33 minutes ago, Ace Nova said:

Watching the All-22, Derek Barnett absolutely exploded off the line on that 4th down stop at the 2 yardline.  Blew by Metcalf and shed the Guard...was not "pancaked" on that play @HazletonEagle

Barnett played exceptionally well. 

metcalf didnt play in the superbowl. not sure what youre talking about 

2 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

No one is going after Darius Slay or Reagor.   

I don’t know who went after reagor. I made a point on 3rd and 9 he didn’t run a very good route. If we watch the all 22 and he doesn’t run a particularly good route i should just ignore it? Or say that’s what it was. 

5 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

 

This. 

Get a new Sarcasm meter....

Just now, ManuManu said:

If he were a FA he would have gotten more, and it wouldn’t have such a team friendly structure. 

If he were a free agent, I'd expect the team signing him to anticipate having him for more than 2 years... which again makes the deal more like the 3 year extension that he got, once again raising his cost closer to the avg of $16+M.    Paying for cap flexibility with draft picks... 🤦‍♂️

17 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

 

People say he got pancaked as if the guard didn’t tackle him because he shot the gap too quickly for Metcalf to block. 

That’s a damn good play, and he blew it up along with Hargrave.

i saw no one say he got pancaked. 

21 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

I don't see how it's 'below market'.  

 

Looks like pretty much 'market value' to me, only it also cost draft capital.   The only part that was 'below' value was 2020.  2021-2023 are all 'at market value'.  And even if you average 2020 in to the cost of that contract, it knocks him down to $15.1M/year, which pushes only Jones over him... so he's being paid as a top 5 or 6 in the NFL.  How exactly does that equate to 'below market'? 

I understand you're upset but you're not thinking straight.

YEAR		AGE	BASE SALARY	SIGNING	WORKOUT	CAP HIT	DEAD CAP	YEARLY CASH
2020		29	$1,050,000	$3,250,000	-	$4,300,000	$26,050,000	$14,050,000($14,050,000)
2021		30	$12,000,000	$3,250,000	$500,000	$15,750,000	$21,750,000	$12,500,000($26,550,000)
POTENTIAL OUT: 2022, 2 YR, $26,550,000; $6,500,000 DEAD CAP
2022		31	$16,000,000	$3,250,000	$500,000	$19,750,000	$6,500,000	$16,500,000($43,050,000)
2023		32	$17,000,000	$3,250,000	$500,000	$20,750,000	$3,250,000	$17,500,000($60,550,000)
2024		33	UFA

 

Slay is ONLY A 4.3 Million cap hit this year.  Good luck getting a better deal than that for a CB of his caliber for this season.

He's a 15.7 million cap hit next year.  That's an average of 10 million per year (against the cap)  for a top 5 NFL CB...when the average salary for a top 5 CB is 17+ million. 

After 2021 his salary is no longer guaranteed.  So depending on his performance, etc he could likely restructure.  

The Eagles filled a "top 2" need by getting a top 5 CB and it's costing them almost half (against the cap)  of what they would have likely needed to pay a free agent of his caliber. 

Just now, jwill2420 said:

Get a new sarcastic meter....

You don’t think I was being equally sarcastic?

1 minute ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

I don’t know who went after reagor. I made a point on 3rd and 9 he didn’t run a very good route. If we watch the all 22 and he doesn’t run a particularly good route i should just ignore it? Or say that’s what it was. 

Nah.  Some people struggle with reading comprehension.    If I say the Slay deal was bad, because it cost too much money and too many draft picks, for a team that is old, way over the cap and in desperate need of younger players... that's going after Slay, rather than criticizing the architect of all that is wrong with this roster/cap. 

1 minute ago, Iggles_Phan said:

If he were a free agent, I'd expect the team signing him to anticipate having him for more than 2 years... which again makes the deal more like the 3 year extension that he got, once again raising his cost closer to the avg of $16+M.    Paying for cap flexibility with draft picks... 🤦‍♂️

Most contracts are two years and "we’ll see.” Howie can be killed for a lot of his contracts lately, but he did well on that one. 

