half Asian.

Can anyone reasonably explain why my local barber can’t open but Walmart and Target can?

2 minutes ago, Outlaw said:

Can anyone reasonably explain why my local barber can’t open but Walmart and Target can?

Reasonably? No.

3 minutes ago, Outlaw said:

Can anyone reasonably explain why my local barber can’t open but Walmart and Target can?

Or Home Depot.  Are there essential groceries in Home Depot or something?

1 minute ago, hey suess said:

Reasonably? No.

 

Just now, xzmattzx said:

Or Home Depot.  Are there essential groceries in Home Depot or something?

I’m not a confederate flag waving "open at all costs” guy but I think it’s ridiculous that big box retailers can be open and full of crowds of people but local mom and pop‘s who even when open under normal circumstances have 10 people in the shop at a time, can’t. 

5 minutes ago, Outlaw said:

Can anyone reasonably explain why my local barber can’t open but Walmart and Target can?

I mean technically Walmart/Target sell truly essential goods like groceries. In reality that's not why the majority of people are still going there, but at least I get the loophole they're using.

7 minutes ago, xzmattzx said:

Or Home Depot.  Are there essential groceries in Home Depot or something?

This one makes less sense to me.  Keeping contractors, landscapers and the like afloat is important but it seems as if they easily could have transitioned to an online/phone ordering system with curbside pickup to serve that purpose given what the rest of the country has had to do.

4 minutes ago, DEagle7 said:

I mean technically Walmart/Target sell truly essential goods like groceries. In reality that's not why the majority of people are still going there, but at least I get the loophole they're using.

This one makes less sense to me.  Keeping contractors, landscapers and the like afloat is important but it seems as if they easily could have transitioned to an online/phone ordering system with curbside pickup to serve that purpose given what the rest of the country has had to do.

Dude...Bass Pro Shops in my area stayed open.

2 minutes ago, Outlaw said:

 

I’m not a confederate flag waving "open at all costs” guy but I think it’s ridiculous that big box retailers can be open and full of crowds of people but local mom and pop‘s who even when open under normal circumstances have 10 people in the shop at a time, can’t. 

Anyone who advocates for shopping local, or anyone in urban planning, or anyone looking for "the real experience" in an urban environment (all left-leaning to various degrees, although shopping local can also be right-leaning) should be receptive to opening things back up.  The big box stores can and did ride this out.  Many small businesses will never come back.  Wal-Mart, Home Depot, Amazon, Target, McDonald's, etc will all pull ahead of the pack a little bit more because of this.

 

I was fine with shutting down, and I am still fine with limiting crowds and opportunities for people's networks of contacts in public to grow, but some of the things we are being asked to do seem very patchworky.

6 minutes ago, hey suess said:

Dude...Bass Pro Shops in my area stayed open.

Oh I'm not arguing that it's not BS.  But for Target and Walmart I at least understand the company line of "we sell groceries". Which, for some people/communities a Walmart might be their biggest supplier of groceries.  I'd be willing to bet that is the large minority of people that are still going to those stores right now though.

Home Depot/Lowes I get staying open considering how many workers they supply but that role could easily be filled as an order/pickup situation. Opening the stores to masses while shutting down local hardware joints doesn't make much sense.  

Bass pro shop....yeah I got nothing for that.

If Wal-Mart and Target hadn't been open where else would we have gone to look for toilet paper?

3 minutes ago, DEagle7 said:

Oh I'm not arguing that it's not BS.  But for Target and Walmart I at least understand the company line of "we sell groceries". Which, for some people/communities a Walmart might be their biggest supplier of groceries.  I'd be willing to bet that is the large minority of people that are still going to those stores right now though.

Home Depot/Lowes I get staying open considering how many workers they supply but that role could easily be filled as an order/pickup situation. Opening the stores to masses while shutting down local hardware joints doesn't make much sense.  

Bass pro shop....yeah I got nothing for that.

Yeah, not talking dedicated grocery stores. I live in Hatboro/Horsham.  Home Depot is packed. Lowe’s is packed. Walmart is packed. But if I want to go get my kid a haircut in a shop that at most ever has 8-10 people in it?  Nope, sorry. Can’t do it. It’s so arbitrary it’s nauseating. 

20 minutes ago, Outlaw said:

Yeah, not talking dedicated grocery stores. I live in Hatboro/Horsham.  Home Depot is packed. Lowe’s is packed. Walmart is packed. But if I want to go get my kid a haircut in a shop that at most ever has 8-10 people in it?  Nope, sorry. Can’t do it. It’s so arbitrary it’s nauseating. 

