7 hours ago, eagle45 said:

For those of you who say you play to win the game (amidst a disastrous season after clear elimination from contention)....think of how our draft capital situation could be different right now.

If we don’t beat a punchless NO team without a qb in their offense, we would have had Miami’s draft haul.  If we don’t tank against WTF, we are likely looking at the same player we are getting at 12 and no extra first round pick next year.

 

Yup.

TBH, we got some bad breaks
- Atlanta blew a 17 point leading week 15 & dropped a game winning INT in week 16.
- Houston was tied in the 4th quarter in their last 3 games and lost all 3. They should have beaten the Titans week 17. They somehow lost to the Bengals in week 16 too.

We should have been drafting 4th.

8 hours ago, eagle45 said:

For those of you who say you play to win the game (amidst a disastrous season after clear elimination from contention)....think of how our draft capital situation could be different right now.

If we don’t beat a punchless NO team without a qb in their offense, we would have had Miami’s draft haul.  If we don’t tank against WTF, we are likely looking at the same player we are getting at 12 and no extra first round pick next year.

 

Yes it’s all good in theory but there’s a reason it’s typically the same teams at the top of the draft every year... 

8 hours ago, eagle45 said:

Yep.  I think Paye is the most likely pick.  

Oh I would be so sad.  

35 minutes ago, Original Sin said:

No NFL HC is going to tell his team go out and play to lose , and we as coaches will coach to lose . It’s just not going to happen  , tanking implies , losing on purpose.

and  if a player bought into tanking , I don’t want him on my team .

Sure looked like the Jags lost on purpose as soon as the Jets Fed up and won that game

13 hours ago, austinfan said:

Actually, for all the smoke, only two times has any reporter documented Lurie interfering, one was dumping an aging TE (who no other team picked up) to make roster room for a younger player under Rhodes, the second was pushing Doug to hire real assistant coaches. There may have been more, but I suspect not many. Lurie respected AR, and there was no point with Chip.

Doug earned a couple years to run the show, but face it, his heart wasn't in the administrative side (hiring and firing, which means spend a lot of time networking, building contacts around the league, gathering information about lower level people on other teams), or he'd have a list of solid candidates. He seems to like coaching, he may simply be the Peter Principle in action.

This is incorrect.  There are many other instances that have been reported, some more recent.  However, ownership outright cutting a player without the head coach's knowledge and also demanding that the head coach fire his own coaches and hire others are not to be understated.  These go beyond simple meddling or undo influence.  No sane person would assume that this kind of diabolical meddling would be isolated incidents.

More recently, the JJAW selection over D.K. Metcalf has been blamed on the owner.  The Hurts selection, possibly the worst 2nd round draft pick in history (due to when and who made it along with net impact), the primary impetus for the Eagles implosion, has been partially blamed on Lurie.  How could we forget, the "Hurts Decree" for 2021, that Hurts is to be the starter and draft investment in QB is to moderated, is attributed to the owner.  When the owner can make these kinds of decisions and set direction in this fashion, he is in effect the GM, and not just the owner in the traditional sense.

Sources are only now starting to come forward and share their Lurie stories.  It's clear he has been meddling in a far more significant way and for a far longer period of time than anyone suspected, but clearly there was a marked acceleration of this process since the SB.  The SB clearly emboldened the owner to take additional steps forward, with devastating effect.

This revelation also provides a clear explanation as to why the "General Manager" in name only has been retained, and in fact whose performance was not even considered in any kind of evaluation, despite total and complete failure by all measures.  The team has arguably drafted worst in the league (it's hard to make a case for other teams, other than the Jets perhaps), has very little young talent, and has the league worst cap situation.  Draft capital has been wasted on multiple trades that have provided little to no benefit.  Extensions have been given to players that were totally nonsensical.  Most importantly, a quarterback was taken high in the draft after a franchise quarterback contract was given to the existing starter, and the results were total, systemic failure.  There is no measure of performance that would result in retention of this "GM" -- until these revelations uncovered for the fan base what is and has been actually going on in Nova Care.

This is the reason for me this season and this franchise is so disappointing, and anticipation for the season is my lowest in decades.  The team itself won't be very exciting, but worse, the decision maker has been a train wreck, and he is not fireable.  It's not a fixable issue.  How does it get better?

Unless and until the owner comes to the realization that what he is doing is not working.... and makes the decision to both hire and empower a qualified person/team to take over his role... I have a hard time seeing the path forward with any optimism.  Not even an afan post or two can change this.... maybe after the draft, I'll read a bunch of afan and think differently.  We will see.

15 minutes ago, Swoop said:

Including toy. Must be where he gets his draft board from.

 

15 minutes ago, Swoop said:

Including toy. Must be where he gets his draft board from.

 

11 minutes ago, Mike030270 said:

Sure looked like the Jags lost on purpose as soon as the Jets Fed up and won that game

Even if that were the case , which I say it wasn’t , what happen to the Jags HC ?

