Yeah 2011 was arguably the best team. ‘80 wasn’t even the best of that era in my mind. ‘76 and ‘77 were both better but disappointed in the playoffs. 

13 minutes ago, DrPhilly said:

Yeah 2011 was arguably the best team. ‘80 wasn’t even the best of that era in my mind. ‘76 and ‘77 were both better but disappointed in the playoffs. 

It’s the same kind of thing with 08. Like out of the 5 teams from 07-11, they are probably the weakest of the 5 outside of 07. Frankly also disappointing was Hamels in 09. I still believe if Hamels wasn’t as bad as he was that year that the Phillies would’ve repeated. Lidge drop off didn’t help but really Hamels and Lee would’ve likely been enough to take out the Yankees. His 7.58 ERA in the playoffs was just abysmal. Game 3 is where they had a chance to take control of the series. Hamels was given a 3-0 lead and blew an inning later. 

The 70s team was a bit too staid. They had Bowa but needed someone else with the external spark and fiery competitiveness that Rose provided in ‘80 to help them get over the hump. 
 

‘93 was the most fun and crazy team. They had all the intangibles you’d ever want and those made up for whatever talent that was missing. They simply didn’t have enough to overcome the limitations of Mitch blowing games.

I think the Harper being hurt stuff is a convenient excuse.  His wrist and elbow hurting hasn't caused him to swing and miss at 1,000 breaking pitches outside the zone over the past month and a half. 

4 minutes ago, mikemack8 said:

I think the Harper being hurt stuff is a convenient excuse.  His wrist and elbow hurting hasn't caused him to swing and miss at 1,000 breaking pitches outside the zone over the past month and a half. 

Tbh i think a lot of fans want to use some excuse for why he hasn’t had a lot of power lately. I think teams aren’t giving him pitches to tee off on and when he has he has simply missed doing it. The fact he’s hitting .362 over his last 12 games tells me it’s not that big of a deal. Just have to hope his power comes back at some point during the postseason. 

5 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Tbh i think a lot of fans want to use some excuse for why he hasn’t had a lot of power lately. I think teams aren’t giving him pitches to tee off on and when he has he has simply missed doing it. The fact he’s hitting .362 over his last 12 games tells me it’s not that big of a deal. Just have to hope his power comes back at some point during the postseason. 

yep, theres a reason turner and casty are hitting better right now. They're seeing more pitches to hit while harper is seeing less. 

 

15 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Tbh i think a lot of fans want to use some excuse for why he hasn’t had a lot of power lately. I think teams aren’t giving him pitches to tee off on and when he has he has simply missed doing it. The fact he’s hitting .362 over his last 12 games tells me it’s not that big of a deal. Just have to hope his power comes back at some point during the postseason. 

I think regardless of Harper's power or lack of they still have a hole in the cleanup spot since Rhys left. Who do you think they could go after this offseason assuming Soto goes elsewhere? Santander?

1 hour ago, Dave Moss said:

Of course you do, old timer.  April 17, 1976 (Schmidt’s four homer game at Wrigley) is my DOB.  There’s a fun fact for you.

What was the name of your first pet?

1 hour ago, DrPhilly said:

Yeah 2011 was arguably the best team. ‘80 wasn’t even the best of that era in my mind. ‘76 and ‘77 were both better but disappointed in the playoffs. 

I have always considered the '77 team to be the best one of that era ('76 through '83). What happened in the ninth inning of game three was crushing. And then they played game four in the rain while Bowie Kuhn sits in the stands and smugly pretends it isn't raining.

33 minutes ago, John Blutarski said:

I think regardless of Harper's power or lack of they still have a hole in the cleanup spot since Rhys left. Who do you think they could go after this offseason assuming Soto goes elsewhere? Santander?

Teoscar Hernandez is available. He’s having a great year. Strikeouts a lot. I’m also unsure if his resurgence is because he has guys like Ohtani, freeman, will smith and now betts that allows him to see more pitches.

Tbh i wouldn’t be shocked if they look to make a trade. The OF market isn’t great outside of Soto and Hernandez. Gamel is older. Bellinger likely opts in and i don’t trust Jackson profar. I think Kyle Tucker is going to get dealt. On the last year of his contract. Phillies could put a package of marsh, Caba and someone like Abel which might entice the Astros as he’s gonna walk at the end of the year and he’s coming off an injury season. Marsh being cheap for 3 more years and the Astros have taken on guys they believe they can fix problems with. 

34 minutes ago, paco said:

What was the name of your first pet?

