April 21, 20223 yr 1 minute ago, JohnSnowsHair said: Yes. And they do. School boards hold a lot of sway. Acting like parents are somehow being victimized by schools is insanity. I say this as the father of multiple school age children spanning multiple levels of education. What's laughable is that the parents complaining are the ones least likely to actually be involved in their kids' education day to day. Sure, and so is acting as if they have nothing to say about their children's schooling. Let's get back to the bill itself. Yes, it is being used by both sides politically and yes it is not really necessary. Anything else wrong with it?
April 21, 20223 yr 1 minute ago, Kz! said: The funniest thing in here is that ishlibs all of a sudden have to pretend to care about central Floridians supposedly having to pay more taxes. Raising taxes to own the libs! You're completely broken.
April 21, 20223 yr 1 minute ago, JohnSnowsHair said: Yes. And they do. School boards hold a lot of sway. Acting like parents are somehow being victimized by schools is insanity. I say this as the father of multiple school age children spanning multiple levels of education. What's laughable is that the parents complaining are the ones least likely to actually be involved in their kids' education day to day. This. People already have the ability to run for and elect school boards. This keeps getting conveniently ignored whenever people are trying to justify BS overreaching legislation. 1 minute ago, DrPhilly said: Sure, and so is acting as if they have nothing to say about their children's schooling. Let's get back to the bill itself. Yes, it is being used by both sides politically and yes it is not really necessary. Anything else wrong with it? Literally ignoring the 2 sentences immediately before what you bolded. The mechanism for them to have a say in their kid's schooling already exists.
April 21, 20223 yr 4 minutes ago, DEagle7 said: Literally ignoring the 2 sentences immediately before what you bolded. The mechanism for them to have a say in their kid's schooling already exists. Incorrect. The point is that many do essentially take the position that parents have no right to take a stance at all. There was no indication in my post that I accused JohnSnow of taking that position. I know full well that he does not do so. JohnSnow also knows that I understand his position.
April 21, 20223 yr 5 minutes ago, DrPhilly said: Sure, and so is acting as if they have nothing to say about their children's schooling. Let's get back to the bill itself. Yes, it is being used by both sides politically and yes it is not really necessary. Anything else wrong with it? I'm having a little trouble understanding the point you're trying to make. It's the kind of bill authoritarians pass to consolidate power. It's not just that it's unnecessary, it's that it literally gives the state an outsized say in education, something that can and should remain local.
April 21, 20223 yr 12 minutes ago, JohnSnowsHair said: Yes. And they do. School boards hold a lot of sway. Acting like parents are somehow being victimized by schools is insanity. I say this as the father of multiple school age children spanning multiple levels of education. What's laughable is that the parents complaining are the ones least likely to actually be involved in their kids' education day to day. How much do you know about the Swedish school system? Now think of the reverse and you understand the problem with the poster you’re conversing with.
April 21, 20223 yr Just now, JohnSnowsHair said: I'm having a little trouble understanding the point you're trying to make. It's the kind of bill authoritarians pass to consolidate power. It's not just that it's unnecessary, it's that it literally gives the state an outsized say in education, something that can and should remain local. The point (just as Vikas pointed out) is that the bill itself is fine. There is literally nothing wrong with it directly. 90% of everyone will agree with the actual limitations it places on education for K-3. The issues are in the indirect aspects of the way it is presented, marketed, etc.
April 21, 20223 yr 3 minutes ago, Dave Moss said: How much do you know about the Swedish school system? Now think of the reverse and you understand the problem with the poster you’re conversing with. As I've told you several times, I grew up with both parents in local education in PA. Stay out of it you hack.
