2 more weeks?

2 hours ago, Mike31mt said:

From Russias not trying to occupy Ukraine to "they only occupy the parts near Russia" which is about 20% of the whole country.

Just admit you made a stupid point and move on

Just admit you have no idea what an insurgency is and their long history in military occupations and how it differs from conventional war. I'll give you a hint, all of the would be insurgents are currently regular army. My lawd you're stupid. Do yourself a favor and ask chat GBT about them before you try to act like you know what you're talking about. You've made a bigger jack arse out of yourself than usual in this thread which is really saying something.

Me: "A Ukrainian insurgency would be like Chechnya on steroids for the Russians"

Hillbilly Mike:

8 minutes ago, Gannan said:

Just admit you have no idea what an insurgency is and their long history in military occupations and how it differs from conventional war. I'll give you a hint, all of the would be insurgents are currently regular army. My lawd you're stupid. Do yourself a favor and ask chat GBT about them before you try to act like you know what you're talking about. You've made a bigger jack arse out of yourself than usual in this thread which is really saying something.

Me: "A Ukrainian insurgency would be like Chechnya on steroids for the Russians"

Hillbilly Mike:

You're not even making any sense. So there's no Ukrainian "insurgency" now, but at some random point in the future there will be?

You're so far off your original stupid point, which is essentially "no one can occupy another country because it's super hard and stuff" and the two examples you gave were (apparently) the Soviet-Afghan war and the US war with Vietnam.

The US literally just occupied Afghanistan. Don't you remember your pal's disastrous withdrawal from that country?

And again, Russia currently occupies 20% of Ukraine and it will continue to grow. I'm pretty sure Ukraine is trying really hard not to give up land, but I guess they'll try super harder whenever their true insurgency begins.

Dumb point, move on

so, any chance the great peacemaker could just get on his knees for putin and get this over with?

because his "peace through strength" isn't doing squat right now.

2 hours ago, Mike31mt said:

You're not even making any sense. So there's no Ukrainian "insurgency" now, but at some random point in the future there will be?

You're so far off your original stupid point, which is essentially "no one can occupy another country because it's super hard and stuff" and the two examples you gave were (apparently) the Soviet-Afghan war and the US war with Vietnam.

The US literally just occupied Afghanistan. Don't you remember your pal's disastrous withdrawal from that country?

And again, Russia currently occupies 20% of Ukraine and it will continue to grow. I'm pretty sure Ukraine is trying really hard not to give up land, but I guess they'll try super harder whenever their true insurgency begins.

Dumb point, move on

Why did the US ultimately abandon the vietnam war? Why did Russia ultimately abandon the Afghanistan war? Why did the US ultimately abandon the Iraq and Afghanistan wars?

"no one can occupy another country because it's super hard and stuff"

Yes, it's actually incredibly hard for one country to occupy another country when the people of the country being occupied do not wish to be governed by the country doing the occupying. Not too complex to understand. It requires a continual 24/7 military/police presence to force compliance. A military/police presence that will face frequent and repeated attacks from an insurgency presence. So for the country doing the occupying, this means a never ending cost of money and blood to keep the occupancy going. The only way for it to succeed is for the occupying regime to be so brutal and ruthless that for the insurgency, the fear of being caught begins to outweigh the will to live free and under sovereign rule.

3 hours ago, Mike31mt said:

You're not even making any sense. So there's no Ukrainian "insurgency" now, but at some random point in the future there will be?

The stupid... it burns

6 hours ago, Alpha_TATEr said:

2 more weeks?

maybe?

U.S. and Russia hold new talks as Ukraine hopes to finalize peace deal

We are no closer to an actual peace deal than we were back when Zelensky first came to the WH or when Putin traveled to Alaska.

Time for the Congressional Republicans to step up and tell Trump to F off with regard to this conflict and MAGA's path of tearing down NATO.

1 hour ago, DrPhilly said:

Time for the Congressional Republicans to step up and tell Trump to F off with regard to this conflict and MAGA's path of tearing down NATO.

