2 minutes ago, Aerolithe_Lion said:

@paco or anyone else who sees this:

I’ve seen multiple times over the years that it is erroneous reporting to say contract restructures actually pay a player a lump sum signing bonus instead of their salary. It does that for the bookkeeping side yes, but the player himself just gets the same games checks.

Do you know of any sources to this off hand? Even a nonverified tweet or anything?

I just stumbled upon this tweet a few minutes ago…

 

2 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

I just stumbled upon this tweet a few minutes ago…

 

Yeah this exact tweet is what sparked my search. I’ve seen players and reporters claim otherwise and get uppity when this is perpetuated, I just can’t find any of it as it was from past years.

 

2 minutes ago, Aerolithe_Lion said:

Yeah this exact tweet is what sparked it. I’ve seen players and reporters claim otherwise and get uppity when this is perpetuated, I just can’t find any of it as it was from past years.

They definitely get the money right away. The still get game checks, but they’re much smaller. 

14 minutes ago, Aerolithe_Lion said:

@paco or anyone else who sees this:

I’ve seen multiple times over the years that it is erroneous reporting to say contract restructures actually pay a player a lump sum signing bonus instead of their salary. It does that for the bookkeeping side yes, but the player himself just gets the same games checks.

Do you know of any sources to this off hand? Even a nonverified tweet or anything?

My understanding is a restructure is simply converting base salary (which isn't guaranteed) or bonuses into an actual signing bonus. A players game check comes from their base salary, so the player would get the signing bonus and their base salary becomes smaller. The player doesn't get any less money, nor does the contract add additional years. The benefit to the player is they get the new signing bonus all at once when they sign the restructured contract. This pushes more of this years cap hit into future years, and thus causing more dead money of the player is cut in the future. Also makes the player less likely to be cut in the future since the dead money is now higher. So technically their game check is less, but they got a lump sum up front.

I think this is where the void years come into play, with a restructure you can push the dead cap further down the line and spread out more, not 100% sure on this though.

4 minutes ago, wussbasket said:

My understanding is a restructure is simply converting base salary (which isn't guaranteed) or bonuses into an actual signing bonus. A players game check comes from their base salary, so the player would get the signing bonus and their base salary becomes smaller. The player doesn't get any less money, nor does the contract add additional years. The benefit to the player is they get the new signing bonus all at once when they sign the restructured contract. This pushes this years cap hit into future years, and thus causing more dead money of the player is cut in the future. Also makes the player less likely to be cut in the future since the dead money is now higher. So technically their game check is less, but they got a lump sum up front.

I think this is where the void years come into play, with a restructure you can push the dead cap further down the line and spread out more, not 100% sure on this though.

Yeah, just specifically the lump sum payment is what I’m questioning. Is there any actual evidence this happens? Never have I seen a player acknowledge this one way or another, as they’d be getting a monster payment right then

9 hours ago, RememberTheKoy said:

 

It isn't.  Jalen Hurts is the your house.  You've wanted your dream home all your life and Jalen Hurts is it.  It's the best Fing house on the block.  What you are proposing is selling that house so you can get yourself an apartment and buy the newest iPhone.  

 

You continue to play dumb like you don't want to trade Hurts yet continue to advocate for the absolutely ridiculous notion that trading Hurts is at all a good idea that only yourself big time Hurts hater ToastJenkins is in favor of.  

The fact that you can't even stay consistent with your ridiculous idea and say that the Bengals should also trade Burrow instead of signing him just goes to show that you don't respect and appreciate what Hurts brings to the table.  To you the Bengals should sign Burrow but the Eagles should trade Hurts.  Both teams operate under the same salary cap.  Budget isn't different for either team.  They both have high end skill players.  

You are so simple minded … and racist.  When you make a dollars and cents investment you also take into consideration the risk that the house (your choice of metaphorical equivalent) will burn to the ground and in the process deprive you of your best Fing house on the block.

As desertbirds said I’m wasting my time trying to talk about the economics of business alternatives with you.  You think only with your Dick.  God gave you a Dick and a brain, but only enough blood to run one at a time.

26 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

More dissapointing than terrible.  The problem with Watkins IMO, was:

1. He regressed.  Had drops and fumbles at key moments in big games.

2. He was used wrong in so many games.  Quez is a straight line speed guy, not a quick twitch good in small places guy.  The amount of short yardage passes they threw to him was absurd.

3. He's just not a typical slot guy.  Goes with #2 in that he's good for down field but that's it.  I want a slot/WR3 guy to be able to do it all.

This actually brings up an issue I have with our receivers…

Brown and Smith are obviously both very good WRs. You can’t take anything away from them individually.

