Just now, HazletonEagle said:

I think those 3 are the ones who make the team. I think Sanders and Warren are the most likely. Because I like Warren more than Holyfield. I think Scott has the inside track after his performance last year, but if hes like sproles, Killins is like sproles with a jet pack so I think he has a chance. Mostly, I think Killins would likely only pass Scott if he kills it on returns. But maybe Scott makes it and Killins makes the team as a return specialist and we carry 4. 

I see Sanders, Scott, a cheap veteran (Shady? Freeman?), and Warren (or Holyfield) as the 4th back.  I envision Killins on the PS this year, where hopefully he can bulk up and gain good weight.  Also the loser of the Warren/Holyfield battle should end up on PS.

4 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

The same thing a veteran quarterback could do for us?  This is why the pick just bothers me to no end.  They've been selling Nate Sudfeld to us for years.  There are capable quarterbacks out there.  Flacco isn't the Super Bowl quarterback we all remember but he is serviceable and can fling it to our new track team. 

I still just don't like the pick one bit.  I can't imagine the reaction here if CeeDee Lamb torches Sidney Jones for a game winning TD and Jalen Hurts isn't even dressed for the game.  

I'm trying to come to terms with it, trying to understand the thought process but I honestly just can't agree with the pick one bit.

What does a veteran QB cost, though?  I started a thread some months ago listing the options available for the #2 QB next season and really Dalton and Mariota were the most reasonable alternatives.  Mariota got almost $9M from the Raiders.  Newton and Winston are both garbage IMO.

I’ve never seen a darn thing from Nate Sudfeld to make me believe he’s an NFL QB; time to move on.

2 minutes ago, IggleWalt said:

Especially when your QB is injury prone.

I think this Wentz is injury prone narrative is a bit overblown. He started all 16 games last year and started the playoff game. He was injured because of a cheep shot to the head which would have sidelined anyone with today's concussion protocols. He would have started the next week.

1 hour ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Winston can't be fixed until he matures.

Younger than Carson. So is Mariota. Something to ponder with both. 

13 minutes ago, TEW said:

I think he’s being groomed as a pure QB. And not just the backup, but their potential starter:

 

Why sign Jameis if they’re grooming him? It just takes more snaps away. He’ll be 31 when the 2021 season kicks off and everything about his game is built off athleticism. He has no QB foundation to build off of. 

27 minutes ago, Desertbirds said:

The more I think about the Hurts pick, the more I fear that he wasn't picked to be Wentz's backup but rather his replacement.

Let me preface this by saying I 100% do NOT want this to happen.  For the sake of trying to make the most sense of the Jalen Hurts pick I had given this some thought too. 

If we don't reach and/or win the Super Bowl by 2023 you have to wonder do they move on from Carson (32) in 2024 and hand over to Hurts on a new 2nd contract (potentially half of what Carson costs).  Carson's dead cap in 2024 is only $6 million so he is tradeable.  Could the return on Wentz be more than the return on Hurts? 

Just food for thought and debate to have now that we are back in a dead period with no rookie camps, mini camps or anything.

AGAIN, I DO NOT WANT THIS TO HAPPEN.  

 

1 hour ago, BigEFly said:

Like the idea of Hightower as an X.  I think his frame might support some strengthening and weight gain without a loss of speed.  Good height. 
 

i,like the idea of platooning the WRs.  Rest for DJax and he really is the only vet likely to make the team. I expect to see a lot more motion in the offense that will make for easier target identification on reads. 

I like the platoon too. Rest Jackson, and Goodwin comes in even faster. Rest Reagor and Hightower is nearly just as explosive. Rest JJAW and Ques is entering the slot with even more speed. 

 

5 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

What does a veteran QB cost, though?  I started a thread some months ago listing the options available for the #2 QB next season and really Dalton and Mariota were the most reasonable alternatives.  Mariota got almost $9M from the Raiders.  Newton and Winston are both garbage IMO.

I’ve never seen a darn thing from Nate Sudfeld to make me believe he’s an NFL QB; time to move on.

