20 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Being a young cheap QB with a "solid season" is his ceiling.  If that is good enough for you, then again, you'll be happy with mediocre.  Spare me the top 20 BS....That means he's bottom 12.  

 

And he's only top 20 because of his running ability.  How long have you been an Eagle fan?  Long enough to remember all of the running QB's in the past and what happens to them?  

It may or may not be his ceiling. Neither of us know, although you are convinced you do.

Yeah I started as a fan with Cunningham as a kid. If the Eagles got him a half decent O-Line they could have won a SB. The Eagles should have won a Super Bowl with McNabb.

2 minutes ago, austinfan said:

Would you trade Jimmy G for Hurts. Yea. Would you trade Matt ryan for Hurts, Ya. Cousins, Tannehill, Carr,

Hell no. None have upside, all have downside, and Hurts outperformed them, except for Carr and Cousins.

Running is a skill. They don't change the score b/c you ran it in for a TD instead of throwing a perfect fade.

No, they don't change the score because it was a run, and not a throw.   Instead, defenses have a much easier time defending against a QB that can run better than he can pass.  And therefore, the team won't be in the position to be in the red zone often enough to get him to run the ball in versus pass the ball in.  

So... while you aren't wrong in the facts presented, your interpretation of the facts are in error.    Running is a skill for a QB, but it is not a skill that makes up for the skills that are lacking from the passing game.  So, yes, in the isolated case of scoring a TD, it doesn't matter whether its a throw from the QB or a run.  But, in the larger sense, if the QB has to rely on the legs rather than the arm, the defense has an easier time defending against that.  And that's precisely what we saw from Hurts.  Against good defenses, he couldn't move the offense.  Against bad defenses, he did enough.  And the blue print is out there... it's obvious to all who are willing to see it.  Crowd the LOS, take away his running lane to the right and you pretty much make him completely ineffective.  We saw it against the Bucs in the playoffs.  We saw it in Game 1 against the Giants.  Now, some teams don't have the ability to actually do that, especially with a really good OL to create running lanes, despite the LOS being crowded.  But, it's not a recipe for success in the NFL.  It never has been, and since it means the defense has to defend less of the field, I'm pretty sure it never will.

10 minutes ago, austinfan said:

Would you trade Jimmy G for Hurts. Yea. Would you trade Matt ryan for Hurts, Ya. Cousins, Tannehill, Carr,

Hell no. None have upside, all have downside, and Hurts outperformed them, except for Carr and Cousins.

Running is a skill. They don't change the score b/c you ran it in for a TD instead of throwing a perfect fade.

Maybe Hurts improves, maybe he doesn't, but there is no one in this draft that I see having better than his current performance  as their probable upside. So don't waste a pick.

It's the second year of a rebuild, come back after the 2023 season, and if the team goes 11-6 and stalls in the playoffs due to Hurts, then make the move.

 

One reason to build a team around the Hurts skill package is it's a lot easier to upgrade if you build an offense around a QB with an accurate arm, quick release and good anticipation than one based on a big arm, big play QB. That means the OL, the running game, a big possession receiver and two solid TEs. Power running, play action and screens, TEs down the seam and crossing patterns. If Hurts can't run that offense, you can find someone who can who won't cost an arm and a leg and blow up your cap. One thing the playoffs showed is good defenses will take away the big play and force you to dink and dunk - so build the best dink and dunk offense possible and use play action to burn them if they bring the safeties up.

 

Why don't we let Minshew start? He can make those throws you mention, and if he's not able to do it consistently, then we can move on from him just as easily, no? 

Instead Hurts is going to be gifted the job again, and the offense will be another year being run heavy, to detriment of our skill players. If Hurts is the starter, we actually need to run that type of offense to hide his limitation, which is passing the football. Which should be the QBs primary skill set, not his tertiary. (Hurts first skill is swag, second running, then much farther down, passing). 

Hutchinson looks trim 

Just running a mock draft, and got an offer from the Lions, pick 15 for 32 and 34.....would you make that deal?

9 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said:

Just running a mock draft, and got an offer from the Lions, pick 15 for 32 and 34.....would you make that deal?

Yes

I would prefer trading it for a 2023 first.

He looks really skinny for 337. 

15 minutes ago, austinfan said:

One reason to build a team around the Hurts skill package is it's a lot easier to upgrade if you build an offense around a QB with an accurate arm, quick release and good anticipation than one based on a big arm, big play QB. That means the OL, the running game, a big possession receiver and two solid TEs. Power running, play action and screens, TEs down the seam and crossing patterns. If Hurts can't run that offense, you can find someone who can who won't cost an arm and a leg and blow up your cap. One thing the playoffs showed is good defenses will take away the big play and force you to dink and dunk - so build the best dink and dunk offense possible and use play action to burn them if they bring the safeties up.

You've seen this 'accurate arm', 'quick release' and 'good anticipation' from Hurts?  Which games should I watch to see that too?

36 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said:

In scenario 1, no interest in Jordan Davis? 

I would love a package up to get Hamilton. I've stated it since September, if we somehow land him, I'll buy his jersey immediately. And I hate buying jerseys. 

Jordan Davis is so old he already has a reverse mortgage 

1 hour ago, TorontoEagle said:

Just running a mock draft, and got an offer from the Lions, pick 15 for 32 and 34.....would you make that deal?

Yes, but as @Desertbirds says... getting their first for 2023 would be preferable to either 32 or 34.  

3 minutes ago, Desertbirds said:

Yes

I would prefer trading it for a 2023 first.

