9 minutes ago, MediterraneanDiet said:

This is interesting.   Many of the football players we love, write about, cheer for, talk about food insecurity growing up.  Are you suggesting their parents should not have had them?  

Not if they were making smart decisions. Nfl players are by definition outliners with Unexpected physical ability. If they werent playing someone else would be

2 minutes ago, WentzFan11 said:

Cause we didn’t let them abort. 

So long as they pay for it themselves i am fine with legal abortion

7 minutes ago, ToastJenkins said:

Yes i am blaming the parents. Thats what accountability and responsibility looks like
 

wages move with supply and demand. Unskilled labor has never been less valuable. Those jobs are not meant to support a family.

i dont support corporate welfare either but who is the second largest employer again? Was the USPS last time i looked...public sector jobs are far bigger welfare

More and more jobs are becoming meaningless. That’s automation at work. The issue is that we don’t have enough good jobs to go around. Thus people are forced to work those jobs to provide for their family. 
 

There’s no reason why someone should work a  full time job and still need government assistance. Big business is taking your tax payer dollars so they don’t have to foot the bill. 

19 minutes ago, Desertbirds said:

Your version of democracy is quite different from mine. There was no vote regarding the letter. Either you agreed with it or you had no say.

Are you suggesting that WSU should have had a vote on whether or not they should start a petition? Should they have had a vote on that vote and a vote on that vote, i mean i feel like somebody infringed on my rights as i wasnt asked to vote on whether a petition should be formed nor did i get to sign the petition.

Weird its almost as if it had absolutely nothing to do with me other than my wife works at WSU.

If the students here in wichita are that upset about it which the arent why dont they start their own petition to re invite the uninvited Ivanka?

Again this isnt some liberal conspiracy their are like two liberals in Wichita if anything the people that voted most likely dislike ivanka and what she stands for more than they dislike conservative politics.

This isnt extremely liberal Berkely where ive also lived this is wichita where they grow wheat and vote republican.

1 minute ago, ToastJenkins said:

Not if they were making smart decisions. Nfl players are by definition outliners with Unexpected physical ability. If they werent playing someone else would be

Not a direct answer but its not an easy  question to answer..  What if they were young and made immature decisions?  What if their religious beliefs impacted their choices and decisions?   My point is "smart" is both subjective and situational.  Your definition of whether it is a smart choice to have a child is not, as I know you know, universal. 

5 minutes ago, Utebird said:

Are you suggesting that WSU should have had a vote on whether or not they should start a petition? Should they have had a vote on that vote and a vote on that vote, i mean i feel like somebody infringed on my rights as i wasnt asked to vote on whether a petition should be formed nor did i get to sign the petition.

Weird its almost as if it had absolutely nothing to do with me other than my wife works at WSU.

If the students here in wichita are that upset about it which the arent why dont they start their own petition to re invite the uninvited Ivanka?

Again this is some liberal conspiracy their are like two liberals in Wichita if anything the people that voted most likely dislike ivanka and what she stands for more than they dislike conservative politics.

This isnt extremely liberal Berkely where ive also lived this is wichita where they grow wheat and vote republican.

I not sure what your point is with this post.

I was refuting your claim that the letter was the result of a democratic process.

 

6 minutes ago, ToastJenkins said:

Yes i am blaming the parents. Thats what accountability and responsibility looks like
 

wages move with supply and demand. Unskilled labor has never been less valuable. Those jobs are not meant to support a family.

i dont support corporate welfare either but who is the second largest employer again? Was the USPS last time i looked...public sector jobs are far bigger welfare

Unskilled labor is a great term coined by capitalist to drive down wages of the working class. 

If those jobs arent meant to support a family and there are limited opportunities for " skilled jobs" then what do you suggest the people that cant get skilled jobs do. 

Die? Decrease the surplus population and all that?

2 hours ago, Desertbirds said:

Yes, but you will always be a Texan. That disqualifies you in New Mexico.

Probably does.  Touché.  

13 minutes ago, ToastJenkins said:

Not if they were making smart decisions. Nfl players are by definition outliners with Unexpected physical ability. If they werent playing someone else would be

So now whether or not a person has food or a home is dependant on how smart they are.

So youre saying not only are homeless stupid people lazy theyre also dumb.

