8 minutes ago, ManchesterEagle said:

WR - everybody wants Chase, but we may not get him and even if we do, Hurts could really do with an established vet. We are not going to get Godwin or Robinson, but we should be looking at the second tier like Curtis Samuel and see if we can get decent value. 

 

It's too bad that Tyrell Williams got signed by DET, as he fits the veteran/1-year mold with experience in this system and is a big bodied X.  I'm sure, there's other guys out there.  In any case, I would feel more comfortable if we had somebody a bit more seasoned for Hurts to lean on. 

On 12/31/2020 at 10:50 AM, What The F said:

6'6 240lbs from Philadelphia.  Kid is a monster.  He might emerge as the best WR in this class. While listed as a TE, he has better hands and size then anyone in this draft.  

At this point, I'm thinking positively about Pitts.  It seems like he could be rare.  Is he rare?  Let's look at the pro day numbers.  

It seems to me that it's very possible that he's going to have the pro day numbers that are clearly better than other TEs that are available in drafts.   It wouldn't be a question of whether he was the best TE this year,  but of a number of years.  Does he have the freakish numbers for a TE?  Can you find TEs to compare to him that were drafted recently?

Because it seems like Chase and Smith are the best receivers this year.  But I don't know that Chase and Smith are clearly the best WRs going back years.  Last year,  you had Jeudy, Ruggs and Lamb as the top WRs,  2 from Alabama,  1 from LSU.  This year it's Smith, Waddle and Chase.  Again, 2 from Alabama, 1 from LSU,  and there isn't even uniform thinking about which of the 2 WRs from Alabama is the better one.

Lets assume that you want a great WR and a great TE, and let's assume that you have neither right now.    If the TE is rare,  you won't be able to get that TE in the draft next year.  This would be your opportunity to get him.  It could be argued that WR is more intrinsically more valuable than TE,   but top WRs are generally available often,  some years aren't as good as others,  but they're not rare the way top TEs are.  If you want a top TE (and maybe you don't) you have to get him when he's available.  It just happens that DE and OLB are more important positions in the NFL and also in college.  And they're basically the same size,  so, typically, top athletes who are TE sized are playing DE or OLB in college.

It will be interesting to compare the numbers of Penn State DE Oweh and Florida TE Pitts. 

About Tight End.  By the rules of football,  there are 7 players on the offensive line.  2 are eligible to catch passes.  They're called Ends.  And for years of the NFL,  decades, everyone was happy enough to call them the Left End and the Right End.   As the NFL changed,  they came up with terms like Tight End and Split End to describe exactly where on the offensive line that player generally is lining up.  Those players might not stand at the same spot every time.  Sometimes they would stand right next to the Tackle, as a Tight End, and other times he might not, he might be split out at least a couple yards.   It seems to me that Pitts can do that, and the Eagles would use him as a Split End.  After a bit of time, they started calling the Split End the X.   At some point,  the term wide receiver was used,  instead of more precise terms.  And then completely meaningless terms like WR1 and WR2 and WR3 were invented.   It seems like Pitts is a big Split End to me.  But, an End.   I would think it would be good to have 2 big ends on the field.  It seems like you're too small if you're not. 

tl/dr - top TEs are more rare than top WR, so if you'd like both, it's easier to get top WR, so get top TE.   Not saying they shouldn't trade down,  maybe get more picks,  maybe focus on defense? But TE vs WR,  if they think that Pitts is a true #1 franchise big split end or move TE,  and he has pro day numbers that blow people away,  and they want that,  get that because more rare. 

On 3/8/2021 at 9:25 AM, Waiting4Someday said:

It's too bad that Tyrell Williams got signed by DET, as he fits the veteran/1-year mold with experience in this system and is a big bodied X.  I'm sure, there's other guys out there.  In any case, I would feel more comfortable if we had somebody a bit more seasoned for Hurts to lean on. 

More seasoned?  Terrelle Pryor.  The Eagles should be filling in with cheap when they can.  Here, they can.  The Ravens had Dez Bryant last year.  he wasn't great but he was cheap.

Why would people think that the Eagles would have the money to spend on an expensive free agent receiver this year?

2 hours ago, Random Reglar said:

At this point, I'm thinking positively about Pitts.  It seems like he could be rare.  Is he rare?  Let's look at the pro day numbers.  

