...why the F are we talking about WW2 so much in here?

6 minutes ago, Frankfurteagle89 said:

Oh lord, you seem very gullible if you believe that nonsense.

Reagan won the Cold War because he showed strength! He showed those Commies that he wasn’t going to sh.t from them.

 

You deal with bullies, even on the playground, through your own strength. You don’t just give in. They might still beat your a s s, but they will respect you. 

 

Of course you stand up to bullies and make a stand.  After that, then what? 

Ukraine did exactly that.  They made their stand - they defended themselves against a bigger/stronger aggressor.  Now what?   

@Ace Nova 

10 minutes ago, Ace Nova said:

Don't watch Tucker Carlson other than the same clips most people see.  And not a ton of Fox News either.    Mostly News Nation if I decide to watch cable news, anyway. 

If you want some decent insight into the Russia regime, which basically resembles the regime of the Cold War, I suggest reading some of the Tom Clancy novels. You might see some things differently on how their thought process is.

1 minute ago, Ace Nova said:

 

Of course you stand up to bullies and make a stand.  After that, then what? 

Ukraine did exactly that.  They made their stand - they defended themselves against a bigger/stronger aggressor.  Now what?   

Give up a chunk of their land, half their rare metals and thank Trump and Putin for the opportunity of course

 

19 minutes ago, Ace Nova said:

See, this is where you and I disagree.   Do you know what authoritarian dictators respect?  Leaders/Ambassadors  that will talk to them face to face - man to man.  They regard leaders that are unwilling to talk to them as a sign of weakness.  

Look at Jesse Jackson - for example:

 In 1983, he traveled to Syria to secure the release of a captured American pilot, Navy Lt. Robert Goodman, who was being held by the Syrian government. Goodman had been shot down over Lebanon while on a mission to bomb Syrian positions in that country. After Jackson made a dramatic personal appeal to Syrian President Hafez al-Assad, Goodman was released. The Reagan administration was initially skeptical about Jackson's trip, but after Jackson secured Goodman's release, Reagan welcomed Jackson and Goodman to the White House on January 4, 1984.^[33] This helped to boost Jackson's popularity as an American patriot and served as a springboard for his 1984 presidential run. In June 1984 Jackson negotiated the release of 22 Americans being held in Cuba after an invitation by Cuban president Fidel Castro.^[34]

On the eve of the 1991 Persian Gulf War, Jackson made a trip to Iraq to plead with Saddam Hussein for the release of foreign nationals held there as a "human shield", securing the release of several British and 20 American individuals.^[35][36][37]

In 1997, Jackson traveled to Kenya to meet with Kenyan President Daniel arap Moi as United States President Bill Clinton's special envoy for democracy to promote free and fair elections. In April 1999, during the Kosovo War and NATO's bombing of Yugoslavia, he traveled to Belgrade to negotiate the release of three U.S. POWs captured on the Macedonian border while patrolling with a UN peacekeeping unit. Along with Serbian American congressman Rod Blagojevich, he met with then-Yugoslav president Slobodan Milošević, who later agreed to release the three men.^[38][39][40] Jackson's negotiation was not sanctioned by the Clinton administration.^[39]

 

 

Then the KENNEDY-KHRUSHCHEV exchanges that ended the Cuban Missile Crisis and potentially prevented WWIII.

The Reagan - Gorbachov exchanges that were the catalysts for ending the Cold War

 

 

 

 

So your main argument against being blunt with dictators is talking about how Bobby Goodman was released by a country that was holding him after he was brought there after ejecting over a separate country?

 

And then gave more examples of limited hostage negotiations and nothing at all related to total war?

3 minutes ago, Ace Nova said:

 

Of course you stand up to bullies and make a stand.  After that, then what? 

Ukraine did exactly that.  They made their stand - they defended themselves against a bigger/stronger aggressor.  Now what?   

You give them weapons that we have sitting around collecting dust so that they can take back what is theirs.

 

We have tons of Abrams tanks and Bradley Fighting Vehicles that we will never use, that we only bought because a congressman from Detroit used his pull to have us buy them, and that continually cost us a bunch of money to have just sitting there. Or giving them out tons of expired stock of weapons that cost us more to get rid of than it would to just give them to Ukraine.

