October 26, 20205 yr 18 minutes ago, DBW said: From talking with him the confidence is not high within their company. 2 major companies pulled trials recently, one has started back up due to illness and I think a death. AZ was one of them. Look I hope they figure it out, but I am not hanging my hat on it nor am I signing up for it. To each their own and I’m not an antivaxxer but just not sold on there being a quick fix like they promise. Both AZ and J&J have resumed their trials. All candidates are not created equal though. ChAdOx-1 from AZ had less promising trial data than the other candidates I mentioned, and while I hope J&J's candidate shows good results, because they are the only single dose solution of all the leading candidates, I'm not as confident in them either for the same reason.
October 26, 20205 yr 16 minutes ago, Bwestbrook36 said: Wouldn't finding a treatment that lowers your chances of dying from it be just as effective? I see a lot of talk about vaccines and not much on the treatment front. No, ideally you want a vaccine that triggers sterilizing immunity so that anyone who is inoculated can't even get "infected" to begin with and thus can't actively spread the disease to others. Therapeutic options still allow for anyone who's infected to be carriers and infect others prior to seeking treatment. 10 minutes ago, DBW said: Yeah I feel like a "tamiflu” type Of treatment makes more sense. No, see above.
October 26, 20205 yr 29 minutes ago, we_gotta_believe said: No, ideally you want a vaccine that triggers sterilizing immunity so that anyone who is inoculated can't even get "infected" to begin with and thus can't actively spread the disease to others. Therapeutic options still allow for anyone who's infected to be carriers and infect others prior to seeking treatment. No, see above. Makes sense, still a long way to go on all of this.
October 27, 20205 yr 30 minutes ago, we_gotta_believe said: No, ideally you want a vaccine that triggers sterilizing immunity so that anyone who is inoculated can't even get "infected" to begin with and thus can't actively spread the disease to others. Therapeutic options still allow for anyone who's infected to be carriers and infect others prior to seeking treatment. No, see above. That makes sense - in a perfect world we’d have both I guess.
October 27, 20205 yr 2 hours ago, DrPhilly said: Childish to look at the overall effects the pandemic has on a country over time. Got it. You sound like a Trumpbot. We're talking about COVID in various countries but the only metric you want is a 5 year look at death rates? And I'm a Trumpbot? I mistook you for an intelligent person. Correction received.
October 27, 20205 yr 8 hours ago, Dave Moss said: Pretty sure he’s making fun of you pretending like we can’t discuss masks because of Trump, not mocking the actual pandemic. And the fact that the topic is so far gone politically In the US that people can’t have a discussion about it without the dug in positions is very troubling. My very point. The conversation in other countries is far more nuanced on the topic, I.e. a far more valuable and healthy discussion. Yes, I blame Trump.
October 27, 20205 yr 6 hours ago, Toastrel said: We're talking about COVID in various countries but the only metric you want is a 5 year look at death rates? And I'm a Trumpbot? I mistook you for an intelligent person. Correction received. Forgive me for a bit of extreme posting to try to prove a point. All I am saying is that it is very hard to just point at one metric and only part way into the process. I do believe this is a long term game and a very complex situation. Excess deaths is the only simple metric that can be used but then I would want to look at 12 months minimum. I think it is more effective to look at a broad group of parameters that include the excess deaths but also items that measure the over all well being of the country.
October 27, 20205 yr 9 hours ago, Joe Shades 73 said: Wait second you are the one that laughed at me in March when I said 1 million people already had the virus Not possible. I was pushing the concept that loads of people already had it back in late Jan and early Feb.
October 27, 20205 yr 8 hours ago, we_gotta_believe said: I'm not laughing at the current situation we're in, I'm laughing at you because you're a joke. And yes I was wrong on how insidious this contagion was back in February. I changed course two months later and admitted my mistake once I saw how easily it was spreading within our borders. You, on the other hand, seem resigned to avoiding a simple question about masks. I wonder why that is. See other posts. I’ll answer on masks. Have some patience grasshopper.
October 27, 20205 yr 3 hours ago, DrPhilly said: Forgive me for a bit of extreme posting to try to prove a point. All I am saying is that it is very hard to just point at one metric and only part way into the process. I do believe this is a long term game and a very complex situation. Excess deaths is the only simple metric that can be used but then I would want to look at 12 months minimum. I think it is more effective to look at a broad group of parameters that include the excess deaths but also items that measure the over all well being of the country. I think you chose an effective strategy to make the numbers look the way you want. Not to discuss how different nations are handling the pandemic.
October 27, 20205 yr 4 hours ago, DrPhilly said: See other posts. I’ll answer on masks. Have some patience grasshopper. Another day, another chance to make yourself the laughing stock of CVON... Do you agree that the evidence for mask wearing is weak? Do you think policies requiring their use is based on "blind principle"?
October 27, 20205 yr The Trump team has given up on COVID. Not surprising, given that the President and his family caught it and now 5 of Pence's staff have it (head of the COVID task force) They are not giving up on spreading the virus at in person events, though.
October 27, 20205 yr 3 hours ago, Toastrel said: I think you chose an effective strategy to make the numbers look the way you want. Not to discuss how different nations are handling the pandemic. Happy to discuss how nations have handled the pandemic. Metrics can be a part of that discussion but need to be put into context. Part of the context is the time horizon. Another part is the specific context. For example, New Zealand has a very specific context given its geographical realilty.