Do you really think that these scared a s s Republicans will defy Trump on anything? There should be calls for Wittkoff’s head for the traitorous acts he has committed for his bosses in the Kremlin. In a normal world he would have already ask for asylum in Russia because we have a warrant for his arrest. We have these Russian operatives (Tulsi Gabbard) all over our current administration and it’s going take years for this security breach to be reversed…

4 minutes ago, Frankfurteagle89 said:

Do you really think that these scared a s s Republicans will defy Trump on anything? There should be calls for Wittkoff’s head for the traitorous acts he has committed for his bosses in the Kremlin. In a normal world he would have already ask for asylum in Russia because we have a warrant for his arrest. We have these Russian operatives (Tulsi Gabbard) all over our current administration and it’s going take years for this security breach to be reversed…

No I don’t and time is running out now.

https://euromaidanpress.com/2025/11/26/made-me-sick-to-my-stomach-lawmakers-launch-bipartisan-push-to-stop-ukraine-peace-deal-they-call-munich-style-agreement/

On 11/25/2025 at 1:04 PM, Phillyterp85 said:

Why did the US ultimately abandon the vietnam war? Why did Russia ultimately abandon the Afghanistan war? Why did the US ultimately abandon the Iraq and Afghanistan wars?

"no one can occupy another country because it's super hard and stuff"

Yes, it's actually incredibly hard for one country to occupy another country when the people of the country being occupied do not wish to be governed by the country doing the occupying. Not too complex to understand. It requires a continual 24/7 military/police presence to force compliance. A military/police presence that will face frequent and repeated attacks from an insurgency presence. So for the country doing the occupying, this means a never ending cost of money and blood to keep the occupancy going. The only way for it to succeed is for the occupying regime to be so brutal and ruthless that for the insurgency, the fear of being caught begins to outweigh the will to live free and under sovereign rule.

We chose not to "govern" in Vietnam and Afghanistan.

Russia has held Crimea with no problems. We held Afghanistan for months with no problems. Only when the dementia-laden idiot withdrew our forces without any preparation did it lead to trouble. Israel has even held Palestinian lands for years with all the nations surrounding it opposed.

This still doesn't make the point he was trying to make, which is that Ukraine can hold out forever. It's just not true.

29 minutes ago, Mike31mt said:

We chose not to "govern" in Vietnam and Afghanistan.

Russia has held Crimea with no problems. We held Afghanistan for months with no problems. Only when the dementia-laden idiot withdrew our forces without any preparation did it lead to trouble. Israel has even held Palestinian lands for years with all the nations surrounding it opposed.

This still doesn't make the point he was trying to make, which is that Ukraine can hold out forever. It's just not true.

And we would never have been able to govern Afghanistan or Vietnam because the human, political, and financial cost would have been too great to keep going in perpetuity.

If the people’s will to live free is greater than their fear of retribution, then yes the people can hold out forever. Even if they ultimately lose the war, then Russian occupying forces will have to deal with constant attacks from the insurgency. Russia would then ultimately have to decide if it’s worth it to keep the occupation going and keep paying the political, human, and financial cost to do so.

Now, if the people of Ukraine are ok with living under Russian rule, then so be it. Russia will be able to occupy them. But I don’t think that’s the case.

2 hours ago, Mike31mt said:

We chose not to "govern" in Vietnam and Afghanistan.

Russia has held Crimea with no problems. We held Afghanistan for months with no problems. Only when the dementia-laden idiot withdrew our forces without any preparation did it lead to trouble. Israel has even held Palestinian lands for years with all the nations surrounding it opposed.

This still doesn't make the point he was trying to make, which is that Ukraine can hold out forever. It's just not true.

