1 minute ago, judunno said:

You're sitting here comparing CMC to Shipley lol. Did that change somewhere along the conversation?

Im not comparing what you think I am comparing. Nothing has changed. 

1 minute ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

I’m not investing the 3rd overall pick in a qb i don’t absolutely love. I can draft and develop a solid Qb in round 2-7. I can’t take that risk at 3 if I’m not head over heels about that Qb when i could potentially get either MHJ (generational talent) or boatload of firsts that sets me up for a better roster in the future or be in placed in a better position to acquire a QB i do love. I am not taking a quarterback in the top three unless I absolutely love them. This would be just taking a quarterback just to take a quarterback, cause we need a quarterback.

Marvin Harrison Jr. is not a generational talent.  Even if he puts up Justin Jefferson production, how many playoff games has JJ helped the Vikings win?  WR is not nearly as important as a franchise QB -- not even in the same stratosphere.  

Do you think the Texans absolutely loved CJ Stroud?  I think they were in position to draft a franchise QB, and were happier than pigs in sh!t when CAR took a terrible QB prospect in front of hem.

2 minutes ago, Joe Ball said:

and that is worth more than they received in the trade...

Agreed.

Watch Seattle sign Baker and Dodson and get much better LB play than us. 

32 minutes ago, austinfan said:

I would suspect the coaches dictated the FA moves, this is where coach input is vital, they've seen these guys play, they know their schemes, and what they want.

The draft is more scouts, Stoutland gives input b/c he directly coaches players, but I'd suspect the coordinators have less influence (too little time, too many players).

That would explain replacing Sweat with Huff, Swift with Barkley (Moore probably looked at teams heavily blitzing Hurts), etc.

I think there are more moves, they need a slot WR, more depth at ILB and S and RB, etc.

Driscoll and Opeta are still out there, probably bring one back.

TE2 is a big hole unless they think Calcaterra or Albert O can step up, but neither is a blocker.

But most of these roles are filled with low cost veterans, SFAs and draft picks.

 

The Eagles do a very good job scouting pros.  I don't think they are relying on coaches to make decisions on FA.  I don't believe signing Huff had anything to do with Fangio.  I think they liked the player (likely better than any draft options) and new that they needed depth at the position.  They also knew they are likely moving on from either Sweat or Reddick.  While they may have consulted Fangio, he wasn't making that decision.  I am sure Braun wasn't someone that was on Fangio's radar.  He is a player that Howie targeted based on pro-scouts.  

I think Devin White may have been vetted by Fangio.  Again, it doesn't look like he's Fangio's guy (i.e. he's never played for or been coached by him) but Fangio may have pushed for him over other possible FAs.  

I don't think there's much on the FA market that they should target prior to the draft.  It's also possible they trade Sweat for a player but it's not like they need another starter on defense.  My hope is they hold off until after the draft and then see what they need.  

5 minutes ago, Joe Ball said:

I thought the same thing yesterday...then I went at looked at the final '23 QB rankings...granted he didn't have a lot of protection, but he is not the future for them...especially with new ownership and coaching staff.

Yeah he had some real bad games towards the end of the season, but that whole team had given up already so not as easy to judge how much thay played a factor. I could see if they got a 3rd rd pick for him straight up, but they had to give up a 4th along with Howell to do it. Seems like a bad return for someone they could've just kept to compete with Mariota who we all know is garbage.

The Eagles needed a high floor LB who is just dependable and won't cost you games. It seems like the Eagles went for the higher ceiling choice, even if his floor is basically below sea level. It does feel like more of a Howie move than Fangio, but who knows.

6 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

I’d point out, the 2 cheap years of Herbert’s extension are 2023 and 2024. Jumps from 19.3 to 37.3 in 2024 to 2025. That said can’t happen as it’s $89 mil cap hit in 2024 to trade him unless it’s post June 1st which then actually clears cap. Just interesting hypothetical 

Very much so.  If the Chargers are going to have a level of cap hell better to do it now than be stuck in Harbaugh's 3rd year and potentially having other contracts to give out. Would be harsh on Herbert, but there is strong logic there for why

1 minute ago, we_gotta_believe said:

Yeah he had some real bad games towards the end of the season, but that whole team had given up already so not as easy to judge how much thay played a factor. I could see if they got a 3rd rd pick for him straight up, but they had to give up a 4th along with Howell to do it. Seems like a bad return for someone they could've just kept to compete with Mariota who we all know is garbage.

