2 minutes ago, schuy7 said:

The only argument you can make for the defense/Gannon is the turf being complete garbage. Other than that, it was a horrible performance. If the offense had a bad game and had 3-4 three and outs, how many points would the Chiefs have scored? I don't think 56 is out of the question. They didn't defend anything. They were just out there and along for the ride.

It just accentuates the need for good, athletic LBs. That was the big difference in KC at least making us try to get yards. With the field being garbage it put more pressure on Edwards/White to perform and they flopped. Hopefully this means we don't throw money at Edwards because I don't think he deserved as much praise as he was receiving. If the DL doesn't do the dirty work for him he looks bad in run support.

28 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

Normally I'd say the Niners will take a step back next year after losing Saleh then Ryans, but that division has turned to slop.  The Eagles still have the best team in the NFC IMO -- depending which FA they can re-sign

Things can change so quick though, a decent team makes a few key free agent signings and some rookies that contribute immediately, seems like something we don't get the luxury of having, and bam, they're right in the mix. This team is more likely to get worse than better too with aging players, a lot of cap dollars needing to be spent at QB, Chauncey.. We can very easily slide back from the best team in the NFC, actually it's highly likely. 

6 minutes ago, schuy7 said:

The only argument you can make for the defense/Gannon is the turf being complete garbage. Other than that, it was a horrible performance. If the offense had a bad game and had 3-4 three and outs, how many points would the Chiefs have scored? I don't think 56 is out of the question. They didn't defend anything. They were just out there and along for the ride.

We’re fortunate the chiefs only had 24 mins of TOP. If the offense didn’t sustain those long drives they likely would’ve given up 40 if not more. Add on missed FG and chiefs milking clock 

The first half defense was similar to SB LII. When you look at the scoreboard it says the defense only gave up 7. In SB LII it was 12. But then you forget butker and New England missed kicks and they moved the ball well on 2 of the 4 possessions. Chiefs and pats figured it out in the second half and were basically unstoppable except one game graham got a strip sack and this game the eagles didn’t. Tbh i am more surprised that this defense gave up 31 (could’ve been more if butker doesn’t miss and they don’t milk clock for a Fg) then the 2018. imo personnel on this team is better particularly at corner 

8 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

We didn’t really make them kick a second FG. They wanted the eat clock and kick it late. That was a huge loss by the defense. 

We did.  We had a 3rd down stop with a minute and a half left.  But then the penalty...

Just now, bitbased said:

It just accentuates the need for good, athletic LBs. That was the big difference in KC at least making us try to get yards. With the field being garbage it put more pressure on Edwards/White to perform and they flopped. Hopefully this means we don't throw money at Edwards because I don't think he deserved as much praise as he was receiving. If the DL doesn't do the dirty work for him he looks bad in run support.

yeah TJ makes a play or 2 during a game but he is always outa place or gets beat in coverage and can't get off blocks.

7 minutes ago, Doc S. said:

Will take the time to read this in a moment.

In the meantime, rumors of your death were greatly exaggerated...welcome back, Mr. Twain...

Thanks. 

I thought I was dead for a second.  Then i saw the date, I was going to be allowed back on the 18th.

Then i had a pleasant surprise this morning when it let me in. 

Mod12 apparently meant to let me back in time for the game too, although somehow that didn't happen.

But I'm here now. 

15 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

We didn’t really make them kick a second FG. They wanted the eat clock and kick it late. That was a huge loss by the defense. 

And it was a penalty on bradberry. Don’t think the throw would’ve have been completed with or without. Add on they hadn’t called it all game and to call it randomly then felt like bs cause it should’ve been called earlier and hadn’t. I’m irritated by that penalty but I’m more angry at the the overturn of smith’s catch. That’s complete Bs cause was no evidence he didn’t catch it and it was ruled a catch 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/35649198/how-patrick-mahomes-chiefs-played-perfect-second-half-super-bowl-2023-nfl-win-jalen-hurts-eagles

One good way to measure offensive dominance is down set conversion rate, which looks at every time a team took the ball on first down and sees whether it turned that series into a first down or a touchdown. The Chiefs converted 93.8% of their first downs into another first down or a touchdown in the second half, and the only reason they didn't hit 100% is because Jerick McKinnon slid down on the 1-yard line to set up the title-winning field goal. ESPN has data going back through 2000, and no team has ever done that in the second half of a Super Bowl before

 

Gannon

Just now, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

And it was a penalty on bradberry. Don’t think the throw would’ve have been completed with or without. Add on they hadn’t called it all game and to call it randomly then felt like bs cause it should’ve been called earlier and hadn’t. I’m irritated by that penalty but I’m more angry at the the overturn of smith’s catch. That’s is complete Bs cause was no evidence he didn’t catch it  

Agreed and at that point in the game there was no need to call it. Everyone knew KC were going to kick the FG on that next play. The clock had stopped so all they did was allow KC to drain more clock on a BS call. 