You’re joking right? Is losing almost 2,400 military personnel, almost 4000 US contractors and 1200 allied troops holding down a country with no problems? You do know we were there for years and that DJT made the decision in 2018 and finally in 2019 to pull out all troops within a 14 month timeframe? He signed the so called "peace treaty” with the Taliban. It was that decision that put that Afghan "US led” administration to handle their internal problems and the issues with the Taliban on their own. And YES, the Biden pull out was a total disaster, but that doesn’t omit the fact that Trump had a hand in the failure as well…

2 hours ago, Mike31mt said:

We chose not to "govern" in Vietnam and Afghanistan.

Russia has held Crimea with no problems. We held Afghanistan for months with no problems. Only when the dementia-laden idiot withdrew our forces without any preparation did it lead to trouble. Israel has even held Palestinian lands for years with all the nations surrounding it opposed.

This still doesn't make the point he was trying to make, which is that Ukraine can hold out forever. It's just not true.

Did you know that Russian and Ukrainian are 2 different languages? Probably not. Did you know that Crimea and the regions currently occupied by Russian forces are predominantly Russian speaking? Did you know that the culture of Western Ukraine is very different and might not be so accepting of Russian occupation? Of course you didn't...because you are an uneducated moron who doesn't know anything outside of what you see on Fox News and right wing twitter. Keep embarrassing yourself though, it's fun for all of us.

Two thoughts on the current series of posts:

1.) We absolutely could have won Afghanistan were it not for shifting focus to Iraq and the fact that in OEF we were fighting a one year war twenty times over. He we had enough troops for the first few years and dealt with Pakistan more effectively, we would have come out ahead. We would have still had to have had troops there for a bit, but it would have been a different story.

2.) Even in the Russian speaking parts of Ukraine, after the invasion the Russian speakers made a concerted effort to start speaking Ukrainian. Oddly enough the areas I was in there that had the higher percentage of Russian speakers was where I received the warmest of welcomes. It’s almost as if the places with larger Russian influences understood just how ish the Russians are as people.

12 hours ago, Bill said:

Two thoughts on the current series of posts:

1.) We absolutely could have won Afghanistan were it not for shifting focus to Iraq and the fact that in OEF we were fighting a one year war twenty times over. He we had enough troops for the first few years and dealt with Pakistan more effectively, we would have come out ahead. We would have still had to have had troops there for a bit, but it would have been a different story.

2.) Even in the Russian speaking parts of Ukraine, after the invasion the Russian speakers made a concerted effort to start speaking Ukrainian. Oddly enough the areas I was in there that had the higher percentage of Russian speakers was where I received the warmest of welcomes. It’s almost as if the places with larger Russian influences understood just how ish the Russians are as people.

This is the main reason that Putin and his regime don’t really fear NATO militarily. They know that NATO would not attack Russia. They fear democracy and the effects it will have on their population. They instill fear of the West attacking their homeland, but it’s not a war with NATO that they worry about, it’s the impact that freedom would have on their authoritarian system. They’ve seen it happen all over Eastern Europe and that’s why they are aggressively fighting against this "freedom” in Ukraine and other parts of their former Soviet empire.

On 11/25/2025 at 10:21 AM, Mike31mt said:

You're so far off your original stupid point, which is essentially "no one can occupy another country because it's super hard and stuff" and the two examples you gave were (apparently) the Soviet-Afghan war and the US war with Vietnam.

The US literally just occupied Afghanistan. Don't you remember your pal's disastrous withdrawal from that country?

And again, Russia currently occupies 20% of Ukraine and it will continue to grow. I'm pretty sure Ukraine is trying really hard not to give up land, but I guess they'll try super harder whenever their true insurgency begins.

Dumb point, move on

OMG

Dude. There's no way. There's no way someone this stupid is an actual real person and not an AI-based satire of what a goat-F'ing inbred moron from the WV hills would actually sound like.

This has got to be the best post I've ever seen on here. The idiots who incessantly scream about Trump ending these costly forever wars are now the same ones saying the forever wars aren't even that hard to win and they're apparently not costly anymore either.

If this is not the most unintentionally hilarious post in CVON history, I'd love to see what is. I really would.

