2 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

Lurie is going to meet with some/all of the players to read locker room.

But you know who might be most important in all of this?  Jeff Stoutland.

He has survived 3 regimes, so there is almost certainly a direct line of communication and trust between him and Howie/Lurie.  He has seen these coaches fly high and crash and burn.  He's worked with the veteran OC's that took them to the top and seen how things have (or have not) changed with the young green guys.  

He should have a VERY interesting perspective on how good or bad this coaching staff is.

I would say the most important players are probably Jalen hurts because you tied yourself to him going forward at quarterback. So his thoughts and input matters. I’d also say Jason Kelce because he’s been with the organization so long and he loves this organization. He will give an honest assessment and likely not hold back. Im guessing his voice along with graham, Cox and lane hold more weight. 

2 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Good chance harbaugh goes to the chargers where he likely can have more personnel control then he would here and has herbert. He won’t get that type of control here. Add on possibly same on NE and Washington where he’d likely have more control and could use their picks to get the Qb he wants and not hamstrung by a Fo run by howie and a good Qb bit on a massive deal going forward. Same for Johnson but less so on personnel but he might want to handpick his own quarterback on a rookie contract rather than jumping into an organization where he’s has a good quarterback, but on a big time contract, which kind of hampers you going forward.

this theory that the Eagles would just automatically get Jim Harbaugh, or Ben Johnson is a theory. You might not get either of them. That realm also exists. 

It Sirianni sucks and the players don't believe in him, it doesn't matter whether they get the top guys or not. Can't bring a coach back who the top players don't believe in, if that's the case, or if Lurie and Howie don't believe in him. That would make 2024 a total disaster in waiting. They wouldn't be firing Sirianni because Harbaugh and Ben Johnson are available. They'd be firing him because they don't think he's worth keeping and hoping they could get the two hottest names. And if they don't, they don't. You find another coach.

3 hours ago, Alphagrand said:

move toward a more aggressive defensive approach to get some more turnovers.  The tough part is they don't really have the athletes for this.   

I dunno.   How about a 3 man DL of Carter Davis Graham and 2 LBs blitzing all the time,  pass rushing and run defending,  from Reddick, Nolan Smith, Ben VanSumeren.  The ILBs,  instead of pass coverage,  would be doing pass rushing.   Reddick and Nolan Smith,  instead of pass rushing and run defense from the edge, would be doing pass rushing and run defense from the ILB spot. You have 5 rushers,  maybe you're getting pressure on the QB quicker, you're getting more sacks. Could go zero blitz,  put Reddick on the DL of 4,  with Nolan Smith and VanSumeren behind.   I think the athletes are there.  Maybe the experience might not be where you want it.

11 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

It Sirianni sucks and the players don't believe in him, it doesn't matter whether they get the top guys or not. Can't bring a coach back who the top players don't believe in, if that's the case, or if Lurie and Howie don't believe in him. That would make 2024 a total disaster in waiting. They wouldn't be firing Sirianni because Harbaugh and Ben Johnson are available. They'd be firing him because they don't think he's worth keeping and hoping they could get the two hottest names. And if they don't, they don't. You find another coach.

And who says it’s definitive that the players don’t believe in sirianni? What if when Jeffrey Lurie and Howie have meetings with the players they still believe in Sirianni’s but they don’t believe in Brian Johnson and their defensive coordinator? Then what. You have a theory that the players don’t believe in him based off frustration of players. There’s a difference between frustration and completely not believing in him. This is like some of the same logic people used for Matt Patricia be coming to DC. It was well players didn’t believe/have confidence in desai so we might as well just go to somebody new because hopefully they’ll be better. it didn’t work. There’s part of your theory where it blows up in your face and it is worse. You unfortunately don’t want to believe that is a possibility.

again the only two coaches you can mention are Ben Johnson and Jim Harbaugh. So what happens if you don’t get either one of them and you get a worse coach? Cause the eagles were dangerously close to hiring mcadoo and mcdaniels before Doug and sirianni 

I don’t think Sirianni gets fired. The OC and supporting coaching staff will be first to go. But 2024, he is squarely on the hot seat. He signed a 5 year contract that runs through the 2025 season. They certainly aren’t extending him if he doesn’t fix this next year and I doubt he enters 2025 as a lame duck. 2024 he will be coaching for his job. 

I think the defense would actually be better off letting teams score faster.  The offense had 6 true possessions last week.  They aren't even getting a chance to leave their fingerprints on the game.  We all have complaints about the Eagles offense, but they are good at controlling the clock with long drives and are good on 3rd down.  Get the ball in their hands even if it takes 7 points to do it.  At least the pass rush will be rested for the next time they are on the field.

