Just now, allphilly said:

Calvin?

charles

20 minutes ago, Godfather said:

Duvernay in the 3rd

I like duvernay not sure he can play on outside though may just be a slot guy but i like him. Hes a bit straightline for me but has great hands and speed and is tough.

20 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said:

 

That has been my thinking for a while now...I am rolling with 3 options

Priority A - Stay put and grab one of the top 4 WR's 

Priority B - Slide back 5-7 slots and grab a Tier 2 WR...pick up some ammunition to move up in the 2nd and grab a LB

Priority C - Stay put and grab the BPA with need - an LB (Queen or Murray) and then give up something to move up in the 2nd and get the WR

I think id prefer B or C but staying put just seems like settling to me.

13 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

That's silly. 

Why not just take the highest rated Punter?   

 

It's not about whether it's the 5th WR or the 2nd CB, its about which PLAYER is the better prospect and fits your team better.  If you want to say that CJ Henderson is a better prospect than Denzel Mims... then say that.  That's meaningful.   And I agree.   If you say 2nd CB over 5th WR, then I'll have to ask you who they are and consider them... 

 

As for the LB... same deal.   Is Patrick Queen or Kenneth Murray a better fit and prospect for this team than Jalen Reagor... whether Reagor is the top WR or the 10th doesn't matter... same as whether or not Queen/Murray is the 2nd best LB or the 12th.  

If you believe in BPA with need, then this argument becomes moot. Punter is not where draft value meets need so that argument is pretty weak. Positional value is less a priority than draft positional value. Grabbing a 2nd tier WR at 21 is a reach, but the 2nd rated CB or LB has a draft value right around 21-25 so drafting for need makes sense. Of course I am predicating that on believing the WRs and LBs both have the highest priority going into this draft. There is just more options at WR in the early rounds.

Is Queen or Murray and better fit than Reagor. Yes! They are a better value at 21 so I would prefer the Eagles move back a few spots for the WR or grab the LB.

Of, course there has to be a trade partner...that's the challenge!

17 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said:

 

That has been my thinking for a while now...I am rolling with 3 options

Priority A - Stay put and grab one of the top 4 WR's 

Priority B - Slide back 5-7 slots and grab a Tier 2 WR...pick up some ammunition to move up in the 2nd and grab a LB

Priority C - Stay put and grab the BPA with need - an LB (Queen or Murray) and then give up something to move up in the 2nd and get the WR

The issue with moving back 5-7 slots is that MIN, NE, MIN, NO have the next 4 picks after us and could pick a WR and our first WR drafted could be a Higgins/ Hamler type.

3 minutes ago, Utebird said:

I think id prefer B or C but staying put just seems like settling to me.

As Bowen just said, if the Eagles want the top 4 WR's it may take a small trade up...but it will be expensive because all those teams are looking for WR as well.

1 minute ago, Han Solo said:

The issue with moving back 5-7 slots is that MIN, NE, MIN, NO have the next 4 picks after us and could pick a WR and our first WR drafted could be a Higgins/ Hamler type.

The Eagles are in no man's land for WR, which again brings up the option of going CB/LB. 

18 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

That's silly. 

Why not just take the highest rated Punter?   

 

It's not about whether it's the 5th WR or the 2nd CB, its about which PLAYER is the better prospect and fits your team better.  If you want to say that CJ Henderson is a better prospect than Denzel Mims... then say that.  That's meaningful.   And I agree.   If you say 2nd CB over 5th WR, then I'll have to ask you who they are and consider them... 

 

As for the LB... same deal.   Is Patrick Queen or Kenneth Murray a better fit and prospect for this team than Jalen Reagor... whether Reagor is the top WR or the 10th doesn't matter... same as whether or not Queen/Murray is the 2nd best LB or the 12th.  

Well I’m thinking these other positions that get pushed down are going to be better than the next bunch of wide receivers. You can still move up from round two for a wide receiver. Reagor, Aiyuk, Shenault, Higgins, Hamler... There will be some receivers there. The depth at these other positions doesn’t match up to the quality depth of receiver, at least I don’t think. I can’t see how Diggs, Queen, Murray aren’t fits here and they won’t get out of round 1. Probably between the 18-32 area is where they go and we have a need for these areas as well. It’s an option is all im saying. I think the consensus top 4 receivers are all gone by 21 too which is why I’m thinking of other options. 

3 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

I sent this.  
 

 

i sent 

 

13 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

That's silly. 

Why not just take the highest rated Punter?   

 

It's not about whether it's the 5th WR or the 2nd CB, its about which PLAYER is the better prospect and fits your team better.  If you want to say that CJ Henderson is a better prospect than Denzel Mims... then say that.  That's meaningful.   And I agree.   If you say 2nd CB over 5th WR, then I'll have to ask you who they are and consider them... 

