9 hours ago, Alphagrand said:

Cunningham‘s legacy is holding a championship caliber defense back with lacklustre QB play and not learning the playbook

Hopefully Hurts’ legacy can be prouder 

You are going deeper than I intended, but your comments resonate.  

My message was simpler … 12-1

Hopefully that will ease 4for4’s confusion.

@LeanMeanGM  Eagles 31 Giants 3

Bonus: Eagles move up to the #2 scoring Defense in the NFL and produce over 500 yards of total Offense

@LeanMeanGM

Eagles 27

Giants 16

*Jack Stoll TD 

8 hours ago, D-Shiznit said:

Re Randall: I think a little while ago Jaws said he spoke to Hurts after Wentz was traded, and Hurts told him that he just wants someone to believe in him and teach him how to be a proper QB. Over the course of the last two years, Siri/Shane/Brian along with Tom House and Quincy Avery have done exactly that for him.

No one ever did that for Randall, his early coaches just saw him as a play-making instrument, it wasn't until he was with the Vikes and Green/Billick where he actually got coached up properly.

This is only partially true. Doug Scovil was Randalls QB coach from 1986 until his death in December of 1989. Doug was a father figure for Randall as well and his death hit Randall hard. RC was making great progression up until that time. But there was never anyone added to the coach staff to replace Doug as a coach let alone the "mentor" relationship. 

10 hours ago, Captain F said:

Can a draft pick be sold? 

Technically yes - you can trade for cash but it won't change your cap. 

Edit: It may change your cap ... the rookie salary pool is based on the number of draft picks and their position. Selling a draft pick would effective decrease your rookie salary pool and increase your regular cap pool by the same amount.

@LeanMeanGM

Eagles 31

Giants 13

Watkins with a TD

6 hours ago, Alphagrand said:

The coaching only lasted one season.  Cunningham was a mirage in 98 and returned to lacklustre in 99 and promptly lost interest and his job, again.  He enjoyed a splash season propped up by two future HOF WR in Carter and Moss, and an excellent RB in Robert Smith.  Cunningham was lazy and unmotivated by nature, and he made his coaches look worse than they were as a result.
 

Duante Culpepper was very close to as good in his rookie season a couple of years later.

False. Completely false. I have inside information (that's all I will say other than my source is rock solid).

12 minutes ago, Nivraga said:

False. Completely false. I have inside information (that's all I will say other than my source is rock solid).

Seams solid

The eagles are on sky sports here in Ireland for the second week in a row. Ffs 

6 hours ago, D-Shiznit said:

Gotta give Howie and his FO major props, we have an amazing young nucleus.

This list should also include: Dickerson, Davis, Dean, Sweat, and hopefully CJGJ.

He's not wrong about his list but I don't think Quez and Miles should be included.  Who knows what kind of contract Miles Sanders wants and I think Quez is gone after next season.  

I need to see Dean and Davis perform at a consistent level before crowning them the nucleus and Sweat is a hot and cold rotational player, hardly nucleus.  

The Eagles have some great young talent.  Howie's real test is going to be Hurts next contract and then building a team around that massive salary.

6 hours ago, D-Shiznit said:

Gotta give Howie and his FO major props, we have an amazing young nucleus.

This list should also include: Dickerson, Davis, Dean, Sweat, and hopefully CJGJ.

I'll take a 27 year old Mahomes plus whatever else is on his roster as the best future outlook for any team in the NFL. 

6 minutes ago, EaglesIreland said:

The eagles are on sky sports here in Ireland for the second week in a row. Ffs 

Top oh the mornin to ya 

10 hours ago, SkippyX said:

Buddy and Kotite built a rusty jalopy and asked Randall to drive it. Buddy said I know defense so of course I know offense (he was Juan Castillo before Castillo) Kotite hated Randall. HoF coaches Parcells, Belichick, Gibbs, Walsh, and Johnson coached circles around them. Randall left and dominated in Minnesota. Buddy left and went 12-20. Kotite left and went 4-28.

BTW, that so-called dominant defense was dominant in 1991 when Randall was hurt, very good in 1992, pretty good in 1989, and that's it. What they were most of his career was big play flashy with amazing Eric Allen and 4 of the worst corners in the league. One of their nicknames was actually Toast. Ben Smith was a 2nd dominant corner for all of about 10 weeks before his injury. They had HoF players here on D for years and always 1 or 2 incredibly weak players to be exploited.