I bet youre fun at parties😒

2 hours ago, bpac55 said:

Those are good points.  I have always always associated DARE with the police. I'm an 80s child so I think I was around for the infant stages of it.  Also McGruff the crime dog.  How much money here in York is spent on the drug that revives victims of OD?  That's part of the police budget too.  Should people that OD be a police issue or an EMT issue?

 

Narcan.  We put it in all our police cars.  Lifesaver.  

2 hours ago, Utebird said:

Cities arent people, corporations legally yes, cities no so...

Having said that i doubt " people" protesting will beg the police to come back and shoot them with rubber bullets nor deserve a raise for doing so.

Cops exist to protect domestic capital interests and serve those in control of those capital interest.

Cities are capital for those in control when cops are called into to use force they do so to protect capital interest bot the peoples interest.

If the police were protecting and serving the people the protesters they would be marching with them and protecting them from those trying to disrupt discredit and incite violence in  Instead the cops and national guard are disrupting discrediting and inciting violence.

Dont fool yourself into thinking cops exist to protect society. They exist to protect capital.

 

Lots of cities are incorporated, FWIW...

The rest is mostly Marxist drivel. Do you know what "capital” includes?

Homes. Stores. Cars.

Anyone who has made anything of their life financially has "capital interests.”

5 minutes ago, Desertbirds said:

I not sure what your point is with this post.

I was refuting your claim that the letter was the result of a democratic process.

 

And i was explaining that a petition is a form of democracy.

11 minutes ago, WentzFan11 said:

More and more jobs are becoming meaningless. That’s automation at work. The issue is that we don’t have enough good jobs to go around. Thus people are forced to work those jobs to provide for their family. 
 

There’s no reason why someone should work a  full time job and still need government assistance. Big business is taking your tax payer dollars so they don’t have to foot the bill. 

That sounds nice but as Jules would say...that ish aint the truth.

if all a person is capable of are those jobs they should not be having kids.

Big business is where the economy happens. our problem is that the bottom 80% of earners pay almost nothing into the system. Its the ignored reality when comparing to socialist systems. They tax the hell out of lower earners too
 

the people taking my tax dollars are the failures and public sector workers. 

6 minutes ago, Utebird said:

Unskilled labor is a great term coined by capitalist to drive down wages of the working class. 

If those jobs arent meant to support a family and there are limited opportunities for " skilled jobs" then what do you suggest the people that cant get skilled jobs do. 

Die? Decrease the surplus population and all that?

I suggest they adapt or get left behind

all you have are tired and disproven collectivist cliches. You ever had a real job? Doesnt sound like it...

6 minutes ago, Utebird said:

So now whether or not a person has food or a home is dependant on how smart they are.

So youre saying not only are homeless stupid people lazy theyre also dumb.

I bet youre fun at parties😒

Sure am i usually bring good whisky or beer

2 minutes ago, TEW said:

Lots of cities are incorporated, FWIW...

The rest is mostly Marxist drivel. Do you know what "capital” includes?

Homes. Stores. Cars.

Anyone who has made anything of their life financially has "capital interests.”

Yes most people have capital interests and in most cases the police dont protect most peoples capital interests they protect corporate domestic capital interests. If they were protecting most peoples capital interests they wouldnt be slashing tires at protests. They wouldnt be enforcing home seizure and foreclosure they wouldnt enforce taxes for private corporate enterprises so on and so on yet here we are...

2 hours ago, Utebird said:

A barber receives more training to be a barber than a cop does to be a cop.

That isn’t true.   Our local police get tons of training.  The question is whether the training is appropriate. 
Scary how relevant this is fifty years later.  I was 12  

 

I hope the NFL doesn’t cut 2 preseason games. I actually love to watch the kids play

1 hour ago, ToastJenkins said:

I didnt mean you   i meant the liberals as welfare staters

we would have been better off in the long run to let AIG go under. Same with banks. Now weve set the expectation of bailout and warped the risk analysis.

The social safety net argument ignores the human behavior aspects

 

Well, too big too fail has been gutted since that time.

5 minutes ago, Utebird said:

Unskilled labor is a great term coined by capitalist to drive down wages of the working class. 

If those jobs arent meant to support a family and there are limited opportunities for " skilled jobs" then what do you suggest the people that cant get skilled jobs do. 