I'm not advocating to "let them score."  Just stop fearing the big play so much.  They are scoring anyway.  Every play doesn't need to be a jail break blitz with 9 rushers.  But the worst that could happen is 11 straight possessions with a TD, not a 90 yard TD.  So stop playing so scared.

2 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

And who says it’s definitive that the players don’t believe in sirianni? What if when Jeffrey Lurie and Howie have meetings with the players they still believe in Sirianni’s but they don’t believe in Brian Johnson and their defensive coordinator? Then what. You have a theory that the players don’t believe in them based off frustration if players. There’s a difference between frustration and completely believing in him.

again the only two coaches you can mention are Ben Johnson and Jim Harbaugh. So what happens if you don’t get either one of them and you get a worse coach? Cause the eagles were dangerously close to hiring mcadoo and mcdaniels before Doug and sirianni 

I didn't say it's definitive, I said "if that's the case"

If they believe Sirianni is a great coach, then they should keep him, but I think it would prove to be a major mistake.

If you fire Sirianni and don't get Ben Johnson or Harbaugh and hire a worse coach, then tough luck. Those are the breaks. Can't guarantee anything in sports.

Just now, LeanMeanGM said:

I don’t think Sirianni gets fired. The OC and supporting coaching staff will be first to go. But 2024, he is squarely on the hot seat. He signed a 5 year contract that runs through the 2025 season. They certainly aren’t extending him if he doesn’t fix this next year and I doubt he enters 2025 as a lame duck. 2024 he will be coaching for his job. 

Im good with that. 

I agree with whoever said yesterday- an excellent offensive head coach who can stay the course with changing OCs would be ideal. Then you dont have to worry about coordinators on one side of the ball.

But I like Siri and I think the bigger issue is not him, but both of his coordinators suck. 

If they cant get better after replacing both coordinators though, then theres not much else to do than start completely over with a new HC. 

1 hour ago, The Blackfish said:

 It’s about what fans believe what Lurie will do, wasn’t Kotite’s collapse his first season as owner?  Not comparing Nick to Kotite but Lurie won’t forget that disaster, plus only 3 teams since 1960 started 10-1, and lost 4 of 5, Eagles, 2020 Steelers, 1986 Jets, of course Kotite was their OC.   
 Also does Kelce retiring play a roll in Lurie’s decision, with Cox and Graham possibly leaving as well, that will leave a big hole leadership wise.  None of it matters if they beat the Giants and win a wild card game, but if they lose the next two games, Lurie would have a tough decision to make.   

Call me cold, but no player over 30 should matter at all.  They're not part of the Eagles' future, and that includes Kelce.  

The way the roster is currently built the nucleus is Hurts, Brown, Smith, Goedert (who turns 29 tomorrow), Mailata, Dickerson on offense and Davis, Carter, Reddick, Sweat on defense.  That's your nucleus starting next season.  Notice no LBs or DBs currently part of your nucleus going forward. 

 

They should sign him and keep him on the PS every week to give Penny a buddy.

7 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

 

If you fire Sirianni and don't get Ben Johnson or Harbaugh and hire a worse coach, then tough luck. Those are the breaks. Can't guarantee anything in sports.

Lol. This is a BS answer. I can say that about any down spot in eagles history or any professional team. Like we should fire Andy Reid after he lost the Super Bowl in 2004 and dumpster fire of 2005 where are the locker room was completely split with Terrell Owens, McNabb and even how the front office and reid handled it. You don’t think that locker room had some massive issues with Andy Reid (coming off a SB time management fiasco) and fractures?

I guess we should trade Jalen hurts on a year where he regressed and had a turnover problem and if we get a worse Qb that’s just tough luck cause nothing is guaranteed in sports. Lol

37 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

For anyone who cares about my self-reflective rambling...

I only miss games due to understandably extenuating circumstances.  I don't shut them off or "boycott" when they are bad.  I had season tickets for about 10 years...boo'd once in 10 years of home games.  I don't think it's generally appropriate to boo.  I'm nit-picky and negative on a message board with you guys, but it is just my nature and my job to obsess over deviations from perfection.  

So I'm going to label myself as a decent fan.  BUT...I am a very binary fan.  I'll talk personnel on here for hours on end, watch the games, and be a fan even if they are 0-17.  But I can't have my heart and emotions in a game...or a season...if I do not feel that they are either realistic SB competitors or on the exciting upslope of a new generation of great Eagles football.  It's an emotional circuit that I just lack.  Other people can enjoy a competitive game or season even if they fall short of my two aforementioned criteria.  But I just can't.  I watch, I analyze, I hope for better.  But it's dull, emotionless, and I ultimately don't care.  To be fair, there are only 3-5 teams in the NFL that are realistic SB contenders and 3-5 that are on that exciting upslope.  So yea, I'd be "out" on 20+ teams every year.  But that's how I'm wired and it's also where I'm at with this Eagles team.