@Ace Nova is the perfect example of the historical ignorance and low information that allowed a movement like MAGA to take hold.

I'm sure he's listened to some off brand hot takes with zero historical context that's made sense in his mind and now genuinely believes Russia, who was allied with Hitler and plotted with him to take over Europe during WWII, is actually our friend. He has zero understanding of what Russian intentions are but feels completely empowered and unshamed walking into a Ukraine/Russian thread and making declarative statements that are both objectively and subjectively false.

We're totally lost as a country. 

6 minutes ago, DEagle7 said:

...why the F are we talking about WW2 so much in here?

Because that’s all that was on the tv at our grandparents house for us latchkey kids. 

Pretty much sums it up. It's impossible to overstate just how much libtards' emotions are dictated by what the tv says to them. Always enjoyable to watch. 

6 minutes ago, Bill said:

Because that’s all that was on the tv at our grandparents house for us latchkey kids. 

I just don't see how the actions of the Big 3 during WW2 is in any way relevant to what's happening now in Ukraine unless you're writing a "cumts who led Russia" history book. 

Just now, Kz! said:

Pretty much sums it up. It's impossible to overstate just how much libtards' emotions are dictated by what the tv says to them. Always enjoyable to watch. 

Nobody cared about Crimea or MH17 shootdown? Lol WHAT? 

Come on, Kz. Your Facebook meme regurgitation used to be so much better. Have some self respect. 

When you hear and read the lies that people like Tucker Carlson spout out, it’s very obvious that a part of the country has been infected with a virus. Covid brought the "China virus” and now we the "Russia virus”.

I hope there is a cure out there. 🙏 

5 minutes ago, DEagle7 said:

I just don't see how the actions of the Big 3 during WW2 is in any way relevant to what's happening now in Ukraine unless you're writing a "cumts who led Russia" history book. 

They already wrote that book.

It’s called "Russian History”.

1 minute ago, DEagle7 said:

Give up a of their land, half their rare metals and thank Trump and Putin for the opportunity of course

 

They defended themselves from Russia taking over their entire country.  That in itself is an honorable and historic  achievement and should never be minimized. 

 The rare Earth minerals are very expensive and difficult to extract/process - they're not just handing over billions worth of minerals - it will require billions of dollars in investments from the US Government and US companies.  

Even Russia is willing to work with US companies in extracting their rare Earth metals because of the expense, etc. 

  So the Ukraine deal is more of a "partnership" than anything else, imo. 

 

Just now, Ace Nova said:

They defended themselves from Russia taking over their entire country. 

Only with the help of an American led NATO and allies. What part of that don’t you understand? Also, Putin’s Russia wants to destroy America. 

1 minute ago, Tnt4philly said:

 Also, Putin’s Russia wants to destroy America. 

Or at least diminish it to the point where we can't project democracy or freedom outside of our own borders. If they can manage that then it leaves to door wide open for Russian and Chinese power projection.

6 minutes ago, Ace Nova said:

 

They defended themselves from Russia taking over their entire country.  That in itself is an honorable and historic  achievement and should never be minimized. 

 The rare Earth minerals are very expensive and difficult to extract/process - they're not just handing over billions worth of minerals - it will require billions of dollars in investments from the US Government and US companies.  

Even Russia is willing to work with US companies in extracting their rare Earth metals because of the expense, etc. 

  So the Ukraine deal is more of a "partnership" than anything else, imo. 

 

Russia only wants this because they will get money which they will then use to rebuild their military.

18 minutes ago, mayanh8 said:

@Ace Nova is the perfect example of the historical ignorance and low information that allowed a movement like MAGA to take hold.

I'm sure he's listened to some off brand hot takes with zero historical context that's made sense in his mind and now genuinely believes Russia, who was allied with Hitler and plotted with him to take over Europe during WWII, is actually our friend. He has zero understanding of what Russian intentions are but feels completely empowered and unshamed walking into a Ukraine/Russian thread and making declarative statements that are both objectively and subjectively false.