Die? Decrease the surplus population and all that?

It’s a fair question...

We need to come to a basic understanding before this question can be answered though.

On the one hand, some people argue the "nurture” side of the equation. We are more or less all blank slates at birth from an intellectual standpoint. We can all "learn” to do the same things. With the right upbringing, you or I could have been Newton or Bach or Shakespeare. If this is the case, then there are two issues that present obstacles: (1) Upbringing and (2) personal motivation. So if this is the case, we just teach them marketable skills. Anyone unmotivated enough to seize that opportunity should rightfully be unsupported by society.

On the other hand, we can look at the "nature” side of the equation. In this case, we don’t all have the same potential. We are not all the same. Some are simply smarter than others. Some people are literally too dumb to ever do anything productive. This is the military’s stance, by the way, after many studies on the relationship between performance and IQ. They just won’t accept people under a certain threshold because it’s a waste of resources. So in this case, where someone’s full potential is to lift boxes at an Amazon warehouse, then maybe we really do need to rethink the role of the welfare state to acknowledge that some people are so fundamentally unfit for modernity that they cannot possibly ever provide enough value to society to earn a decent living.

Both of these positions present a lot of uncomfortable truths within them, and most people balk at the prospect of a real conversation, but if we are to get anywhere then we’ve got to start with the nature versus nurture debate. Everything flow from there because it is either the case that people are not reaching their potential or they are.

35 minutes ago, Asg 15 said:

Arizona State University revoked a job offer from its incoming journalism school dean after students and faculty accused her of "microaggressions," including a tweet that called some police officers "good."

Tell me again that leftists aren't trying to stifle free speech

Be careful what you cheer for. The political climate swings back and forth. Next time it might be your free speech being trampled.

This isn't a matter of free speech.  The incoming dean was able to express her views.

The issue is that those views, in the opinion of the administrations, were inconsistent with the values they want to convey.

I'll defend your right to free speech.  Don't blame me for the consequences of what you say.

7 minutes ago, Utebird said:

Yes most people have capital interests and in most cases the police dont protect most peoples capital interests they protect corporate domestic capital interests. If they were protecting most peoples capital interests they wouldnt be slashing tires at protests. They wouldnt be enforcing home seizure and foreclosure they wouldnt enforce taxes for private corporate enterprises so on and so on yet here we are...

Now this is a very clever observation.

Why is it that a government, elected by people, would deliberately allow a relatively small mob of people to destroy their voter’s capital?

10 minutes ago, ToastJenkins said:

That sounds nice but as Jules would say...that ish aint the truth.

if all a person is capable of are those jobs they should not be having kids.

Big business is where the economy happens. our problem is that the bottom 80% of earners pay almost nothing into the system. Its the ignored reality when comparing to socialist systems. They tax the hell out of lower earners too
 

the people taking my tax dollars are the failures and public sector workers. 

Really, so you paying 700% a year on average to big business is great because failed trickle down economics but that 30$ a year you give to fund food stamps is a drain on society?

How do you feel about the taxes you pay towards the military budget which is far more than you pay in just about everything else. Unless you are a weapons manufacture that investment isnt really paying off unless you are suggesting that US economic growth and sustainabilty is dependent on War and blowing people up?

Nice that you categorize people as failures bevause they arent good enough at capitalism to not starve or house themselves, but then again its because theyre either lazy or stupid or both right?

5 minutes ago, uncphillyfan said:

I hope the NFL doesn’t cut 2 preseason games. I actually love to watch the kids play

It's actually a knee-jerk response by Goodell to infringe on the players right to express their abilities.

1 hour ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

Disagree.  The bailouts were necessary to keep the credit and liquidity markets for collapsing.

The mistake was not prosecuting the few dozen executives that set the crisis into motion or didn't raise alarms.  It was gross negligence on a grand scale.

Further, almost all of the TARP money proved to the banks was returned.

Damn, you are on fire tonight. Bravo. I would add it is also the insulation Directors and Officers insurance ( my area) gives the bad actors and the willingness of professional class action attorneys to take the insurance money and not hit the executives individually so that they can get their legal fees is detrimental to a holding to account of such bad actors.  Hank Greenberg had the balls to sue the US for bailing out his firm for horrible risk transfer practices at Hank’s direction.