The thing I respect and enjoyed watching with him is he was a fighter...good or bad, he was going to give everything he had, maybe in a better situation (better o-line, more weapons/targets) he is a much better qb.

 

38 minutes ago, austinfan said:

Think the approach to ILB is White, Dean and VanSumeren provide upside, then they'll bring in a veteran as an insurance policy and draft a LB. And look at Baun at ILB in camp.

They're definitely faster and more athletic, whether that translates to production remains to be seen. But after Cunningham and Leonard, at least they can run.

Problem at WR is with Brown and Smith and Goedert hogging the throws, and Barkley likely to get a major role in the passing offense, what talented WR would want to sign here to be #3? This might be where you draft slot WRs in the middle rounds and bring in UDFAs (a lot of top slot WRs have been UDFAs or late round picks, average RAS but good hands and routes and short area quickness).

Brown getting hurt complicated safety, what can you expect from him this season?

 

 

Good point about speed at LB.  The instant reaction I had to White signing was  that at least he has sideline to sideline speed.  For a poor tackler, he racks up a lot of tackles. 

22 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

Marvin Harrison Jr. is not a generational talent.  Even if he puts up Justin Jefferson production, how many playoff games has JJ helped the Vikings win?  WR is not nearly as important as a franchise QB -- not even in the same stratosphere.  

Do you think the Texans absolutely loved CJ Stroud?  I think they were in position to draft a franchise QB, and were happier than pigs in sh!t when CAR took a terrible QB prospect in front of hem.

I’ll disagree with you on MHJ. 

Again, if you don’t love a quarterback in the top 3 you shouldn’t just take a Qb. Yes I really do think houston loved CJ Stroud. Do I think they love Bryce Young too? Yeah i think they wouldve been happy with young too. I think they loved either one enough to take them at 2. And it also filled a need. I also believe if they didn’t love CJ Stroud, they wouldn’t have taken him and went with Anderson at 2 and not made a deal to move up with the cardinals to get Anderson as well. I don’t think the Texans went into that draft like hey we need a quarterback, so we just have to draft a quarterback even if we don’t love the quarterback. No offense i don’t see teams investing a top three pick into a player they do not absolutely love the upside and potential. If you are lukewarm on a prospect in the top three then you should not draft them. You should never draft a player in the top three that you do not love or lukewarm about. You might be wrong in your evaluation. Probably would be with Maye this year. But I am not picking a quarterback in the top three just because I have a need and there’s 80% chance of a bust of the first round quarterback anyways.

also not just about Qb or MHJ it’s about value at 3. If you don’t love Maye and your evaluation says he’s not a franchise Qb why wouldn’t you take a potential Vikings offer of 11, 23 and 2025 first and probablt more 

1 hour ago, Sack that QB said:

The Vikings will end up with JJ McCarthy. And they’ll regret it. He’s not worth trading up multiple firsts for.

If he’s as good as I think, he’ll be worth it. As I’ve said before, he can make all the throws, he’s mobile, and he had great college coaching. The system he was in did not showcase him but he was clutch when he needed to be.

1 minute ago, Sack that QB said:

The Eagles needed a high floor LB who is just dependable and won't cost you games. It seems like the Eagles went for the higher ceiling choice, even if his floor is basically below sea level. It does feel like more of a Howie move than Fangio, but who knows.

I don't think there was much available at the position in free agency, tbh.  I'd have been happy with Kenneth Murray in the $4.5M range, but he signed for $8M per season.  I never liked Patrick Queen much, even at LSU.  He was thought to be getting shipped out of BAL before Roquan Smith got there and propped him up.

What the Eagles need to do is invest a solid draft pick at the position, either #50 or 53.  I believe Cooper will be gone before then (last first, early 2nd before 40 at the latest IMO).  Then it becomes a question if there is another off-ball LB worthy of a pick in that range.  Maybe a small trade back.  

30 minutes ago, Aerolithe_Lion said:

Who would they be trading for, assuming Daniels/Williams/Maye are gone?

I dont think McCarthy is top 5 caliber, so I guess Penix? 

