Dallas sucks but lol

 

 

38 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

No.  The only reason/s people are making a big deal out of this is:

- The first team has played a total of what, 10 snaps?

- They have had soft, short practices.

- Other more established teams have had real practices and have had their first team getting more reps in previous pre-season games.

- There is more than 2 weeks from the opening game.

- We essentially have a rookie starting QB, with a rookie HC and new coaches all across the board.

- There is a young WR core, with a 1st rounder who has barely been on the same GAME field with said QB.

- Week 1 is winnable...if you're prepared.

- This team will see a rash of injuries because they will not be in game shape

 

 

I'm sure there is more.  

I agree with nearly all of this, and it's a pretty comprehensive summary...  I would say, though, that you mentioned soft practices, but didn't say anything about the Jets & Patriots joint practices which, while not actual game experience, were pretty legit otherwise...

Also, your final point is pretty speculative...  there are almost always injuries of one type or another, and whether this opener is above or below any norm would need some digging...

1 minute ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

 No.  Because they will be soft, because they have run a soft preseason and the injuries will begin to mount again.  

Why can't we just re-hire Chip's smoothie guy? 

5 minutes ago, downundermike said:

I expect veterans like Matt Ryan, Mike Davis, Calvin Ridley to have an easier time adjusting to game 1 with no reps than a QB with 4 career starts, a rookie WR and an oft injured RB who has been struggling to catch the ball in camp.

I can kinda get on board with what you're saying as it pertains to Ryan and Ridley, but you're overrating Mike Davis here to a comical degree.

2 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Speculative is most of what goes on in here.  And how legit can joint practices be?  It’s not like they were sacking the 1 read and run QB.  They’re still not games.  

Exactly.  The talked about it on 97.5 this morning.

Sure, Jalen Hurts was 17 of 19 for whatever yards and TD's in the joint practice, but the defense had to hold up on what would have been 5 sacks, so those stats are bogus.

11 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said:

I mean if they come out with a strong September let's say....then I think you'd have to agree it makes all this angst about pre-season worthless? 

I appreciate the optimism but as an ex player, I can understand how important preseason is to get ready for the season. You can't practice taking hits in camp, in preseason games it is important to get that limited amount of time with contact and work your way up. Same goes with the Oline working together and getting on the same page. Recs and QBs matching up full speed against real competition. 

There is a reason most of the top teams year in and year out do play their starters in the preseason. The old school norm of Game 1, 1Q, Game 2, 2Q, Game 3, 3Q and then rest just works. If you play scared in the offseason, you will play scared in the reg season. You can;t project or truly prevent injuries. If anything you have a greater risk to injuries when you do not fully prepare your body properly for full contact week 1. 

So i am expecting the same that we have seen that last few years. The oline will fall apart int he first few weeks. They will start to look like a team come week 4 or 5. But sadly weeks 1-3 will be preseason games now. So your looking at Oct till we see what this team is. 

Just now, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Speculative is most of what goes on in here.  And how legit can joint practices be?  It’s not like they were sacking the 1 read and run QB.  They’re still not games.  

To your 1st point, I'm saying it's easy to predict, but wouldn't be easy to prove...  to your 2nd point,  I'd say the joint practices, at the very least, don't fall under the heading of short, soft practices...  that's all...

I can go point by point with your other statements and repeat I agree, I agree, I agree  if it'll make you feel better... I simply pointed out where we differed slightly...  don't be so touchy...

5 minutes ago, Saltpeter said:

I can kinda get on board with what you're saying as it pertains to Ryan and Ridley, but you're overrating Mike David here to a comical degree.

The two seasons that Mike Davis has received more than 100 carries, he averaged 4.17 per carry.  He's no slouch, and has played in the NFL for 6 years.  Getting ready for game speed is not going to be an issue for him.  He also caught 59 passes filling in for McCaffery last year.

10 minutes ago, WentzFan11 said:

Dallas sucks but lol

 

 

Why is John Fassel obsessed with dick and balls?

1 minute ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Touchy?  You’re reading that wrong. Trust me.  

Fair enough...

3 minutes ago, Veejer said:

To your 1st point, I'm saying it's easy to predict, but wouldn't be easy to prove...  to your 2nd point,  I'd say the joint practices, at the very least, don't fall under the heading of short, soft practices...  that's all...