We're totally lost as a country. 

No,  that's not it.  Try again. 

Hitler also had an agreement in place with Great Britain before he went on a rampage.  Do you consider Great Britain "allied with Hitler"?  No - because once Hitler did what he did - all agreements ceased - including with Russia.  And I never said Stalin or Russia"was our friend". 

I stated FACTS.  The FACT is that Russia's involvement in defeating Germany on Germany's Eastern front helped the Allies defeat Hitler in Europe.  Do you actually dispute that? 

 

51 minutes ago, Bill said:

So your main argument against being blunt with dictators is talking about how Bobby Goodman was released by a country that was holding him after he was brought there after ejecting over a separate country?

 

And then gave more examples of limited hostage negotiations and nothing at all related to total war?

 

The John F Kennedy - Nikita Khrushchev  exchanges that ended the Cuban Missile Crisis prevented a war with Russia - which could have escalated to nuclear war. I know from a direct first hand source that the United States had called troops stationed all over the world to New Jersey first - ready to deploy to Miami - for a full out invasion of Cuba; had Russia broken through the blockade and installed nuclear weapons in Cuba. 

  (The source is a close family member who was stationed in Germany.  His entire unit was called in the middle of the night - thrown on planes - without knowing where they were going or what was happening.  They landed in New Jersey and immediately began to receive instructions on invading Cuba through Miami.  They were ready,loaded and waiting on dozens of airplanes.  Hours and hours went by but eventually the operation was called off. That's how close we were to a war with Russia. 

1 minute ago, Ace Nova said:

 

The John F Kennedy - Nikita Sergeyevich Khrushchev  exchanges that ended the Cuban Missile Crisis prevented a war with Russia - which could have escalated to nuclear war. I know from a direct first hand source that the United States had called troops stationed all over the world to New Jersey first - ready to deploy to Miami - for a full out invasion of Cuba; had Russia broken through the blockade and installed nuclear weapons in Cuba. 

  (The source is a close family member who was stationed in Germany.  His entire unit was called in the middle of the night - thrown on planes - without knowing where they were going or what was happening.  They landed in New Jersey and immediately began to receive instructions on invading Cuba through Miami.  They were ready,loaded and waiting on dozens of airplanes.  Hours and hours went by but eventually the operation was called off. That's how close we were to a war with Russia. 

Yeah, we got them to back off by making them think we were going to F them up. The Soviets blinked first and capitulated without us asking them to come to the table.  You negotiate with them by not negotiating and just doing a Commando style suit up montage in front of them until they get the message. 

26 minutes ago, Ace Nova said:

No,  that's not it.  Try again. 

Hitler also had an agreement in place with Great Britain before he went on a rampage.  Do you consider Great Britain "allied with Hitler"?  No - because once Hitler did what he did - all agreements ceased - including with Russia.  And I never said Stalin or Russia"was our friend". 

I stated FACTS.  The FACT is that Russia's involvement in defeating Germany on Germany's Eastern front helped the Allies defeat Hitler in Europe.  Do you actually dispute that? 

 

You implied that Russia had come to the aid of Europe / the West in the past with your WW2 argument and it’s not true in the way you are suggesting.

5 minutes ago, Bill said:

You negotiate with them by not negotiating

38 minutes ago, Ace Nova said:

 

They defended themselves from Russia taking over their entire country.  That in itself is an honorable and historic  achievement and should never be minimized. 

 The rare Earth minerals are very expensive and difficult to extract/process - they're not just handing over billions worth of minerals - it will require billions of dollars in investments from the US Government and US companies.  

Even Russia is willing to work with US companies in extracting their rare Earth metals because of the expense, etc. 

  So the Ukraine deal is more of a "partnership" than anything else, imo. 

 

Well gee whiz that sounds like an incredible opportunity for them. I wonder why it only took 4 years of being invaded and this being dangled as the only alternative to being left alone without any military support for them to think of doing such a wonderful partnership. 

We minimize the "achievement" by caving to Putin, which is exactly what this is. And we embolden him to continue to make these power grabs.  It's pathetic cowardice at its worst.