I took it...ended up with

16 - Ojabo

19 - Elam

32 - Wyatt

34 - Pitre 

51 - Harris

83 - Pickens

123 - Robinson

154 - Bryan Cook (S, Cincinnati)

162 - Krull (TE, Pitt)

166 - Micah McFadden (LB, Indiana)

205 - Parham (G, Memphis)

 

Super defense heavy, but that's just how the board kept falling to me.

That is a bulldog right there 

 

 

38 minutes ago, austinfan said:

Would you trade Jimmy G for Hurts. Yea. Would you trade Matt ryan for Hurts, Ya. Cousins, Tannehill, Carr,

Hell no. None have upside, all have downside, and Hurts outperformed them, except for Carr and Cousins.

Running is a skill. They don't change the score b/c you ran it in for a TD instead of throwing a perfect fade.

Maybe Hurts improves, maybe he doesn't, but there is no one in this draft that I see having better than his current performance  as their probable upside. So don't waste a pick.

It's the second year of a rebuild, come back after the 2023 season, and if the team goes 11-6 and stalls in the playoffs due to Hurts, then make the move.

 

One reason to build a team around the Hurts skill package is it's a lot easier to upgrade if you build an offense around a QB with an accurate arm, quick release and good anticipation than one based on a big arm, big play QB. That means the OL, the running game, a big possession receiver and two solid TEs. Power running, play action and screens, TEs down the seam and crossing patterns. If Hurts can't run that offense, you can find someone who can who won't cost an arm and a leg and blow up your cap. One thing the playoffs showed is good defenses will take away the big play and force you to dink and dunk - so build the best dink and dunk offense possible and use play action to burn them if they bring the safeties up.

 

  No I'm not building a team around the skill set of a quarterback that wants to run. You've been around long enough to realize what happens to that guy.

You want to keep him a year to see how that pans out (and mostly because there isn't a better option in the draft) fine. He doesn't have "an accurate arm, quick release and good anticipation" so we build as if Hurts will somehow gains that and if he doesn't (which he won't) bye, bye.

 

55 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

Wow that is huge. To expand on this, I watched A. Donald and he is really good.

I let you know when I’m done with C. Kupp, got a good feeling for him too!

9 hours ago, Dwide Schrude said:

Reid is probably my favorite for realistic free agents we might sign 

I like a Whitehead more at S but would be ok with Reid. Regardless, they need to draft another S day 1 or 2 of the draft. Reid/Whitehead and Epps as the starting duo is underwhelming. 

54 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said:

Just running a mock draft, and got an offer from the Lions, pick 15 for 32 and 34.....would you make that deal?

That depends if there is a prospect the Eagles really want.  Howie would ask who they intend to take at #15.  Having pick #16 comes in really handy for that type of trade.

 

42 minutes ago, Original Sin said:

 

 

Unrelated to what he’s saying. I looked at his Twitter pic to get a better look at his wife. I noticed in his statement under his pic, he says endzones should be 11 yards. 😂

1 hour ago, austinfan said:

Would you trade Jimmy G for Hurts. Yea. Would you trade Matt ryan for Hurts, Ya. Cousins, Tannehill, Carr,

Hell no. None have upside, all have downside, and Hurts outperformed them, except for Carr and Cousins.

Running is a skill. They don't change the score b/c you ran it in for a TD instead of throwing a perfect fade.

Maybe Hurts improves, maybe he doesn't, but there is no one in this draft that I see having better than his current performance  as their probable upside. So don't waste a pick.

It's the second year of a rebuild, come back after the 2023 season, and if the team goes 11-6 and stalls in the playoffs due to Hurts, then make the move.

 

One reason to build a team around the Hurts skill package is it's a lot easier to upgrade if you build an offense around a QB with an accurate arm, quick release and good anticipation than one based on a big arm, big play QB. That means the OL, the running game, a big possession receiver and two solid TEs. Power running, play action and screens, TEs down the seam and crossing patterns. If Hurts can't run that offense, you can find someone who can who won't cost an arm and a leg and blow up your cap. One thing the playoffs showed is good defenses will take away the big play and force you to dink and dunk - so build the best dink and dunk offense possible and use play action to burn them if they bring the safeties up.

 

 

Jalen Hurts's stats:

Passing Yards - 21st

Passing TDs - 23rd

Yards Per Pass Attempt - 14th

Completion Percentage - 26th

Passing Yards per game - 26th

Rating - 22nd

QBR - 19th

Time to Throw- 38th (LAST PLACE)

On what planet does this qualify as a top 20 QB with an accurate arm, quick release, and good anticipation? If you are in last place for time to throw, you have zero anticipation, and zero quick releases.

1 hour ago, ManuManu said:

He looks really skinny for 337. 

How the hell is he 337.  Looks more like 285 if that. 

 

16 minutes ago, wussbasket said:

Time to Throw- 38th (LAST PLACE)

On what planet does this qualify as a top 20 QB with an accurate arm, quick release, and good anticipation? If you are in last place for time to throw, you have zero anticipation, and zero quick releases.

Hurts was last place in his 2020 starts as well; there wasn't any development there at all.  He was at 3.11 or 3.12 both seasons IIRC

22nd is accurate for his overall NFL rating.  There's no way he was 17th as Rosenthal tried to assert.  Many of the QBs Zangaro and Reub listed in the 18-24 range had better seasons than Hurts did.

2 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

 

London was supposedly 6'5 once upon a time.

Said this a year ago. Wentz made a huge mistake bishing his way out of town. He should have stayed.