2 hours ago, EagleVA said:

If I were running a team, every draft I'd begin looking at the team's weaknesses, aka positions of need, only then would I start looking at players who play those positions,  that's how you build a football team.

How in the hell CB wasn't a priority is beyond me.

Every team is drafting with need in mind to some extent. But it gets less important in those later rounds. Especially when there are so many UDFA available.

On 6/5/2021 at 8:27 PM, EazyEaglez said:

The problem is during Howie’s 20 year tenure the Eagles basically have 4 losing seasons. They also have two Super Bowl appearances, a Super Bowl victory, and several division championships. The truth is they’ve had more success than failure and anytime things got bad they fired a coach and soon after they’re back on track. I don’t like Howie and think he should’ve been fired a long time ago, but the the truth is there hasn’t been a steady dose of losing in Philly under Lurie or Howie’s tenure. How can you expect him to learn from success? He’s not going to change the way he does things unless he’s forced out. Howie’s been a suspect drafter for sometime now, but still the Eagles have won with him as GM. It is what it is. 

Only in Philadelphia is this a "problem."

On 6/5/2021 at 8:31 PM, PoconoDon said:

And he is what he is. Time will tell the tale.

Time has told the tale. We have a super bowl and we have winning records most years.

Again, only in Philly is this a problem. "The thrill of victory and the agony of reading about it the next day."

9 minutes ago, TEW said:

Only in Philadelphia is this a "problem."

Time has told the tale. We have a super bowl and we have winning records most years.

Again, only in Philly is this a problem. "The thrill of victory and the agony of reading about it the next day."

I mean I don't like Howie but, you do actually make a good point. 

The last 20 years are the best years in the Eagles history and even at times the most successful stretch of success in the league. 

If Howie has been here for all of those 20 yrs he has been part of that success. Me personally I'd fire him tomorrow but, if you look at it from Jeff's eyes he is the only one who knows how much of that success was because of Howie and apparently it's enough for him to stay. 

6 minutes ago, Bwestbrook36 said:

I mean I don't like Howie but, you do actually make a good point. 

The last 20 years are the best years in the Eagles history and even at times the most successful stretch of success in the league. 

If Howie has been here for all of those 20 yrs he has been part of that success. Me personally I'd fire him tomorrow but, if you look at it from Jeff's eyes he is the only one who knows how much of that success was because of Howie and apparently it's enough for him to stay. 

Yeah, look - I don't think anyone believes Howie or the Eagles organization is perfect. There are things I'd change.

But for a guy who has been the GM for 3 HCs each of whom had winning records most years, and for a guy who brought the only Super Bowl in franchise history, the fans are absolutely insane with the hate.

1 hour ago, TEW said:

Only in Philadelphia is this a "problem."

Time has told the tale. We have a super bowl and we have winning records most years.

Again, only in Philly is this a problem. "The thrill of victory and the agony of reading about it the next day."

The story is still being written. Roster building begins with the draft. Under his leadership the team's draft performances have been forgettable and he's been forced to use FA to compensate. Improve the drafts dramatically and his support/approval will grow.

1 hour ago, Bwestbrook36 said:

I mean I don't like Howie but, you do actually make a good point. 

The last 20 years are the best years in the Eagles history and even at times the most successful stretch of success in the league. 

If Howie has been here for all of those 20 yrs he has been part of that success. Me personally I'd fire him tomorrow but, if you look at it from Jeff's eyes he is the only one who knows how much of that success was because of Howie and apparently it's enough for him to stay. 

I made the same point first! Did you read my post? 😂

2 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

I made the same point first! Did you read my post? 😂

Nope!! Lol I usually do read through and get some context on why the last comment was said. This time I didn't and I got caught lol. 

2 hours ago, TEW said:

Only in Philadelphia is this a "problem."

Time has told the tale. We have a super bowl and we have winning records most years.

Again, only in Philly is this a problem. "The thrill of victory and the agony of reading about it the next day."

I’m only pointing out that people are expecting Howie to be fired, but the reality is the Eagles have been good under his tenure so it isn’t a realistic expectation. Heck under Lurie every coach he’s hired has been in the playoffs within two years of his time as coach. They’re doing something right over there. With that being the case let’s not act like Howie’s been perfect. He’s dropped some clunker drafts, and handed out some bad contracts. Very few GMs survive 4 coaching changes. It could be a lot better and more consistent. 

There is a reason I describe Howie as extreme mediocrity, who got lucky with a statistical anomaly by winning a Super Bowl after a great year of free agency. Why some of you talk about a 20 year tenure is weird. Most of those early years, Banner had him at a desk outside his office. He wasn’t making personnel decisions. If we take his time since 2010 when he was officially named GM, even though Reid was still in charge, things don’t look so great under him minus 1 season. For starters, 2017 aside, we’ve never had a season greater than 10-6, and aside from 2017, we’ve only had 1 season where we’ve actually won a playoff game, and if Travon Hester trims his nails that morning, we don’t even win that one. 
 