April 21, 20223 yr Just now, DrPhilly said: Incorrect. The point is that many do essentially take the position that parents have no right to take a stance at all. There was no indication in my post that I accused JohnSnow of taking that position. I know full well that he does not do so. Who exactly is arguing that? Point out one person in here who has argued parents should have absolutely no say in their kid's education. You're all over the place here. Nor is that argument even relevant to this situation. This isn't parents taking a stance on their kid's education. It's the state taking a stance on other people's kid's education. Kind of a big difference. 4 minutes ago, JohnSnowsHair said: I'm having a little trouble understanding the point you're trying to make. It's the kind of bill authoritarians pass to consolidate power. It's not just that it's unnecessary, it's that it literally gives the state an outsized say in education, something that can and should remain local. I think I see the problem The brännvin has been flowing...
April 21, 20223 yr 1 minute ago, DEagle7 said: Who exactly is arguing that? Point out one person in here who has argued parents should have absolutely no say in their kid's education. You're all over the place here. I'm 100% clear. This is a **** bill because it is unnecessary and only stokes political bull sheet but its contents aren't anything to be upset with. No teachers in Florida are being prevented form teaching things they should be teaching to children of that age.
April 21, 20223 yr 19 minutes ago, Kz! said: The funniest thing in here is that ishlibs all of a sudden have to pretend to care about central Floridians supposedly having to pay more taxes. Is empathy such a foreign concept to you that you cannot see a $1B bill with continuing obligations being dropped on a relatively small population of citizens as worthy of at least acknowledgement if not a touch of disdain, maybe even outrage? Then again, who am I talking to. Some caricature of a human being.
April 21, 20223 yr 6 minutes ago, DrPhilly said: I'm 100% clear. This is a **** bill because it is unnecessary and only stokes political bull sheet but its contents aren't anything to be upset with. No teachers in Florida are being prevented form teaching things they should be teaching to children of that age. So given your non-answer, I can assume that you agree that one is actually arguing that parents should have no say in their kid's education and that was just a BS nonsensical point you're trying to make to justify this nonsense And yes the bill is 100% something to be upset with. You simply cannot separate the bill from the intent and desired outcomes. You already agreed with me the intent behind this bill was to marginalize gay families. On 4/7/2022 at 9:19 AM, DEagle7 said: Sorry but I think you're being incredibly naive if you don't think that's the explicit reason behind this bill. But you seem pretty dug in so I guess I'll drop it. On 4/7/2022 at 10:39 AM, DrPhilly said: I never said it wasn’t the reason. And I think we can all agree that the desired outcome is just that, in addition to increasing governmental control over the public school system. So how you could possibly argue that the bill itself isn't something to be upset with is absolutely Procus-level looney tunes stuff Doc.
April 21, 20223 yr Author 1 minute ago, DEagle7 said: And yes the bill is 100% something to be upset with. You simply cannot separate the bill from the intent and desired outcomes. You already agreed with me the intent behind this bill was to marginalize gay families. How exactly does not teaching 5-8 year olds about gender fluidity and sexuality "marginalize gay families?"
April 21, 20223 yr Quote Democratic state Rep. Fentrice Driskell told CNN just before the votes happened on Thursday, "It's going to cost the government in Orange County and Osceola Counties and therefore the tax payers billions of dollars, I'm talking an additional tax burden that's estimated $2,200 to $2,800 per family." $2,500 per family is a small price to pay for a Republican temper tantrum.
April 21, 20223 yr Author 12 minutes ago, JohnSnowsHair said: Is empathy such a foreign concept to you that you cannot see a $1B bill with continuing obligations being dropped on a relatively small population of citizens as worthy of at least acknowledgement if not a touch of disdain, maybe even outrage? Then again, who am I talking to. Some caricature of a human being. I 100% guarantee you don't give an ish about how much central Floridians pay in taxes nor do you know anything about how this move will ultimately effect their overall tax payments. Look, the whole "Don't Say Gay" lie blew up in the democrats faces. It's forced them to publicly take a stand that they want 5 year olds to be taught about gender fluidity. That idea is repulsive to the vast majority of the population. Now, you're panicking like the rest of the retarded ishlibs in here and trying to paint DeSantis's decision to treat Disney like every other business in the state like it's some sort of major L for him. It's not. Your guys lost this one. Dust yourselves off and try to come up with ideas less repulsive.