Penix doesn't compare to those four and yes JJ is as good. 

1 minute ago, Alphagrand said:

I don't think there was much available at the position in free agency, tbh.  I'd have been happy with Kenneth Murray in the $4.5M range, but he signed for $8M per season.  I never liked Patrick Queen much, even at LSU.  He was thought to be getting shipped out of BAL before Roquan Smith got there and propped him up.

What the Eagles need to do is invest a solid draft pick at the position, either #50 or 53.  I believe Cooper will be gone before then (last first, early 2nd before 40 at the latest IMO).  Then it becomes a question if there is another off-ball LB worthy of a pick in that range.  Maybe a small trade back.  

I don't think there was either, but I could still name about 5 guys I'd rather have had than White, and those are guys I'm not even super high on, I'm just very down on White. I don't think he's good. And in 2023 I think he was a net negative at the position, which is something the Eagles can absolutely not afford right now. They just need dependability there, and that is one thing White was not in 2023. Given how dire the position is, I don't think they're in the position to be gambling at the position. Because if White doesn't work out and he plays like he did in 2023, they're really SOL. If they signed a more higher floor, lower ceiling guy, they may not wow you, but I think at the very least they'd have been fully playable. The downside for White is he isn't playable. Incredibly risky to sign a guy with that kind of downside.

23 minutes ago, Joe Ball said:

I agree with everything you stated except I think Jerry doesn't want to extend Dak this year, investigation or not...I think he wants to see Dak produce in the post-season before commiting again. Here's the problem, DAL can't really help Dak do that by not filling roster holes created by cap issues, they just don't have room without extending him. DAL is in a situation where they will likely end up with a few down years whether they pay Dak or not (unless they by some miracle end up with a cost-effective, low cap QB as his replacement), they can't create/retain a top line supporting cast for him with the cap constraints. If they pay/extend him they still can't keep other top level talent because Dak wants too much.

They are really in a no win situation that they created for themselves.

I say blow it up...trade Parsons while he is in his prime before he becomes the highest (top 3-5 minimum) paid defensive player...get a few picks (two 1st, two 2nd...idk pick something that is a win-win), same with CDL, he's going to command top 3 receiver $...let Dak finish this year, take the hit in '25...start over. F it.

It's a great time to be a Cowboy fan...next year 🤣!

The COULD have opened up cap space without extending Dak. Convert his salary to a signing bonus and you have ~18mm. Extend Ceedee and get his 5th year option cap number down - probably another 10mm. Right there is almost $30mm that could have been used to support the team this year without extending Dak. So why didn't they do it? Because...JERRY JONES IS CHEAP AND KNOWS HE DOESN'T HAVE TO. Jerry wants to be the biggest brand and talked about, and he really couldn't care less about winning. So Dallas is always bottom third in cash spending per year. Jerry doesn't want to write a check to Dak and Ceedee right now, and he doesn't have to because they'll stay the biggest brand in sports regardless.

Watching national media idiots (wee Wright, Nick) constantly fall for the lie that Jerry is willing to do anything to win a Super Bowl is comical.  

4 minutes ago, just relax said:

If he’s as good as I think, he’ll be worth it. As I’ve said before, he can make all the throws, he’s mobile, and he had great college coaching. The system he was in did not showcase him but he was clutch when he needed to be.

I don't watch much college football, but I really like his game tape.  Puts zip on the ball, very mobile without constantly tucking it and running, and seems quite accurate and a good decision maker.

The Vikings haven't drafted a good QB since Culpepper in 1999 -- and it's hard to grade him while he was throwing to Moss and Carter, and handing the ball to Robert Smith.  If they can move up into the top 5, they have to pull the trigger.  

8 minutes ago, UK Eagle said:

Very much so.  If the Chargers are going to have a level of cap hell better to do it now than be stuck in Harbaugh's 3rd year and potentially having other contracts to give out. Would be harsh on Herbert, but there is strong logic there for why

Idk how they’d clear the space to do it tbh. They dealt Allen, Williams was released, restructured bosa and Mack yet only have $15 mil of cap space. So even if they wanted to do it they have no chance unless a team like Minnesota obliged to waiting til June 1st to have the trade go through 

10 minutes ago, just relax said:

If he’s as good as I think, he’ll be worth it. As I’ve said before, he can make all the throws, he’s mobile, and he had great college coaching. The system he was in did not showcase him but he was clutch when he needed to be.