I can go point by point with your other statements and repeat I agree, I agree, I agree  if it'll make you feel better... I simply pointed out where we differed slightly...  don't be so touchy...

My problem with valuing joint practices over games, and Sirianni said it, we can practice the same thing over and over if we don't get it right.  That is not gonna get you ready for game flow.

In practice, they ran a first down play 5 times, and 4 times got a first down, so they ran another first down play.

In a game, they could get no yards, they could have a long gainer down inside the 10.  You need to take what you learn in practice, and then adapt it to ever changing game situation.

4 minutes ago, downundermike said:

The two seasons that Mike Davis has received more than 100 carries, he averaged 4.17 per carry.  He's no slouch, and has played in the NFL for 6 years.  Getting ready for game speed is not going to be an issue for him.  He also caught 59 passes filling in for McCaffery last year.

Yeah I'm sure he was ok on your PPR fantasy team, but he's the ultimate journeyman RB. Come on...

1 minute ago, downundermike said:

My problem with valuing joint practices over games, and Sirianni said it, we can practice the same thing over and over if we don't get it right.  That is not gonna get you ready for game flow.

In practice, they ran a first down play 5 times, and 4 times got a first down, so they ran another first down play.

In a game, they could get no yards, they could have a long gainer down inside the 10.  You need to take what you learn in practice, and then adapt it to ever changing game situation.

I don't value joint practices over games so you're preaching to the choir...  but, I do think joint practices are quite a few notches above short, soft practices...  that's all...

5 minutes ago, DeathByEagle said:

I appreciate the optimism but as an ex player, I can understand how important preseason is to get ready for the season. You can't practice taking hits in camp, in preseason games it is important to get that limited amount of time with contact and work your way up. Same goes with the Oline working together and getting on the same page. Recs and QBs matching up full speed against real competition. 

There is a reason most of the top teams year in and year out do play their starters in the preseason. The old school norm of Game 1, 1Q, Game 2, 2Q, Game 3, 3Q and then rest just works. If you play scared in the offseason, you will play scared in the reg season. You can;t project or truly prevent injuries. If anything you have a greater risk to injuries when you do not fully prepare your body properly for full contact week 1. 

So i am expecting the same that we have seen that last few years. The oline will fall apart int he first few weeks. They will start to look like a team come week 4 or 5. But sadly weeks 1-3 will be preseason games now. So your looking at Oct till we see what this team is. 

Eh it seems there are more and more teams eschewing the traditional pre-season schedule of playing starters a little bit week 1, little more week 2, little more week 3, then nothing week 4. 

I used to play as well, and yes you need to get your body "football ready" as we used to say. Your second paragraph sounds like macho tough guy nonsense. I like that the team is trying a new approach to things, though it may very well fall flat on it's face. The good thing is this year isn't really a year anybody expects us to compete anyway, so what better time to try than now?

2 minutes ago, Saltpeter said:

Yeah I'm sure he was ok on your PPR fantasy team, but he's the ultimate journeyman RB. Come on...

Once again, both season he had more than 100 carries he averaged 4.1 yards per carry.  We will revisit this after week 1.

52 minutes ago, nipples said:

Ah I see. The difference I guess then is that this entire season is an evaluation in my mind. They are not going to be a good team. They have 17 weeks of regular season to evaluate every single player. So yeah, I don’t much care about what they do in week 3 of the preseason.  

Just evaluate?  Any development?  

5 minutes ago, downundermike said:

My problem with valuing joint practices over games, and Sirianni said it, we can practice the same thing over and over if we don't get it right.  That is not gonna get you ready for game flow.

In practice, they ran a first down play 5 times, and 4 times got a first down, so they ran another first down play.

In a game, they could get no yards, they could have a long gainer down inside the 10.  You need to take what you learn in practice, and then adapt it to ever changing game situation.

You act like they've never played a game of football in their lives. They know how to deal with football situations, that's nonsense. 

Also, you don't think they practice weird situations? 2nd and 19, QB was sacked first down, let's try a few different plays for this situation? 

