Jalen Hurts - shoulder sprain injury; expected for playoffs

[EazyEaglez]

1 minute ago, Bwestbrook36 said:

I understand why they are comparing Allen with the improvement and with the accuracy issues. I'm not saying Hurts can't improve but, what Allen did was rare usually guys that struggle with accuracy in college end up having the same issues in the pros. Most people had Allen pegged as a bust before he was even drafted because of it. 

So now that Allen did it we all of a sudden think anyone can do it? That's where I have the problem. Allen has the physical tools and the mental aspect down before entering the league so he didn't have as much of an uphill battle as Hurts does because he does struggle with the mental aspects and he doesn't have the physical tools arm wise to make up for the late reads and down field throws. 

Saying all that I know he will improve he works to hard not too. The thing that we will all be wondering is will it be enough? Will the mental aspect improve? Those are the questions I'm looking to be answered. 

The thing is we don’t know answers yet, and just like those who deemed Allen a bust way too early could be wrong too. They way people want to make it out it as if Hurts completed 40% of his passes, had more interceptions than touchdowns, was always injured, and the team won more with him out the lineup than in it. That’s not who things went down.

[Bwestbrook36]

1 minute ago, EazyEaglez said:

The thing is we don’t know answers yet, and just like those who deemed Allen a bust way too early could be wrong too. They way people want to make it out it as if Hurts completed 40% of his passes, had more interceptions than touchdowns, was always injured, and the team won more with him out the lineup than in it. That’s not who things went down.

I agree, I'm willing to see how it goes. If you watch the video I posted they did a pretty good break down of hurts drive he did some really good things that he didn't do last year. Still some of that other not so great things but, he has made improvements. Just have to see how that translates to the regular season 

[EazyEaglez]

1 minute ago, downundermike said:

Not rooting against him, just being honest about his trajectory.

I mean, if he succeeds all these will grow in value.

 

You don’t know his trajectory. You’re assuming his trajectory. There are countless numbers of early round drafted quarterbacks that didn’t meet their so called trajectories and there are also many story’s of latter picks exceeding their trajectories. Brady and Montana are both examples of two guys who exceeded their trajectories and arguably they’re the two greatest quarterbacks ever. Now am I saying Hurts will be that? No I’m not, but I’m not stating he’s doomed to fail like some of you are expecting to happen either. On a side note if I buy a stock I’m not expecting it to fail. Heck I’m rooting hard for it to succeed. Just sayin. 

[Guest]

1 minute ago, EazyEaglez said:

You don’t know his trajectory. You’re assuming his trajectory. There are countless numbers of early round drafted quarterbacks that didn’t meet their so called trajectories and there are also many story’s of latter picks exceeding their trajectories. Brady and Montana are both examples of two guys who exceeded their trajectories and arguably they’re the two greatest quarterbacks ever. Now am I saying Hurts will be that? No I’m not, but I’m not stating he’s doomed to fail like some of you are expecting to happen either. On a side note if I buy a stock I’m not expecting it to fail. Heck I’m rooting hard for it to succeed. Just sayin. 

This one though, no doubt the value will skyrocket.

[EazyEaglez]

4 minutes ago, Bwestbrook36 said:

I agree, I'm willing to see how it goes. If you watch the video I posted they did a pretty good break down of hurts drive he did some really good things that he didn't do last year. Still some of that other not so great things but, he has made improvements. Just have to see how that translates to the regular season 

Yeah I don’t even think that drive told us anything about who the Eagles will be this season. Basically no Brown or Smith out there and they didn’t run the ball. I still expect them to be a running team, but I also expect Brown and Smith (provided they stay healthy) to be much more involved. Heck just going from throwing to Reagor to Brown is a 90% improvement. 

[EazyEaglez]

2 minutes ago, downundermike said:

This one though, no doubt the value will skyrocket.

He didn’t even register a stat, but clearly made an impact on the game. I’m a fan of the big guy. 

[Guest]

1 minute ago, EazyEaglez said:

He didn’t even register a stat, but clearly made an impact on the game. I’m a fan of the big guy. 

Neither of them are as cool as this one.

 

[Iggles_Phan]

43 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

Wentz is another big guy/big arm that didn’t amount to much. This idea that big guy/big arm automatically equals success isn’t real. 

Nice straw man.  

[EazyEaglez]

3 minutes ago, downundermike said:

Neither of them are as cool as this one.

