The NFL was like "really Seattle?"

2 hours ago, RememberTheKoy said:

 

 

Fast forward to 12:30 after Howie and Sirianni have again committed to Hurts again and the blog tries to do mental gymnastics about how their answers actually indicate they will be drafting a QB in the first. 

 

Then fast forward to every Sunday this fall when we are forced to endure a high school offense.

4 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

BTW.  Other teams who aren’t run by a much of soft imbeciles are having an off season workout this week.  

So soft they ran the ball down the league's throat.

55 minutes ago, bitbased said:

As long as the draft board is complete none of this is really a problem. If you're scrambling because players didn't go where you thought they would then you already failed going into the draft.

 

51 minutes ago, downundermike said:

 

Didn't you say any good team should have 150 players on their board ??  

 

 

Agreed.  As I stated above, he already said a team should have 150 players on their board.  If you are scrambling at 15, your front office sucks and should be replaced.

OK - I think that's fine in an abstract setting.  The reality is that teams make real time decisions in the time allotted to make the pick.  Those decisions are impacted by unexpected picks and trades that occur before their pick.  Boards also aren't necessarily organized in a strict hierarchy from 1 to 150.  They are organized by position, scheme fit and talent.  So while a draft site may have some rigid view of a players value compared to another.  They may have 10 players with a first round grade and have to make a decision about potentially trading back when they reach their pick.  They may have a player they like they expect to have fall to them that doesn't and makes them have to make a different decision.  It happens every year with many different teams.  Last year Howie really moved around well in the first round and ended up with a very good player.  The Giants were not unprepared for the move but clearly had to change plans and made a good trade but probably a reach of a 1st round pick.  

My frustration with Howie is that I think the process he engages in to "collaborate" is one that ultimately allows him to be absolved from blame.  I think this "collaborative" process is worse when the planned pick goes awry or when different FO personnel and coaches do not agree on a player.  

6 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

Then fast forward to every Sunday this fall when we are forced to endure a high school offense.

 

We will be forced to endure another likely playoff season.  

5 minutes ago, NCiggles said:

 

OK - I think that's fine in an abstract setting.  The reality is that teams make real time decisions in the time allotted to make the pick.  Those decisions are impacted by unexpected picks and trades that occur before their pick.  Boards also aren't necessarily organized in a strict hierarchy from 1 to 150.  They are organized by position, scheme fit and talent.  So while a draft site may have some rigid view of a players value compared to another.  They may have 10 players with a first round grade and have to make a decision about potentially trading back when they reach their pick.  They may have a player they like they expect to have fall to them that doesn't and makes them have to make a different decision.  It happens every year with many different teams.  Last year Howie really moved around well in the first round and ended up with a very good player.  The Giants were not unprepared for the move but clearly had to change plans and made a good trade but probably a reach of a 1st round pick.  

My frustration with Howie is that I think the process he engages in to "collaborate" is one that ultimately allows him to be absolved from blame.  I think this "collaborative" process is worse when the planned pick goes awry or when different FO personnel and coaches do not agree on a player.  

The reality is that they need to be reassessing their strategy as those unexpected picks and trades happen... keep talking and changing direction.  Howie seems to be really bad at thinking on his feet.  Which is why it's such a big deal that the players Howie has identified go before their pick every year.   It's a shame.   Poor guy, if he didn't have bad luck, he'd have no luck at all.

4 minutes ago, RememberTheKoy said:

 

We will be forced to endure another likely playoff season.  

My guess is that Howie and Lurie will give Sirianni a mandate to let Hurts sink or swim at least the first 4 games of the season. I don't think they are going to start with the same running offense.  

1 minute ago, NCiggles said:

My guess is that Howie and Lurie will give Sirianni a mandate to let Hurts sink or swim at least the first 4 games of the season. I don't think they are going to start with the same running offense.  

Don't impede on his safe space

5 minutes ago, NCiggles said:

My guess is that Howie and Lurie will give Sirianni a mandate to let Hurts sink or swim at least the first 4 games of the season. I don't think they are going to start with the same running offense.  

After 4 below average games and two stat padding specials last year, the moved the offense to run based.

 

5 minutes ago, NCiggles said:

My guess is that Howie and Lurie will give Sirianni a mandate to let Hurts sink or swim at least the first 4 games of the season. I don't think they are going to start with the same running offense.  

 

What happens after 4 games?  They trade for Aaron Rodgers?  

5 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

The reality is that they need to be reassessing their strategy as those unexpected picks and trades happen... keep talking and changing direction.  Howie seems to be really bad at thinking on his feet.  Which is why it's such a big deal that the players Howie has identified go before their pick every year.   It's a shame.   Poor guy, if he didn't have bad luck, he'd have no luck at all.