It seems to me that it's very possible that he's going to have the pro day numbers that are clearly better than other TEs that are available in drafts.   It wouldn't be a question of whether he was the best TE this year,  but of a number of years.  Does he have the freakish numbers for a TE?  Can you find TEs to compare to him that were drafted recently?

Because it seems like Chase and Smith are the best receivers this year.  But I don't know that Chase and Smith are clearly the best WRs going back years.  Last year,  you had Jeudy, Ruggs and Lamb as the top WRs,  2 from Alabama,  1 from LSU.  This year it's Smith, Waddle and Chase.  Again, 2 from Alabama, 1 from LSU,  and there isn't even uniform thinking about which of the 2 WRs from Alabama is the better one.

Lets assume that you want a great WR and a great TE, and let's assume that you have neither right now.    If the TE is rare,  you won't be able to get that TE in the draft next year.  This would be your opportunity to get him.  It could be argued that WR is more intrinsically more valuable than TE,   but top WRs are generally available often,  some years aren't as good as others,  but they're not rare the way top TEs are.  If you want a top TE (and maybe you don't) you have to get him when he's available.  It just happens that DE and OLB are more important positions in the NFL and also in college.  And they're basically the same size,  so, typically, top athletes who are TE sized are playing DE or OLB in college.

It will be interesting to compare the numbers of Penn State DE Oweh and Florida TE Pitts. 

About Tight End.  By the rules of football,  there are 7 players on the offensive line.  2 are eligible to catch passes.  They're called Ends.  And for years of the NFL,  decades, everyone was happy enough to call them the Left End and the Right End.   As the NFL changed,  they came up with terms like Tight End and Split End to describe exactly where on the offensive line that player generally is lining up.  Those players might not stand at the same spot every time.  Sometimes they would stand right next to the Tackle, as a Tight End, and other times he might not, he might be split out at least a couple yards.   It seems to me that Pitts can do that, and the Eagles would use him as a Split End.  After a bit of time, they started calling the Split End the X.   At some point,  the term wide receiver was used,  instead of more precise terms.  And then completely meaningless terms like WR1 and WR2 and WR3 were invented.   It seems like Pitts is a big Split End to me.  But, an End.   I would think it would be good to have 2 big ends on the field.  It seems like you're too small if you're not. 

tl/dr - top TEs are more rare than top WR, so if you'd like both, it's easier to get top WR, so get top TE.   Not saying they shouldn't trade down,  maybe get more picks,  maybe focus on defense? But TE vs WR,  if they think that Pitts is a true #1 franchise big split end or move TE,  and he has pro day numbers that blow people away,  and they want that,  get that because more rare. 

Indeed! If they believe Pitts is an elite generational talent who will produce pro ball numbers like Kelce and Kittle year in and out and will open up the entire offense, they shouldn’t hesitate taking him at #6.

3 hours ago, Random Reglar said:

More seasoned?  Terrelle Pryor.  The Eagles should be filling in with cheap when they can.  Here, they can.  The Ravens had Dez Bryant last year.  he wasn't great but he was cheap.

Why would people think that the Eagles would have the money to spend on an expensive free agent receiver this year?

Tyrell Williams 2021 cap number with DET is $3M/1yr with the usual fluff incentives. This is the definition of a bargain bin FA.

I'm onboard with Pitts. He looks great - plus he's from philly too!

Chase or Pitts. Pitts looks like a more agile Metcalf 

11 hours ago, Waiting4Someday said:

Tyrell Williams 2021 cap number with DET is $3M/1yr with the usual fluff incentives. This is the definition of a bargain bin FA.

No, bargain bin FA is $1 Million.   It's not a real term anyway, so sure, if you want to say $3 Million is that,  I'm pretty confident that 1 Million is 2 Million less than 3 Million.  And the Eagles do not have a lot of money.

It seems to me that, right now,  the Eagles have more WRs than they need.  People can say that those WRs aren't good. I dunno.  But if you've got a run first team with running QBs,  you are going to want more RBs,  more blockers at TE/FB etc,  the pieces that the run first teams have.   If some of the WRs or TEs are also QBs, they can take a roster spot.  A WR/QB like Ward or Tate could take a QB roster spot, allowing the Eagles to keep an extra WR.   

On 3/11/2021 at 3:17 AM, Random Reglar said:

Lets assume that you want a great WR and a great TE, and let's assume that you have neither right now.   

Then you go with Pitts in the 1st and Tamorrian Terry with your 1st 3rd. 

5 hours ago, EagleVA said:

Then you go with Pitts in the 1st and Tamorrian Terry with your 1st 3rd. 