39 minutes ago, we_gotta_believe said:

OMG

Dude. There's no way. There's no way someone this stupid is an actual real person and not an AI-based satire of what a goat-F'ing inbred moron from the WV hills would actually sound like.

This has got to be the best post I've ever seen on here. The idiots who incessantly scream about Trump ending these costly forever wars are now the same ones saying the forever wars aren't even that hard to win and they're apparently not costly anymore either.

If this is not the most unintentionally hilarious post in CVON history, I'd love to see what is. I really would.

Lives in a county founded on the idea that people should be free to determine their own governance and were willing to die for that right. A country that defeated a global superpower because the superpower could no longer justify the cost of the fight and occupation. And yet still doesn’t see how Russia could run into a problem trying to occupy Ukraine.

1 hour ago, we_gotta_believe said:

OMG

Dude. There's no way. There's no way someone this stupid is an actual real person and not an AI-based satire of what a goat-F'ing inbred moron from the WV hills would actually sound like.

This has got to be the best post I've ever seen on here. The idiots who incessantly scream about Trump ending these costly forever wars are now the same ones saying the forever wars aren't even that hard to win and they're apparently not costly anymore either.

If this is not the most unintentionally hilarious post in CVON history, I'd love to see what is. I really would.

This. I've seen high degrees of stupidity in CVON over the years, but Hillbilly Mike is taking it to new levels.

Leave the poor little fella alone

Recency bias. Mike is an idiot, no doubt. But in recent memory we've had people post about taking livestock dewormer to fight a virus, regularly struggle with the concepts of calendars, brag about going all in on crypto right before a crash, a child sex ring being run out of a pizza parlor basement, and of course whether or not the earth is round.

The bar for dumbest CVON poster is incredibly high.

18 minutes ago, DEagle7 said:

Recency bias. Mike is an idiot, no doubt. But in recent memory we've had people post about taking livestock dewormer to fight a virus, regularly struggle with the concepts of calendars, brag about going all in on crypto right before a crash, a child sex ring being run out of a pizza parlor basement, and of course whether or not the earth is round.

The bar for dumbest CVON poster is incredibly high.

Game time in 1:50 hours. Not sure when the non-posting in CVON takes effect, so Go Eagles !

The latest from ISW:

Data on Russian forces’ rate of advance indicates that a Russian military victory in Ukraine is not inevitable, and a rapid Russian seizure of the rest of Donetsk Oblast is not imminent. A senior US military official reportedly stated that the war will only worsen for Ukraine as Russia can fight indefinitely and that it is better for Ukraine to negotiate a peace settlement now rather than negotiate from a weaker position later.[1] The Kremlin has consistently pushed a narrative claiming that a Russian victory is inevitable — particularly since reports first emerged of the 28-point peace proposal — in order to push Ukraine and the West to acquiesce to Russia’s demands. The reality on the battlefield indicates that a Russian victory in Ukraine is far from certain, however. Russian President Vladimir Putin and Russian military commanders have been attempting to portray Russia as capable of rapidly seizing Donetsk Oblast militarily, but hard data on the rate of Russian advance in Donetsk Oblast does not indicate that Russian forces will imminently seize the rest of the oblast.[2] Russian forces have been prioritizing completing the seizure of Pokrovsk and Myrnohrad, but have been slow to do so as Ukrainian forces have successfully stymied the rate of Russian advance in Pokrovsk to footpace. Russian forces entered Pokrovsk for the first time by July 31, and Russian forces have advanced an average of 0.12 kilometers per day in Pokrovsk from July 31 to November 26. Russian forces have not seized Pokrovsk — a town of 11.5 square miles — despite operating within the town for over 118 days. ISW has only observed evidence to assess that Russian forces have consolidated advances in 66 percent of Pokrovsk as of November 26, a low percentage given the time and manpower (elements of at least two combined arms armies) Russia has dedicated to pursuing this effort.