But the Smith overturn was definitely the one. That took a likely TD off the board and we had to settle for 3. A TD there and that completely changes the complex of that second half. 

4 minutes ago, SkippyX said:

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/35649198/how-patrick-mahomes-chiefs-played-perfect-second-half-super-bowl-2023-nfl-win-jalen-hurts-eagles

One good way to measure offensive dominance is down set conversion rate, which looks at every time a team took the ball on first down and sees whether it turned that series into a first down or a touchdown. The Chiefs converted 93.8% of their first downs into another first down or a touchdown in the second half, and the only reason they didn't hit 100% is because Jerick McKinnon slid down on the 1-yard line to set up the title-winning field goal. ESPN has data going back through 2000, and no team has ever done that in the second half of a Super Bowl before

 

Gannon

Anyone defending Gannon or making excuses for him either is blind with loyalty or just doesn’t want to believe it was as bad as it was. Players didn’t do their job and Gannon  didn’t do anything with his game plan to adjust to help them. 

I want to go back and watch the 2021 chiefs/eagles game. Cause I’m guessing Gannon employed the same defense and just thought my personnel is better so it’ll work this time. And it was slightly better as didn’t give up 40+ but still not good 

1 hour ago, LeanMeanGM said:

 

Good man.

17 minutes ago, HazletonEagle said:

A lot of thoughts I wasnt able to share the night of the game.

KC had 8 possessions. They scored 4 TDs, Kicked 2 FGs but missed one. And were stopped twice. Bad result for the D. But what are realistic expectations against the Reid/Mahomes offense? Any D in the modern NFL is going to give up points to them. We had 2 stops, and made them kick FGs twice. If we had 1 more stop, that would have been 3 TDs, 2 FGs with one missed, and 3 stops. 27 points. Suddenly, you feel pretty good about what they were able to do. You held them out of the end zone on 5 out of 8 possessions. Not bad against the Chiefs at all.

What it comes down to on defense to me is, individual performances more so than Gannon and his scheme. We needed 1 player on defense to make 1 big play. And it never happened. There was no sack to back them up. Only 1 TFL. No PDs, and no INTs. No FFs or recoveries. So many awesome players on this D with incredibly seasons. I was sure, at some point, we would make 1 big play. Just one guy had to do it just 1 time. No one ever did. 

Reddick drew a ton of attention all game long. Graham had a resurgent season. Philly legend. Where was he? Cox. Sweat had a breakout season. Where was he? Hargrave?  All of those guys had an easier job because of Reddick. They didnt help him out at all. Gardner-Johnson led the league in INTs even after missing like 6 games. He at least made a hard hit towards the end of the game. But no plays of real significance. Slay and Bradberry- where was their big play?

As we continue to zoom in on things Im honing in on Maddox. The WR in motion caused him to sprint to the other side of the formation. Never looked at the WR. Never realized the WR stopped and stayed on the other side. Maddox with a complete lack of awareness and focus just ran away from the play before the ball was even snapped. NOT just once either. TWICE! There are a bunch of points hung squarely on him individually in that game. Maddox should be public enemy #1 in Philly for the rest of his career here. I dont think many people really noticed. Too busy complaining about the macro level and blaming Gannon. A bunch of individuals failed to step up even just once, all game. And one individual was directly responsible for a whole bunch of those points. I was always a maddox supporter. I am now forever in the Maddox sucks camp.

 

On offense

I dont think it hurt us in the end because the run game wasnt really needed. The passing game was working so well. But Sanders got hurt on the 1st play and fumbled. Maybe the injury, or maybe the fumble- something caused them to lose confidence in him. He wasnt really utilized. The other guys failed to puck up the slack for him. Gainwell didnt have a ton of opportunity either, but he underwhelmed with weak runs last night when he earned playing time by being a hard nosed runner. He and Boston Scott failed on numerous short yardage attempts. Gainwell's mistake on the 2nd and 2 run lead to Seumalo's false start penalty on 3rd down, which led to the fumble on the 3rd down replay. Snowball effect, started with Gainwell not just picking up the 1st.

