June 12, 20242 yr 1 hour ago, Mike31mt said: Better than falling asleep on the job as POTUS. Literally everyone knows Biden isn't even in charge of his own mental faculties or bodily functions, let alone the office of POTUS. But yeah let's vote for him so he can usher in even more failure. All because Orange Man Bad Well...he is bad. He did, after all, encourage a bunch of goobers to assault the Capitol to overturn an election. His own cabinet members won't endorse him. And John Kelly, his own chief of staff called him out - on the record - for calling service men "suckers" for serving their country. So much phony posturing from you people. If you love the cult, just say you love the cult. At least it'd be honest.
June 12, 20242 yr 5 minutes ago, Lloyd said: Well...he is bad. He did, after all, encourage a bunch of goobers to assault the Capitol to overturn an election. His own cabinet members won't endorse him. And John Kelly, his own chief of staff called him out - on the record - for calling service men "suckers" for serving their country. So much phony posturing from you people. If you love the cult, just say you love the cult. At least it'd be honest. Pretty much every major GOP figure, who isn't a cultist, has spoken out against Trump and the danger he represents. Of course the cultists see it differently. They are cultists who can see the steal, and don't need things like evidence or proof.
June 12, 20242 yr 11 minutes ago, Lloyd said: Well...he is bad. He did, after all, encourage a bunch of goobers to assault the Capitol to overturn an election. His own cabinet members won't endorse him. And John Kelly, his own chief of staff called him out - on the record - for calling service men "suckers" for serving their country. So much phony posturing from you people. If you love the cult, just say you love the cult. At least it'd be honest. 11 minutes ago, Toastrel said: Pretty much every major GOP figure, who isn't a cultist, has spoken out against Trump and the danger he represents. Of course the cultists see it differently. They are cultists who can see the steal, and don't need things like evidence or proof. See they would say those people aren't Republicans because they committed the cardinal sin of criticizing Trump so they're RINOs or Dems or liberals or they have TDS, basically any insult to say they have a different set of beliefs so they can be discounted. And, okay, I guess if that's the criteria now for what's a Republican, then so be it. But those people are conservatives. All of them. They have a history of conservatism and a lot of them have worked in multiple Republican administrations so the question is, what ideology is Mike? Or Zucker? Or pretty much anyone on the right that easily discounts these people's opinions? It's not conservatism. Because everyone that's criticized Trump in the party is more conservative than he is. So if you're taking Trump's side in this fight, then what's your ideology? But they won't answer that question because they'd have to admit the truth.
June 12, 20242 yr 1 minute ago, VanHammersly said: See they would say those people aren't Republicans because they committed the cardinal sin of criticizing Trump so they're RINOs or Dems or liberals or they have TDS, basically any insult to say they have a different set of beliefs so they can be discounted. And, okay, I guess if that's the criteria now for what's a Republican, then so be it. But those people are conservatives. All of them. They have a history of conservatism and a lot of them have worked in multiple Republican administrations so the question is, what ideology is Mike? Or Zucker? Or pretty much anyone on the right that easily discounts these people's opinions? It's not conservatism. Because everyone that's criticized Trump in the party is more conservative than he is. So if you're taking Trump's side in this fight, then what's your ideology? But they won't answer that question because they'd have to admit the truth. Well, mike is a good Christian, so obviously, for him, it was a tough choice between two men of God. Easy to see why he picked Trump as the better Christian. They follow the same way.
June 12, 20242 yr There really isn't a conservative party in the US anymore, at least not one that believes in the principle of limited government. The Democratic Party has somewhat abandoned its core base of working class voters through support for things like illegal immigration (depresses wages) and woke ideology (doesn't really fly in the Midwest). They've basically traded union workers for college educated folks that want to lecture everyone on how evil America is. The Republican Party is a cult of personality built around one man, and the best description is it has become the party for the aggrieved, or at least those that seem themselves that way. Trump being a whiny little b and playing the victim works with them because they also view themselves as victims. Small government, traditional conservatives basically have no party anymore.