I think this is the most convincing rationale. We also can't rule out that this was a move to block a rival from drafting him, too. The Eagles have locked up their backup QB, with someone who is both cheap and versatile, and they will likely be able to get draft capital for him down the road. If they trade him two years from now for a 1st round pick, the pick was a wash. But they saved a ton of money at the QB #2 position with someone who is more talented and more versatile than Sudfeld.

1 minute ago, Desertbirds said:

I think this Wentz is injury prone narrative is a bit overblown. He started all 16 games last year and started the playoff game. He was injured because of a cheep shot to the head which would have sidelined anyone with today's concussion protocols. He would have started the next week.

True enough, and while Josh McCown played as well as he could without much weapons in there, I never felt like he was going to get the Eagles to the end zone in that game.  It was winnable and we just didn’t have the offense to do it.  I don’t want to put all of that on McCown — god bless him for gutting it out on a bad hamstring — but the Eagles suffered not having a viable #2 QB in that spot.  I believe that’s Doug’s thinking as well

Just now, Desertbirds said:

I think this Wentz is injury prone narrative is a bit overblown. He started all 16 games last year and started the playoff game. He was injured because of a cheep shot to the head which would have sidelined anyone with today's concussion protocols. He would have started the next week.

If Wentz and Dak traded injuries most people would say Dak is injury prone. Wentz couldn't even sit in a chair correctly after that concussion. I don't see any way he plays the rest of the playoffs. Especially with the NFL putting heavy emphasis on concussions.

20 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

I don’t think we’re getting a first round pick for Hurts unless Wentz misses a big chunk of time again; hopefully he’s a good X factor and does 1-2 short stints as a necessary starter in the next 2-3 seasons.  Getting a first for him means he’s gotten a fair amount of game action at starting QB

You’re giving DAL way too much credit for their draft.  Having Lamb fall to them worked out great and their other strong pick was Biadasz.  I don’t see Diggs being all that good, and they did next to nothing to improve their pass rush.  If LVE can’t come back strong next season I see them being not very good on defense.

I'm not so impressed with Biadasz as you are. A pretty good run blocker but only so-so in pass pro. His shortcomings there were hidden by Wisconsin's offensive style. He's not a fluid player which limits him in things like outside zone blocking and screens. Oregon did a lot of slanting in the Rose Bowl and that looked like it gave him problems. He may turn out to be a decent center but he is no Travis Frederick.

I think the way we lost to Seattle in the playoffs made a deep impression on Howie and Doug. Having nothing at QB after Wentz and, with Wentz's very real injury history, I believe they said "never again" to that. What happened with Andrew Luck may have been a factor as well. They may not want to replace Wentz anytime soon but they have privately come to the conclusion that it is a real possibility (JMHO, I emphasize). I think they would be  happy never playing Hurts except in mop-up duty.

1 hour ago, ManuManu said:

Hightower already bulked up for the combine (he was 17 pounds above his listed weight). I’m not sure how much more weight he can gain and maintain his speed. 

Not weight gain for just added weight. Weight gain from weightlifting.  He has some room to get a bit bigger and stronger in the upper body.  I am fine with his bird legs.  Suspect our new strength coach is better equipped to coach that than Boise State.

4 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

What does a veteran QB cost, though?  I started a thread some months ago listing the options available for the #2 QB next season and really Dalton and Mariota were the most reasonable alternatives.  Mariota got almost $9M from the Raiders.  Newton and Winston are both garbage IMO.

I’ve never seen a darn thing from Nate Sudfeld to make me believe he’s an NFL QB; time to move on.

Cost is irrelevant if you ask me.  Howie does one thing well and that's the cap.  If they paid Flacco $10 million to back-up Carson and used the 2nd rounder to move up for Lamb or stay put and draft Mims, Chinn, name your prospect I would be totally on board.  It's not our money, use it to make the team better.  I would rather waste cap space on a 1-year 2nd string quarterback instead of using a highly valuable 2nd round pick on a player we hope never plays.

I wasn't made they paid Chase Daniel $10 million.  Wasn't mad they paid Foles however much he got.  

Agree, Sudfeld hasn't shown a thing, just looking at what's been given to us in form of coach speak and how much they like him.