The way it's currently set up is absolutely hypocritical in a lot of ways clearly done patchwork and shouldn't be, and being manipulated by people and store owners, but that's not really an arbitrary distinction either.  Besides how close a barber has to get to you by the nature of their job and the square footage difference of those stores, a barber shop staying closed also significantly impacts a lot fewer people than a place that sells groceries/paper goods/construction equipment etc. Not being able to get a haircut is annoying but not exactly on the same level as not being able to go buy food, TP, cleaning supplies, repair a plumbing issue in your house, etc.

11 minutes ago, DEagle7 said:

The way it's currently set up is absolutely hypocritical in a lot of ways clearly done patchwork and shouldn't be, and being manipulated by people and store owners, but that's not really an arbitrary distinction either.  Besides how close a barber has to get to you by the nature of their job and the square footage difference of those stores, a barber shop staying closed also significantly impacts a lot fewer people than a place that sells groceries/paper goods/construction equipment etc. Not being able to get a haircut is annoying but not exactly on the same level as not being able to go buy food, TP, cleaning supplies, repair a plumbing issue in your house, etc.

So you require masks and glove, for customer and barber. DE is doing it. It’s just an example. 

The liquor store I'm a manager at has been busy AF since this thing started.  Ever since the day the NY/NJ/CT governors announced the tri-state curfew and rules (the day they did that, when people were thinking we'd be shutdown, we had our busiest day in our history) it's been like every week is a holiday week.  Though, the holidays are finite and eventually end.  This has been going on for 6+ weeks now and unlike the holidays we've been doing it short staffed at both our stores.  Yet, our owners still have both stores open 9am-8pm for 7 days/week when other liquor stores have either cut their hours down or just gone to pickup/delivery only.  But since our owners are making bank right now it's cool to run the employees into the ground and wear them down.  Yeah, it's nice to keep working and not be on unemployment, but this is like Groundhogs Day replaying 4th of July or Thanksgiving week over and over again.  

And we have a Lowe's next to us and on every nice day that parking lot is packed.  I really haven't gone out much, but I did go to my local Lowe's Monday to get stuff for my yard and garden and it was really busy.  The lines for the outdoor center were a 10-15 minute wait at least.  Wawas are still open and past curfew, only closing from 2-3am to clean, but they aren't as crowded as normal.  The local pizza place just a few minutes from me is usually busy with takeout and delivery orders.  So some small businesses are doing well.  But having WalMart/Target open while other small stores have to close doesn't make sense.  If their excuse is they sell groceries then leave that part of the store open and shutdown what's considered non-essential.  But since you can't enforce that the whole store is open.  It seems any store open that people use it as an excuse to get out of the house.  I swear I've seen that at my store.  You can tell the customers who know what they want and come in and get it and those who are lollygagging and on a day trip.  Fers.  

 

Just now, Outlaw said:

So you require masks and glove, for customer and barber. DE is doing it. It’s just an example. 

All stores require mask and gloves (at least around me) right now. Plus masks/gloves help but they don't prevent transmission really. Reducing exposure and distancing are still important in the flattening the curve phase.

I think I get your point.  Places like Walmart shouldn't be allowed to sell non-essential BS when you're forcing small vendors that sell clothes/electronics/toys etc are forced to close.  Places like Home Depot should be curbside pickup and shouldn't let people in the store while mom and pop hardware stores are closing.  Places like Bass Pro Shop being open is an absolute embarrassment. Just not sure a barber is really a good example here.

31 minutes ago, Green_Guinness said:

The liquor store I'm a manager at has been busy AF since this thing started.  Ever since the day the NY/NJ/CT governors announced the tri-state curfew and rules (the day they did that, when people were thinking we'd be shutdown, we had our busiest day in our history) it's been like every week is a holiday week.  Though, the holidays are finite and eventually end.  This has been going on for 6+ weeks now and unlike the holidays we've been doing it short staffed at both our stores.  Yet, our owners still have both stores open 9am-8pm for 7 days/week when other liquor stores have either cut their hours down or just gone to pickup/delivery only.  But since our owners are making bank right now it's cool to run the employees into the ground and wear them down.  Yeah, it's nice to keep working and not be on unemployment, but this is like Groundhogs Day replaying 4th of July or Thanksgiving week over and over again.  

