Just now, 4for4EaglesNest said:

We are going with "Juicy Squirts Hurts” as the nickname this year.  Right?  
 

JSH for short? 

I'm going with Jalen Squirts. Squirts, for short.

4 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said:

You arguing that Reid didn't develop any QB's is insanity. It seems like you're just being contrarian for the sake of it. He's widely recognized as a great offensive mind, and has had excellent results with many different QBs (McNabb, Garcia, Vick, Alex Smith, Mahomes). Those guys you list, he was able to even make them look good enough to trade away for assets (well not Kafka). He even made Koy f'n Detmer look amazing for a nationally televised game. 

Your logic is illogical, and you're flat out wrong on this one. Take the L and move on. 

Nope, no loss to be taken.

McNabb did not have a continued improvement.

Garcia, seriously, he threw 63 TD's in his second and third year in the league.

Vick, his best season was his first with Andy, and he regressed every year after that.  His completion percentage went down every year, and his TD:INT ratio increased every year.

Alex Smith I will give you.

Mahomes, really, a once in a generation QB talent.  He could do what he is doing under any coach, he is a unicorn.

13 hours ago, Alphagrand said:

Sirianni reiterated in his PC today that roster decisions on who makes the team will be "a group effort” between the coaches and front office.

Lol guess they caught that convo on here the other day

5 hours ago, Veejer said:

I guess, given the nature of most Eagles fans, it shouldn't surprise me much that some of you are burying Hurts before he gets a fair shake to see what he can do, with a real OL and real WRs... the overwhelming need, especially on this Board, to denigrate instead of just using your eyes for a reasonable time frame... SMH...

Can you quote them

9 minutes ago, Original Sin said:

Big fan of his , and so far so good

per pff 

 

Zach Wilson: 137.7 passer rating this preseason 

1st among all QB

Funny how everyone was clowning him like a week ago because of how he looked during practices. It's almost like practices are different than games....

Just now, downundermike said:

Nope, no loss to be taken.

McNabb did not have a continued improvement.

Garcia, seriously, he threw 63 TD's in his second and third year in the league.

Vick, his best season was his first with Andy, and he regressed every year after that.  His completion percentage went down every year, and his TD:INT ratio increased every year.

Alex Smith I will give you.

Mahomes, really, a once in a generation QB talent.  He could do what he is doing under any coach, he is a unicorn.

I know you mentioned them, but Kolb declined.

Feeley consistently declined.

Vince Young had the worst year of his career. 

5 minutes ago, Swoop said:

I'm going with Jalen Squirts. Squirts, for short.

What about when people say "well he didn't play in the preseason much, so it makes sense he had a bad week 1"? Squirtscuses?

2 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

What about when people say "well he didn't play in the preseason much, so it makes sense he had a bad week 1"? Squirtscuses?

I said it last week. The excuses are already locked and loaded. 

"Well, it's only 5 games" 

"Well, the play calling was bad" 

"He was rusty, no preseason" 

"Im putting this one on Nick. Hurts did all he could" 

"Maybe he's still sick" 

"It's just week one, calm down" 

And so on.

9 minutes ago, downundermike said:

Nope, no loss to be taken.

McNabb did not have a continued improvement.

Garcia, seriously, he threw 63 TD's in his second and third year in the league.

Vick, his best season was his first with Andy, and he regressed every year after that.  His completion percentage went down every year, and his TD:INT ratio increased every year.

Alex Smith I will give you.

Mahomes, really, a once in a generation QB talent.  He could do what he is doing under any coach, he is a unicorn.

If he was a once in a generation talent who was a slam dunk for any team, he wouldn’t have been drafted where he was. He developed when he made it to the NFL, and Reid was a part of that. 

3 minutes ago, Swoop said:

Afan argued that PPG is the only stat that matters as it pertains to a QB, which has been continually been proven to be a shallow, incongruous thought.

That’s really not what he said in his last post.  He is, in his unique way, arguing for context and why just QB stats are not the best way to measure a QB without context. He also argues why PPG matters.  I get his point but pointed out in the post you quote where context may be lacking, albeit in less circumstances using PPG.  

But PPG may be as good of a stat as any in measuring QB success.  I don’t think his argument is shallow and incongruous at all if we take the time to think about what he is really saying instead of playing the game of piling on him.   I understand him to say considering a QBs stats alone are a poor measurement of QB success.  The most valid stat may be overall offensive performance, which is probably PPG.  I understand the reasoning.  He is looking for a stat that measures the level of success (scoring points) by the offense, which is led and managed by the QB.  

Personally, I suspect at an NFL level using quantitative modeling far past the stats we see but that the coaches and management understand success is not just the statistical model  the 2017 underdog Super Bowl champion Eagles are an excellent demonstration of that   Facing adversity, the team dynamic led to success as much as any models did.  

Overall, there is pretty solid support that stats need context by pretty much everyone who posted.  There seems to be disagreement on which stats matter most.  Not surprising.  

5 minutes ago, Swoop said:

I know you mentioned them, but Kolb declined.

Feeley consistently declined.

Vince Young had the worst year of his career. 

And using "the only metric that matters", points per game, here is Vick's regression under Reid.