The problem I have is that they force us into an awkward trio.

Smith is small, but he’s not really a slot WR. He does his best work on the edge in space with his route running and hands. And he’s not particularly fast.

Brown is a tank, but again, not particularly fast, and is best on the boundary.

If we get a prototypical slot WR, the 5’10” quick/agile guy, we become very small out wide which hurts us in the run game. If we get a bigger guy they’re not going to have that short area quickness that’s exploited in the slot. And we are desperate for speed at the position, which puts another demand on the slot receiver. So unless we find a unicorn 6+ footer with short area quickness AND 4.3 speed we are going to have a weakness in our personnel.

It’s not-picky for sure, but that’s the issue I see. Quez is important because without him we have very mediocre speed at WR.

1 hour ago, eagle45 said:

Who are the DB and all-22geeks?

I want to know how good CJGJ really was in coverage last year.

Maddox was much better.  Overall, I thought GJ was okay.  Too much emphasis on the interceptions in grading him.  Epps seems worse to most in here but that is primarily because he drew the deep position more. If I was going to sign one of our FA Ss, it would be Epps.  (cheaper and a smart player). He is a heady player.  Epps was Bradberry’s safety net a lot.  (Note that Bradberry is an excellent zone CB with real nice man match tendencies that made it easier on the Ss than Nelson).  That said, CJGJ was good in the box and working with the LBs when the Eagles seemed to be playing Cover 4 MOD.  Gannon/Wilson have a tendency to play the Ss downhill.  

I didn’t think Wilson did a good job disguising coverages.   Suspect we will see more of that with Desai.  Real curious about who replaces Wilson. 
 

3 minutes ago, mattwill said:

.  You think only with your Dick.  God gave you a Dick and a brain, but only enough blood to run one at a time.

Why do you have to pull the rest of us into this?

1 minute ago, TEW said:

This actually brings up an issue I have with our receivers…

Brown and Smith are obviously both very good WRs. You can’t take anything away from them individually.

The problem I have is that they force us into an awkward trio.

Smith is small, but he’s not really a slot WR. He does his best work on the edge in space with his route running and hands. And he’s not particularly fast.

Brown is a tank, but again, not particularly fast, and is best on the boundary.

If we get a prototypical slot WR, the 5’10” quick/agile guy, we become very small out wide which hurts us in the run game. If we get a bigger guy they’re not going to have that short area quickness that’s exploited in the slot. And we are desperate for speed at the position, which puts another demand on the slot receiver. So unless we find a unicorn 6+ footer with short area quickness AND 4.3 speed we are going to have a weakness in our personnel.

It’s not-picky for sure, but that’s the issue I see. Quez is important because without him we have very mediocre speed at WR.

Solve that with another TE

10 minutes ago, Aerolithe_Lion said:

Yeah, just specifically the lump sum payment is what I’m questioning. Is there any actual evidence this happens? Never have I seen a player acknowledge this one way or another, as they’d be getting a monster payment right then

The lump sum is a signing bonus. They get it the day they sign the contract. 
 

It’s also probably not recommended that the player make an announcement they just received a huge lump sum of money that’s sitting in their bank account before they can invest it in anything.

59 minutes ago, Penn7980 said:

Did I miss the news on Johnson?  He needs to have surgery to repair his core muscle.  The season is over and he could have that surgery already.. 

One thing I never quite understand: why players delay the necessary surgery in the off season.  The earlier the surgery is done, earlier they can rehab and be ready for the off season training.  By delaying it, it cuts into the off-season works. 

He had it weeks ago. So did Maddox. 

As for delaying, there could be multiple reasons. In Brock Purdys case, they wanted to do it asap but they had to wait for swelling to go down so he just had it yesterday. Other guys try to rehab or go alternative routes to surgery, which may not work so then they need to get surgery. I think you would need to hear all the details on a case by case basis to get a clear reason why. 

6 minutes ago, Diehardfan said:

Why do you have to pull the rest of us into this?

I will refrain.

Not that I think Howie will draft an RB in round 1 but, if he does, I would prefer Gibbs.  That guy can fly.  I like his decisiveness when hitting the hole.  One cut and he gone.  Robinson has more power but he seems to dance little too much for my liking.  

Question is how high do you think Gibbs goes?  Does he make it to 30 or would we need to trade up to secure him?

57 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

 

2. He was used wrong in so many games.  Quez is a straight line speed guy, not a quick twitch good in small places guy.  The amount of short yardage passes they threw to him was absurd.

 

This - more than anything else - imo. 