The Russian rate of advance across the theater intensified since the Alaska summit on August 15, with Russian forces advancing an average of 9.3 square kilometers per day across the entire theater, between August 15 and November 20, but these advances are still constrained to footpace.[3] Russian forces could seize the remainder of Ukrainian-held Donetsk Oblast by August 2027, assuming a constant Russian rate of advance.[4] ISW continues to assess that the Russian military command may prioritize offensive operations in Donetsk Oblast but is unlikely to completely deprioritize other sectors to maintain the strategic initiative and pressure along the entire theater.[5] Russian forces have most rapidly advanced in eastern Dnipropetrovsk and Zaporizhia oblasts in recent weeks, inflating the theater-wide rate of advance compared to Russian forces’ comparatively slower rate of advance in Donetsk Oblast.[6]

Recent Russian advances elsewhere on the frontline have largely been opportunistic and exploited seasonal weather conditions. Russian forces are pursuing an offensive campaign design that consists of battlefield air interdiction (BAI) efforts and infiltration missions to degrade the efficacy of Ukrainian defenses.[7] Russian forces leveraged this campaign design and a porous frontline in the area to make relatively rapid advances toward Hulyaipole from the northeast and east, but even these advances are constrained to footpace.[8] Russian infiltration missions elsewhere on the frontline have not resulted in advances similar to the Pokrovsk and Hulyaipole directions, however. Russian forces have leveraged infiltration missions and interdiction efforts in the Vovchansk and Kupyansk directions, but have failed to make rapid, sweeping gains this campaign design hopes to enable.[9] These Russian forces are forced to engage Ukrainian forces in attritional urban combat and make only creeping gains, all at disproportionately high manpower losses. The Russian military command would likely have to commit the time and resources to other areas of the frontline as it is currently committing in the Pokrovsk direction to replicate the results of the Pokrovsk and Hulyaipole efforts elsewhere on the frontline, particularly areas that Ukrainian forces are better fit to defend.

Ukrainian forces have proven effective at constraining Russian advances and conducting successful counteroffensives, particularly when well-staffed and well-equipped. Ukraine notably forced Russian forces to withdraw from Kyiv Oblast and elsewhere in northern Ukraine in April 2022, liberated much of Kharkiv Oblast in a surprise counteroffensive in September and October 2022, and forced Russian forces to withdraw from west (right) bank Kherson Oblast in November 2022 following a successful summer-fall interdiction campaign.[10] Ukrainian forces have liberated over 50 percent of the territory that Russian forces have seized since 2022 and forced Russia to expend manpower, equipment, time, and energy on attritional offensives that generate losses disproportionately high relative to the amount of gains.[11] Ukrainian forces have thwarted the Russian offensives into northern Kharkiv and Sumy oblasts in Spring 2024 and January 2025, respectively.[12] Ukraine has forced Russia into a positional war that denies Russia the ability to conduct operational maneuver. ISW continues to assess that timely and sufficient Western military assistance and weapon sales to Ukraine, in concert with strong US and other Western economic measures against Russia, can enable Ukraine to stop Russian battlefield advances cold, especially if Ukrainian forces leverage their well-developed fortifications in Donetsk Oblast.[13]

Kremlin officials continue setting conditions to reject any peace deal that does not concede to all of Russia’s maximalist demands. Russian Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Ryabkov stated on November 26 that "there can be no talk of any concessions or any surrender” of the "key aspects” of Russia’s challenges with Ukraine in response to the US peace plan.[14] Ryabkov stated Russia "is prepared to achieve its stated goals” in negotiations – referring to Russia’s long-held and oft-repeated demands — and noted that Russia will continue its war in Ukraine if there are "any setbacks” in negotiations.[15] Ryabkov reiterated that Russia’s position has not changed and invoked the alleged "understanding” that the United States and Russia reached at the August 2025 Alaska summit, despite the fact that there are no public-facing agreements resulting from the summit.[16] ISW continues to assess that the Kremlin is attempting to exploit the lack of clarity about the Alaska summit to conceal the Kremlin’s continued unwillingness to compromise and its commitment to achieving nothing short of a full victory in Ukraine.[17] Kremlin Spokesperson Dmitry Peskov stated on November 26 that ”it is too early to say” when responding to a question asserting that Ukraine and Russia had never been so close to concluding a peace deal, a further indication that the Kremlin is distancing itself from the peace proposal, likely because Russia intends to reject it.[18]