1 minute ago, justrelax said:

I'm not so impressed with Biadasz as you are. A pretty good run blocker but only so-so in pass pro. His shortcomings there were hidden by Wisconsin's offensive style. He's not a fluid player which limits him in things like outside zone blocking and screens. Oregon did a lot of slanting in the Rose Bowl and that looked like it gave him problems. He may turn out to be a decent center but he is no Travis Frederick.

I think the way we lost to Seattle in the playoffs made a deep impression on Howie and Doug. Having nothing at QB after Wentz and, with Wentz's very real injury history, I believe they said "never again" to that. What happened with Andrew Luck may have been a factor as well. They may not want to replace Wentz anytime soon but they have privately come to the conclusion that it is a real possibility (JMHO, I emphasize). I think they would be  happy never playing Hurts except in mop-up duty.

I defer to your evaluation on Biadasz — that makes the Turds draft look even a bit less shiny 😂

1 minute ago, IggleWalt said:

If Wentz and Dak traded injuries most people would say Dak is injury prone. Wentz couldn't even sit in a chair correctly after that concussion. I don't see any way he plays the rest of the playoffs. Especially with the NFL putting heavy emphasis on concussions.

For what it's worth, Wentz said he would have been good to go. I know athletes tend to downplay their injuries but this is the only information we have to go on.

Honestly didn’t realize Hurts weighed in combine at 222. Guess I just thought he was closer to 200..Im not saying line him up 10+ and run between the tackles but I definitely see Doug wanting to get him in the field in multiple gimmick roles including some run plays. 

 

27 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

It’s just one game, but it was so bad I’m not sure why we drafted him over any of our later picks. It was dreadful. 

The answer to that isn't that troubling when you look at who was selected after him:

 

Watkins - having already landed Hightower, Watkins is a bit of a 'luxury' pick as insurance on if Hightower flames out.  This also occurred after they had finalized the deal for Goodwin, making him that much more of a luxury.

Prince - I love him, I really do.  But the red flag of the knee injury is why he lasted as long as he did.  At the point the Eagles finally pulled the trigger you do it because... why not?  You hope for the best, but if the knee turns out to be too much... nothing much you lost in cost.

Toohill - Good pass rusher.  Bad run defender.  PS material.

3 minutes ago, justrelax said:

I'm not so impressed with Biadasz as you are. A pretty good run blocker but only so-so in pass pro. His shortcomings there were hidden by Wisconsin's offensive style. He's not a fluid player which limits him in things like outside zone blocking and screens. Oregon did a lot of slanting in the Rose Bowl and that looked like it gave him problems. He may turn out to be a decent center but he is no Travis Frederick.

I think the way we lost to Seattle in the playoffs made a deep impression on Howie and Doug. Having nothing at QB after Wentz and, with Wentz's very real injury history, I believe they said "never again" to that. What happened with Andrew Luck may have been a factor as well. They may not want to replace Wentz anytime soon but they have privately come to the conclusion that it is a real possibility (JMHO, I emphasize). I think they would be  happy never playing Hurts except in mop-up duty.

Agreed.  After McNabb missed several games in 2005 and 2006, Andy picked Kolb in 2007.

Especially like the Luck angle.  Players are making so much money that leaving early for health reasons won't be as rare.

1 hour ago, eagle45 said:

Let's dive into the future at DE for a second:

Fact 1: There is zero chance Graham and Barnett are allowed to count a total of $28.5m against the cap in 2021.

Assertion 1: I think it is unlikely Graham takes a pay cut substantial enough to make Graham/Barnett a viable option as the starting DE's in 2021.

Possibility 1: Graham may agree to a modest pay cut.  But this would only be enough for the Eagles to side with sentimentality/proven production so that they keep Graham while declining the option of Barnett.

Possibility 2: Graham won't take enough of a pay cut, Barnett stays on his $10.5m option and Graham is gone in 2021.

Possibility 3: Eagles trade for Yannick and extend him.  That means BOTH Graham and Barnett's contracts MUST be off the books for 2021.

 

Reasonable assumption/conclusion 1: The Eagles are going to have one veteran DE with starting experience in 2021.  The other spot will need to be entrusted to the competition between Sweat/Miller/Toohill and a high 2021 draft pick.  

Reasonable assumption/conclusion 2: Expect better than even odds that our 2021 first round pick is a DE.