 

As for the LB... same deal.   Is Patrick Queen or Kenneth Murray a better fit and prospect for this team than Jalen Reagor... whether Reagor is the top WR or the 10th doesn't matter... same as whether or not Queen/Murray is the 2nd best LB or the 12th.  

I think reagor is a better pick at 21 than any LB other than simmons.

I also think murray or queen may be better at 21 than Mims but im not as confident about that but i definitely think henderson has more value than mims or anyLB outside of simmons.

I think if reagor and henderson are there at 21 id flip a coin. I think henderson could end up being the best corner from this draft and same goes for reagor.

I imagine howie and co have a bunch of receivers rated higher than lbs not named simmons but im not sure how many WRs they have rated over henderson at CB. 

 

2 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said:

The Eagles are in no man's land for WR, which again brings up the option of going CB/LB. 

Then we end up with the Donnell Pumphrey of the WR class

4 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said:

As Bowen just said, if the Eagles want the top 4 WR's it may take a small trade up...but it will be expensive because all those teams are looking for WR as well.

Id rather trade down than up, trading down to me isnt settling when one re coups more picks and can still get a player of value.

1 minute ago, Han Solo said:

Then we end up with the Donnell Pumphrey of the WR class

NO, we end up having to trade up into the 2nd to get someone.

6 minutes ago, Han Solo said:

Then we end up with the Donnell Pumphrey of the WR class

Uggg not sure there is a donell pumphrey at WR in this class, but if there is leave it to howie to pick him.

4 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said:

NO, we end up having to trade up into the 2nd to get someone.

Or trade back in the first or even early second.

4 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said:

The Eagles are in no man's land for WR, which again brings up the option of going CB/LB. 

Or, take your preferred WR at 21, value be damned.  That way you know you’ve gotten your 5th most preferred WR, which is better than settling for the 8th. 

5 hours ago, justrelax said:

Well, some small nuggets. Judson Kilpatrick was a brigadier general of cavalry in Sherman's Army. He was known as "Kill-cavalry" for his penchant of charging infantry positions with mounted troopers. Not good. He was particularly bad at Second Bull Run (aka Second Manassas). During Sherman's March through Georgia, Kilpatrick travelled with an entourage that included at least one mistress, possibly more.

George Armstrong Custer, something of a hero in the Civil War, was killed with his men near the Little Bighorn River in 1871, IIRC. The traditional depiction of his last stand is one of his men forming a circle, surrounded by thousands of Sioux and Cheyenne. Not the case. They were basically chased and cut down in small numbers over an extended period of time and space. Major Reno, who was with a separate detachment, spent the battle staggering around drunk on brandy, with a small cask under his arm. He survived the battle on dumb luck.

Major General Joseph Hooker was a heavy drinker and womanizer. He would throw parties for his friends and staff, attended by um, ladies of the evening. This is the most favored of the theories for the origin of the work "hooker" to mean prostitute. Hooker was sacked as commander of the Army of the Potomac three days before the Battle of Gettysburg, when his army was already on the move to follow Lee. He was replaced by George G. Meade who, when awakened at 3:00 a.m. on June 28th to be apprised of his promotion, thought at first that he was being arrested.

Good stuff.  Little Bighorn is an interesting battlefield to walk.  The archeology on tracing the battle is pretty interesting.  Custer prevailed in the Civil War on bravado.  He was not a particularly skilled tactician and that really showed at Little Bighorn.

Interesting factoid.  The commanders of soldiers that responded to John Brown’s raid, JEB Stuart and Robert E .Lee.   Both were highly involved at Gettysburg so it is ironic the proximity to Harpers Ferry and their pivotal role in both events.  

2 minutes ago, purplefiggy said:

Or, take your preferred WR at 21, value be damned.  That way you know you’ve gotten your 5th most preferred WR, which is better than settling for the 8th. 

It is certainly a likely possibility especially  knowing  trade partners may be hard to find. What if you have the same draft grade for the next 6 WR's . I think the Eagles would have to be really sold on that specific player at 21.

1 minute ago, Inigo Montoya said:

If you believe in BPA with need, then this argument becomes moot. Punter is not where draft value meets need so that argument is pretty weak. Positional value is less a priority than draft positional value. Grabbing a 2nd tier WR at 21 is a reach, but the 2nd rated CB or LB has a draft value right around 21-25 so drafting for need makes sense. Of course I am predicating that on believing the WRs and LBs both have the highest priority going into this draft. There is just more options at WR in the early rounds.

Is Queen or Murray and better fit than Reagor. Yes! They are a better value at 21 so I would prefer the Eagles move back a few spots for the WR or grab the LB.

The punter comment was hyperbole, obviously.

Your first paragraph is still dealing in platitudes... 2nd tier WR versus 2nd rated CB.    Names are what matter, prospect rankings, not positional rankings.  