 

IDK. Running backs can have fleeting careers. He’s looking really good right now though. 

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

IDK. Running backs can have fleeting careers. He’s looking really good right now though. 

I got more

 

[EazyEaglez]

2 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Nice straw man.  

So people aren’t saying big guy/big arm quarterbacks are better? Please tell me more. 🙄

[KDUB1510]

10 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

It’s not Jalen’s fault he played in less games as a rookie, and the Giants played a similar schedule as the Eagles las year. Jones tds dropped by double digits. Lol He didn’t progress, he regressed despite having more experience. Most quarterbacks don’t go backwards from year one to year two. In his third year he basically leveled off to year one with no improvement.  Jones seems to be he is what he is, and that can be shown through the fact of the amount of seasons and games he has under his belt. Still this is also his 4th season, he’s only 25, and perhaps with a new coach that guy could find out the best way to use the player. The problem with most teams is they’re so obsessed with trying to find the next big guy they give up too quickly on their guy. Like it or not Jalen’s the Eagles starting quarterback. Carson Strong you avatar (big arm guy)  probably doesn’t even make this team. 

And it's not Daniel's fault he played in more games as a rookie lmao what kind of arguement is that. I only brought it up because you said Hurts progressed from year 1 to year 2 compared to Jones. Hurts year 1 isnt even worth mentioning because he only played 4 games. Sad thing is, you can add Hurts passing TD's from his rookie season, his 2nd rookie season & his playoff start and he still wouldnt have more passing TD's than Jones did as a rookie. Jones is what he is, which is an average QB at best but so is Hurts. Unlike Hurts, Jones didnt throw passes to 8 different 1st round pass catchers in college and still look mediocre whole doing so. Just another reason the Allen comps dont make sense. Allen came from Wyoming where there isnt much NFL talent. Hurts came from bama & OU where he was surrounded by NFL talent and looked like a mediocre QB while other QB's before and after him were/will be 1st round picks. I was only pointing out that you can take many average QB's first 2 seasons compared to Allen's first two seasons and make a case that they'll make some sort of quantum leap. Jalen is the Eagles starting QB and ill be glad to say i was wrong about him if he lights it up this season. If Strong makes the roster you have to change your avatar to a picture of him for a month, If he doesnt i'll change mine to Hurts, deal?

[EazyEaglez]

Just now, downundermike said:

I got more

 

Got an autographed rookie Cal Jackson card. I thought that would be worth a lot after his rookie season. Now not so much.  

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

Got an autographed rookie Cal Jackson card. I thought that would be worth a lot after his rookie season. Now not so much.  

 

[EazyEaglez]

1 minute ago, KDUB1510 said:

And it's not Daniel's fault he played in more games as a rookie lmao what kind of arguement is that. I only brought it up because you said Hurts progressed from year 1 to year 2 compared to Jones. Hurts year 1 isnt even worth mentioning because he only played 4 games. Sad thing is, you can add Hurts passing TD's from his rookie season, his 2nd rookie season & his playoff start and he still wouldnt have more passing TD's than Jones did as a rookie. Jones is what he is, which is an average QB at best but so is Hurts. Unlike Hurts, Jones didnt throw passes to 8 different 1st round pass catchers in college and still look mediocre whole doing so. Just another reason the Allen comps dont make sense. Allen came from Wyoming where there isnt much NFL talent. Hurts came from bama & OU where he was surrounded by NFL talent and looked like a mediocre QB while other QB's before and after him were/will be 1st round picks. I was only pointing out that you can take many average QB's first 2 seasons compared to Allen's first two seasons and make a case that they'll make some sort of quantum leap. Jalen is the Eagles starting QB and ill be glad to say i was wrong about him if he lights it up this season. If Strong makes the roster you have to change your avatar to a picture of him for a month, If he doesnt i'll change mine to Hurts, deal?

Hurts throwing to Reagor. 😂🤣😂 Anyways It’s not Jalen’s fault he was behind Wentz, and barley got to play. Okay then if you want to look at it that way. Jalen Hurts first year as a starter was comparable to Jones and better than Allen’s so he’s either going to be another Jones or another Allen. Either way he’s still the starting quarterback of the Philadelphia Eagles despite your feelings. 🤷‍♂️

[Iggles_Phan]

2 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

So people aren’t saying big guy/big arm quarterbacks are better? Please tell me more. 🙄

Simple.   People are saying that Hurts cannot become Josh Allen, because he's not Josh Allen's size, nor does he have his arm.  IF, and that's a huge if right now, he can become as productive as Allen, he will need to do it very differently.  He can't do it with the gun slinging style that Allen has.  He won't be able to throw it deep like he does, nor throw the outs that he does, or so many other things he does.  They are very different styles of QB.