June 12, 20242 yr 2 minutes ago, vikas83 said: There really isn't a conservative party in the US anymore, at least not one that believes in the principle of limited government. The Democratic Party has somewhat abandoned its core base of working class voters through support for things like illegal immigration (depresses wages) and woke ideology (doesn't really fly in the Midwest). They've basically traded union workers for college educated folks that want to lecture everyone on how evil America is. The Republican Party is a cult of personality built around one man, and the best description is it has become the party for the aggrieved, or at least those that seem themselves that way. Trump being a whiny little b and playing the victim works with them because they also view themselves as victims. Small government, traditional conservatives basically have no party anymore. Honestly, it makes me think there's never been a particularly large group of small government conservatives in this country. The Conservatives have benefited massively over the last 60+ years of having the south in their back pocket, but Trump really exposed how paper thin that really was. He gave them a way to hold onto the grievances/race part of it all and abandon the small government side and they took it and ran. And it really shouldn't be the least bit surprising, since the south was so entrenched in the Dem Party before Civil Rights.
June 12, 20242 yr 1 minute ago, VanHammersly said: Honestly, it makes me think there's never been a particularly large group of small government conservatives in this country. The Conservatives have benefited massively over the last 60+ years of having the south in their back pocket, but Trump really exposed how paper thin that really was. He gave them a way to hold onto the grievances/race part of it all and abandon the small government side and they took it and ran. And it really shouldn't be the least bit surprising, since the south was so entrenched in the Dem Party before Civil Rights. Small/limited government conservatism was the heart of the GOP in the 1980s and even through Clinton's first term -- remember, welfare reform was something the GOP pushed through and got Clinton to sign. The change in 2000 was with the ascension of GWB and the Religious Right to a place of greater prominence in the party -- Reagan courted their votes but didn't govern much to their benefit (putting Sandra Day O'Connor on the court); Reagan wasn't a regular churchgoer. GWB sought expansion of the federal bureaucracy (No Child Left Behind, Homeland Security Department, etc.) -- his only real attempt to shrink government was his plan to privatize parts of social security, but that failed. But small government conservatism only existed when the GOP was the opposition party after 2000. Now -- it's completely been exiled from the GOP. The GOP is simply a cult of personality built on grievance politics.
June 12, 20242 yr The parities evolved. Will be interesting to see how the country evolves in a few decades from the changes in the parties
June 12, 20242 yr 52 minutes ago, vikas83 said: Small/limited government conservatism was the heart of the GOP in the 1980s and even through Clinton's first term -- remember, welfare reform was something the GOP pushed through and got Clinton to sign. The change in 2000 was with the ascension of GWB and the Religious Right to a place of greater prominence in the party -- Reagan courted their votes but didn't govern much to their benefit (putting Sandra Day O'Connor on the court); Reagan wasn't a regular churchgoer. GWB sought expansion of the federal bureaucracy (No Child Left Behind, Homeland Security Department, etc.) -- his only real attempt to shrink government was his plan to privatize parts of social security, but that failed. But small government conservatism only existed when the GOP was the opposition party after 2000. Now -- it's completely been exiled from the GOP. The GOP is simply a cult of personality built on grievance politics. You're right, but again, I wonder how thin it really was. It's been incredibly easy for them to abandon and the Republican Party doesn't really even look at ideology anymore when they decide who they want leading them. I also get that so much of this has been warped by the media landscape. Rush in the 90's and Fox News in the 90's/2000's just completely rewired the way the right thought about everything and then obviously social media on its heels turned it up to 11. Being fed a 24 hour IV drip about why liberals are evil sets up perfectly for someone like Trump to come in with zero conservative chops but as the loudest vessel to channel their rage.