Howie has made bad decisions but thinking on his feet and panic haven't been the primary reason.  In the first round, I think the last-time the player went before they expected and they made a panicked move was when they picked Marcus Smith.  I ultimately don't think it was panic as much as just a dumb decision based on a board that was too heavily geared to get players to fit Chip's scheme.  Reagor was a bad choice because there was a disagreement on who was the better player between him and Jefferson (allegedly). JJAW was a bad pick.  Barnett was a bad trade up and pick.  Sidney Jones was a bad pick.  I don't think any of these moves were panicked.  He made a good trade up for Smith with Dallas last year.  There was no panic in the move.    It's clear to me that Howie goes into the draft with a very good understanding of his options.  I don't think he's the best at picking the best option for the team.

1 minute ago, NCiggles said:

Howie has made bad decisions but thinking on his feet and panic haven't been the primary reason.  In the first round, I think the last-time the player went before they expected and they made a panicked move was when they picked Marcus Smith.  I ultimately don't think it was panic as much as just a dumb decision based on a board that was too heavily geared to get players to fit Chip's scheme.  Reagor was a bad choice because there was a disagreement on who was the better player between him and Jefferson (allegedly). JJAW was a bad pick.  Barnett was a bad trade up and pick.  Sidney Jones was a bad pick.  I don't think any of these moves were panicked.  He made a good trade up for Smith with Dallas last year.  There was no panic in the move.    It's clear to me that Howie goes into the draft with a very good understanding of his options.  I don't think he's the best at picking the best option for the team.

The bolded statement makes me sad.  There's no way that professional scouts could possibly have had that debate and somehow get to keep their job.  

Pumphrey was definitely a panic move to go with Marcus Smith.  

7 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Don't impede on his safe space

I am on a mission to win my bracket.  

5 minutes ago, downundermike said:

After 4 below average games and two stat padding specials last year, the moved the offense to run based.

 

2 minutes ago, RememberTheKoy said:

 

What happens after 4 games?  They trade for Aaron Rodgers?  

They potentially move to a more run heavy approach and win games.  I wouldn't be surprised if they were a potential wild card team but it's not going to be based on some great passing attack.  

1 minute ago, Iggles_Phan said:

There's no way that professional scouts could possibly have had that debate and somehow get to keep their job.  

And if they disagreed, and the GM, the guy with final say picked the wrong guy, he should be shown the door along with those scouts.

Justin Jefferson was the most pro ready route runner in that draft, and for the last several drafts.  

1 minute ago, downundermike said:

And if they disagreed, and the GM, the guy with final say picked the wrong guy, he should be shown the door along with those scouts.

Justin Jefferson was the most pro ready route runner in that draft, and for the last several drafts.  

Yup.  I said so at the time.  He was the guy I wanted and he was just sitting right there... ripe for the picking, and Howie crapped the bed.

1 minute ago, Iggles_Phan said:

The bolded statement makes me sad.  There's no way that professional scouts could possibly have had that debate and somehow get to keep their job.  

Pumphrey was definitely a panic move to go with Marcus Smith.  

They could have drafted Aaron Jones and instead got Pumphrey.  That wasn't panic but stupidity.  

1 minute ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Yup.  I said so at the time.  He was the guy I wanted and he was just sitting right there... ripe for the picking, and Howie crapped the bed.

And the Minnesota Vikings war room laughed at us, and forced us to use a 1st on a WR the following year, and we may have to do it again.

1 minute ago, NCiggles said:

They could have drafted Aaron Jones and instead got Pumphrey.  That wasn't panic but stupidity.  

They traded up to get Pumphrey.

4 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

The bolded statement makes me sad.  There's no way that professional scouts could possibly have had that debate and somehow get to keep their job.  

Pumphrey was definitely a panic move to go with Marcus Smith.  

Who knows but it's possible the scouts had Jefferson much higher but Pederson wanted Reagor.  Again, the problem is Roseman not knowing better.  

2 minutes ago, downundermike said:

And if they disagreed, and the GM, the guy with final say picked the wrong guy, he should be shown the door along with those scouts.

Justin Jefferson was the most pro ready route runner in that draft, and for the last several drafts.  

Their mistakes come from trying to pigeon-hole players into pre-assigned roles -- JJAW the next Jeffery, Reagor the next Desean Jackson, etc.  They tried to draft for scheme fit instead of the best talent and create the offense to maximize the talent.

That's part of what would make Drake London such a terrible pick.  Who cares if a guy is 6'4 if he can't get any separation and constantly pushes off?

1 minute ago, NCiggles said:

Who knows but it's possible the scouts had Jefferson much higher but Pederson wanted Reagor.  Again, the problem is Roseman not knowing better.  

I agree

1 minute ago, Iggles_Phan said:

They traded up to get Pumphrey.

Yeah - that was a dumb trade but because somewhere someone had missed Pumphrey's evaluation.  

Just now, Iggles_Phan said:

I agree

Stop putting black lines over my words - that's culturally appropriating my posts. 

Who was the player that we missed when we traded back and got Milton?

2 minutes ago, NCiggles said:

Yeah - that was a dumb trade but because somewhere someone had missed Pumphrey's evaluation.  

And they worried that they'd miss out on him, so they wasted extra on that little gem.  (pun intended)