16 hours ago, downundermike said:

OTC, and calculating what actually happens after all the one-year players with void years accelerate to the current year, and if Cox and Kelce are June 1 releases as their new contracts were designed for. I have actually had a pretty lengthy email exchange with Jason at over the cap, and he verified all my numbers are correct.

 

3 hours ago, downundermike said:

 

@mattwill never received a response to my last.  I can give  you the link to my google spreadsheet if you like.  

You are right I didn't see your response.  Thank you for sharing your process.  As I noted in my responses to Paco yesterday (see below) both OTC and Spotrac have already accounted for those dollars in their 2023 active Cap amounts.  For example in 2023 they have Hargrave with a Dead Cap of $0 a Base Salary of $0 a Signing Bonus Proration of $4,802,000 and a total Cap Number of $11,956,000.  As they say in the Prego spaghetti sauce ad "It's in there!"  When  you perform the manual manipulation anticipating the acceleration, the $11,956,000 active Cap Number is reduced to $0 and the Dead Cap total is increased by $11,956,000.  No 2023 Cap space is lost as a result of the acceleration.  In fact, if Howie decides to negotiate another one-year contract with Hargrave, it is likely that Hargrave's 2023 Cap Number on OTC and Spotrac will come down, and Howie will have more available Cap space to work with.

 

 15 hours ago, mattwill said:

The numbers for Hargrave’s, Bradbury, White, and Edwards are all accounted for as active commitments by Spotrac and OTC.  If the Dead Cap goes up the active commitments go down by a equal amount. Either way the Eagles have just under $30 million of available Cap for Howie to work with.

 

15 hours ago, mattwill said:

Those dollars are accounted for on both sites as active contractual commitments.  You are jumping the gun in labeling those dollars as dead prior to them actually becoming dead.  For example, Hargrave’s 2023 active contract commitment is recognized by both Spotrac and OTC as $11,956,000.  You appear to want to count that as Dead Cap, but if the Dead Cap goes up by that amount the Active Cap goes down by the same amount.  The final number will differ regardless of whether Hargrave’s is an Eagle in 2023 or not.

 

I’m pheeling a 3-1 lead tonight. Nola isn’t perfect, but the bats stay hot. Slug fest. 
 

If we are up 3-1 there’s no way Topper let’s game 5 be a bullpen/Thor game, right?
 

I pheel like ya gotta throw Wheeler out there. 

 

@LeanMeanGM

Eagles 24

Texans 17

*bold prediction- unhappy the Eagles have to grind out a win half the EMB wants 75% of roster traded for future draft picks.

8 minutes ago, EaglesRocker97 said:

I wish they'd wear all green again. I remember random things, and the last time they did a green jersey/green pants combo was like 2002/03 against Washington, I believe 

last game at the Vet.

2 minutes ago, Outlaw said:

I’m pheeling a 3-1 lead tonight. Nola isn’t perfect, but the bats stay hot. Slug fest. 
 

If we are up 3-1 there’s no way Topper let’s game 5 be a bullpen/Thor game, right?

I think Nola will have a bounce back game being at home with this crowd. The whole team really should be riding a massive wave of momentum after last night. 

8 minutes ago, mattwill said:

You are right I didn't see your response.  Thank you for sharing your process.  As I noted in my responses to Paco yesterday (see below) both OTC and Spotrac have already accounted for those dollars in their 2023 active Cap amounts.  For example in 2023 they have Hargrave with a Dead Cap of $0 a Base Salary of $0 a Signing Bonus Proration of $4,802,000 and a total Cap Number of $11,956,000.  As they say in the Prego spaghetti sauce ad "It's in there!"  When  you perform the manual manipulation anticipating the acceleration, the $11,956,000 active Cap Number is reduced to $0 and the Dead Cap total is increased by $11,956,000.  No 2023 Cap space is lost as a result of the acceleration.  In fact, if Howie decides to negotiate another one-year contract with Hargrave, it is likely that Hargrave's 2023 Cap Number on OTC and Spotrac will come down, and Howie will have more available Cap space to work with.