June 12, 20242 yr 3 minutes ago, VanHammersly said: You're right, but again, I wonder how thin it really was. It's been incredibly easy for them to abandon and the Republican Party doesn't really even look at ideology anymore when they decide who they want leading them. I also get that so much of this has been warped by the media landscape. Rush in the 90's and Fox News in the 90's/2000's just completely rewired the way the right thought about everything and then obviously social media on its heels turned it up to 11. Being fed a 24 IV drip about why liberals are evil sets up perfectly for someone like Trump to come in with zero conservative chops but as the loudest vessel to channel their rage. Social media has done more to change and corrupt our politics than anything else. We are a society that can only handle headlines and 140 characters. Furthermore, we now have elected officials who are more interested in being Twitter stars than legislators. And it makes sense -- morons like MTG and AOC are massive fundraisers because they are social media stars. 20 years ago both of those clowns would have zero clout in their respective party. Now, they are both looked at as "leaders." And of course, Trump is the ultimate example of this.
June 12, 20242 yr 1 hour ago, vikas83 said: There really isn't a conservative party in the US anymore, at least not one that believes in the principle of limited government. The Democratic Party has somewhat abandoned its core base of working class voters through support for things like illegal immigration (depresses wages) and woke ideology (doesn't really fly in the Midwest). They've basically traded union workers for college educated folks that want to lecture everyone on how evil America is. The Republican Party is a cult of personality built around one man, and the best description is it has become the party for the aggrieved, or at least those that seem themselves that way. Trump being a whiny little b and playing the victim works with them because they also view themselves as victims. Small government, traditional conservatives basically have no party anymore. I think it's even worse in that he's creating a culture of victimhood on the right, not only drawing in failures who want to blame externalities for their situation but also encouraging people who might otherwise be successful to lean into the failure mindset. In unrelated news, the Republican party has lost every election since 2016. who knew? 🤷♂️
June 12, 20242 yr Yeah you guys are right, Trump is just so bad ...good thing we elected Biden so we didn't hand a country to terrorists, allow Russia and China to increase influence around the world, experience ridiculous inflation, allow illegal immigration to get out of control, have multiple wars going on at the same time.... thankfully none of that has happened. That would have been rough.
June 12, 20242 yr 1 hour ago, vikas83 said: There really isn't a conservative party in the US anymore, at least not one that believes in the principle of limited government. The Democratic Party has somewhat abandoned its core base of working class voters through support for things like illegal immigration (depresses wages) and woke ideology (doesn't really fly in the Midwest). They've basically traded union workers for college educated folks that want to lecture everyone on how evil America is. The Republican Party is a cult of personality built around one man, and the best description is it has become the party for the aggrieved, or at least those that seem themselves that way. Trump being a whiny little b and playing the victim works with them because they also view themselves as victims. Small government, traditional conservatives basically have no party anymore. Nobody with a brain has a party anymore. Both are ridiculous.
June 12, 20242 yr 2 minutes ago, Toastrel said: Nobody with a brain has a party anymore. Both are ridiculous. And yet social media has dialed the tribalism up to 11. It's just a recipe for disaster with a stupid population.
June 12, 20242 yr 12 minutes ago, Mike31mt said: Yeah you guys are right, Trump is just so bad ...good thing we elected Biden so we didn't hand a country to terrorists, allow Russia and China to increase influence around the world, experience ridiculous inflation, allow illegal immigration to get out of control, have multiple wars going on at the same time.... thankfully none of that has happened. That would have been rough. Am I supposed to ask you for your ideas on how Trump would solve this for you? Or is the grievance the whole point?
June 12, 20242 yr 1 minute ago, Lloyd said: Am I supposed to ask you for your ideas on how Trump would solve this for you? Or is the grievance the whole point? Trump's releasing his plans to fix all that in 2 weeks
June 12, 20242 yr 7 minutes ago, vikas83 said: And yet social media has dialed the tribalism up to 11. It's just a recipe for disaster with a stupid population. Yeah, the anti-knowledge crowd seems to be growing.