So, when people scoff at the comparison to Allen, it's because it's not a realistic comp.  Find a different mediocre QB for his first two years that fits Hurts' style to make a comp.  Yes, tall, big armed QBs have failed, time and again.  And short, weak armed QBs have failed more frequently.    Most QBs fail, that's the reality of the NFL.  But, guys that meet the prototypical criteria generally have a better chance than those that are starting off with less than prototypical physical attributes.  Sure, there are examples of those who didn't who went on to have great success, but those are the exceptions, not the rule.  

[KDUB1510]

1 minute ago, EazyEaglez said:

Hurts throwing to Reagor. 😂🤣😂 Anyways It’s not Jalen’s fault he was behind Wentz, and barley got to play. Okay then if you want to look at it that way. Jalen Hurts first year as a starter was comparable to Jones and better than Allen’s so he’s either going to be another Jones or another Allen. Either way he’s still the starting quarterback of the Philadelphia Eagles despite your feelings. 🤷‍♂️

I guess Smith, Goedert & Quez dont exist. He missed all three of those guys plenty last year. Unlike Hurts, Jones doesnt have the luxury of handing the ball off 40 times a game behind one of the best offensive lines in the league. He wont be Allen or Jones, he'll be Jalen Hurts, which is a QB who is a good runner but a mediocre passer, despite your feelings. 

[Iggles_Phan]

33 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

Hurts throwing to Reagor. 😂🤣😂 Anyways It’s not Jalen’s fault he was behind Wentz, and barley got to play. Okay then if you want to look at it that way. Jalen Hurts first year as a starter was comparable to Jones and better than Allen’s so he’s either going to be another Jones or another Allen. Either way he’s still the starting quarterback of the Philadelphia Eagles despite your feelings. 🤷‍♂️

Are we disregarding Reagor?  He's going into his 3rd season.  Why are we ignoring that he now has a true #1 opposite him, we'll see a jump in his numbers as defenses turn their attention away from him to the other side?   Dude doubled his TD total from last year.   I think we should just let the season play out and see what he does.

[Guest]

11 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Are we disregarding Reagor?  He's going into his 3rd season.  Why are we ignoring that he now has a true #1 opposite him, we'll see a jump in his numbers as defenses turn their attention away from him to the other side?   Dude doubled his TD total from last year.   I think we should just let the season play out and see what he does.

Yep, everyone gets to make the 3rd year jump.

Cooper Kupp 3rd year, 94 catches, 1161 yards and 10 TD's.

[PhillyMG]

3 hours ago, EazyEaglez said:

So people aren’t saying big guy/big arm quarterbacks are better? Please tell me more. 🙄

No, I believe what people are saying is that big guy/big arm QBs have a much higher ceiling than small, weak arm RBs masquerading as QBs.

[ManchesterEagle]

10 hours ago, EazyEaglez said:

So people aren’t saying big guy/big arm quarterbacks are better? Please tell me more. 🙄

 

10 hours ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Simple.   People are saying that Hurts cannot become Josh Allen, because he's not Josh Allen's size, nor does he have his arm.  IF, and that's a huge if right now, he can become as productive as Allen, he will need to do it very differently.  He can't do it with the gun slinging style that Allen has.  He won't be able to throw it deep like he does, nor throw the outs that he does, or so many other things he does.  They are very different styles of QB.

So, when people scoff at the comparison to Allen, it's because it's not a realistic comp.  Find a different mediocre QB for his first two years that fits Hurts' style to make a comp.  Yes, tall, big armed QBs have failed, time and again.  And short, weak armed QBs have failed more frequently.    Most QBs fail, that's the reality of the NFL.  But, guys that meet the prototypical criteria generally have a better chance than those that are starting off with less than prototypical physical attributes.  Sure, there are examples of those who didn't who went on to have great success, but those are the exceptions, not the rule.  

Lol at some people claiming Hurts is still a running back after some of the throws he’s made recently.

Allen may have more physical gifts than Hurts, but Hurts has more physical gifts than say a Brees or Tannehill, guys who also took a big leap in year 3. There are lots of QBs who took a big step in year 3. More who took a big leap in their 2nd year of starting.