4 minutes ago, Original Sin said:

 

 

Even if that were the case , which I say it wasn’t , what happen to the Jags HC ?

Apparently he's the Oline coach for University of Alabama now

Still doesn't mean that Jags didn't intend to lose though because it sure looked like they did

26 minutes ago, Freshmilk said:

Oh I would be so sad.  

Yup.

Heres what I don’t like about Paye...

Hes a nice prospect overall, low risk of total bust.  Good get-go off the LOS, decent size, nice 40 in an offseason when all 40s are fabricated...but there are more explosive edge guys with more upside (and more risk) who will go later.

And isn’t that a typical Eagle first/2nd round pick?  Less risk, lower ceiling...and more explosive players at the same position drafted later go on to have more impactful careers.

5 years from now, no one is going to say he was the best edge to come out of this draft or a premier defensive player.  He’ll start and hold his own, so certain posters will file him away as a great pick in hindsight though.

1 minute ago, Mike030270 said:

Apparently he's the Oline coach for University of Alabama now

Still doesn't mean that Jags didn't intend to lose though because it sure looked like they did

He got fired , now you think he lost intentionally so he could get fired and sent back to the college ranks as a position coach ?

15 hours ago, Alphagrand said:

To me they’re just different-colored canisters on an immense shopping list.  

Would Pitts/Chase be an upgrade over the current targets on the roster?  Immensely.  Would Parsons be a better talent in the middle of the defense?  Again, immensely.  Would Surtain Jr be a better talent than anyone in the secondary not named Slay?  Immensely again.  Moehrig at safety?  Again, big upgrade in potential at a needed position 
 

It’s subjective to say whether WR is a bigger need than CB, LB, S, QB — they all need to be upgraded and I’m not sure any is a larger need than the other.

For me, the roster needs more than one, it needs multiples.  Potentially 3 1st round picks next year opens up a lo of avenues for trade ups, player trades, etc, esp when this year the talent drops off.  If you could have 3 1sts in a loaded draft, that is a big win for a team.

It's not nice to walk away from a very good player, but the roster needs more than that. Sadly.

10 hours ago, RememberTheKoy said:

1. Jaguars - Trevor Lawrence 

2. Jets - Kyle Wilson

3. 49ers - Mac Jones

4. Panthers - Justin Fields

5. Bengals - Penei Sewell

6. Broncos - Trey Lance

7. Lions - Ja'Marr Chase

8. Falcons - Kyle Pitts

9. Dolphins - Jalen Waddle 

10. Cowboys - Patrick Surtain II

11. Giants - Micah Parsons

12. Eagles - Kwity Paye

This is my nightmare draft.  If both Chase and Pitts go after 6 Howie should be fired before pick 12.  All kidding aside it would show a huge mistake in scouting and the way Howie thnks the league is thinking.

If DeVante Smith is the lone WR left at 12 and it's between Smith and Kwity Paye, I'm convincing myself Smith should be the pick if they don't move down again.  I've been anit-Smith when compared to the rest of the top WR but if he's there and you're deciding between him and Kwitty Paye ugh, just depressing.

Tommy Lawlor wrote about Smith a bit and pointed out that not only did Smith return punts, he also was a gunner on the punt team.  That's a nice little nugget to know about him regarding how he might hold up.  Plus, he was willing to do so, I'll take that attitude.  I just don't know though.

2 minutes ago, Original Sin said:

He got fired , now you think he lost intentionally so he could get fired and sent back to the college ranks as a position coach ?

No. I think he intentionally lost because the owner told him to

I have no idea when the owner decided to move on from him. Very likely had nothing to do with Jags intentionally losing and more about their record before that

What is the eagles record for number of losses in a season?   Im thinking with a 17 game schedule, and no qb, we could easily break it. 

Interested in Gowan and Hamilcar  and Tylan Wallace pro days today 

1 minute ago, Mike030270 said:

No. I think he intentionally lost because the owner told him to

I have no idea when the owner decided to move on from him. Very likely had nothing to do with Jags intentionally losing and more about their record before that

He knew his job was in jeopardy , trust me Marrone did not intentionally tank the season/ his job , because the owner told him to 

Just now, Ipiggles said:

What is the eagles record for number of losses in a season?   I'm thinking with a 17 game schedule, and no qb, we could easily break it. 

I don't think so.  With the new coaches, the QB who will run around and make first downs, some formerly great players coming back... I bet they win more games thank last year.  Not only will there be nothing out there on the Eagles offense, many other teams will overlook them. 

Still the draft to go, and how they look before the season, but I think something like 6-7 wins is more likely than 3-4 this season.