2010 - 29.08 PPG

2011 - 26.5 PPG

2012 - 17.3 PPG

2 minutes ago, WentzFan11 said:

If he was a once in a generation talent who was a slam dunk for any team, he wouldn’t have been drafted where he was. He developed when he made it to the NFL, and Reid was a part of that. 

So Bill developed Brady? Or is it just hard to tell how QBs will transition to the pros?

12 minutes ago, Swoop said:

I'm going with Jalen Squirts. Squirts, for short.

catchy 👍

26 minutes ago, justrelax said:

I was joking. What he has doesn't qualify as footwork. Here are two consecutive plays to make the point. His set at the snap is the same for both so I only include it once. 

In the first, he takes one step and turns. You don't turn, you slide, but no. You can see his right foot isn't planted and he's given up his outside shoulder. That's pretty bad but the second play is worse. He's turned again but this time his back is to the DE. A spin move by the OT!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks. Good stuff, as usual.  

1 minute ago, BigEFly said:

That’s really not what he said in his last post.  He is, in his unique way, arguing for context and why just QB stats are not the best way to measure a QB without context. He also argues why PPG matters.  I get his point but pointed out in the post you quote where context may be lacking, albeit in less circumstances using PPG.  

But PPG may be as good of a stat as any in measuring QB success.  I don’t think his argument is shallow and incongruous at all if we take the time to think about what he is really saying instead of playing the game of piling on him.   I understand him to say considering a QBs stats alone are a poor measurement of QB success.  The most valid stat may be overall offensive performance, which is probably PPG.  I understand the reasoning.  He is looking for a stat that measures the level of success (scoring points) by the offense, which is led and managed by the QB.  

Personally, I suspect at an NFL level using quantitative modeling far past the stats we see but that the coaches and management understand success is not just the statistical model  the 2017 underdog Super Bowl champion Eagles are an excellent demonstration of that   Facing adversity, the team dynamic led to success as much as any models did.  

Overall, there is pretty solid support that stats need context by pretty much everyone who posted.  There seems to be disagreement on which stats matter most.  Not surprising.  

To be clear, I don't think he's way off base, but I do think the way he went about his explanation was poor. I get what he's trying to say, I just "like" how he said it.

We should make "Squirtscuses" bingo cards.

1 minute ago, Diehardfan said:

So Bill developed Brady? Or is it just hard to tell how QBs will transition to the pros?

Do you think the QB Brady was in the NFL is the same QB he was in college? Are you saying he didn’t develop as a pro? 

42 minutes ago, Swoop said:

Afan argued that PPG is the only stat that matters as it pertains to a QB, which has been continually been proven to be a shallow, incongruous thought.

Only in your mind.

I never argued it ws the only stat that mattered, rather, if you're gonna point to one stat, it's the most important stat. And far more important than a QBs' individual stats.

4 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

You do you man.  I need to work in the word "juicy”. 

Just borrow the name from Three 6 Mafia rapper "Juicy J"

Just now, 4for4EaglesNest said:

You do you man.  I need to work in the word "juicy”. 

Juicy

Ass

Leftovers

Enema is

Next 

Or JALEN for short...?

2 minutes ago, WentzFan11 said:

Do you think the QB Brady was in the NFL is the same QB he was in college? Are you saying he didn’t develop as a pro? 

Who is responsible for that though? Yeah, coaches play a part, but it comes down to drive, intelligence, and work. I'd say if Andy did develop him it's a product of all the failures he had with the Eagles...same as his drafting at the skill positions.

3 minutes ago, Swoop said:

Juicy

Ass

Leftovers

Exiting

Now

Or JALEN for short...?

FYP

1 minute ago, Diehardfan said:

Who is responsible for that though? Yeah, coaches play a part, but it comes down to drive, intelligence, and work. I'd say if Andy did develop him it's a product of all the failures he had with the Eagles...same as his drafting at the skill positions.

Who is responsible for QBs in KC? 

34 minutes ago, justrelax said:

I was joking. What he has doesn't qualify as footwork. Here are two consecutive plays to make the point. His set at the snap is the same for both so I only include it once. 

In the first, he takes one step and turns. You don't turn, you slide, but no. You can see his right foot isn't planted and he's given up his outside shoulder. That's pretty bad but the second play is worse. He's turned again but this time his back is to the DE. A spin move by the OT!

That's pitiful. Why does Stoutland even waste his time with him at this point, lacks the feet for outside, and the leg explosion with guard.

Guess what his jump tests were, even at 328 lbs, 24" VT, 8'0 LJ are horrible. He has size, reach, mass but no momentum.

1 minute ago, downundermike said:

FYP

Better.

1 hour ago, BigEFly said:

Stats are interesting but really one dimensional.  PFF looks at film and creates their own one dimensional stats based on their observations.  They claim to be more in depth but it isn’t really data modeling.  As you point out, there is inherent bias in their observations whether they want to see it that way or not. Ultimately, the only stats that matter are by the team for Wins and Losses.  

I use stats at times to prove a point, we all do.  But ultimately, that use can reflect our bias on the given subject. 

Agreed, 100%