June 12, 20242 yr 1 minute ago, VanHammersly said: Trump's releasing his plans to fix all that in 2 weeks A big beautiful plan. You're gonna have so much friggin world peace you're not gonna know what to do with yourself. Because, you know, you got all this war going on out there. And it's ugly stuff. Bad stuff. Bullets these days. They're doing terrible things with bullets. They're big giant bullets. And these old army guys, big strong guys. They come to me with tears in their eyes and they say "Sir?" and I say "Yes?" and they say "Sir, you gotta do something about these wars." And I tell them, I got a plan. Now I can't tell you that plan right now because that's what our enemies want me to do. That's top secret.
June 12, 20242 yr 21 minutes ago, Mike31mt said: Yeah you guys are right, Trump is just so bad ...good thing we elected Biden so we didn't hand a country to terrorists, allow Russia and China to increase influence around the world, experience ridiculous inflation, allow illegal immigration to get out of control, have multiple wars going on at the same time.... thankfully none of that has happened. That would have been rough. NO! TRUMP IS THE SAVIOR WE WERE PROMISED. HE IS A GODLY MAN WHO WILL LEAD AMERICA TO RIGHTEOUSNESS. THAT TIME THERE WERE TWO SETS OF FOOTPRINTS, AND THEN JUST ONE? THAT IS WHEN TRUMP LIFTED JESUS UP AND CARRIED HIM. FOR AMERICA!
June 12, 20242 yr 1 hour ago, Lloyd said: A big beautiful plan. You're gonna have so much friggin world peace you're not gonna know what to do with yourself. Because, you know, you got all this war going on out there. And it's ugly stuff. Bad stuff. Bullets these days. They're doing terrible things with bullets. They're big giant bullets. And these old army guys, big strong guys. They come to me with tears in their eyes and they say "Sir?" and I say "Yes?" and they say "Sir, you gotta do something about these wars." And I tell them, I got a plan. Now I can't tell you that plan right now because that's what our enemies want me to do. That's top secret. In reality, his plan is to stop bishing about that stuff, and his pathetic lap dogs like Mike will pretend it’s gone, and then he'll do and say a bunch of stupid, awful sheet so the media stops bishing about them too. And then...viola! They're gone.
June 12, 20242 yr 29 minutes ago, Mike31mt said: allow Russia and China to increase influence around the world Slingblade: "When are we gonna stop sending pallets of cash to Ukraine? It's gotta be close to a trillion dollars by now and I heard he's got boots on the ground over there!" Also Slingblade: "That goddamn Joe Biden is letting Russia increase its influence around the world without doing anything about it!"
June 12, 20242 yr 2 hours ago, vikas83 said: Small/limited government conservatism was the heart of the GOP in the 1980s and even through Clinton's first term -- remember, welfare reform was something the GOP pushed through and got Clinton to sign. The change in 2000 was with the ascension of GWB and the Religious Right to a place of greater prominence in the party -- Reagan courted their votes but didn't govern much to their benefit (putting Sandra Day O'Connor on the court); Reagan wasn't a regular churchgoer. GWB sought expansion of the federal bureaucracy (No Child Left Behind, Homeland Security Department, etc.) -- his only real attempt to shrink government was his plan to privatize parts of social security, but that failed. But small government conservatism only existed when the GOP was the opposition party after 2000. Now -- it's completely been exiled from the GOP. The GOP is simply a cult of personality built on grievance politics. Reagan ramped up military spending and cut taxes resulting in huge deficits. He catered to social conservatives but was unsuccessful with policies like school prayer.
June 13, 20242 yr Quote "Haul Out The Guillotine!” The title of Trump's latest fundraising email. Nothing to see here.
June 13, 20242 yr 17 hours ago, Lloyd said: Am I supposed to ask you for your ideas on how Trump would solve this for you? Or is the grievance the whole point? His plan to solve those items is included in his healthcare plan.
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