Waiting for after the draft when we'll hear complaints about the "Third Guy" that we could have drafted had Howie not made the trade.

8 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

Winston is so bad though and he’s coming off an ACL. Their defense is solid, but I think their offense is going to be really bad.

He was not bad. He had a 4-2 record with 1,200 yards, 14 TDs, 3 Ints and a 102.8 rating playing with nobodies at the skill positions. The ACL could change things though it’s not like he was a super mobile QB to begin with. 

5 minutes ago, we_gotta_believe said:

Bit of an understatement, they were 4th in pts allowed. 

I don’t think great defenses exist in the modern NFL anymore, so even a lot of the higher ranked ones I consider just solid. The Eagles and Hurts lit them up FFS

4 minutes ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

TB x 2, ATL x 2, CAR x 2, LAR, SEA, at ARZ, at SF, BAL, CIN, at CLV, at PIT, MIN, LVR, at PHL

I see a floor of 5 wins (ATLx2, CARx2, SEA).  Tossups are ARZ, CLV, PIT, MIN, LVR, and PHI. Maybe steal a game against the Bucs, against whom they seem to play well.

They'll be around .500.

That’s my feeling. You forget if they play Cleveland early and watson is suspended they could win that game. Also Arizona if they follow the past couple years begins to nosedive late in the year so if they face them then could also win that game. Don’t know if it’s lance or Jimmy g at Qb. If lance he may or may not be great off the bat. I think they wind up being a 6 to 8 win team. Vegas has them at 7.5. I feel like that is spot on 

Love it.

4 minutes ago, we_gotta_believe said:

Then he sold that loan with less favorable terms for the lender than comparable loans have been sold for in the past couple decades.

Jumping in late here....

Where did you see that the 1,2,3 that we got for #16 was not favorable?

 

Just now, Connecticut Eagle said:

Jumping in late here....

Where did you see that the 1,2,3 that we got for #16 was not favorable?

Two decades of draft pick trades that resulted in the valuations seen on modern value charts like Rich Hill's. 

4 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

He was not bad. He had a 4-2 record with 1,200 yards, 14 TDs, 3 Ints and a 102.8 rating playing with nobodies at the skill positions. The ACL could change things though it’s not like he was a super mobile QB to begin with. 

Small sample size that goes completely against his larger sample size and also lost one of the best offensive coaches/playcallers in the NFL. And like you said, the ACL complicates things.  

1 minute ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

Jumping in late here....

Where did you see that the 1,2,3 that we got for #16 was not favorable?

The Giants got a big haul from Chicago for 12 but the Giants were in a position to draft a premium player. Quite frankly pick 16 in this draft doesn't look all that compelling. Happy to roll the dice in the next draft tbh

1 minute ago, D-Shiznit said:

Love it.

To be fair, it doesn't seem to discount the first in 2023.  

Either way, it still is a nice value....GIVEN THE UNCERTAINTY OF WHERE THE SAINTS WILL PICK NEXT SEASON, THAT WILL CERTAINLY BE USED TO CRITICIZE THE TRADE IN HINDSIGHT!!!

 

So even if you aren’t patient, that’s a win on the Rich Hill trade chart. If you’re patient (and you can be with two other first-round picks), that’s a resounding win. 

1 minute ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Hubert Davis with a Glenn Rivers special.  Waiting forever to call the timeout.   

I wonder how much steam Kansas has to finish this out. The climb to get back from down 15 could take its toll on them later in this game. 

6 hours ago, Ipiggles said:

ahh... But here is the kicker in the Tampa game, that you are neglecting to address:

Hurts was bailing out of clean pockets with Wide Receivers running wide open downfield, multiple times. Both Watkins and Smith could have had multiple TD's in that game if Hurts stayed in the pocket, went through his progressions and made the throws ONTIME. 

He was doing this because the defense was confusing him, they were showing one defense presnap and then taking away - post snap, what Hurts was determiniing to be his 1st read based off the pre look. This confused Hurts, who was unable to go adjust and make the proper reads post snap.  This is concerning since we all know that game 7 of this past season Siri dumbed down extensively the offense to fit Hurt's limited abilities. 

there was a Tampa DB coach caught on the sidelines telling his players to keep doing it, because it was working because Hurts cant read the defense. 