I really like McCarthy’s ball placement.  

18 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

Watch Seattle sign Baker and Dodson and get much better LB play than us. 

What does the Eagles remaining cap look like? We should be all over Baker, Simmons or Blackmon if affordable.

Lets look at this video.

1st play, tell me that doesnt look like McCaffrey surprisingly powerful running through contact right up the middle.

39 seconds. Bursts through the middle. Hurdles a tackler, and runs through contact as 2 other tacklers sandwich him but fail to bring him down.

1:02 up the middle, takes 2 guys to drag him down as he keeps his feet churning.

1:09 through a tackle attempt in to the end zone.

1:30 just bulldozing his way in to the end zone up the middle

2:07 3 broken tackles, and drags a 4th in to the end zone

 

I stopped there because I ended up just enjoying the brilliance on display and forgetting to mark things.

@judunno

 

@just relax are there enough nice pieces of up the middle running here for you to see the potential there too?

 

This guy is really, really good.

This video shows some really nice examples of his elusiveness (as does the other video.)

 

 

Take a look at their college stats

Shipley

McCaffrey

 

McCaffrey has an edge on yards per play. As well as 120 more total touches.

Shipley actually scored 10 more rushing TDs, and move overall TDs.

By the way, they both returned kicks and both had over 26 yards per kick return.

 

Extremely, extremely similar skillsets. Similar sizes coming out. Similar running styles. Both excellent pass catchers....

You know why McCaffrey got a lot of buzz and Shipley didnt? Clemson stunk most of Shipley's time there, and Stanford was excellent during McCaffrey's time. More exposure for him. 

McCaffrey has become an absolute beast in the NFL. Shipley already shows all the traits to do the same thing.

43 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Just purely a hypothetical, but what if the chargers and Harbaugh want to draft McCarthy at five (frankly think the chargers would be dumb to do this trade). the Vikings are acquiring first round picks to trade for Justin Herbert, so that McCarthy could be drafted at five by Harbaugh who loves him and thinks highly of him. He is on a rookie contract, and the Minnesota Vikings get Herbert, who is ready to win now with playmakers on that offense. If i remotely even thought about trading Herbert it’d start with at least 3 first and I’d probably want more. 

That's a very interesting idea, and worth a phone call if I'm the Vikings.  Harbaugh is EXTREMELY stupid; he's the guy who benched Alex Smith for Colin Kaepernick.  Also, the Chargers just restructured a 33-year old edge rusher and a poorly performing edge on the opposite side. 

2 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

That's a very interesting idea, and worth a phone call if I'm the Vikings.  Harbaugh is EXTREMELY stupid; he's the guy who benched Alex Smith for Colin Kaepernick.  Also, the Chargers just restructured a 33-year old edge rusher and a poorly performing edge on the opposite side. 

The only issue with it is that there’s a $89 million cap hit in 2024 to deal Herbert. Unless the chargers can convince Minnesota to sit until June 1 to make that trade happen (then it becomes the chargers getting $6 million in cap space and just a lot of dead money). The problem is they did all those things you mentioned and yet still only have $15 million in cap space. So in theory I’d try it but it’s unrealistic due to Herbert’s contract 

14 minutes ago, HazletonEagle said:

What was your opinion of Barkley's blocking?

In those clips, he was in the way just enough imo. But the tape didnt match the rave review he got in the video. It was sloppy. And he looked lucky the QB got the ball off in time. Blankenship dominated him with a straight arm move. Another one he went stumbling about 10 yards up field. I think there was 1 clean win in the whole video. The effective cut block. Otherwise, bad hand placement. Poor balance. Looked pretty bad honestly. 

I thought he was fine.   I also don't consider that video to be a comprehensive look at his blocking, so I won't make a definitive statement one way or the other.

I will say this.  He had 3 important elements in that video. 
1 - Knew his assignment.
2 - Was in the right place.
3 - Was willing.

Those 3 are the most important, IMO.   No RB will win every rep, but if they are in the right place, and are willing, they will buy some time for the QB... and usually in blitz pickup, that's about all they need to do.  They don't need to provide a stone wall block every time.