The Kremlin is reportedly concerned that the United States will correctly interpret Russia as unwilling to meaningfully engage in negotiations and accept any peace deal that compromises its ability to achieve its maximalist claims. Bloomberg published on November 25 the transcript of an October 29 call between lead Russian negotiator and Russian Direct Investment Fund (RDIF) CEO Kirill Dmitriev and Russian Presidential Aide Yuriy Ushakov in which Ushakov expressed concerns about Dmitriev’s plan to present a peace proposal based on Russia’s position to the United States.[19] Ushakov stated that Russia needs the "maximum” of its demands and asked, "otherwise, what’s the point” of passing on proposals to the United States. Ushakov stated that the United States "might not take [Russia’s proposal] and say that it was agreed with [Russia],“ expressing concern that the United States might not understand and accept all of Russia’s demands. Russia has not engaged in meaningful negotiations since launching the full-scale invasion in February 2022 and continues to reject terms that compromise on any of its maximalist demands.[20] Kremlin officials continue to deflect blame for Russia’s willingness to negotiate through a variety of means, including shifting blame for the lack of meaningful negotiations onto Ukraine and Europe.[21] US Vice President JD Vance stated that Russia is ”asking for too much” to end the war in Ukraine in May 2025.[22]

Recent Ukrainian counterattacks may further delay Russian forces’ seizure of Pokrovsk, though the situation in Pokrovsk remains serious and dynamic at this time. Recent Ukrainian counterattacks in northern Pokrovsk and northwest of the town continue to slow the rate of Russian advance in the Pokrovsk direction. A Ukrainian military source reported on November 26 that Ukrainian forces recently recaptured key positions in northwestern and western Pokrovsk during counterattacks, and a Ukrainian journalist reported that Ukrainian forces advanced near the Donetska Railway line in northern Pokrovsk and prevented Russian forces from advancing toward Hryshyne (northwest of Pokrovsk).[23] Both Russian and Ukrainian forces likely hold positions in northern Pokrovsk. Geolocated footage published on November 26 indicates that Russian forces also infiltrated into positions in northeastern Pokrovsk.[24] Russian sources also claimed that Ukrainian forces counterattacked in the northwestern outskirts of Pokrovsk and near Hryshyne (northwest of Pokrovsk) and Rodynske (north of Pokrovsk), cohering with Ukrainian reports of advancing in northern Pokrovsk.[25] Both Russian and Ukrainian forces likely hold positions in northern Pokrovsk. Ukrainian 7th Rapid Reaction Corps of the Air Assault Forces Spokesperson Serhiy Okishev reported on November 26 that Ukrainian forces maintain positions in Pokrovsk and that the frontline largely runs along the Donetska Railway line, cohering with recent reports indicating that Russian forces have seized the area south of the Donetska Railway line.[26] The 7th Corps noted that Russian forces continue attempts to encircle Myrnohrad and attack the town from the north and south, and Myrnohrad City Military Administration Head Yuriy Tretyak stated that Russian forces are attacking from the west near Rivne and Svitle, all likely in an attempt to fix Ukrainian forces within Myrnohrad while also tightening the encirclement around Myrnohrad.[27] Ukraine’s East Group of Forces reported on November 26 that Ukrainian forces are adapting to Russian attempts to cut off Ukrainian logistics into Pokrovsk and Myrnohrad, including by building protective corridors with nets, covering logistics routes with air defenses, and using heavy drones and unmanned ground vehicles (UGVs) for logistics.[28] ISW continues to assess that Russian forces will very likely complete the seizure of Pokrovsk and Myrnohrad after a 21-month campaign, though the timing and operational implications of these seizures remain unclear at this time.[29]