April 21, 20223 yr 29 minutes ago, VanHammersly said: $2,500 per family is a small price to pay for a Republican temper tantrum. I say this with 100% sincerity - will it really cost those counties BILLIONS of dollars every year to fix potholes and make sure the sewer runs in the proper direction?
April 21, 20223 yr 2 minutes ago, mikemack8 said: I say this with 100% sincerity - will it really cost those counties BILLIONS of dollars every year to fix potholes and make sure the sewer runs in the proper direction? They're not just overseeing the road maintenance, sewers, etc., they're also taking on a whole sheet ton of debt. https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/politics-news/florida-senate-passes-bill-strip-disney-special-self-governing-status-rcna25219 Quote Farmer said the current bill as written could leave Orange and Osceola counties to assume the nearly $1 billion bond debt the Reedy Creek Improvement District carries, as required by Florida law. "So this is not supposition, this is not conjecture, this is Florida law that says those 1.7 million people are going to have to pick up this bill,” Farmer said. According to the RCID’s annual financial report for 2021, the district carries a long-term bonded debt of $977,215,801.
April 21, 20223 yr 42 minutes ago, DEagle7 said: So given your non-answer, I can assume that you agree that one is actually arguing that parents should have no say in their kid's education and that was just a BS nonsensical point you're trying to make to justify this nonsense And yes the bill is 100% something to be upset with. You simply cannot separate the bill from the intent and desired outcomes. You already agreed with me the intent behind this bill was to marginalize gay familie I agree that anyone arguing that parents shouldn't have a say is total bs just as anyone arguing that they have no say. So, yeah, we agree and both are worth pointing out. I also agree the intention and signalling is something to be upset with, yes. Equally, there isn't anything specifically in the bill worth batting an eye at as it is simply common sense (though unnecessary). This is simply ridiculous political banter from both sides. Neither get a pass from me.
April 21, 20223 yr 2 minutes ago, VanHammersly said: They're not just overseeing the road maintenance, sewers, etc., they're also taking on a whole sheet ton of debt. https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/politics-news/florida-senate-passes-bill-strip-disney-special-self-governing-status-rcna25219 I saw that - I also saw that Disney will now pay tax to the state instead of themselves?
April 21, 20223 yr Author There's a reason Disney is upset their losing tax breaks in this deal. Ishlibs in here unironically think they were paying more in road maintenance than they were saving in tax breaks like they're some sort of charity.
April 21, 20223 yr 2 minutes ago, mikemack8 said: I saw that - I also saw that Disney will now pay tax to the state instead of themselves? Disney was already paying state and local taxes. $780 million last year.
April 21, 20223 yr Just now, Toastrel said: So I see I missed nothing by being busy today. Kz's for raising taxes now. So that's kind of a big deal.
April 21, 20223 yr 1 hour ago, Dave Moss said: Orlando area residents got owned!!! Now hol up...if FloridaMan is feeling the pain here, I might have to rethink my position 😃
April 21, 20223 yr 16 minutes ago, DrPhilly said: I agree that anyone arguing that parents shouldn't have a say is total bs just as anyone arguing that they have no say. So, yeah, we agree and both are worth pointing out. I also agree the intention and signalling is something to be upset with, yes. Equally, there isn't anything specifically in the bill worth batting an eye at as it is simply common sense (though unnecessary). This is simply ridiculous political banter from both sides. Neither get a pass from me. Once again, the swedish meatball over here continues to ignore the enforcement mechanism is the primary issue with the bill. Deputizing nutjobs parents to enforce the vague language of the law by way of suing school districts is not a trivial problem. Teachers will be discouraged from even referring to their own same sex spouses out of fear that some pyscho will sue the district for discussing sexual orientation or gender identity.
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