I dunno about Terry.  Maybe.

But it seems like the rare one, the hard to get done,  is the TE with the high sparq. 

And we're not sure yet, no pro day times,  but it looks like Pitts might be that guy. 

Other Florida WRs include Toney, who is said to be the most electric  WR out there, and Grimes, who might be about the same as Terry when it comes to size and speed.

4 hours ago, Random Reglar said:

I dunno about Terry.  Maybe.

But it seems like the rare one, the hard to get done,  is the TE with the high sparq. 

And we're not sure yet, no pro day times,  but it looks like Pitts might be that guy. 

Other Florida WRs include Toney, who is said to be the most electric  WR out there, and Grimes, who might be about the same as Terry when it comes to size and speed.

Here's the thing with WR's, just as is the case with RB's, you have WR's that bring different skillsets to their respective positions. 

For RB's, you have good open field runners, power runners, good receivers out of the backfield and then you have some that do it all.  

For receivers, you have quick short area receivers, the big go across the middle receivers, the filed stretchers but rarely do you have a WR that can do it all. 

Terry is your field stretcher, I think we need that type more than any other type because he'll open up space for the other types of receivers to operate. 

BTW, Toney, who reminds me of Reagor, is a Gator, Terry is a Seminole. 

15 hours ago, EagleVA said:

Terry is your field stretcher, I think we need that type more than any other type because he'll open up space for the other types of receivers to operate. 

What other type of receivers? See I agree we do need field stretchers (though Reagor is meant to be that) but we also need legit go to guys. We don't have that either right now.

2 hours ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

What other type of receivers? See I agree we do need field stretchers (though Reagor is meant to be that) but we also need legit go to guys. We don't have that either right now.

Quez, Hightower and Reagor are all supposed to be able to stretch the field. With Jeffrey gone, and JJAW unreliable - the spot for a possession type of receiver is open (Fulgham?). I figure KP would steal as many snaps from Ward as a big slot and our traditional X as he would from Goedert.

19 hours ago, EagleVA said:

Here's the thing with WR's, just as is the case with RB's, you have WR's that bring different skillsets to their respective positions. 

For RB's, you have good open field runners, power runners, good receivers out of the backfield and then you have some that do it all.  

For receivers, you have quick short area receivers, the big go across the middle receivers, the filed stretchers but rarely do you have a WR that can do it all. 

Terry is your field stretcher, I think we need that type more than any other type because he'll open up space for the other types of receivers to operate. 

BTW, Toney, who reminds me of Reagor, is a Gator, Terry is a Seminole. 

Right,   there are WRs who had Brian Johnson as their offensive coordinator a couple months ago, and WRS who did not.

I would think that getting Florida Gator WR/TE would be a good plan.  

8 hours ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

What other type of receivers? See I agree we do need field stretchers (though Reagor is meant to be that) but we also need legit go to guys. We don't have that either right now.

Yeah, Reagor is a big question mark to me,  I believe can be a good/great receiver but he doesn't seem to have the desire to want that so I think it's wise to look elsewhere for one that has that desire? 🙂

As for Terry, I believe he can be the go to receiver you spoke of as he has the attributes for it, one of which being his desire.  The dilemma he presents is if you want to ensure he's an Eagle you probably should select him with the 1st pick because I'm not sure he'll be there in the 2nd, but It's also conceivable he'll be there in the 3rd.  One thing Terry will bring is double teams as there will be very few corners that can run with him once he starts picking them up and putting them down.

If the Eagles land both Pitts and Terry, Pitts will have to be their first pick and Terry would be their second.  this would give Hurts the weapons needed to operate a very powerful offense, all he would need is  LG and and the remainder of the OL to remain healthy. 

So the big question is who'd be more valuable, Pitts or Terry, I'm leaning towards Terry because for all intent and purposes, Pitts has the game of a WR and Terry is much better at that position than Pitts.

The biggest thing that has to be taken into consideration is Hurts ability to extend plays, extended plays with Terry running down the field spells big plays all game long. 

Pitts can play X or Move TE. Chase can play X, Slot, and Z in a pinch. Either one is a win for the Eagles. While I want Chase most, if it's Pitts, I won't complain.

1 hour ago, PoconoDon said:

Pitts can play X or Move TE. Chase can play X, Slot, and Z in a pinch. Either one is a win for the Eagles. While I want Chase most, if it's Pitts, I won't complain.

