EMB Blog: 2021 Offseason

[DeathByEagle]

6 minutes ago, RLC said:

When exactly has drafting a TE in the top 10 worked out?

Mike Ditka

Thats all I got

[LeanMeanGM]

Just now, downundermike said:

Could say the same about having a top WR

 

 Mike Evans, Julio Jones, Sammy Watkins at least made it to a SB

[ManuManu]

Vernon Davis helped SF to the SB and was a stud for a couple of seasons. 

[eagle45]

Drafting ANYONE in the top 10 usually doesn't work out because teams picking in the top 10 usually suck.

OL works out more often because it's a less dependent position.  A great OL on a crap team can still stand out on his own and play well. 

A potentially great QB/WR/TE will put up crap stats and will be declared a bust.

That doesn't mean it's easier to find OL than any other position.  It just means it's easier to START with OL and work from there.

[DeathByEagle]

2 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

Drafting ANYONE in the top 10 usually doesn't work out because teams picking in the top 10 usually suck.

OL works out more often because it's a less dependent position.  A great OL on a crap team can still stand out on his own and play well. 

A potentially great QB/WR/TE will put up crap stats and will be declared a bust.

That doesn't mean it's easier to find OL than any other position.  It just means it's easier to START with OL and work from there.

Well the Bucs and Bills who were picking in the top 10 in 2019 would disagree with you. 

Wait so was the 49ers and made it to the SB that same year

[RLC]

5 minutes ago, downundermike said:

Could say the same about having a top WR

 

This is dumb. Hill is the best WR in the NFL. Adams is #2. 

WRs matter.

[Diehardfan]

7 minutes ago, downundermike said:

Could say the same about having a top WR

 

Yeah, but they have to pick something. I don't like any of the CB at 6, the top OL will probably be gone, and the DL seem like a roll of the dice this year....unless you want them to grab another QB, WR is probably the best option there.

[eagle45]

3 minutes ago, DeathByEagle said:

Well the Bucs and Bills who were picking in the top 10 in 2019 would disagree with you. 

Wait so was the 49ers and made it to the SB that same year

I will repeat, most teams picking in the top 10 suck.

[e-a-g-l-e-s eagles!]

3 minutes ago, RLC said:

This is dumb. Hill is the best WR in the NFL. Adams is #2. 

WRs matter.

Yeah the time period that we’re playing in wide receivers have increasingly mattered more with how the league is going. Final four teams had diggs, hill and Adams. All top 5 wrs in the league (hill would’ve been if he didn’t sit week 17). The bucs are in the super bowl with arguably the best wr corps in the league with Evans, godwin, AB and lesser known Scottie Miller.  That’s not by accident. (Besides the great QB play)

[ManuManu]

This isn’t Diggs’ first rodeo. 

[mattmcginley7]

20 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

I haven’t done my homework on Pitts yet.

Sure, Travis Kelce or Gronk are worth it as foundation pieces to a passing game.  I am not willing to assume a TE will turn into that at #6.  Even those guys went in round 3.

Now, if Pitts runs a 4.42, jumps 42”, and kills the agility drills...then it will be a little easier to convince me that he’s more than a TE.

Pitts being worth a top 10 pick isn’t about being a probowl TE, it’s about being more than a TE...like Gronk or Kelce or just a plain WR like Metcalf.

And if his workout numbers aren’t in the stratosphere, that’s not an assumption I’m making at #6.

 

Let's make this very clear: Pitts is a top 10, maybe even top 5, WR ONLY prospect. He's getting dinged for being so versatile that he has the capability to play TE if you wanted

Pitts is 6'6" 240, gonna run 4.4s (Mike Evans 6'5" 230 4.53 for comparison), just turned 20 3 months ago, had 0 drops, highest graded TE/WR by PFF, and people still just say "TE" against taking him lol 

It's so lazy. Watch him. He lines up out wide and in the slot. Dominated draftable corners on slants, curls, 9 balls all year on the outside. He was roasting corners in the slot. It's really incredible how well his change of direction is for that size

There is simply no linebacker or safety that has any chance

And you're gonna see him pull away from corners.

 

The bandwagon is open. Just gotta get a "yeah I was wrong, he's an elite WR prospect" to join. Me and whoever said he was the leader of the Pitts bandwagon will be here and welcome all of you newcomers.

[LeanMeanGM]

3 minutes ago, Diehardfan said:

Yeah, but they have to pick something. I don't like any of the CB at 6, the top OL will probably be gone, and the DL seem like a roll of the dice this year....unless you want them to grab another QB, WR is probably the best option there.

I’ll be honest. I’m a fan of Chase but even he doesn’t scream #6 overall to me. But no one really does. I think there will be talent available but no one worth running to the podium for. 

[TEW]

2 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Yeah the time period that we’re playing in wide receivers have increasingly mattered more with how the league is going. Final four teams had diggs, hill and Adams. All top 5 wrs in the league (hill would’ve been if he didn’t sit week 17). The bucs are in the super bowl with arguably the best wr corps in the league with Evans, godwin, AB and lesser known Scottie Miller.  That’s not by accident. (Besides the great QB play)

I think this is the real issue.  Those are obviously all really good WRs. But they're all getting great QB play and offenses that really play to their strengths. Hill is a great player, for instance, but is anyone going to get more out of him than Andy Reid and Patrick Mahomes? Good WRs are necessary in this day and age, that much is clear, but they're not the prerequisite.

