41 minutes ago, toolg said:

Not good if Hurts can't throw deep. The Eagles have been building around speed: Smith, Reagor... Watkins ran a 4.35 40. It does them no good if Hurts can't hit the long ball.

Hurts can't do anything aside from scramble to the right for 2/3 yards and put up big yardage in garbage time.

56 minutes ago, toolg said:

Not good if Hurts can't throw deep. The Eagles have been building around speed: Smith, Reagor... Watkins ran a 4.35 40. It does them no good if Hurts can't hit the long ball.

Give him time! He's basically just a rookie. He'll develop a cannon arm by week 6

19 minutes ago, Swoop said:

Hurts can't do anything aside from scramble to the right for 2/3 yards and put up big yardage in garbage time.

Seems like it, how long does he think it's going to be before it's noticed that he has a tendency to roll to the right and it's schemed against with LBs waiting for that BS? 

Thanks @Swoop

On 9/28/2021 at 4:45 PM, ToDie4Eagles said:

Give him time! He's basically just a rookie. He'll develop a cannon arm by week 6

I don't think his arm strength is a problem, it's overthinking how deep to throw it, QBs that are naturals don't have to think about how hard and what trajectory to put on the ball, they see the opening and lead the QB to it.

Unfortunately we have yet another QB that's not a natural, this is what I saw from him at 'Bama.

On the pick six how did the receiver fall down?

54 minutes ago, XoqTionR said:

On the pick six how did the receiver fall down?

Didn’t matter.  Hurts telegraphed it so bad Diggs was going to the house regardless.

Hurts is no worse than the other newbies. We were outcoached (how about that 1-2 RB punch), our new contract LT was out, and our star RG is on IR. Then you have the ridiculous officiating (Dallas committed just as many penalties but fewer were called), which just fit the narrative of bad Eagles and good C***** all too well.

I don't know how any objective person could watch that game last night and not conclude that as of right now the biggest problem with his team is the head coach and it's not even close. I cannot and will not defend Hurts' abysmal performance, but the warning signal is not just the fact that he had one of the worst games I've ever seen, but literally everyone not named Javon Hargrave literally just turned in one of the worst performances in pro football. Many people have rightly pointed out already that we just had a full professional football game in the year 2021 and there was not a single offensive play that ran any sort of motion whatsoever. It is also proving to be one of the most undisciplined teams I've ever seen and considering this is the Philadelphia eagles that says something. Benching Hurts does nothing for us. Even if their odds are against him there is a far better chance that he is a much better quarterback by the end of the year then there is Minshew helping us win anything at all. And if you've already been off the Hurts train, here's more bad news: there might not be a single franchise signal collar worth looking at in the first two rounds next year. And unless the Eagles or 1000% sold that there is "that guy" in the draft than reaching for one with any of our first round picks would be a mistake. You might have to deal with Jaylin not just for the remainder of this year but maybe even next, and it might be the better move. This team needs lots of blue chip talent, and for once they will have the draft capital to get it. The biggest worry though is that at least through three weeks, Sirriani appears to be the one that is lost. 

yes I know my last post was riddled with grammatical errors but I'm too tired and disgusted to give a F. 

8 hours ago, EagleVA said:

I don't think his arm strength is a problem, it's overthinking how deep to throw it, QBs that are naturals don't have to think about how hard and what trajectory to put on the ball, the see the opening and lead the QB to it.

Unfortunately we have yet another QB that's not a natural, this is what I saw from him at 'Bama.

His arm strength is a problem because it’s not good enough to overcome all his other deficiencies. If he was able to have great mechanics, good processing and good timing it wouldn’t be a problem. His mechanics stink and he’s slow with everything else and he doesn’t have the arm to make up for it. We have at least 3 illegal men downfield penalties because he can’t even properly execute a f’ing RPO. 