6 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

You don’t think I was being equally sarcastic?

Where you?

1 minute ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Nah.  Some people struggle with reading comprehension.    If I say the Slay deal was bad, because it cost too much money and too many draft picks, for a team that is old, way over the cap and in desperate need of younger players... that's going after Slay, rather than criticizing the architect of all that is wrong with this roster/cap. 

 

Just now, ManuManu said:

Most contracts are two years and "we’ll see.” Howie can be killed for a lot of his contracts lately, but he did well on that one. 

I don’t think it was a bad trade. I also just don’t think it’s going to be looked back upon as great of a trade as people made it out to be at the time of the deal. I think we will look back on it as we wasted slay’s last couple prime years as our team wasn’t nearly as close as the eagles believed after 2019.  

Just now, ManuManu said:

Most contracts are two years and "we’ll see.” Howie can be killed for a lot of his contracts lately, but he did well on that one. 

And most contracts don't also cost a 3rd round and 5th round pick.  So, he gave up a 3 and 5 to get a CB at 'only' had to pay a top 12 CB price.  Awesome.

 

Again, you are focused on the contract... if its contract only... great deal.  But, it's not.  Its contract AND picks.  Hence the comment "Paying for cap flexibility with draft picks."    Howie is just making bad decisions to cover up for worse decisions.  

4 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

I don’t think it was a bad trade. I also just don’t think it’s going to be looked back upon as great of a trade as people made it out to be at the time of the deal. I think we will look back on it as we wasted slay’s last couple prime years as our team wasn’t nearly as close as the eagles believed after 2019.  

I can come off the 'bad' trade part, but it shouldn't be hailed as a great trade, by any means.  And frankly, that might be the only move that Howie has made since Feb 5th, 2018 that's actually worked out.  Too bad that move was forced by some many other failed moves.  

4 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

 I think we will look back on it as we wasted slay’s last couple prime years as our team wasn’t nearly as close as the eagles believed after 2019.  

Right.  Because had they not filled the need at CB in the off-season, this place would have been fine with that. 

10 minutes ago, HazletonEagle said:

i saw no one say he got pancaked. 

I’m not gonna try to find it, but I recall someone making the comment that he was pancaked on the play. I don’t remember if it was during the game or after. 

2 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

And most contracts don't also cost a 3rd round and 5th round pick.  So, he gave up a 3 and 5 to get a CB at 'only' had to pay a top 12 CB price.  Awesome.

 

Again, you are focused on the contract... if its contract only... great deal.  But, it's not.  Its contract AND picks.  Hence the comment "Paying for cap flexibility with draft picks."    Howie is just making bad decisions to cover up for worse decisions.  

No, I’m focused on both. I’ve said all night that a 3/5/below market deal for Slay is good. 

15 minutes ago, HazletonEagle said:

i saw no one say he got pancaked. 

You did.  In this thread during the game.  You said he got pancaked on that 4th down play and "got lucky" or something like that.  You went on to say he deserved credit for his 2nd big stop but not that one. 

3 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

I’m not gonna try to find it, but I recall someone making the comment that he was pancaked on the play. I don’t remember if it was during the game or after. 

I made the pancake comment that nigth when someone brought up the super bowl play and Ferris was the first to mention how he sucked on that play and the ball bounced to him. I mentioned that he was pancaked. 

It wasnt the play in the Seattle game that Hargrave made first even though Barnett was only blocked by a WR. No one said he got pancaked on that one.

Just now, Ace Nova said:

You did.  In this thread during the game.  You said he got pancaked on that 4th down play and "got lucky" or something like that.  You went on to say he deserved credit for his 2nd big stop but not that one. 

wrong

1 minute ago, HazletonEagle said:

I made the pancake comment that nigth when someone brought up the super bowl play and Ferris was the first to mention how he sucked on that play and the ball bounced to him. I mentioned that he was pancaked. 