5 minutes ago, downundermike said:

My problem with valuing joint practices over games, and Sirianni said it, we can practice the same thing over and over if we don't get it right.  That is not gonna get you ready for game flow.

In practice, they ran a first down play 5 times, and 4 times got a first down, so they ran another first down play.

In a game, they could get no yards, they could have a long gainer down inside the 10.  You need to take what you learn in practice, and then adapt it to ever changing game situation.

You realize that the did live, "game situation" sessions in the joint practices.  e.g. Ball at the opponent's 25, 45 seconds left, no time outs, need to get a TD.

1 minute ago, downundermike said:

My problem with valuing joint practices over games, and Sirianni said it, we can practice the same thing over and over if we don't get it right.  That is not gonna get you ready for game flow.

In practice, they ran a first down play 5 times, and 4 times got a first down, so they ran another first down play.

In a game, they could get no yards, they could have a long gainer down inside the 10.  You need to take what you learn in practice, and then adapt it to ever changing game situation.

Exactly this. Are joint practices more valuable than games? Sure, if you want to work on red zone, hurry up, third down conversions etc. and go at it multiple times. But real games are completely different for all the reasons already mentioned. The key is to value both equally the same. 

1 minute ago, Veejer said:

I don't value joint practices over games so you're preaching to the choir...  but, I do think joint practices are quite a few notches above short, soft practices...  that's all...

Agreed.   Would be nice to use both joint practices AND preseason games.  Belichek did with the Eagles last week.  That's all I'm saying.  

3 minutes ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

You realize that the did live, "game situation" sessions in the joint practices.  e.g. Ball at the opponent's 25, 45 seconds left, no time outs, need to get a TD.

Yes, but the practice them in groups, they don't start at the 20 and run a full drive.  Also, you can not sack the QB, so they don't go from 1st and 10 in the red zone to 2nd and 20 outside the redzone.  They run that play and don't get sacked, and then run the same play again.  They never run the next play as a result of the previous play.

1 hour ago, nipples said:

Teams have always rested starters in the final preseason game for as long as I can remember.  The only reason people are making a big deal about it is because game 3 is now the last game instead of game 4. 

Yeah but in previous seasons the starters played as a unit for the full first half of game 3 then rested.  The starters have barely played in the games this season. They have, however, played as a unit a lot in those controlled joint practices. The Eagles seem to value those more than the games. 

One other point, they were using the majority of the play book during the joint practices.  Unless the Pats decided to sell the coach's tape, they had the opportunity to work on most everything they expect to run against the Falcons.  

They are upfront in saying that their preseason scheme is ultra-vanilla.  Your game situation argument falls short if you don't have all your tools available.

2 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said:

You act like they've never played a game of football in their lives. They know how to deal with football situations, that's nonsense. 

Also, you don't think they practice weird situations? 2nd and 19, QB was sacked first down, let's try a few different plays for this situation? 

Football is the most 'team' of all the 'team sports'.  All 11 need to be on the same page as each other, and when a new scheme is introduced, that's a new variable.  Preseason games are dress rehearsals... no pausing, no resetting, just learning to deal with whatever comes your way and reacting to it.  And unlike practice, you don't know what the other side is going to do in response to you.  In theater, they have practices, and then they have dress rehearsal... and even the most experienced actors participate, because there are important pieces to be learned from the dress rehearsal and 'making it work' no matter what.    NOW, there's almost no chance of injury in a play production, versus a football game.  So that's why the amount of reps are normally limited in an NFL dress rehearsal, but these 11+ players on the first team offense and defense haven't really played together and haven't been in this new system.  There's a learning curve, even for the most veteran of players.  They all need some reps together, as a unit.  And the Eagles are basically just punting away these opportunities in the name of 'health'.  Its just them allowing themselves to be controlled by fear.

3 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Exactly this. Are joint practices more valuable than games? Sure, if you want to work on red zone, hurry up, third down conversions etc. and go at it multiple times. But real games are completely different for all the reasons already mentioned. The key is to value both equally the same. 

But preseason games aren't "real" games; there's no game-planning, no schemes being worked out, etc.   Sometimes they matter - just ask Jameis Winston who won the starting job in New Orleans based on Monday night's preseason game - but not to the Eagles.