 

You want Queen or Murray over Reagor, that's fine and good.  That's a discussion worth having.  You want to say that then 2nd CB or 2nd LB is better than the 5th WR.  That's meaningless.   

 

I don't disagree that Queen/Murray is a better answer at 21 than Reagor, but only because of the prospects not because Queen is the 2nd best LB in this draft and Reagor is the 6th WR.  That doesn't matter.   Queen as a better fit than Reagor... sure.  And the idea of moving back from 21... sure.  But, there needs to be a trade partner to make that happen.  You can't force another team to make that deal.  And if the team puts such a positional value on the WR position because Carson needs HELP, then I could see Reagor (or Mims or Higgins) at 21 over those LBs.  And while it may not be value in a vacuum, you have to agree that forcing Wentz to play with the WRs he had last year is just not an option.  So they have to find WRs in this draft.  And if they feel that they can't get one at 53, or won't be able to move up from there and don't have a trade back partner, I can imagine that they may feel the need to reach for a WR over the value at LB.  And frankly, I wouldn't be overly upset about it.  I just hope that they hit on the guy that they would 'reach' for in that scenario.  

3 minutes ago, BigEFly said:

Good stuff.  Little Bighorn is an interesting battlefield to walk.  The archeology on tracing the battle is pretty interesting.  Custer prevailed in the Civil War on bravado.  He was not a particularly skilled tactician and that really showed at Little Bighorn.

Interesting factoid.  The commanders of soldiers that responded to John Brown’s raid, JEB Stuart and Robert E .Lee.   Both were highly involved at Gettysburg so it is ironic the proximity to Harpers Ferry and their pivotal role in both events.  

Question- do generals these days travel with mistresses? 

1 minute ago, Iggles_Phan said:

The punter comment was hyperbole, obviously.

Your first paragraph is still dealing in platitudes... 2nd tier WR versus 2nd rated CB.    Names are what matter, prospect rankings, not positional rankings.  

 

You want Queen or Murray over Reagor, that's fine and good.  That's a discussion worth having.  You want to say that then 2nd CB or 2nd LB is better than the 5th WR.  That's meaningless.   

 

I don't disagree that Queen/Murray is a better answer at 21 than Reagor, but only because of the prospects not because Queen is the 2nd best LB in this draft and Reagor is the 6th WR.  That doesn't matter.   Queen as a better fit than Reagor... sure.  And the idea of moving back from 21... sure.  But, there needs to be a trade partner to make that happen.  You can't force another team to make that deal.  And if the team puts such a positional value on the WR position because Carson needs HELP, then I could see Reagor (or Mims or Higgins) at 21 over those LBs.  And while it may not be value in a vacuum, you have to agree that forcing Wentz to play with the WRs he had last year is just not an option.  So they have to find WRs in this draft.  And if they feel that they can't get one at 53, or won't be able to move up from there and don't have a trade back partner, I can imagine that they may feel the need to reach for a WR over the value at LB.  And frankly, I wouldn't be overly upset about it.  I just hope that they hit on the guy that they would 'reach' for in that scenario.  

I am in agreement. Thanks, we are on the same page. I just enjoy the chess board intrigue at this point.

11 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said:

NO, we end up having to trade up into the 2nd to get someone.

So...

1) Trade down and pick up assets

2) Watch 3 or 4 more WRs come off the board (Remember Min, NE, NO, GB, SF all pick after us in round 1 and almost every team at the top of round 2 needs WR help)

3) Get desperate and trade all the assets we acquired in step 1 to move up in round 2

4) Draft the 8th WR on your board when you could've stayed at 21 and drafted a better one.

 

3 minutes ago, Utebird said:

I think reagor is a better pick at 21 than any LB other than simmons.

I also think murray or queen may be better at 21 than Mims but im not as confident about that but i definitely think henderson has more value than mims or anyLB outside of simmons.

I think if reagor and henderson are there at 21 id flip a coin. I think henderson could end up being the best corner from this draft and same goes for reagor.

I imagine howie and co have a bunch of receivers rated higher than lbs not named simmons but im not sure how many WRs they have rated over henderson at CB. 

 

I am not a fan of Reagor. I like the speed but that’s about it. He’s just one of the guys I didn’t get that good feeling about so I’m hoping we don’t go that route. Since I don’t like him you can bet your bottom dollar we get him. 
I’d rather Mims, Aiyuk even Shenault at 21 or a small move back for one.

Henderson is good, but I think he’s gone before 21 so I’m not considering him a real option there. If so, he should absolutely be considered. I think at least one of Diggs/Johnson/Gladney and one of Murray/Queen will be there at 21 though. 

26 minutes ago, allphilly said:

Calvin?

yup

11 minutes ago, Utebird said:

Uggg not sure there is a donell pumphrey at WR in this class, but if there us leave it to howie to pick him.

Darrell Mooney