I bet it was Otto

13 hours ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Not sure why we are trying to be cute and not going with Hoffman or estevez after a day off 

i don’t mind strahm but really he’s not a closer 

Why is Strahm "not a closer"?  What is the deficiency in his pitching style that you find fault with?

16 minutes ago, mattwill said:

Why is Strahm "not a closer"?  What is the deficiency in his pitching style that you find fault with?

Strahm doesn’t have overpowering stuff like Hoffman and estevez can do. He’s usually 89-94. Fastball kind of tops out at 95ish. Whereas Hoffman and estevez can ramp it up to 96-99. I also think hoffman’s fastball combo with his slider is much more devastating than strahm’s. Estevez has a better mentality for a closer. Hes done it and had success. Strahm has had troubles in the past when asked too. Also strahm has been much more wild lately then Hoffman and estevez. Against the Braves he had the bases loaded and was fortunate to get out of the situation. Yesterday he gave up a homer. I think he’s better suited for a 7th inning role or if you need a bridge for two innings. 

Oh boy! 

 

13 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Strahm doesn’t have overpowering stuff like Hoffman and estevez can do. He’s usually 89-94. Fastball kind of tops out at 95ish. Whereas Hoffman and estevez can ramp it up to 96-99. I also think hoffman’s fastball combo with his slider is much more devastating than strahm’s. Estevez has a better mentality for a closer. Hes done it and had success. Strahm has had troubles in the past when asked too. Also strahm has been much more wild lately then Hoffman and estevez. Against the Braves he had the bases loaded and was fortunate to get out of the situation. Yesterday he gave up a homer. I think he’s better suited for a 7th inning role or if you need a bridge for two innings. 

Greg Maddox didn't have overpowering stuff either.  That didn't make him less effective as a pitcher. 

Strahm has a 2.18 ERA (3.51 for his career).  Hoffman's is 1.85 (4.82 for his career)  Estevez's is 2.22 (4.21 for his career). 

They are effective now and significantly more effective than their career stats would indicate.

Bottom-line, your preference in what a closer looks like is just that ... a preference.  My preference ... and it too is a preference ... is that looks are irrelevant.  Production is what is relevant.

With that said, there is an important characteristic that is a factor.  If you are going to have a single designated closer, he needs to be just as effective against right handed batters as left handed batters.  If he can't be that, then I prefer closer by committee, with the makeup of the 9th inning batters determining which relief pitcher takes the mound. 

Off topic question, the Phillies began the year with a minor league pitcher that they had claimed from the Red Sox.  If I remember correctly he had some sort of military involvement and was of asian-american descent.  What happened to him?

4 hours ago, mikemack8 said:

I think the Harper being hurt stuff is a convenient excuse.  His wrist and elbow hurting hasn't caused him to swing and miss at 1,000 breaking pitches outside the zone over the past month and a half. 

Media is afraid to criticize him

3 hours ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Teoscar Hernandez is available. He’s having a great year. Strikeouts a lot. I’m also unsure if his resurgence is because he has guys like Ohtani, freeman, will smith and now betts that allows him to see more pitches.

Tbh i wouldn’t be shocked if they look to make a trade. The OF market isn’t great outside of Soto and Hernandez. Gamel is older. Bellinger likely opts in and i don’t trust Jackson profar. I think Kyle Tucker is going to get dealt. On the last year of his contract. Phillies could put a package of marsh, Caba and someone like Abel which might entice the Astros as he’s gonna walk at the end of the year and he’s coming off an injury season. Marsh being cheap for 3 more years and the Astros have taken on guys they believe they can fix problems with. 

Jays were stupid for giving him up

13 hours ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

 

There have been 2 games in MLB history where a player had:
6+ RBI
5+ times on base
4+ XBH
3+ HR
a leadoff HR
a HR in the 9th or later

Both were by Kyle Schwarber within the last 30 days.

Francis is the AL pitcher of the month and has only given up 1 hit in each of his last 2 starts.  His era in August was 1.05 with 5 starts.

Might be touch sledding today at the plate.

 

Weak lineup today as well.

Wow

Nothing for three weeks and then 4 in 7 at-bats

He's an animal

Oh no, which elbow has he been having trouble with?

2 hours ago, mattwill said:

Greg Maddox didn't have overpowering stuff either.  That didn't make him less effective as a pitcher. 

Strahm has a 2.18 ERA (3.51 for his career).  Hoffman's is 1.85 (4.82 for his career)  Estevez's is 2.22 (4.21 for his career). 

They are effective now and significantly more effective than their career stats would indicate.