October 27, 20205 yr 1 hour ago, we_gotta_believe said: Another day, another chance to make yourself the laughing stock of CVON... Do you agree that the evidence for mask wearing is weak? Do you think policies requiring their use is based on "blind principle"? Continue to beat the dead horse. I'll answer your question the day Trump either concedes or is taken into custody. In the meantime, I'll be laughing at you. You can laugh at me if you like.
October 27, 20205 yr 2 minutes ago, DrPhilly said: Happy to discuss how nations have handled the pandemic. Metrics can be a part of that discussion but need to be put into context. Part of the context is the time horizon. Another part is the specific context. For example, New Zealand has a very specific context given its geographical realilty. You can stop now. I just wanted you to pick a metric we can use to discuss how countries are CURRENTLY handing the COVID crisis. You picked, I have no interest in whatever game you are playing.
October 27, 20205 yr Just now, DrPhilly said: Continue to beat the dead horse. I'll answer your question the day Trump either concedes or is taken into custody. In the meantime, I'll be laughing at you. You can laugh at me if you like.
October 27, 20205 yr 33 minutes ago, DrPhilly said: Happy to discuss how nations have handled the pandemic. Metrics can be a part of that discussion but need to be put into context. Part of the context is the time horizon. Another part is the specific context. For example, New Zealand has a very specific context given its geographical realilty. Geography, climate, culture, affluence are all big influencers. Which is why I would argue (without looking into the numbers before hand in case anyone thinks I'm trying to take a side here) that the most appropriate comparison for Sweden would be the other Scandanavian countries. Low overall population density, comparable weather, shared borders but not as many as say Germany, big into saunas and smoked fish, etc.
October 27, 20205 yr 15 minutes ago, Toastrel said: You can stop now. I just wanted you to pick a metric we can use to discuss how countries are CURRENTLY handing the COVID crisis. You picked, I have no interest in whatever game you are playing. Ok. There isn't a single metric that can be looked at on its own without any context brought into the discussion. That's it.
October 27, 20205 yr 8 minutes ago, DEagle7 said: Geography, climate, culture, affluence are all big influencers. Which is why I would argue (without looking into the numbers before hand in case anyone thinks I'm trying to take a side here) that the most appropriate comparison for Sweden would be the other Scandanavian countries. Low overall population density, comparable weather, shared borders but not as many as say German, big into saunas and smoked fish, etc. Here is a reasonable post. Yes, that's the kind of discussion that needs to take place. There is of course more to it. Timeline, economic impact, education, etc. etc. 12 minutes ago, we_gotta_believe said: Tell you what, take your smug attitude and shove it up your ass.
October 27, 20205 yr 2 minutes ago, DrPhilly said: Here is a reasonable post. Yes, that's the kind of discussion that needs to take place. There is of course more to it. Timeline, economic impact, education, etc. etc. I think that's a reasonable stance. I don't think we will have the full breadth of understanding about COVID's impact for a long time. I do think it is fair to comment/make some critiques based on the data we have at this point as long as it's properly contextualized. I will say that this type of argument can get out of control though. For example, any time anyone tries to compare the US to the rest of the world for any reason (healthcare, carbon emissions, payscale, tax structure, etc) people automatically shut it down because there is no easy proxy culturally/population density/geographically/historically to the US. We should be able to factor in context differences without completely giving up on available data. Not saying you're doing that here, just pointing out that the context argument can be taken too far.
October 27, 20205 yr NOT WEARING A MASK IS LINKED TO ANTISOCIAL TRAITS, STUDY FINDS Those who don’t comply with Covid-19 containment measures were found to be more callous, hostile and deceitful. https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-families/mask-wearing-anti-social-personality-traits-study-brazil-b1347252.html
October 27, 20205 yr 3 minutes ago, DEagle7 said: I think that's a reasonable stance. I don't think we will have the full breadth of understanding about COVID's impact for a long time. I do think it is fair to comment/make some critiques based on the data we have at this point as long as it's properly contextualized. I will say that this type of argument can get out of control though. For example, any time anyone tries to compare the US to the rest of the world for any reason (healthcare, carbon emissions, payscale, tax structure, etc) people automatically shut it down because there is no easy proxy culturally/population density/geographically/historically to the US. We should be able to factor in context differences without completely giving up on available data. Not saying you're doing that here, just pointing out that the context argument can be taken too far. Agree 100% I'm very happy to have a discussion now with anyone that is capable of viewing it contextually as you are doing above. I don't think any country has been perfect, far from it.
October 27, 20205 yr 3 minutes ago, DaEagles4Life said: NOT WEARING A MASK IS LINKED TO ANTISOCIAL TRAITS, STUDY FINDS Those who don’t comply with Covid-19 containment measures were found to be more callous, hostile and deceitful. https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-families/mask-wearing-anti-social-personality-traits-study-brazil-b1347252.html I'm as anti antimasker as anyone, but this is just stupid.
October 27, 20205 yr 1 minute ago, paco said: I'm as anti antimasker as anyone, but this is just stupid. but did you view the nuance contextually? huh? did you?
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