2 hours ago, highboy said:

I don't know how any objective person could watch that game last night and not conclude that as of right now the biggest problem with his team is the head coach and it's not even close. I cannot and will not defend Hurts' abysmal performance, but the warning signal is not just the fact that he had one of the worst games I've ever seen, but literally everyone not named Javon Hargrave literally just turned in one of the worst performances in pro football. Many people have rightly pointed out already that we just had a full professional football game in the year 2021 and there was not a single offensive play that ran any sort of motion whatsoever. It is also proving to be one of the most undisciplined teams I've ever seen and considering this is the Philadelphia eagles that says something. Benching Hurts does nothing for us. Even if their odds are against him there is a far better chance that he is a much better quarterback by the end of the year then there is Minshew helping us win anything at all. And if you've already been off the Hurts train, here's more bad news: there might not be a single franchise signal collar worth looking at in the first two rounds next year. And unless the Eagles or 1000% sold that there is "that guy" in the draft than reaching for one with any of our first round picks would be a mistake. You might have to deal with Jaylin not just for the remainder of this year but maybe even next, and it might be the better move. This team needs lots of blue chip talent, and for once they will have the draft capital to get it. The biggest worry though is that at least through three weeks, Sirriani appears to be the one that is lost. 

You've made some good points in this post.  Sirianni did pretty well his 1st game, but I think we're now seeing exactly how bad the Falcons are.  That game was Fool's Gold.  The past 2 games have been bad as far as his play calling.  Having only 3 running plays by RBs and no pre-snap motion to help your young QB (who clearly needs as much help as he can get) is inexcusable.  So far he does seem to be in over his head.  I think he's a really good teacher and can help develop young talent, something we've been missing for ages, but that's different than being a HC, a leader.  However, he's only 3 games in so for now I'm willing to see if he learns from his mistakes and can make changes needed to get better results on the field.

From what I recall in the "predict the Eagles record this year" is that the majority of us predicted losing records for them, anywhere from 4-13 to 7-10 mostly, so the expectations for this season were low.  Again, going back to the opening Fool's Gold game that gave a little too much hope that we could actually make something of this season and be the 'tallest midget' in a weak division.  We still played well enough to win the 49ers game if not for a couple momentum killers, but last night's game was just F'ing brutal.  Looked like dirty ass on both sides of the ball.  I think on D it's a bit more the lack of personnel than the coaching/scheme while on O it's a bit more the scheme than the personnel.  Having 3 young WRs (2 'sophomores' and 1 'freshman') starting and the OL missing 2 of its starters didn't help.  What would have helped is making the game simpler and running the ball against a D that had an undersized and banged up DL.  Trying to get more possession of the ball so their O had it less would have been nice.  Hopefully we don't see that again, but if we do continue to see poor play calling that plays to the opponent's strength instead of our strengths then it's a huge red flag. 

I'd rather see us use our first 4 picks (looking like at worst we could have 4 picks in the first 40-45 picks, including at least 1 top ten, maybe 2) to build around a QB than draft another crap shoot rookie QB.  How many times has a team picking in the top 5 that took a QB has it worked out?  Seems like it doesn't work out more than it does.  You keep putting a young QB on an ishy team without a good core of talent around him and more times he'll fail than be successful.  That's what would happen on this team as we don't have enough talent needed to put around a rookie QB.  We need an influx of talent at most positions.  We basically have no back 7 and are thin at DE.  Sweat is the only young DE with upside.  We desperately need a playmaking ballhawking S as that's what is required in today's NFL.  We need OL since this could be Kelce's last season and Lane/Brooks who knows how much longer their bodies can hold up?  I want 4 players in Rounds 1 and 2 who can come in and make positive contributions Week 1 of the 2022 season.  No more projects, no more drafting a first round talent in the 2nd round because he's injured and is 'good value'.  NO!  NO!  NO!  F'ing F NO! 

This is why I've stated Minshew would be adequate as a good "PLACE HOLDER" while we build talent around the QB position, then we either draft/groom one or trade for one.  He's better than Hurts.  He showed it in 2 seasons playing on an ishy Jags team that he can see/read the field well enough and get throws out quick enough to make plays, something Hurts is not able to do.  It would be hard to fully evaluate Sirianni when he's handcuffed by very limited QB play so at least with Minshew you'd get a ballpark idea what he could do with a QB who can make most/all throws a starting NFL QB should make.  I don't think Minshew is a QB you build your team around and go out and try to win a SB with, but I do think he's at worst one of the top backup QBs in the NFL and a good place holder.  Unless Hurts drastically improves then you really can't evaluate anything/anyone on the O side of the ball.

 

 

7 hours ago, LeanMeanGM said:

His arm strength is a problem because it’s not good enough to overcome all his other deficiencies.

I said I didn't think is arm strength was a problem because I don't know what it is, do you know how long he can heave the ball, I sure as hell don't.

The last thing we need is for him to hear that his arm strength is being questioned and he begins playing macho man showing his arm strength and overthrowing everyone. 