Bottom-line, your preference in what a closer looks like is just that ... a preference.  My preference ... and it too is a preference ... is that looks are irrelevant.  Production is what is relevant.

With that said, there is an important characteristic that is a factor.  If you are going to have a single designated closer, he needs to be just as effective against right handed batters as left handed batters.  If he can't be that, then I prefer closer by committee, with the makeup of the 9th inning batters determining which relief pitcher takes the mound. 

Couple things: Greg Maddox was a starter not a closer. Two different objectives being a starter and being a backend of the bullpen closer. Nola doesn’t have overpowering stuff. It’s fine as a starter if you know how to pitch and can locate really well. Can do it as a RP, but in today’s game the analytics have shown it’s much tougher especially as a closer. It’s why a lot of teams don’t have guys like strahm closing out. To be honest, I think the reason why he was used last night, was because Estevez and Hoffman were really rode very hard in the last series. So they were trying to give them a little more rest. 

To be honest, I was actually listen to a podcast where they talked about the Phillies specifically. The Phillies starting pitching isn’t a bunch of guys that just blow you away. Zach Wheeler can do that but he’s unique where he can blow it by you and he has great control. everybody else really isn’t so much that. Sanchez can do that at times. But when he tries to do that, his control isn’t always there. The Phillies are one of the only teams in today’s game that have gone to guys that know had a pitch with control more than just hard throwing flamethrowers and have success. It’s also partially why they haven’t had a lot of guys have Tommy John surgery in their rotation. While other teams have seen a lot of these guys have to go through that. Andrew painter is about the only prospect/rotation guy (would’ve been in the rotation) that has had Tommy John surgery over the last couple years. Meanwhile Dominguez had TJ and he is a flame thrower type guy  

second Greg Maddox is one of the best pitchers we’ve seen in the 30 years. If we are comparing strahm to Maddox that’s pretty lofty expectations. it’s unfair to strahm as good as he’s been this year, he doesn’t have that type of pinpoint control and he’s not in the same class as maddox. This year he’s been phenomenal but he reminds me a lot of jc Romero whereas Hoffman and estevez are more madson and lisge

On hoffman was a 1st round pick. He was actually largely a bust until the Phillies signed him and kind of resurrected his career. He was Ok his last year in cincy. The reason why he was a first round pick was because he had electric stuff. Like really good stuff. It’s why since he put it together he’s been unbelievable. I will point this out. Jeff Hoffman fell to 9th in the draft because he had TJ. If Jeff Hoffman didn’t have that, he would’ve likely went top three and potentially no. 1. That’s how good his stuff was. I think Hoffman’s career is much different if the Rockies started him as a RP and he didn’t develop in the Rockies system  

couple of other things with Jeff Hoffman, the Rockies tried to make him a starter since they took him 9th overall. He wasn’t good as a starter. Because he didn’t know how to pitch or control wasn’t there when he was younger. He just had really good stuff and just tried to beat you just because he had really good stuff. that’s that whole argument you have in Greg Maddox. That’s what made him great. It’s the same with Nola.  Nola stuff isn’t hoffman’s. He’s closer to Maddox. He knows how to pitch when he is on he is hard to hit because he’s accurate with where he wants it to go, can pitch backwards or forwards and learned how to be a starting pitcher. Hoffman didn’t have that as a starter. rockies tried to move him to BP in 2020. He was not good in 2020. Then again pandemic a lot of guys had weird years. Hoffman was strictly bullpen in Cincinnati, that’s when you saw Jeff Hoffman start to turn his career around. Got here and his control has been fantastic. Credit to cotham cause he’s done a terrific job having him learn how to pitch not just rely on his stuff

with estevez, his stuff is always been good. It has had an uptick over the last couple years. But his biggest issue was that his control was never there. Can tell by the amount of walks he had prior to this year. You never knew when he was gonna lose control. It’s kind of like what Jose Alvarado is going through right now and how the Phillies fixed him for a couple of years. Stuff is legit nasty but control wise an issue. He would walk a lot of guys and you didn’t know where it was going. Because he pitched so hard he got himself into trouble with his control. So this year the angels got him to start throwing it 2-3 MPH less and it showed that he could control where the ball was going. it’s why he was dominant with the angels. It is why he only has 8 walks on the year. That by far the lowest in his career. Credit to the Phillies because when he came to the Phillies, cotham has actually got him to have his fastball up 1-2 mph with being able to control it better. Also his slider based on analytics has more spin since coming here. why he’s been so effective over the last month. That’s a feather in cotham hat