[eagle45]

6 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

Vernon Davis helped SF to the SB and was a stud for a couple of seasons. 

Vernon Davis is the best example for and against it.  His workouts put him in the top 10...because he was expected to be "more than a TE."  He slaughtered the combine, including agility work.  The hope was that he'd be a massive weapon and mismatch in the passing game.  He was a probowl TE who had a few huge years as a receiving TE that didn't block much.

The end point here isn't necessarily what matters, since he's a solitary example.  But a top 10 TE needs to have that freakish athleticism for the promise of being something more in the passing game.  The madness the Lions have pulled in the first round with TE a few times is just ridiculous.  With Vernon Davis, I at least get why they did it.

 

[Diehardfan]

2 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

I’ll be honest. I’m a fan of Chase but even he doesn’t scream #6 overall to me. But no one really does. I think there will be talent available but no one worth running to the podium for. 

Yeah, which is scary with Howie making the pick.

[e-a-g-l-e-s eagles!]

12 minutes ago, TEW said:

I think this is the real issue.  Those are obviously all really good WRs. But they're all getting great QB play and offenses that really play to their strengths. Hill is a great player, for instance, but is anyone going to get more out of him than Andy Reid and Patrick Mahomes? Good WRs are necessary in this day and age, that much is clear, but they're not the prerequisite.

Disagree josh allen was no where close to as good last year without diggs. Brady last year without Evans, ab and Godwin was no where close to what he was this year (not that he was bad but he wasn’t 40 td passes). Ive also pointed out on here last year when the chiefs played without tyreek hill they averaged about a touchdown less per game. We can say whatever we want even the great QBs thrive more with better WRs. I’d rather have a great QB over a great WR obviously. However the great QBs become nearly unbeatable when you give them great to good talent at WR. It’s becoming an increasingly important position. This isn’t 2001-03 where you could get to championship game after championship game with marginal players at wr

[mattmcginley7]

6 minutes ago, TEW said:

I think this is the real issue.  Those are obviously all really good WRs. But they're all getting great QB play and offenses that really play to their strengths. Hill is a great player, for instance, but is anyone going to get more out of him than Andy Reid and Patrick Mahomes? Good WRs are necessary in this day and age, that much is clear, but they're not the prerequisite.

Hill has dominated when Mahomes has been out of the lineup and with Alex Smith. Hill is really special 

[eagle45]

2 minutes ago, TEW said:

I think this is the real issue.  Those are obviously all really good WRs. But they're all getting great QB play and offenses that really play to their strengths. Hill is a great player, for instance, but is anyone going to get more out of him than Andy Reid and Patrick Mahomes? Good WRs are necessary in this day and age, that much is clear, but they're not the prerequisite.

I have been saying the key to offensive success is 3 high end pass catchers with a good pass blocking OL and an accurate QB.

SB receivers: Hill, Kelce, Watkins, Hardman, Godwin, Evans, AB.

These teams have multiples of weapons in the passing game.  Sure, AR and Mahomes make Hill better, but he makes them better too.  Lifting off like the space shuttle requires multiple perfect parts working in harmony.

[Casey @ Bat]

25 minutes ago, EaglePhan1986 said:

If Eric Fisher has a serious injury that could be huge. Barrett and JPP were the difference for the Bucs today. 

Agree. I definitely think Tampa has a chance with their Dline

[Guest]

 

[eagle45]

Chase and Smith both scare me a lot.  

Smith allayed some of my fears by going for 800 yards in the BCS championship, but you really want a Julio/Megatron talent at WR in the top 10.  Neither of those 2 WRs are going to intimidate anyone.  At least Smith has been uncoverable in one way or another for multiple years, whereas Chase is a ferociously physical 6' WR without great speed who had one big year and sat out to preserve his stock because his team figured to take a step back.

1 minute ago, downundermike said:

 

I wouldn't hold my breath on that one.  

[e-a-g-l-e-s eagles!]

49 minutes ago, Casey @ Bat said:

Agree. I definitely think Tampa has a chance with their Dline

I think if brady turns the ball over like he did in that GB then tampa is in trouble. While GB has a good offense (were down jones much of the second half) the chiefs are on another level. Likely getting more than 7 points off 3 turnovers with the chiefs offense

[eagle45]

TB could win.  They'd just need to get very lucky.  But Brady is the luckiest player in NFL history.

The Chiefs control the outcome of their game.  If Mahomes, the best player in the NFL, hits his spots, then the game will be over at halftime.  But even Mahomes is human and has off games.  A high quality pass rush from TB will do their best to tilt the odds of an off game in their favor.  IF that happens, then SB Brady will do just enough scoring to keep it close.

The prerequisite for the Bucs to have a chance is that Mahomes just picks a bad time to have an off game.  But with Brady's luck, that will happen in the SB against his team.

[The Holy Vagabond]

There are too many great wrs out there that are around (or exactly are) Chase’s height for that to be the first "worry” when considering drafting him. 

[eagle45]

Just now, The Holy Vagabond said:

There are too many great wrs out there that are around (or exactly are) Chase’s height for that to be the first "worry” when considering drafting him. 

No, the first worry is that most of the great WRs Chase's height are much faster than he is.  The second worry is that his game is being physical in an NFL predicated on speed, regardless of his height.  Then we get to the fact that he's a physical WR who is 6', which is a concerning oddity in the top 10.