Our already amazing offense can take another big step forward next year with 2 things. One is a bigger back who is a hard runner. Charbonnet or Rodriguez later would be nice. 

The other thing that can lead to a massive spike in explosive plays is- right now we have got to be the worst team in the league on scramble drills. The reaction of our WRs to Hurts scrambling is absolutely horrid. WRs used to be coached to come back to the ball. We have a mobile QB who can get outside the pocket and extend plays. His WRs should be turning up field. Seattle had a ton of success with that with Wilson at QB. We should be doing the same thing. Sometimes they turn up, but its far too late. I think theyre often caught wondering if the should block for him to run, or if they should turn up field for him to throw over top. Lets save our QB the hits, and just teach them to always turn upfield quickly and get the explosive plays. Please.... Im so sick of him scrambling only to find no one open and either running out of bounds for no gain, or having to throw it away. Those should be big plays, and they pretty much never are.

Lane Johnson is amazing making it through the whole post-season. Dickerson played through something too with that elbow brace. Jones was pretty much a non-factor. Outstanding.

Hurts was incredible. KCs only path to victory was if Mahomes had another godly game. Obviously capable of doing that. Hurts had to be just as good in order to force Mahomes in to that role. Hurts did his job. He drastically outpreformed Mahomes in the 1st half even in passing along. But then you add in his 68 first half rushing yards with 2 TDs... Even in the 2nd half, Mahomes became unstoppable, but Hurts was still damn near perfect as well. Foles gave us the most incredible superbowl QB performance every. Hurts ended up being right there with him.

Great gameplan by Nick and the rest of the offensive staff. Great execution by the players.

Really a damn shame about the fumble. But even with the 7 points we are up 10 at half, and felt like we could pull away. Even if we couldnt pull away the offense was playing so well, it didnt feel like the Chiefs could overcome that deficit because we were still going to score more points. I cant believe we managed to blow that lead.

 

Refs- Aside from the Bradberry ticky tacky call, the long pass to Smith that got overturned (wrongly) was a game changing play. We were definitely going to score a TD there. Offense was humming, and there was plenty of time. Where was that, the 10 yard line? We had it. Instead, we had to prolong the drive, and ran out of time settling for a FG. 4 point swing. That was the game. Refs didnt just give away the game on the bradberry call. It took them getting both of those calls wrong to do us in.

Special teams- Elliott is a stud. Super bowl. No nerves. Butker missed one. And an XP was pretty close to the upright too. Elliot was perfect. Never in doubt. Punting.. man.. 1 bad punt. One horrible punt coverage... another play that could have cost us the game. 

 

Andy Reid- why did he or his team do something smart with clock management? He sold out and fixed everything that ailed him/us while he was here. Didnt care to root for him anymore prior to this game. Now, I kinda hate him. Hes a sellout. 

Mahomes-- League's biggest baby? Championship game he looked hurt hobbling around but played just fine. This game, the faces he was making on the sideline looked like he was losing his leg. Hes great. Cant take that away. But I dont think he is tough for playing through that injury. I thin hes a little whimp who acted like he was dying when he had minor pain. Theres no way it was that bad, the way he came out and played the rest of the game. Now, he will always annoy me. Because hes going to continue to be QB God. But hes a little whimpy baby. 

 

We will be back very soon.

I dont know if we just rip off the bandaid and let our defensive free agents go so we can get back ahead of the cap a little bit. Or if we actually retain most of them because the LBs have not earned larger contracts and should be easy to retain. Blankenship can replace Epps. Cheap, and you lose nothing. Dean can replace one LB (hopefully Edwards), and White should be very cheap to retain. Open the bank for Gardner-Johnson and Bradberry. The rest may take care of itself. Many of those guys wont find the big deals they want elsewhere and probably choose to stay here. In that case, we are right back in the thick of things next year.

In the event they all leave, Howie will work his magic. Howie, Hurts, Siri- you wont keep that combo down. Theyll be back real soon. 

I was in the minority when I said we overpaid Maddox. I really didn't want to even extend him. I wanted  Mike Hilton who's getting paid less and is a much better player. Last night I think swayed a lot of fans. 

I love 99% of what Siri does.

He looks like a fool for trying to shame us over Gannon 3 weeks ago.

6 minutes ago, bbabraham said:

I don't think I agree about the punt being all that important. It's obviously bad in isolation but my feeling was that since half time, the D wasn't even close to getting a stop. The Chiefs barely even needed 3rd down conversions to march down the field for TDs all second half. So my assessment was that it was basically going to be a TD either way - this was just much quicker. So the real impact it had was on the clock. If the long TD vs quick TD resulted in Hurts getting the final possession to win the game then sure, that's meaningful impact.