Hurts was struggling at times last year, but it was usually reads, decision making and mechanics, not his arm. These are areas that can be improved upon. He also has a top 10 WR now to help him out. 

He may not have Allen’s upside, but it amuses me how many people are shut off to the possibility of him taking a substantial leap this year.
 

 

[Iggles_Phan]

3 hours ago, ManchesterEagle said:

 

Lol at some people claiming Hurts is still a running back after some of the throws he’s made recently.

Allen may have more physical gifts than Hurts, but Hurts has more physical gifts than say a Brees or Tannehill, guys who also took a big leap in year 3. There are lots of QBs who took a big step in year 3. More who took a big leap in their 2nd year of starting.

Hurts was struggling at times last year, but it was usually reads, decision making and mechanics, not his arm. These are areas that can be improved upon. He also has a top 10 WR now to help him out. 

He may not have Allen’s upside, but it amuses me how many people are shut off to the possibility of him taking a substantial leap this year.
 

 

Please don't quote me and attribute statements to me I have never made.  I never called him a running back.  And none of the throws he made recently has changed anything.  6 throws in preseason means nothing.  The bigger concern for me was bailing a perfectly good pocket on the only 3rd down opportunity he had, and then leaving himself open to a late hit.  That's the concern with his style.

[ManchesterEagle]

53 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Please don't quote me and attribute statements to me I have never made.  I never called him a running back.  And none of the throws he made recently has changed anything.  6 throws in preseason means nothing.  The bigger concern for me was bailing a perfectly good pocket on the only 3rd down opportunity he had, and then leaving himself open to a late hit.  That's the concern with his style.

I wasn’t talking about you regarding the running back point. Sorry if you took it that way.

He’s looked improved. Particularly passing over the middle. He has a lot to prove though.

I think too much is being made of Hurts bailing the pocket. He mostly stayed in apart from when flushed. He takes precautions when running. That was just a really dirty late hit that could have been made when he was in the pocket.

[Shalodeep]

25 minutes ago, ManchesterEagle said:

I wasn’t talking about you regarding the running back point. Sorry if you took it that way.

He’s looked improved. Particularly passing over the middle. He has a lot to prove though.

I think too much is being made of Hurts bailing the pocket. He mostly stayed in apart from when flushed. He takes precautions when running. That was just a really dirty late hit that could have been made when he was in the pocket.

The point that has been made with photo evidence is that he could of stayed in pocket and made the easy pass avoiding contact. It's why the bailing gets pointed out. He is calling his own number instead of showing the patience that's needed to develop a passing game. He may actually have all the ability to make most throws, but he has little patience to get good enough to do so 

[Iggles_Phan]

59 minutes ago, ManchesterEagle said:

I wasn’t talking about you regarding the running back point. Sorry if you took it that way.

He’s looked improved. Particularly passing over the middle. He has a lot to prove though.

I think too much is being made of Hurts bailing the pocket. He mostly stayed in apart from when flushed. He takes precautions when running. That was just a really dirty late hit that could have been made when he was in the pocket.

Disagree 100%.

That was a late hit that he left himself open for.  It was obvious that he had no shot at reaching the first down marker.  It was 3rd and 5.  The best play there, especially it being a preseason game, was to throw the ball away and line up again at 4th and 5, punt or kick the FG.  The worst thing he could do in a preseason game was go for that one extra yard.  What was to be gained?  He took an unnecessary hit, that he had the power to avoid.  He chose to leave himself in harms' way.

Secondly, the argument about that he could have been hit like that while in the pocket is a weak one.  QBs in the pocket get protections that 'runners' just don't have.  Granted, that's all well and good, but the damage is usually done already when the flag comes out.  BUT... the reverse side of that is that defenders approach hitting the QB in the pocket differently than out of the pocket, due to the protections and the training they have been getting for years and years.   We saw it with Cam Newton, who complained all the time that he wasn't afforded the same protections as pocket passers even when they were out of the pocket as well.  Long story short... running with the ball as a matter of design or as a major part of your game from the QB position means taking more hits... some legal, some illegal.  Some of the illegal hits will be flagged, but the reality is that some won't.  But, even if the late hit is penalized, what good is that if Hurts is knocked out of the game or for multiple games?

 

Exhibit A from this past weekend's games.   Qbs outside the pocket have liberties taken on them by the defense.