Fact is, we got lucky in 2017, and Howie does and always will deserve his share of credit for that happening, but this team does not have any sort of track record of sustained greatness under him, and it’s been a clear downward trajectory since the Super Bowl. 

10 hours ago, Devaster said:

Every team is drafting with need in mind to some extent. But it gets less important in those later rounds. Especially when there are so many UDFA available.

Well we needed a corner and they didn't make it a priority, we should have targeted rounds 1or 2 to get one. 

5 hours ago, EagleVA said:

Well we needed a corner and they didn't make it a priority, we should have targeted rounds 1or 2 to get one. 

I agree and disagree. We needed a corner for sure and didn't address it. But at the same time the board didn't fall for them so I get why they didn't force things. 

19 hours ago, PoconoDon said:

The story is still being written. Roster building begins with the draft. Under his leadership the team's draft performances have been forgettable and he's been forced to use FA to compensate. Improve the drafts dramatically and his support/approval will grow.

It would grow a LOT. If he'd notice that the scouts' draft choices tend to work out better than his (Howie's) and proceed accordingly the Eagles could become one of the always-in-contention teams. The other concern I have is his kicking the can down the road contract restructures. I hope he has a realistic plan there.

On 6/10/2021 at 5:09 AM, EaglesAddict said:

And here is a link about Lurie wanting Hurts...https://www.espn.com/blog/philadelphia-eagles/post/_/id/31237/eagles-owner-jeffrey-lurie-gone-too-far-quarterback-directives

And I agree that is probably basically how the process goes down.  The issue with Howie is, he's not strong enough in his own evaluations to "take charge" on a given pick.  

Fair enough, those are certainly reports that make those claims and you brought the receipts.

I am always pretty skeptical though of reports claiming to know what went on on the inside of a draft room, especially when it comfortably fits into the narrative of the angle the reporter is trying to portray and the source is unnamed.

What McLane said in the original article was:  "Roseman, ultimately, sided with his coaches over his scouts on Reagor vs. Jefferson, per NFL sources, and stressed need over talent."  First, really, there were like 10 or so coaches who unanimously agreed on Reagor over Jefferson and 15 or so scouts who unanimously agreed on Jefferson over Reagor and nobody who thought they should pick someone else entirely at that spot over both Reagor and Jefferson?  That strains credulity.

And second, what really has me scratching my head there is trying to figure out what "NFL sources" are.  The best source for that would be Roseman, Lurie, Eagles coaches and/or scouts, or other Eagles insiders, but if it was an insider like that, why would McLane not cite that as "an Eagles scout" or "two Eagles coaches", or at least "Eagles sources" (if he was trying to protect the specific identity of his source)?  Does "NFL sources" mean it was instead some outsider like an agent or another team's GM, or what?  If so, how would they know?  And regardless of whether it was an insider or an outsider, were they someone with an ax to grind against Roseman (Pederson?) willing to present as fact their own speculation about how he made the choice rather than someone who actually knows, and is McLane the type of reporter who would rely on something like that to build an article on when he cannot find anyone with actual knowledge?  That is the problem with citing something amorphous like "NFL sources" -- it is really difficult to evaluate the claim.

Meanwhile, McManus' claim was:  "Lurie was influential in the selection of Hurts in last April's draft, according to sources."  Heh, we don't even know if his sources are at least as reliable as "NFL" sources.  And what exactly does "influential" mean?  I have no idea, but what I do know is that that amorphous citation fits squarely into the "meddling owner" trope which was the angle of the entire article. Without that "influential" quote to rely on as a factual basis -- which you can be sure was carefully crafted by McManus to be as specific as possible (and it was not specific at all) -- there is no article. The article was a house of cards built on that citation.  Again, really difficult to assess the truth of the claim.

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/eagles-among-worst-pff-three-113528397.html
 

According to PFF the contracts that Howie has signed has basically put the Eagles in dire cap constraints until 2023 and that assuming he doesn’t kick the can down the road some more. Knowing Howie he probably will. Giving guaranteed contracts to players like Elliott is killing the Eagles right now, and some of these contracts make it downright impossible to get rid of these guys. I hope Sirianni can really coach, because his GM isn’t giving him nearly enough help right now. 

3 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/eagles-among-worst-pff-three-113528397.html
 

According to PFF the contracts that Howie has signed has basically put the Eagles in dire cap constraints until 2023 and that assuming he doesn’t kick the can down the road some more. Knowing Howie he probably will. Giving guaranteed contracts to players like Elliott is killing the Eagles right now, and some of these contracts make it downright impossible to get rid of these guys. I hope Sirianni can really coach, because his GM isn’t giving him nearly enough help right now. 