39 minutes ago, EagleVA said:

I said I didn't think is arm strength was a problem because I don't know what it is, do you know how long he can heave the ball, I sure as hell don't.

It's not about how long/far he can heave the ball.  It's more about how quickly his throws cover a certain distance.  When he throws deep he has to throw it at a high trajectory (aka put air under it or a rainbow ball) to be able to get the needed distance on it.  He'll never be able to throw a ball 40 yards on a rope 20 feet or less off the ground like Josh Allen does.  The more air he puts under it the more 'hang time' his throws have and the more time a defender has to adjust to it and make a play on the ball.  THAT is what arm strength is.  Sure, he can throw it 50+ yards as any QB currently in the NFL should be able to do, but he also needs his mechanics on long/deep throws to be damned near perfect to get the 'zip' on the ball that's needed. 

The last thing we need is for him to hear that his arm strength is being questioned and he begins playing macho man showing his arm strength and overthrowing everyone. 

I don't think we'll ever have to worry about this with Hurts.

 

1 hour ago, EagleVA said:

I said I didn't think is arm strength was a problem because I don't know what it is, do you know how long he can heave the ball, I sure as hell don't.

The last thing we need is for him to hear that his arm strength is being questioned and he begins playing macho man showing his arm strength and overthrowing everyone. 

I sure as hell would rather him overthrow it instead of underthrowing to everyone. Let the WR try to make up the ground and maybe make a play. 

His arm strength "issues" are way overblown. He definitely does not have a big arm but his arm it's just fine to make the necessary throws, the issue is the speed of the game, processing, and mechanics. You don't need to have a big strong arm if you can make a quick read and throw with rhythm and timing. Yes, he sucks at those too, but those are coachable, very coachable, skills. Coaching is everything. Siranni is running, at least so far, a completely asanine offense, undisciplined on both sides of the ball, and it's on him. Guys, it isn't the young rookies or second-year players making all these penalties. It's Fing veterans. Through 3 games the team looks rutterless. I'm not here to say Hurts will be or won't be great, mediocre, or utter crap. But even the most talented QB prospect needs NFL coaching, good playcalling, creativity, and weapons. Other than Hargrave, that loss to Dallas made the entire roster look incompetent, not just Hurts. Siranni may learn from this, I have no idea. But so far this team's struggles are almost entirely on him. Even if all Hurts is or ever will be is a running QB, a semi competent NFL coach would be able to get a better performance out of him than this. 

18 hours ago, ThinkGreen said:

Hurts is no worse than the other newbies. We were outcoached (how about that 1-2 RB punch), our new contract LT was out, and our star RG is on IR. Then you have the ridiculous officiating (Dallas committed just as many penalties but fewer were called), which just fit the narrative of bad Eagles and good C***** all too well.

Ok,  you're not mentioning the Eagles defense, which did some good things like sack fumble TD and 4th and goal stop,  did give up 5 TDs.

And, you're not mentioning the WR/TEs having balls hit their hands and/or falling down.

I recorded the game and I'm looking at the play by play so,  I'll show some plays.

 

1    5:43    1    10    PHI 1    Jalen Hurts pass incomplete short middle intended for Zach Ertz    (off of Ertz hands)

1    0:54    2    1    PHI 34    Jalen Hurts left end for -2 yards (Landon pulled from RG and completely missed Parsons who made the tackle in the backfield)

2    5:13    3    5    DAL 46    Jalen Hurts pass incomplete short left intended for Dallas Goedert (not a great throw but Goedert got his hand on it)

3    14:23    1    10    DAL 47    Jalen Hurts pass incomplete short right intended for Dallas Goedert  (Goedert should have caught that)

3    14:17    2    10    DAL 47    Jalen Hurts pass short left intended for DeVonta Smith is intercepted by Trevon Diggs (Smith fell down)

3    14:07    1    10    PHI 25    Jalen Hurts pass incomplete intended for Kenneth Gainwell (off his hand, catchable, not great throw)

3    2:57    2    11    PHI 10    Jalen Hurts pass incomplete short left intended for Miles Sanders (catchable, not great)

3    2:52    3    11    PHI 10    Jalen Hurts pass incomplete deep left intended for DeVonta Smith (catchable, not great)

4    9:34    1    15    PHI 38    Jalen Hurts pass incomplete short left intended for Jalen Reagor (catchable)

4    9:30    2    15    PHI 38    Jalen Hurts pass incomplete deep right intended for DeVonta Smith (catchable)

what you find here (besides a decent number of OL penalties)  are a number of catchable balls that are not caught.  These aren't perfect passes at all,  but they're catchable,
some borderline catchable,  but if those players were all great pass catchers, there would be more catches there.