 

I understand it fully.  The problem when people look at future years currently, they do not see it as the dead cap it will become so they do not see the full scope of it.

The issue is, when most folks click on this link, they do not understand that the two highlighted amounts are already dead money, but think the dead money is just what is in the section on the right.

https://overthecap.com/salary-cap/philadelphia-eagles

 

13 minutes ago, EaglesRocker97 said:

I wish they'd wear all green again. I remember random things, and the last time they did a green jersey/green pants combo was like 2002/03 against Washington, I believe 

Yup. The 02 game against the Skins which was the last regular season game at the Vet. 

2 hours ago, LeanMeanGM said:

 

Here's what I have for tomorrow night. I'm fairly certain someone quoted me their prediction but I wasn't at my laptop and I can't find it anymore. 

Eagles 27 Texans 10

21 in the first half and 2 time draining field goal drives in the second half

14 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

I think Nola will have a bounce back game being at home with this crowd. The whole team really should be riding a massive wave of momentum after last night. 

Hope you’re right on Nola. This is the game every kid dreams about in little league. Either way I agree, the bats have all the momentum. 

@LeanMeanGM

Eagles 30

Texans 17

 

17 minutes ago, Outlaw said:

I’m pheeling a 3-1 lead tonight. Nola isn’t perfect, but the bats stay hot. Slug fest. 
 

If we are up 3-1 there’s no way Topper let’s game 5 be a bullpen/Thor game, right?
 

I pheel like ya gotta throw Wheeler out there. 

If they win tonight there is no earthly way they don't start wheeler, even if it's for 4 or 5 innings.

1 minute ago, devpool said:

If they win tonight there is no earthly way they don't start wheeler, even if it's for 4 or 5 innings.

I agree. But Thomson looked pretty adamant last night post-game saying Thor. 

22 minutes ago, mattwill said:

You are right I didn't see your response.  Thank you for sharing your process.  As I noted in my responses to Paco yesterday (see below) both OTC and Spotrac have already accounted for those dollars in their 2023 active Cap amounts.  For example in 2023 they have Hargrave with a Dead Cap of $0 a Base Salary of $0 a Signing Bonus Proration of $4,802,000 and a total Cap Number of $11,956,000.  As they say in the Prego spaghetti sauce ad "It's in there!"  When  you perform the manual manipulation anticipating the acceleration, the $11,956,000 active Cap Number is reduced to $0 and the Dead Cap total is increased by $11,956,000.  No 2023 Cap space is lost as a result of the acceleration.  In fact, if Howie decides to negotiate another one-year contract with Hargrave, it is likely that Hargrave's 2023 Cap Number on OTC and Spotrac will come down, and Howie will have more available Cap space to work with.

This is why the Eagles' cap situation looks worse than it is, before diving into anything.

The cap situation is not good, but it's not catastrophic either. There are teams like the Packers, Bucs, Saints who are capped out, have old rosters AND don't have premium picks. We have the assets to get out of this.

It will just suck to lose some good players this off-season, but even then that means comp picks in 2024.

1 minute ago, Outlaw said:

I agree. But Thomson looked pretty adamant last night post-game saying Thor. 

Hopefully it's just him not putting the cart before the horse. It would be crazy if he started Thor up 3-1. Unless his plan is to start Thor for 3 and bring wheeler in hopefully with a lead for 4 and let Alvarado and seranthony finish it off, idk how comfortable wheeler is doing that though. Also makes no sense to do that, just start wheeler lol

2 hours ago, SkippyX said:

You can't expect a QB drafted at 8 or 32 to be able to play at a high level until year 3. You get lucky if you get more.

We are talking MVP level QB play, that unlikely crap is for people stuck in last year.

You miss the point.  Football isn't an individual sport like golf or tennis.  It is a team sport.  I agree with you that on an individual player level going from an MVP to replacement player is a step down.  But at the same time as that step down is being taken, a step up is being taken at multiple other key positions ... CB, Safety, and LB with the Cap dollars ... and EDGE and OT with the additional two 1st Round and two 2nd Round picks.  