Same here...

1 hour ago, PoconoDon said:

Pitts can play X or Move TE. Chase can play X, Slot, and Z in a pinch. Either one is a win for the Eagles. While I want Chase most, if it's Pitts, I won't complain.

That's where I'm at. Pitts or Chase and I'm a happy man. Surtain or Farley and I'm going to be p'ed.

11 minutes ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

That's where I'm at. Pitts or Chase and I'm a happy man. Surtain or Farley and I'm going to be p'ed.

If they trade down for a King’s ransom, I’d not be against a corner but I probably want it to be Horn.

Don’t think they’ll trade back if either Chase or Pitts is available though.

54 minutes ago, Ray75 said:

If they trade down for a King’s ransom, I’d not be against a corner but I probably want it to be Horn.

Don’t think they’ll trade back if either Chase or Pitts is available though.

I mean if they can get a kings ransom then sure but even then? Hmm I'm not sure on CB. Look I know it's a massive need I'm just not sure any of these guys in the draft really move the needle a lot. 

16 minutes ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

I mean if they can get a kings ransom then sure but even then? Hmm I'm not sure on CB. Look I know it's a massive need I'm just not sure any of these guys in the draft really move the needle a lot. 

Agreed! Overall the corner class is okay but lacks top talent. The succes for Surtain is scheme specific, Farley is raw, hasn’t played for an entire year and has been dealing with major injuries in the past and Horn needs to clean up his game because he’s too aggresive at times (will result in a lot of penalties at the next level).

Everything depends on what scheme Gannon will run. In Indy it was mostly zone and in Minnesota it was also zone based but he sprinkled in more man coverage (probably skill set related). If he’s gonna run a zone heavy scheme here, we’ll likely draft accordingly.

Some corners prospects don’t fit that mold. For example; Surtain probably not, Farley maybe, Horn probably yes, Samuel is more of a man corner, Stokes and Campbell likely will etc, etc.

31 minutes ago, Ray75 said:

Agreed! Overall the corner class is okay but lacks top talent. The succes for Surtain is scheme specific, Farley is raw, hasn’t played for an entire year and has been dealing with major injuries in the past and Horn needs to clean up his game because he’s too aggresive at times (will result in a lot of penalties at the next level).

Everything depends on what scheme Gannon will run. In Indy it was mostly zone and in Minnesota it was also zone based but he sprinkled in more man coverage (probably skill set related). If he’s gonna run a zone heavy scheme here, we’ll likely draft accordingly.

Some corners prospects don’t fit that mold. For example; Surtain probably not, Farley maybe, Horn probably yes, Samuel is more of a man corner, Stokes and Campbell likely will etc, etc.

Agreed if we are going to take a corner in the first then I'd like a guy who is going to really move the needle and tip the scales for the defense. Sure we aren't likely to get an legit Ramsey type lock down corner outside of the top 10 but I also don't believe there is that kind of player who is going to be there at #6 this year. I'd rather we take the BPA approach because this team has so many holes.

2 hours ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

Agreed if we are going to take a corner in the first then I'd like a guy who is going to really move the needle and tip the scales for the defense. Sure we aren't likely to get an legit Ramsey type lock down corner outside of the top 10 but I also don't believe there is that kind of player who is going to be there at #6 this year. I'd rather we take the BPA approach because this team has so many holes.

I don’t hate the BPA approach but I think receiver is just still such a weakness that I think you have to take one at 6. I’ll include Pitts in that, because he’s really more than just a tight end. I think you really need to go either Chase, Pitts or Smith at 6. That’s my order of preference. 
 

I like the second round corner prospects better than the receivers at that spot. Give me one of the three pass catchers I mentioned at 6, then Samuel Jr in round 2 and I’ll be thrilled. 

Just now, nipples said:

I don’t hate the BPA approach but I think receiver is just still such a weakness that I think you have to take one at 6. I’ll include Pitts in that, because he’s really more than just a tight end. I think you really need to go either Chase, Pitts or Smith at 6. That’s my order of preference. 
 

I like the second round corner prospects better than the receivers at that spot. Give me one of the three pass catchers I mentioned at 6, then Samuel Jr in round 2 and I’ll be thrilled. 

I think in all likelihood BPA at #6 is going to be a WR bud. Unless Sewell falls and then people are saying he's a can't miss prospect.

The more and more I read about and watch videos of this kid, I like him more. To me it's Chase or Pitts only.