 

So not only does Hurts not have the prototypical NFL Arm, he , to date,  lacks the ability to read and react to what the defense is doing POST snap.... this is where I am not sure he can make enough progress to overcome his lack of NFL Arm talent. 

 

And no, he wasn't basically a rookie last season. 

 

Said nothing about it being his rookie year.  It was his sophomore year.  And if you are paying attention, I tagged him as a one read and go QB back when we were discussing him before he was drafted.  I have always questioned his speed to read.  But Hurts didn’t fail alone.  And not giving credit to the Tampa D is warped.  That defense, the combination of its interior line and that speed at LB is damned hard to counter.  JPP had his best day.  A lot of people on here anoint Mailata as an All Pro (he wasn’t even a Pro Bowl LT).  I like him and when he is on a block, he is great but he is still learning and JPP gave him a challenge all day.  Opeta was miserable to watch in the All 22.  And that is just the offense. Brady could have embarrassed the D even more than he did.  This doesn’t exonerate Hurts.  Hardly.  But this fallacy that the Eagles would have won but for Hurts performance at QB is utter nonsense.  

I know that Hurts isn’t likely the answer at QB.  This year, no one is and thus he is our starter.  But this team has so many holes that probably only kicker wouldn’t warrant a draft selection.   Howie let the team get so diluted that year three of the rebuild won’t complete it entirely and they are in year two.  So we can pray (works for some in here) that Hurts gets better because, like it or not, that’s the QB this year.  Folks razz AFan about the value of making the playoffs but then act like it’s all because of Hurts.  That’s myopic  

Heck, I see posters refer to the awesome OL.  Awesome?  Mailata isn’t even the best LT in the NFC East.   Lane has been missing time.  Seumalo (wrongly disparaged by many) may not come back from a foot injury. Dickerson is still learning and an injury concern.  Driscoll can’t stay healthy and really has had struggles at G.  The anchor isn’t there.  Herbig? If Ward and Scott are JAGs, what do you think Herbig is?  Opeta?  A healthy Toth would push him off the team. Kelce is like the milk in the refrigerator, a use by date quickly approaching and no real answer at C behind him.  It should not be overlooked that health at G has been a huge issue for the Eagles the last two years and the Tampa game, it showed.  

The saints went 9-8 last year, lost Armstred/Williams/Payton/1 Winston ACL, and added pretty much F all. Color me unimpressed with their chances next year. 

6 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

I don’t think great defenses exist in the modern NFL anymore, so even a lot of the higher ranked ones I consider just solid. The Eagles and Hurts lit them up FFS

Call them whatever you want, but they clearly were a huge factor in them winning 9 games this year under those circumstances. I think people are still stuck with the notion of the saints being the offensive heavyweight of yesteryear back when Brees was still under center.

NFL Live crew on the trade.

Spoiler: They think the Eagles won the trade.

7 minutes ago, we_gotta_believe said:

Two decades of draft pick trades that resulted in the valuations seen on modern value charts like Rich Hill's. 

So the other draft value charts that folks are using to evaluate the trade online today are not modern?

I would trade back to the late 1st and grab another 2nd in a heartbeat.

To piggyback my previous post. 

6 hours ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Why the hell would the Saints do that?

QB. They have a damned good D. 

Just now, Connecticut Eagle said:

So the other draft value charts that folks are using to evaluate the trade online today are not modern?

Howie is a lot of things, but he’s not someone who is going to rush into a bad trade from an analytical perspective one month before the draft. 

11 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

Small sample size that goes completely against his larger sample size and also lost one of the best offensive coaches/playcallers in the NFL. And like you said, the ACL complicates things.  

In all seriousness he’s not someone you want to build around but I think he’s one of the better short term stop gap QB’s. Payton worked enough magic to reign him in to become a game manager, I would think the successors on the same team would take the same approach. 

19 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

So even if you aren’t patient, that’s a win on the Rich Hill trade chart. If you’re patient (and you can be with two other first-round picks), that’s a resounding win. 

This tweet is incorrect, the rich hill chart does not value a future 1st Rd pick at 200 pts. Likewise for a 70pt valuation for a 2024 2nd rd pick. Would be curious where he's getting that from because it's not from any chart I've seen attributed to Hill.

5 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Won’t take much steam if UNC keeps getting fouls and Caleb Love settles for 3’s.  
 

 

Feel like i jinxed them lol