 

Often a disorganized attachment style to a team is caused by childhood trauma.  

10 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

I don’t think Sirianni gets fired. The OC and supporting coaching staff will be first to go. But 2024, he is squarely on the hot seat. He signed a 5 year contract that runs through the 2025 season. They certainly aren’t extending him if he doesn’t fix this next year and I doubt he enters 2025 as a lame duck. 2024 he will be coaching for his job. 

Absent something crazy happening (turning it around and reaching the Super Bowl), I agree that Nick is safe but the coordinators are not. Obviously we will have a new DC. I would hope they make a change at OC as well, but I could see them trying to bring in a veteran presence to work with BJ while he keeps the OC title. That would be a useless half measure, but I feel it may happen.

Just now, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Lol. This is a BS answer. I can say that about any down spot in eagles history or any professional team. Like we should fire Andy Reid after he lost the Super Bowl in 2004 and dumpster fire of 2005 where are the locker room was completely split with Terrell Owens, McNabb and even how the front office and reid handled it.

I guess we should trade Jalen hurts on a year where he regressed and had a turnover problem and if we get a worse Qb that’s just tough luck cause nothing is guaranteed in sports. Lol

It's not a BS answer. If they decide they don't think he's the right coach for the future of the team, then they have to fire him. There's always a risk of letting anyone go in sports, whether it's a coach, GM, or player that their replacement will be worse. You have to trust your process, evaluations, and decision-making though.

Unless you're arguing that they should keep Nick Sirianni because the replacement might be worse, I'm not sure what you're trying to argue here. You can say that after any coach is fired for any team in NFL history. And if you're not trying to argue that then you're just playing devil's advocate at this point.

1 minute ago, vikas83 said:

Absent something crazy happening (turning it around and reaching the Super Bowl), I agree that Nick is safe. Obviously we will have a new DC. I would hope they make a change at OC as well, but I could see them trying to bring in a veteran presence to work with BJ while he keeps the OC title. That would be a useless half measure, but I feel it may happen.

It will be someone super uninspiring like Pat Shurmur too

3 hours ago, Outlaw said:

Out of Lane, Cox, Graham, and Kelce I think Lane is the most likely to be back.

He's definitely going to be back, he just signed an extension through 2026. I don't get why people are hellbent on pushing Lane out or why they think the front office will. They just showed everyone how they feel about Lane with that extension. 

If anything, you can draft a RT that can slide in at RG next year. But still, by the time Lane's deal expires, the RG won't have many years left on his rookie deal. I'm only lukewarm on the idea of drafting this style of player in round 1 due to the woefulness of our abysmal defense, which needs a ton. 

However; tackles Mims, Latham and Fuaga are the players I really like for this idea. You will probably need to trade up for one, but I feel as though they possess the quality traits to excel at G and T when/if necessary. 

15 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

I don’t think Sirianni gets fired. The OC and supporting coaching staff will be first to go. But 2024, he is squarely on the hot seat. He signed a 5 year contract that runs through the 2025 season. They certainly aren’t extending him if he doesn’t fix this next year and I doubt he enters 2025 as a lame duck. 2024 he will be coaching for his job. 

This is frankly what I think is going to happen. His coaching career in Philadelphia is going to rely on 2024. They fire him or not, I think they’re in for another regression in 2024 anyways. Their first wildcard playoff game they are going to have 21 or 22 stars. That’s two consecutive years. It’s been like that. At some point in time you’re not gonna be that healthy.  I also don’t think you’re gonna be able to fix everything in one off-season. I think the defense has more issues than people are willing to admit. You need an entirely new linebacker unit. I don’t think your safeties are good enough. You’re stuck in 2 cornerback contracts that have aging older players. And you need depth a long the defensive line.

I am want curious as to who Siriani is going to recommend as is OC and Dc. I think at defensive coordinator you can’t go with a young guy. You have to get a veteran coach back in Ronda defense. They need a Schwartz. On offense I think you can go younger coach but also have an associate head coach like a frank reich type that can help guide Siriani and his OC.

Baldy on PHLY basically called Jordan Davis unplayable right now. Said he's overweight and can't move and essentially by playing him are a man short in their DT rotation.

😬

3 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

It's not a BS answer. If they decide they don't think he's the right coach for the future of the team, then they have to fire him. There's always a risk of letting anyone go in sports, whether it's a coach, GM, or player that their replacement will be worse. You have to trust your process, evaluations, and decision-making though.