46 minutes ago, highboy said:

His arm strength "issues" are way overblown. He definitely does not have a big arm but his arm it's just fine to make the necessary throws, the issue is the speed of the game, processing, and mechanics. You don't need to have a big strong arm if you can make a quick read and throw with rhythm and timing. Yes, he sucks at those too, but those are coachable, very coachable, skills. Coaching is everything. Siranni is running, at least so far, a completely asanine offense, undisciplined on both sides of the ball, and it's on him. Guys, it isn't the young rookies or second-year players making all these penalties. It's Fing veterans. Through 3 games the team looks rutterless. I'm not here to say Hurts will be or won't be great, mediocre, or utter crap. But even the most talented QB prospect needs NFL coaching, good playcalling, creativity, and weapons. Other than Hargrave, that loss to Dallas made the entire roster look incompetent, not just Hurts. Siranni may learn from this, I have no idea. But so far this team's struggles are almost entirely on him. Even if all Hurts is or ever will be is a running QB, a semi competent NFL coach would be able to get a better performance out of him than this. 

a running QB can be a great passer.

Just now, Random Reglar said:

a running QB can be a great passer.

Sure. But even if he's not, a competent coach and gameplan would make him more successful than this.

8 minutes ago, highboy said:

Sure. But even if he's not, a competent coach and gameplan would make him more successful than this.

agreed.

[“I didn’t do a good enough job of leading. I didn’t do a good enough job of running our offense, of doing the things that I need to do. So it’s on me. This one’s on me,” Hurts told reporters after the game.]

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/jalen-hurts-issue-game-054420732.html
 

Hmm no "We have to look at the tape…” or "Everyone needs to step up….” type of comment we used to get from the former guy? He isn’t the best of talents right now, but he at least owns it when he screws up.  

I am a believer in needing the right coach to develop young QBs.  (well, duh, echo...)

Who is developing Hurts?
HC Siriani? HCs dont really have the time to focus on the QB, and Siriani is a WR guy. Had never coached QBs. And when he was an OC he has an established vet francise QB in place already.
Passing Game Coordinator Kevin Patullo? Same, another WR coach promoted to Passing coordinator by following Siriani. Never a QB coach, always had established Vet at QB
QB Coach Brian Johnson? Ok, an experienced QB coach... Dak's QB coach at MSU, and 3 yrs at Florida. Played QB at Utah. This is his first NFL coaching experience.

None of these guys ever played in the NFL, and only Johnson ever played QB, but not at the pro level. This doesn't mean they can't coach, but this is who is in charge of developing Hurts?

6 hours ago, Green_Guinness said:

It's not about how long/far he can heave the ball.  It's more about how quickly his throws cover a certain distance.  When he throws deep he has to throw it at a high trajectory (aka put air under it or a rainbow ball) to be able to get the needed distance on it.  He'll never be able to throw a ball 40 yards on a rope 20 feet or less off the ground like Josh Allen does.  The more air he puts under it the more 'hang time' his throws have and the more time a defender has to adjust to it and make a play on the ball.  THAT is what arm strength is.  Sure, he can throw it 50+ yards as any QB currently in the NFL should be able to do, but he also needs his mechanics on long/deep throws to be damned near perfect to get the 'zip' on the ball that's needed. 

I don't think we'll ever have to worry about this with Hurts.

I'm pretty sure that's a correlation between how far someone can throw and how fast they can throw, like a 100% correlation!!

4 hours ago, highboy said:

His arm strength "issues" are way overblown. 

That's what I think also.

2 hours ago, EazyEaglez said:

Hmm no "We have to look at the tape…” or "Everyone needs to step up….” type of comment we used to get from the former guy? He isn’t the best of talents right now, but he at least owns it when he screws up.  

 

Talk is cheap.  Actions speak louder than words.  And he sure didn't look like he was "owning it" when he ran over to ask Devonta Smith what happened after the pick 6, as if it was somehow Devonta's fault.   But now we're supposed to give him credit because he managed to remember his "it's all on me" media cliche the next time someone stuck a mic in his face?  Sure.