#facts.  

While some folks were saying it will be OK, we have 73 million in 2022 cap room, I laughed at them and started tracking.

March 4th cap room

2022 - $ 73,325,877

2023 - $ 136,813,917

After all the maneuvering to get under the cap, dummy years for FA's signed and the rookie contracts, current cap room

2022 - $ 12,841,928

2023 - $ 79,946,266

Yes.  Howie has removed $ 117,351,600 off the 2022-23 cap.  None of the free agents he signed that have cap numbers for 2022 will be on the roster, so for all that cap damage, all he has added for the 2022 season is 9 rookies.

On 5/6/2021 at 2:28 PM, Rob331 said:

This actually goes back to the Chip Kelly days and the fact that Doug kept so many of Chip's assistant coaches doomed the young players.  They might have been good with vets, but terrible with young guys. 

Two things can be true at the same time.  The player development was poor.  Howie's drafting, contract structures, overpayment for aging players, poor trade decisions, and micromanaging the HC ( although that likely falls on Lurie) were equally poor.

Recall Doug did NOT have final say over coaching staff moves.  He said Walch and Groh were safe. The next day, they were fired.

 

Ultimately though, the issues with this team went far beyond the draft and developing younger players.  Fulgham, for example, is someone we placed our hopes in, but was a guy on his 3rd team in just his second year in the league.  That's generally a bad sign.  And we had to place our hopes in him due to bad contracts to Jeffery and Jackson, and drafting JJAW, whom I still see as a stiff with the new coaching staff.  

 

Point is, everything else about the team was changed this offseason... with the exception of the architect of the failed project.  Howie earned the same fate as Doug, Schwartz, Wentz, etc.  

Good point. Bad coaches can wreck players. 

Stoutland is the best teacher ever. What he did with Mialata speaks volumes. He should be a Head Coach. 

On 6/29/2021 at 10:20 AM, jsdarkstar said:

Good point. Bad coaches can wreck players. 

Stoutland is the best teacher ever. What he did with Mialata speaks volumes. He should be a Head Coach. 

Make sure the Peter principle doesn't apply to Stoutland. How many excellent position coaches or coordinators failed with a resounding thud when promoted above their competence level? The Ryan brothers come immediately to mind and I"m certain there are others. Maybe Stoutland recognizes this and is happy with where he is.

On 6/11/2021 at 1:46 PM, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

I agree and disagree. We needed a corner for sure and didn't address it. But at the same time the board didn't fall for them so I get why they didn't force things. 

BS, keep an eye on the Kentucky corners (Joseph and Echols), Joseph went in the 2nd and Echols in the 6th, both are damn good players that were passed on,\.

Echols was a steal, while smaller than Joesph, he's more atheletic, a better tackler, and has better ballhawking skills.     

Time to bump this thread.

Howie has made his share of mistakes, but he's not the village idiot either.  So far, the Sirianni hire looks to have been a good move.  The lines are looking strong.  Hurts is being used right and looks impressive in his role, as well as the skill players. 

A breath of fresh air after week one and Howie should be out of the doghouse for now.

Yeah, I can't see the good from where I am sitting. I see a GM who can't draft for sheet, and does that often. He had to take Smith this year, or he knows what would have happened...

what stands out to me is the discrepancy in drafting between Offense and Defense...check out this site which goes back to 2010..there seems to be quite an imbalance between Offense vs Defense drafting...
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/phi/draft.htm

So it begs the question...they seem to be better with hits on Offense and miss more often on defense...so maybe they need to re-evaluate their defensive scouting/drafting process?

 

1 hour ago, flyerdog said:

what stands out to me is the discrepancy in drafting between Offense and Defense...check out this site which goes back to 2010..there seems to be quite an imbalance between Offense vs Defense drafting...
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/phi/draft.htm

So it begs the question...they seem to be better with hits on Offense and miss more often on defense...so maybe they need to re-evaluate their defensive scouting/drafting process?

Today's NFL is a different league than in earlier years.  The rules favor the offense.  You just don't see a lot of dominating defenses anymore, and those teams with dominating defenses don't seem to bring trophies home anymore but for a couple of exceptions

I’ve taken my fair share of shots at Howie, but I have to say so far so good this season. Multiple rookies contributing in a game is a big win. It’s something we haven’t seen enough of. Howie’s 2021 has been very solid so far.

1 hour ago, Procus said:

Today's NFL is a different league than in earlier years.  The rules favor the offense.  You just don't see a lot of dominating defenses anymore, and those teams with dominating defenses don't seem to bring trophies home anymore but for a couple of exceptions

right, but in terms of actual talent that they pick...This is why they need to do better drafting on the defensive side...