What you don't appear to be taking into consideration is the timing.  Mahomes got a year to be the #2 QB and learn before stepping in as the #1.  Steve Young spent more than a year playing behind Montana.  Hurts' first year was scheduled to be a backup, but that ended up being accelerated.  If the Eagles draft the projected replacement this spring, that gives Sirriani and the coaches the whole 2023 season to handle the projected replacement the same way Andy Reid handled Mahomes.  And at the same time Slay and Bradberry and CGJ and Epps and Maddox are killing it as a well oiled machine.

With all the above said, here's a question for you ... Which has been a more important contributor to the Eagles 7-0 record (A) Hurts' play or (B) the +14 turnover ratio?

 

NOTE: unlike the polarized conversations about Hurts in the 2022 Offseason, I'm not insisting the approach I have described is RIGHT.  Rather I'm presenting an intellectual conundrum for us all to cogitaste about and discuss. 

It's awesome to see how much everyone is embracing and giving back to the fanbase who is already giving their all to the team.

54 minutes ago, Aerolithe_Lion said:

But that’s in a full 17 game season, not what those stats would have been I. 16 games. Those are Robert Woods/Adam Thielen/heck Michael Gallup numbers. Is that a good enough WR to carry that offense when their opponent is scoring on them? It wasn’t just that they had a backup in, Dallas’s passing attack stagnated because we locked down both their wide outs. All 3 picks were forced passes to Lamb or Gallup. I feel they have 2 quality 2’s, and no one to really pick them up when they need it like Amari Occasionally did

Are we under the assumption that Dalton Schultz being hurt earlier in the year and he’s not gonna get healthier and start being more productive? Because he’s also been more productive since dak has come back. I also think Michael Gallup is going to be healthier as the season goes on as his knee recovers more and more. If they are smart using pollard more is gonna really help open things up as a pass catcher out of the backfield 

I am not saying Dallas is going to beat the Eagles. What I am telling you with Prescott and those guys getting healthier that’s a better offense then the one we saw. They are gonna get better, not worse with Dak out there over cooper rush. You saw the jump from game 1 with Dak to game 2 with Dak the offense looked better. I’m not saying Dak is a savior but I’m also not naive to think Dak doesn’t make that offense more formidable against us  

also, who cares if it’s 16 anymore. They’re not playing 16 games anymore. They play 17. Also, CeeDee Lamb is currently 9th in receiving yards. So he’s a top 10 wide receiver in receiving yards. He is on pace to finish in the top 10 in receiving and is top 15 in receptions. I would add he hasn’t had his starting quarterback for a majority of the season and since dak has come back, he’s been better and he’s seen an increase in yards, yards per reception. 

1 minute ago, mattwill said:

You miss the point.  Football isn't an individual sport like golf or tennis.  It is a team sport.  I agree with you that on an individual player level going from an MVP to replacement player is a step down.  But at the same time as that step down is being taken, a step up is being taken at multiple other key positions ... CB, Safety, and LB with the Cap dollars ... and EDGE and OT with the additional two 1st Round and two 2nd Round picks.  

What you don't appear to be taking into consideration is the timing.  Mahomes got a year to be the #2 QB and learn before stepping in as the #1.  Steve Young spent more than a year playing behind Montana.  Hurts' first year was scheduled to be a backup, but that ended up being accelerated.  If the Eagles draft the projected replacement this spring, that gives Sirriani and the coaches the whole 2023 season to handle the projected replacement the same way Andy Reid handled Mahomes.  And at the same time Slay and Bradberry and CGJ and Epps and Maddox are killing it as a well oiled machine.

With all the above said, here's a question for you ... Which has been a more important contributor to the Eagles 7-0 record (A) Hurts' play or (B) the +14 turnover ratio?

 

NOTE: unlike the polarized conversations about Hurts in the 2022 Offseason, I'm not insisting the approach I have described is RIGHT.  Rather I'm presenting an intellectual conundrum for us all to cogitaste about and discuss. 

(A) and (B) are not mutually exclusive.  Our turnover margin is directly impacted by Hurts.  The guy that handles the ball on every play has only thrown two INTs and hasn't fumbled while carrying the ball.  Your question would be more relevant if you just used the 16 takeaways.  And then I'd argue that the takeaway count is bolstered by the leads our Hurts-led offense creates.