It wasnt the play in the Seattle game that Hargrave made first even though Barnett was only blocked by a WR. No one said he got pancaked on that one.

wrong

Lol, at least you proved my other point about slighting his good plays. 

Just now, ManuManu said:

Lol, at least you proved my other point about slighting his good plays. 

wasnt his play. it was hargraves play the announcers credited Barnett for. And fact is, most of his good plays came unblocked, or WR or TE blocking him. He has very few good plays beating OTs till this year. 

 

Just now, HazletonEagle said:

wasnt his play. it was hargraves play the announcers credited Barnett for. And fact is, most of his good plays came unblocked, or WR or TE blocking him. He has very few good plays beating OTs till this year. 

 

And again. 

20 minutes ago, Ace Nova said:

Right.  Because had they not filled the need at CB in the off-season, this place would have been fine with that. 

Who said they wouldn’t have added another FA corner/trade with lesser pick capital instead trading for slay and/or drafted one  

Because had the eagles not filled the need at WR with a proven veteran potentially diggs, Hopkins or veteran free agent this place would’ve been fine with that... wait that’s exactly what happened  

11 minutes ago, Ace Nova said:

I understand you're upset but you're not thinking straight.

YEAR		AGE	BASE SALARY	SIGNING	WORKOUT	CAP HIT	DEAD CAP	YEARLY CASH
2020		29	$1,050,000	$3,250,000	-	$4,300,000	$26,050,000	$14,050,000($14,050,000)
2021		30	$12,000,000	$3,250,000	$500,000	$15,750,000	$21,750,000	$12,500,000($26,550,000)
POTENTIAL OUT: 2022, 2 YR, $26,550,000; $6,500,000 DEAD CAP
2022		31	$16,000,000	$3,250,000	$500,000	$19,750,000	$6,500,000	$16,500,000($43,050,000)
2023		32	$17,000,000	$3,250,000	$500,000	$20,750,000	$3,250,000	$17,500,000($60,550,000)
2024		33	UFA

 

Slay is ONLY A 4.3 Million cap hit this year.  Good luck getting a better deal than that for a CB of his caliber for this season.

He's a 15.7 million cap hit next year.  That's an average of 10 million per year (against the cap)  for a top 5 NFL CB...when the average salary for a top 5 CB is 17+ million. 

After 2021 his salary is no longer guaranteed.  So depending on his performance, etc he could likely restructure.  

The Eagles filled a "top 2" need by getting a top 5 CB and it's costing them almost half (against the cap)  of what they would have likely needed to pay a free agent of his caliber. 

You are forgetting the $6.5M he'll also cost in 2022 to drop him immediately after 2021... which raises his cost to an average of $13M.   I am thinking just fine.   Howie is spending good money and good draft capital after bad.  He selected Jones, Douglas, and Maddox... traded for Darby.  None of those moves worked, so he has to go out and trade for Slay, costing money that could have gone to other free agents.. and draft picks that could have brought in cheap players to fill in behind the expensive ones.    The way I see it... they used 2 resources on 1 player.   You don't use both draft capital and cap for a single player, unless it is a truly transformative player.  Slay is a wonderful guy, and a great CB.  But, he's not a difference maker for this team.  But, they weren't going to put more money into the WR position... because they already spent that money on Desean and Alshon.   But, the money would have been better spent on Robby Anderson, and using the draft picks to 'fix the CB position'... not that that's worked in the recent past.   That's the spot Howie has this team in though... spending both cap and draft capital to fix what he hasn't been able to figure out in 5 years as a GM, no matter how hard he's tried.

8 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

No, I’m focused on both. I’ve said all night that a 3/5/below market deal for Slay is good. 

And I disagree.   If it is below market, its only slightly below.... and those picks would have been very helpful in adding young talent to this roster... which hopefully would help us beyond 2021... when it matters.

17 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

I can come off the 'bad' trade part, but it shouldn't be hailed as a great trade, by any means.  And frankly, that might be the only move that Howie has made since Feb 5th, 2018 that's actually worked out.  Too bad that move was forced by some many other failed moves.  

Fair.