1 minute ago, Original Sin said:

He knew his job was in jeopardy , trust me Marrone did not intentionally tank the season/ his job , because the owner told him to 

I very much doubt the few losses at the end of the season contributed to his firing. He was likely gone anyway because of his failure of previous seasons

He already had back-to-back losing seasons before 2020 season

But both of us are just guessing anyway regardless of a "trust me" so 🤷‍♂️

4 minutes ago, John_C said:

I don't think so.  With the new coaches, the QB who will run around and make first downs, some formerly great players coming back... I bet they win more games thank last year.  Not only will there be nothing out there on the Eagles offense, many other teams will overlook them. 

Still the draft to go, and how they look before the season, but I think something like 6-7 wins is more likely than 3-4 this season.

Which 6-7 games do you think we have a chance at winning?

Watch us come away with Slater and Etienne round 1/2...

as i edit my board, I am impressed at the linebacker quality and depth in rd 2/3

44 minutes ago, Ipiggles said:

What is the eagles record for number of losses in a season?   Im thinking with a 17 game schedule, and no qb, we could easily break it. 

13 in 1998. 

1 hour ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Pederson was in no way responsible for the salary cap.  Nor was Carson Wentz.  The salary cap situation was all Howie's doing.

Agree I would even go so far as to say 1 million percent 

27 minutes ago, Mike030270 said:

Which 6-7 games do you think we have a chance at winning?

Always hard to say at this point.  I think they will be competitive in a lot of games.  There are many possible outcomes right now.  Other teams are also in flux.  I don't look at it from the standpoint of likelihood to beat team x, y or z.  It's hard to know what the Eagles are this year, to start with, no less how other teams will end up.

On one hand, the pessimistic view is the Eagles aren't very good, most of thier good players are aging, there are few difference makers, and the QB is a Rodney Peete type with better legs.  Not a lot to be excited about.  They won 4 games last year.  The division is harder.  I can see why some will call for fewer wins and challenging for the top pick in the draft.

On the other hand... if the Eagles offensive line comes back healthy, with some truly difference making star players there... Mailata continues to show what he did last year at LT...  and you have the running quarterback, extending drives with first downs, sanders staying healthy (maybe even learning how to catch), and you get something from Goeddert and some of the receivers... could you see the Eagles staying in some games and winning a couple more than last year?  They will have 17 chances at a win.  No one will be worried about playing them, no one will be working harder or putting in anything special for them.  This is the opposite of the case from 2017-2019 and even going into last year.  There will be no tape on their offense or defense.  The NFC East is much better on paper, but they still face four games vs Daniel Jones and Ryan Fitzpatrick plus two games against a Cowboys team that lost some good players and has more questions this year than in prior years.  Division games are generally competitive and I expect they will win a few.

Teams in the Eagles position sometimes surprise early in the season, only to level out later.

So, is it more likely they are 3-14, 4-13, etc. or more like 6-11, 7-10?  I think the latter is more likely.  Is it better in the long term to have a tough initial year next year with fewer wins, for draft position, and to confirm for everyone that Hurts is not an NFL starter, as I expect to be the outcome of that evaluation?  Sure... but I don't expect that to happen.  I think they win a few more games and are drafting next year once again in that 10-15 range.

55 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

Yup.

Heres what I don’t like about Paye...

Hes a nice prospect overall, low risk of total bust.  Good get-go off the LOS, decent size, nice 40 in an offseason when all 40s are fabricated...but there are more explosive edge guys with more upside (and more risk) who will go later.

And isn’t that a typical Eagle first/2nd round pick?  Less risk, lower ceiling...and more explosive players at the same position drafted later go on to have more impactful careers.

5 years from now, no one is going to say he was the best edge to come out of this draft or a premier defensive player.  He’ll start and hold his own, so certain posters will file him away as a great pick in hindsight though.

I keep hearing from posters that Kwitty Paye isn't explosive yet his testing numbers and the tape say otherwise.

Dude ran a 4.5 at 260 holds the record for fastest ever 3 cone for DL benched 36 vert of 35.5 broad of 9"10 those are all explosive numbers and on tape he explodes out of his stance and shows impressive closing speed and he explodes into his hits.

He's not an average athlete who gets by on technique and effort or over whelming size.

He's a plus athlete with a high motor and pretty solid technique not to mention a high character guy that is also a academic all american.

Some of his cons are he's only 6'2" and I believe he's 23 years old or will be and he doesn't have like alot of players this draft not as much production due to truncated season.

His pros though are that he's an explosive edge who also plays the run well.

I like him at 12 if he's there though I think 12 may be a bit high for him then again I think in this draft 12 might be a bit high for any one available there.

 

If anyone thinks this is a 7 win team with the schedule they have, you are nuts. 

4-13 would be a gift.  

I don't want Paye, but the idea that he's not explosive is crazy.

Some people still, wrongly, accuse Graham over being not explosive either. Graham was a great pick in 2010. Paye would be "fine" in 2021. If he has a Graham-like career, that's a win.