Unless you're arguing that they should keep Nick Sirianni because the replacement might be worse, I'm not sure what you're trying to argue here. You can say that after any coach is fired for any team in NFL history. And if you're not trying to argue that then you're just playing devil's advocate at this point.

No, it is a BS response. I can use your logic on almost any move I want to make it. If it doesn’t work out it’s tough luck. That is a BS response. 

10 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

Call me cold, but no player over 30 should matter at all.  They're not part of the Eagles' future, and that includes Kelce.  

The way the roster is currently built the nucleus is Hurts, Brown, Smith, Goedert (who turns 29 tomorrow), Mailata, Dickerson on offense and Davis, Carter, Reddick, Sweat on defense.  That's your nucleus starting next season.  Notice no LBs or DBs currently part of your nucleus going forward. 

I noticed, but I also just noticed/forgot about, Goedert’s age.  

Just now, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

No, it is a BS response. I can use your logic on almost any move I want to make it. If it doesn’t work out it’s tough luck. That is a BS response. 

You asked what happens if they fire Sirianni and his replacement is worse. It was a loaded question. I gave you the reality of what happens. What happens is nothing. That's the risk of hiring coaches, there's nothing you can do about that. You get some right and you get some wrong. I don't know how you expected me to answer that question. If they decide they don't want to keep Sirianni, what are they supposed to do... keep him anyway because they're afraid they'll hire a worse coach? If that's their mentality and they aren't confident they can hire a good coach, then they should never be in charge of the hiring process ever again.

13 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

Call me cold, but no player over 30 should matter at all.  They're not part of the Eagles' future, and that includes Kelce.  

The way the roster is currently built the nucleus is Hurts, Brown, Smith, Goedert (who turns 29 tomorrow), Mailata, Dickerson on offense and Davis, Carter, Reddick, Sweat on defense.  That's your nucleus starting next season.  Notice no LBs or DBs currently part of your nucleus going forward. 

Can make that argument and it’s not wrong but that’s not who Jeffrey Lurie he is. He is going to rely on the guys that have seen and been through wars with the Eagles. That’s who hes shown to be. He trusts guys he’s been surrounded with for a while. No offense to AJ Brown I don’t think Jeffrey lurie is going to rely on him over kelce, lane, graham and fox  

 

As far as the roster for next year, here is where I am at:

QB -- Let Mariota walk and have McKee and a cheap vet battle for the backup spot. Tyrod Taylor makes sense to me. 

RB -- Unless he is cheap, let Swift walk and go bargain shopping again. Gainwell is under contract, and Scott would be cheap. If Swift takes a 2 year, ~$8mm deal, then OK. Otherwise, spend cap dollars elsewhere. 

WR -- Extend Smith. Draft a #3 WR prospect. I wouldn't HATE Zaccheus on the cheap. Assume Julio retires.

TE -- Draft/sign a competent backup for when Goedert misses games.

OL -- Kelce is likely gone, so Jurgens moves to center and Steen is the RG. I don't see Lane walking away, but look for his replacement in the draft. Bring Opeta back if he is cheap enough. Extend Dickerson.

DE -- Either first round pick or splash FA signing (or both). Short extensions for Reddick and Sweat maybe. Graham is likely gone (if he wants to come back for peanuts to get his 15th year he has talked about...OK). Biggest need on team.

DT -- Let Williams play out his contract. If the number is low enough...bring back Fletch. He is still playing well. Give Ojomo more of a chance.

LB -- FA splash signing, along with real competition for Dean at the other spot. At close to the vet minimum, I'd consider Cunningham.

CB -- Bradberry post June 1 cut. Slay is back (contract), let the kids fight for CB 2. Draft

S - Reed and a FA

EDIT: Yup, totally forgot about Sydney Brown

I can see Lurie keeping Siri one more year if they make changes at coordinators, but I really hope Lurie is looking closely at what's happening.  The stupid decisions, bad situational football, bad/predictable play design and calls and the comments from players that are pointing toward coaching should be red flags about Siri.  He made the change at DC and they still suck.  He claims it's his offense and takes responsibility for the play design, so it all has to be on him. 

He doesn't have a good scheme or play design ability.  Steichen brought that.  He's a leader and motivator and good with players but he needs good coordinators...and if they're good they get hired elsewhere.  But even then you have to wonder, what's he doing to fix this mess?  Not changes to scheme on either side.  Not changes to running the ball more or using more short passes and slants.  Still calling QB designed runs and bubble screens on long yardage downs.  Still letting them force downfield into coverage, the list goes on.

They'll likely fire both coordinators, or keep BJ but bring in a "Senior Offensive Assistant" to help but this all would need to be a short leash for Siri as well.

I agree that whenever they hire their next head coach (sooner or later) they need someone who will run things no matter which coordinators get hired elsewhere.