And we have a Lowe's next to us and on every nice day that parking lot is packed.  I really haven't gone out much, but I did go to my local Lowe's Monday to get stuff for my yard and garden and it was really busy.  The lines for the outdoor center were a 10-15 minute wait at least.  Wawas are still open and past curfew, only closing from 2-3am to clean, but they aren't as crowded as normal.  The local pizza place just a few minutes from me is usually busy with takeout and delivery orders.  So some small businesses are doing well.  But having WalMart/Target open while other small stores have to close doesn't make sense.  If their excuse is they sell groceries then leave that part of the store open and shutdown what's considered non-essential.  But since you can't enforce that the whole store is open.  It seems any store open that people use it as an excuse to get out of the house.  I swear I've seen that at my store.  You can tell the customers who know what they want and come in and get it and those who are lollygagging and on a day trip.  Fers.  

 

Are you on Rt 38?

Just now, FranklinFldEBUpper said:

Are you on Rt 38?

Nope.

A former owner of mine, whom I worked with for nearly 15 years, he cut his 3 stores hours down to 11am-7pm M-St and 11-6 on Sundays.  That would be nice.  And one of the busiest stores in the state of NJ, they have been doing from 11am-noon everyday where they only allow seniors and at risk people in the store then noon-7pm Mon-St they are open and noon-6pm on Sun.  That's pretty cool of them.  I'm sure they're losing out on sales, but they are putting the health of their customers, employees and community above their profits.  If it were me I'd advertise that we open later because we are cleaning/disinfecting our store for 1-2 hours every morning.  And we could take in deliveries without customers in the store to make it less difficult as most of the distributors won't allow their drivers to come into the store when we're open.  They now drop all the cases just inside the store past our dock/receiving area, which is twice as much work for us now.  Without customers in the store they could drop their cases in the aisles like they used to.  

9 hours ago, Lorddevn said:

Not really. The cdc changed there stance based on perception, not physical data. Masks still don’t prevent one from getting the infection they prevent one from spreading it. Those countries did not improve infections based on mask wearing. They improved infection based on broad testing and forceful quarantine and tracking. 

Right, masks reduce the amount of particles that are put into the air by a carrier.  Since we are dealing with a virus in which at least 30% of the people are asymptomatic, and for people who are symptomatic, symptoms usually don’t show up until day 5, then it behooves everyone to wear a mask when in public as you could have it and not know it.

Japan didn’t do broad testing. Japan has tested 186,000 people out of a population of 126 million.   That’s 1 test per 677 people.   Neither did Taiwan.  They’ve run 65,000 tests out of a population of 24 million.  That’s 1 test per 370 people.  

Yes the adherence to quarantine and tracking are also key.  But so is having a populous that is willing to comply with wearing a mask when in public spaces.  If everyone wears a mask in public spaces you have less transmission of the virus, that’s basically the starting point of trying to stop this thing.
 

7 hours ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

What position is Hong Kong and Taiwan in?   I’d love to hear this.   

Taiwan has had 439 cases and 6 deaths.  They have a population of 24 million.  That comes out to 0.25 deaths per 1 million people.

Hong Kong has had 1,000 cases and 4 deaths.  They have a population of 7.4 million. That comes out to 0.5 deaths per million people. 

As a comparison, we are currently at 218 deaths per million people.

7 hours ago, xzmattzx said:

Anyone who advocates for shopping local, or anyone in urban planning, or anyone looking for "the real experience" in an urban environment (all left-leaning to various degrees, although shopping local can also be right-leaning) should be receptive to opening things back up.  The big box stores can and did ride this out.  Many small businesses will never come back.  Wal-Mart, Home Depot, Amazon, Target, McDonald's, etc will all pull ahead of the pack a little bit more because of this.

 

I was fine with shutting down, and I am still fine with limiting crowds and opportunities for people's networks of contacts in public to grow, but some of the things we are being asked to do seem very patchworky.

Well according to some in here if a small business folds during this period they never would have made it anyway, so it's no big deal if they go out of business.

11 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Well you’re a complete moron, if you believe the numbers being reported out of China.  Unless you want to believe them to advance your political beliefs.  

Hong Kong is still an international city with external interests and governed somewhat separately than mainland China. If it was bad there, we'd all know even if it were from all anecdotal accounts. 

29 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Well you’re a complete moron, if you believe the numbers being reported out of China.  Unless you want to believe them to advance your political beliefs.  

First, you can drop the "unless you want to believe them to advance your political beliefs” nonsense.  I don’t play that bullsh-t game.  What does that even mean, to "advance my political beliefs”?  

Secondly, if you’d like to not look at Taiwan and Hong Kong that’s fine.  There are other countries to look at where adherence to wearing masks when in public has correlation to decreased rates of infection.  Not to mention the studies that show that wearing masks results in decided transmission of respiratory viruses.

Comparing Taiwan and Hong Kong to the US is like comparing apples to oranges, the cultures are too different.

 

Tucker nails it again.

4 minutes ago, Kz! said:

Tucker nails it again.