2 hours ago, Eagle1ne said:

🤷‍♂️ keeps the conversation going?

Conversation?

2 hours ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

Thanks.

You may think this as semantics, but why are you calling void year charges dead cap?  In my view, they represent different things and should be presented as such.

Dead cap is what it is intended to sound like - a bad thing.  We signed a player for X years of performance.  We paid a bonus up front and possibly guaranteed some salary.  That cash went out the door.  Unfortunately, that player is not around for the full length of the contract.  We ended up paying for years that didn't materialize.  That is bad.  'Dead' is a appropriate adjective to describe the cap impact.

Void years are different.  It is an accounting scheme.  For example, we paid Bradberry $7.25 million dollars for one year of service.  That's it.  That was the deal.  We are getting that one year of service.  Bradberry is getting his $7.25M dollars.  We aren't paying for him to play in 2023 because the contract doesn't expect him to.  Spreading out the cap hit is a mechanism to push off the impact.  My analogy is taking advantage of interest-free financing when you buy a couch.  You still get one couch.  The amount of money you are spending doesn't change, just the timing. 

Bottom line, void years aren't representative of a waste of money like dead cap is and should be shown separately.

Thank you CE.  Beautifully described.

12 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Are we under the assumption that Dalton Schultz being hurt earlier in the year and he’s not gonna get healthier and start being more productive? Because he’s also been more productive since dak has come back. I also think Michael Gallup is going to be healthier as the season goes on as his knee recovers more and more. If they are smart using pollard more is gonna really help open things up as a pass catcher out of the backfield 

I am not seeing Dallas is going to beat the Eagles. When I am telling you with  Prescott and those guys getting healthier that’s a much better offense then the one we saw. They are gonna get better not worse with Dak out there over cooper rush. You saw the jump from game 1 with Dak to game 2 with Dak the offense looked better.

also, who cares if it’s 16 anymore. They’re not playing 16 games anymore. They play 17. Also, CeeDee Lamb is currently 9th in receiving yards. So he’s a top 10 wide receiver in receiving yards. He is on pace to finish in the top 10 in receiving and is top 15 in receptions. I would add he hasn’t had his starting quarterback for a majority of the season and since dak has come back, he’s been better

He’s not exactly on pace to finish top 10 in yards, many of the guys just below him have had their bye, so he’s played 15% more games than they have. We’ll see how many players pass him this week when he’s on his bye

1 hour ago, LeanMeanGM said:

 nsfw

 

For those out of the loop "Mattress Mack" is an Astros superfan who bet $10M total for the Astros to win which would net him $75M. 

I read an article about that - he was pretty smart.  He offered a big promo where he sold a bunch of mattresses and said if the Astros won it all he would give the customers their money back.  Sold a ton of mattresses apparently.  Win win for him.  

6 minutes ago, Aerolithe_Lion said:

He’s not quite on pace to finish top 10 in yards, many of the guys just below him have had their bye, so he’s played 15% more games than they have. We’ll see how many players pass him this week when he’s on his bye

 he’s still top 15-20. Also the next 11 players behind him only 5 have had a bye. And one of them is Mike Williams who’s currently hurt. So he’s very likely to be a top 15 wr who hasn’t played with his starting QB for more than half of his games all year.  You are poo pooing a guy who’s very likely to finish top 15 at this pace and possibly 10 and didn’t have his starting QB most of the year and other guys around him like Schultz and Gallup missed games and were xoming back from injuries so teams could focus more on him in the passing game. 

2 hours ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

I've seen that.  I get that there a $5M cap hit next year for Bradberry.  I get that we will have over $50M in various charges in 2023 for players that aren't here. 

I was making the point that it isn't all wasted money.  Some is.  And some is just a timing scheme.

Further, the $5 million would be a consideration if its acceleration was a "surprise" in terms of the Cap, but both OverTheCap and Spotrac have chosen to carry the full $5 million as an active Cap charge in 2023.