Cunningham was 2nd in MVP voting in 1988 and 1990, but yeah... all his fault. He was 2nd in MVP voting in 1998 too, so 3 time MVP runner up and he's the one you go after?

 

Overall I think this post is spot on but I wanted to correct a couple things.

First, Buddy did try to bring in quality players for the offensively line. Buddy wanted to trade for Jim Lachey but was told no because he would be too expensive. So the Raiders traded him to Washington. Not only didn't Buddy not have Lachey at LT for his OL but he had to play against him twice a year. It was also this sentiment that led to some of the (poor) decisions for the Oline.

Keith Byars was a dominant runner at Ohio State. Two foot injuries robbed him of the speed and quickness that made him dominant - that doesn't change what he was for the Eagles but it's less painful when you understand he wasn't what they thought they were getting.

Juan Castillo gets a bad rap. His defense was top 15 across the board and top 10 in a few despite having the worst back 7 in the NFL and getting the job in the lockout year which robbed him of a new coaches' much needed offseason to tinker with his players.

4 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

He's not wrong about his list but I don't think Quez and Miles should be included.  Who knows what kind of contract Miles Sanders wants and I think Quez is gone after next season.  

I need to see Dean and Davis perform at a consistent level before crowning them the nucleus and Sweat is a hot and cold rotational player, hardly nucleus.  

The Eagles have some great young talent.  Howie's real test is going to be Hurts next contract and then building a team around that massive salary.

He is definitely better than that. Maybe not a perennial pro bowler but I wouldn’t say he’s as inconsistent as you’re making him sound. 

I'm bullish on the long-term outlook on the Eagles, given future draft picks, the cap should be "fine" moving forward and Hurts, but make no mistake *THIS* is the best chance we're going to have at a SB in the next 3-4 years. We have older, elite players (Kelce, Slay, Johnson) who either will be off the team or bad by 2025. We won't have a QB under a rookie contract.

In the NFL, things move quickly so we have to strike while the iron is hot.

The biggest question for the Eagles has been the QB position for a while now.  That has now transitioned from QB to Howie's ability to draft and extend (or decline to extend) roster talent.

With all the players on this roster having career years, filling holes and sustaining talent, moving forward, will have to come exclusively via the draft and not from signing or trading (or both) proven studs.  Howie really has never been able to do that in the past.

Offense: Sanders, Seumalo

Defense: Bradberry, CJGJ, Epps, White, Edwards, Hargrave, Cox, Graham.

Only a couple of true studs on that list, but that's an absurd amount of starters with uncertain contract situations for 2023.  It would be a crippling mistake to turn the franchise into a pretzel trying to keep them all and keep them happy.  They are all going to want $$$ for their contributions to the 2022 success.  

Randall was a complex case study in QB-ing.  True, the discrepancy in the offensive coaching he received vs the coaching of his rival teams was criminal.  He was also famous for never learning his own play book and just winging it.  Some of that is on him.  Anything between the ears was a weakness for his entire career.

He was incredible for a short period in Minnesota, but that was because he lucked into an offense that was historically perfect for the one thing he did well at that point in his career....heave the ball downfield.  It was a match made in heaven with 2 all-pro WRs.  So it's not as simple as "Randall got out of town and look how great he could have been anywhere else."  

But excluding any mental demands of the position, he really was the most purely talented QB of all time.

16 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Never understood why this isn't discussed more.  People look at Randall now as some flawless legend.  He had terrible body language at times, looked dejected all too often after a bad play or a sack.  Was kind of a prima-donna and couldn't win a big game.  Yet McNabb and Wentz are destroyed by this fan base....Randall gets a pass.  Don't know why.  

 

Did he have good offensive coaching or an offensive line?  No.  But he is held to a different standard than those other guys, for whatever reason.  

Some say Cunningham was just too stupid. Thats false too. Cunningham was/is flaky and an introvert. His parents died within a year of each other while he was at UNLV. I think his relationship with his brothers is good but I do know he became very close to his Eagles QB Coach Doug Scovil who died in 1989. If Randall gets a pass it's only because the team around him was crap and only saw success when he was on the field.