Makes sense except for Yannick. His tweet storm was a huge red flag.  Eagles didn’t like the experience with Bennett.  He is gone. Tolerated it with Jenkins but he is gone too.  Neither took to Twitter to fight with the organization.  Lurie doesn’t tend to tolerate that.  Simon, TO, heck arguably Trot when he went south for a year. 

14 minutes ago, Karma_is_a_guy said:

Thinking about the most charitable way to look at drafting Hurts. I don't buy the future draft capital argument, because even a 1st round pick in 2021 or 2022 would essentially be a wash with a current #53 pick. It's possible he could be used like Taysom Hill in 1-4 plays every game. That, too, seems like an under use for someone who was arguably one of the top 5 QBs in this year's draft. Hurts deserves a shot at being a starter somewhere. One thing the Eagles do is overspend for the backup QB position, and given there is a 50/50 chance that QB will start at least one game, that might be a position worth spending on. If drafting Hurts frees up cap room next year and the following year, that could prove to be worth spending a second round pick for. Or maybe the Eagles are hedging their bets that Wentz won't be able to remain healthy. Or maybe they saw that a NFC East rival was fixing to snap him up, and it was a blocking move. So this could be seen as a cost-saving move looking ahead to the next two years when the Eagles may be facing cap strain.

Yea, the cost/cap angle is a leading factor imho. If you can save a lot of money on a backup that you feel can win games for you if needed that's pretty big. If he can contribute on a handful of make-or-break downs confusing the defense, even better. If you're able to trade him in a couple years for a 1 or even a 2, that's a cherry on top.

I didn't like the pick, but I understand the logic. It all depends on if the 3rd round LB and 4th round safety turn out well enough that we don't regret passing up either position in the 2nd. I think we did fine at WR in the end with those lottery tickets/speed receivers, so I'm not upset we didn't take a 2nd round WR. But if we're hurting at LB or safety and guys like Logan Wilson or Jeremy Chinn are lighting it up... then it'll feel awful.

44 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

Gotta hand it to Jimmy on this one

 

 

Every detail of that is hilarious.

9 minutes ago, justrelax said:

I'm not so impressed with Biadasz as you are. A pretty good run blocker but only so-so in pass pro. His shortcomings there were hidden by Wisconsin's offensive style. He's not a fluid player which limits him in things like outside zone blocking and screens. Oregon did a lot of slanting in the Rose Bowl and that looked like it gave him problems. He may turn out to be a decent center but he is no Travis Frederick.

I think the way we lost to Seattle in the playoffs made a deep impression on Howie and Doug. Having nothing at QB after Wentz and, with Wentz's very real injury history, I believe they said "never again" to that. What happened with Andrew Luck may have been a factor as well. They may not want to replace Wentz anytime soon but they have privately come to the conclusion that it is a real possibility (JMHO, I emphasize). I think they would be  happy never playing Hurts except in mop-up duty.

I think this is a huge part of it. That, in conjunction with his contract not allowing the same financial commitment to backup QBs where driving forces as I try to rationalize the pick. Well said jr

14 minutes ago, justrelax said:

I'm not so impressed with Biadasz as you are. A pretty good run blocker but only so-so in pass pro. His shortcomings there were hidden by Wisconsin's offensive style. He's not a fluid player which limits him in things like outside zone blocking and screens. Oregon did a lot of slanting in the Rose Bowl and that looked like it gave him problems. He may turn out to be a decent center but he is no Travis Frederick.

I think the way we lost to Seattle in the playoffs made a deep impression on Howie and Doug. Having nothing at QB after Wentz and, with Wentz's very real injury history, I believe they said "never again" to that. What happened with Andrew Luck may have been a factor as well. They may not want to replace Wentz anytime soon but they have privately come to the conclusion that it is a real possibility (JMHO, I emphasize). I think they would be  happy never playing Hurts except in mop-up duty.

You pay for insurance, hoping you never have to use it. It still has value.

8 minutes ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

Agreed.  After McNabb missed several games in 2005 and 2006, Andy picked Kolb in 2007.

Especially like the Luck angle.  Players are making so much money that leaving early for health reasons won't be as rare.

Especially concussions, you can live with a limp for $100M, but not with scrambled brains.