Nice position you took, appreciate that. Agree.

My feeling involves an emotional context along with the field position.

That return layed the groundwork for a momentum shift, changed the dynamic from attack to defense for us. 

Unfortunately, our Defense was busy ordering cheap Shrimp and Scallops instead of Holding the Line.

Many choices here as to what we could have done better, but that play was key..short field, quick score. 

Jalen's fumble, scoop and score notwithstanding...that was early, game still  a contest.

 

 

Wow! Gannon staying in Arizona to continue the Interview process...Make a Deal, Dude...

Just now, SkippyX said:

I love 99% of what Siri does.

He looks like a fool for trying to shame us over Gannon 3 weeks ago.

I really don't know why anyone believed that Gannon had turned a complete corner. I'm not saying he's a bad DC. I did think he was but this year you've got to give him credit. But I've still not been fully sold on him either. I think the talent he had around him had a huge amount to do with the improvements we saw. 

We better eviscerate SF next year.

Couldn't even tell he had a problem. 

While there’s no guarantee we get back there next year, the team doesn’t have to be worse next year. They could be on paper with less proven guys, but like any other year it comes down to the draft. If the Eagles draft we’ll, they will be fine. And they have a leg up with the multiple first rounders. If they keep hitting on their top picks they’ll continue to be deep even if they lose guys.

And if guys they already have continue to improve like Hurts, Mailata, Smith, Dickerson, Reddick, Sweat, etc they can make up for it with their best guys getting better.

Im more concerned about the coaching staff than anything else honestly, because that’s the area I think has the lowest ceiling to improve, and that’s one of the biggest reasons why we lost.

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/quick-reads/2023/super-bowl-lvii-dvoaquick-reads

If you want to go by the analytics, we were "lucky" to only lose by 3. That's how bad our defense was.

37 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

Secondary thing, but Michael Clay can't be back next season. The STs plagued the Eagles all season. Sirianni needs to ditch the loyalty and let him go. And FFS find a real punter.

Murder leg is available and clear of charges isn't he?

53 minutes ago, Utebird said:

The slippery field effected the pass rush more than the offenses ability to block.

Usually is the case In slippery fields like slippery snow games 

As such that environment negatively effected the eagles more as so much if their success defensively is predicated on their ability to create pressure with  just 4 something they did better than Any other team in the league up to that point 

That the field was a disaster isn't really in question it was an obvious disaster, that slippery conditions benefit offense more than defense is a pretty established train of thought I feel.

So the only thing that's left to debate is whether the bad field conditions gave an unfair or unfortunate advantage to the chiefs simply because the eagles D is so heavily predicated on generating pressure with 4 and that ability was negated simply by the playing surface 

It's more likely to surmise that a team that led the league in sacks and pressures generated by 4 were greatly negatively effected by the playing surface than it is to surmise that the eagles D line who were historically good at pressuring the qb up to that point all just had really bad games.

 

 

Embrace a thought, call it a fact, back it with opinion.

We had no sacks, (one close), neither did they...

Level field...both sides...

 

1 hour ago, Silent Eagle said:

Quez is neither a batman or robin. He is two-faced though.

 

1 hour ago, greendestiny27 said:

If I'm them it would be Lou all way. Maybe Gannon will fool them like he did us in his interview. 

Hoping it's Gannon, if they loved Lou wouldn't they have just announced it already? 

5 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

While there’s no guarantee we get back there next year, the team doesn’t have to be worse next year. They could be on paper with less proven guys, but like any other year it comes down to the draft. If the Eagles draft we’ll, they will be fine. And they have a leg up with the multiple first rounders. If they keep hitting on their top picks they’ll continue to be deep even if they lose guys.

And if guys they already have continue to improve like Hurts, Mailata, Smith, Dickerson, Reddick, Sweat, etc they can make up for it with their best guys getting better.

Im more concerned about the coaching staff than anything else honestly, because that’s the area I think has the lowest ceiling to improve, and that’s one of the biggest reasons why we lost.

The way the eagles draft as of late it's to replace guys two years down the line. I'm not putting any eggs in the draft basket for immediate results. 

3 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

Murder leg is available and clear of charges isn't he?

That's punt god. Murderleg was a kicker. 

I’m back and forth on who I think had the better Super Bowl. Foles or Hurts. Both were all time great performances