1 minute ago, Nivraga said:

Some say Cunningham was just too stupid. Thats false too. Cunningham was/is flaky and an introvert. His parents died within a year of each other while he was at UNLV. I think his relationship with his brothers is good but I do know he became very close to his Eagles QB Coach Doug Scovil who died in 1989. If Randall gets a pass it's only because the team around him was crap and only saw success when he was on the field.

Randall deserves to be remembered fondly, although he'll always be slapped with the "what-if" label.  He was objectively an abject failure with all of the intellectual demands of the position.  That doesn't mean he's stupid, smart, or anything in between.  That's just how it went down on the field.

If Buddy Ryan cared even a little bit about offense, maybe the Eagles could have developed Cunningham instead of just telling him to make a play.

8 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

Randall was a complex case study in QB-ing.

Yes it was.  The receivers around him, both in Philly and in Minn, were absolutely fantastic but the line play and Buddy didn't help one bit.  In the end, I think he was just what he was.  A quirky but overall excellent QB who just fell short.

16 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

The biggest question for the Eagles has been the QB position for a while now.  That has now transitioned from QB to Howie's ability to draft and extend (or decline to extend) roster talent.

With all the players on this roster having career years, filling holes and sustaining talent, moving forward, will have to come exclusively via the draft and not from signing or trading (or both) proven studs.  Howie really has never been able to do that in the past.

Offense: Sanders, Seumalo

Defense: Bradberry, CJGJ, Epps, White, Edwards, Hargrave, Cox, Graham.

Only a couple of true studs on that list, but that's an absurd amount of starters with uncertain contract situations for 2023.  It would be a crippling mistake to turn the franchise into a pretzel trying to keep them all and keep them happy.  They are all going to want $$$ for their contributions to the 2022 success.  

This is exactly why I'd trade down if the Eagles get the option with a high pick from the Saints. This is also why it's dangerous to keep trading away 3rd and 4th round picks to move up. The Eagles are going to have to find guys in rounds 3-5 who can play. (but no 4th and 5th round picks this year.) Having Tariq Woolen going one pick before the Eagles were up last year hurts. 

21 minutes ago, EaglePhan1986 said:

He is definitely better than that. Maybe not a perennial pro bowler but I wouldn’t say he’s as inconsistent as you’re making him sound. 

Yeah, Sweat seems to be the most underrated Eagle in the Blog. His sack production comes in spurts (phrasing?), but he gets solid pressure and is very good against the run. 

Run defense from DEs rarely seems to get much credit in here. 

30 minutes ago, EaglesIreland said:

The eagles are on sky sports here in Ireland for the second week in a row. Ffs 

That's good, right?

From a personal vantage point, Randall Cunningham is the reason I'm an Eagles fan. Growing up watching him, I didn't care about winning and losing as much as I cared about excitement. I was 9-12 years at that time. Randall and that defense were the reasons to watch those late 80s, early 90s Eagles teams.  He put the Eagles on the map for so many fans.  I didn't care about the Whitney Houston stories nor did I ever hear about them until media became more prevalent across sports.  He's 100% a flawed player and I'm sure as an adult he would drive me crazy.

He was also the epitome of cool back in the day.  He was a celebrity.  I was watching Martin the other day and there's Randall playing himself on TV.  He was a guest on the Arsenio Hall Show.  Plus he had the flat top, the earing, the suits...you name it, Randall was it.  He was Cam Newton before Cam Newton was.  I hate the term swag but Randall had it and I understand why so many are drawn to Jalen Hurts because of it.  As a kid, you're drawn to what's cool.  It's a bit embarrassing that so many grown men today use it as a measuring stick but that's another conversation. 

Now that I'm grown, I can look back and see all of Randall's flaws and go over the what ifs.  What if he took the game more serious in Philly?  What if he had a great coaching staff?  What if he never tore his ACL or broke his leg?  What if he played in today's NFL?  

Always thankful for Randall Cunningham.  One of my favorite Eagles of all time and the reason I'm a fan today.  He's also opened the door for so many other quarterbacks after him so he's a huge part of NFL history and the evolution of the game.