9 hours ago, RememberTheKoy said:

 

It isn't.  Jalen Hurts is the your house.  You've wanted your dream home all your life and Jalen Hurts is it.  It's the best Fing house on the block.  What you are proposing is selling that house so you can get yourself an apartment and buy the newest iPhone.  

 

You continue to play dumb like you don't want to trade Hurts yet continue to advocate for the absolutely ridiculous notion that trading Hurts is at all a good idea that only yourself big time Hurts hater ToastJenkins is in favor of.  

The fact that you can't even stay consistent with your ridiculous idea and say that the Bengals should also trade Burrow instead of signing him just goes to show that you don't respect and appreciate what Hurts brings to the table.  To you the Bengals should sign Burrow but the Eagles should trade Hurts.  Both teams operate under the same salary cap.  Budget isn't different for either team.  They both have high end skill players.  

Let me go on the record that I believe I was the first person who suggested trading Hurts as an option.

And for me, at least, it’s still an option.

If someone offers a godfather deal, I’m taking it. It’s nothing against Hurts. He’s done everything anyone could have ever asked of him. He’s worked his arse off to become one of the best players in the NFL. A true MVP candidate and all-pro level player.

But the fact is this: as good as Hurts is, his contract is going to make it very difficult to put a deep, talented team on the field. And his play style has a relatively high probability of resulting in an injury.

For me the goal isn’t to have a great QB. The goal is to win a Super Bowl. Having a great QB is correlated with winning a Super Bowl, but I’m not sure Hurts is going to out QB Mahomes with equal talent around him.

Given that, if someone offers me 3 firsts+ I’m definitely considering it. That’s not me hating Hurts, I actually really like him and am incredibly impressed with him as a player and person. But I have to be dispassionate and do what’s in the best interest of the team to win a Super Bowl. Getting a slew of draft picks plus an extra $40+ million in cap space per year over the next 4-6 years might give us a better chance at a Super Bowl.

1 hour ago, RLC said:

The Cowboys are one of the cheapest organizations. It's crazy given how big of a brand they are.

This doesn’t reflect "cheap”, really at all. It’s about how they structured deals. Cowboys had cap issues last year. Every guy they signed last year was a 1 year deal except their one big signing of Gallup who was 5 for $57.5M but only $10M signing bonus. When you don’t go crazy in FA, and don’t hand out massive contracts with big signing bonuses, your cash spending is going to be down. There’s a reason Browns and Jags are at the top of the list. Also Saints we’re similarly in cap problems last year as well, hence their cash is down.

If not for a likely massive Hurts deal, our cash spending would be lower for 2023. 

4 minutes ago, Cliftoma said:

Not that I think Howie will draft an RB in round 1 but, if he does, I would prefer Gibbs.  That guy can fly.  I like his decisiveness when hitting the hole.  One cut and he gone.  Robinson has more power but he seems to dance little too much for my liking.  

Question is how high do you think Gibbs goes?  Does he make it to 30 or would we need to trade up to secure him?

I think Gibbs starts coming into play around 25. If we want him it has to be at 30. I have been banging the drum about him, but I don’t think we can afford to trade up for him.

17 minutes ago, ToastJenkins said:

Solve that with another TE

But then we become even slower.

We need to get both bigger and faster with 1 player, which is difficult.

It’s a marginal problem and not near the top of our needs, but it does give us some limitations.

Love the prospect of Kelly Green, but this specific tone looks really off

 

 

31 minutes ago, Aerolithe_Lion said:

Yeah, just specifically the lump sum payment is what I’m questioning. Is there any actual evidence this happens? Never have I seen a player acknowledge this one way or another, as they’d be getting a monster payment right then

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/10/20/travis-kelce-on-restructuring-freeing-cap-space-i-think-somethings-in-the-air/amp/

Quote

On the New Heights podcast that Kelce hosts with his brother Jason, the tight end discussed the restructure. Kelce said he didn’t hesitate to say yes when his agent called him about the Chiefs’ plan because it allowed him to get money right away and gave the team cap space to use on getting better this season.

Kelce said he believes the restructuring is "a start to a move” because the team wouldn’t just give him money upfront out of kindness.

Underlined it mentioning twice. I don’t remember the exact words of Travis but it’s  from one of their pods near the trade deadline.

48 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

Would definitely have interest in Whitehead if he’s cut. 

Did he have a good year? 

8 minutes ago, TEW said:

But then we become even slower.

We need to get both bigger and faster with 1 player, which is difficult.

It’s a marginal problem and not near the top of our needs, but it does give us some limitations.

Smith doesn’t have elite speed but he has more than enough. He’s a 4.43 guy who runs routes second to none and has a suddenness out of his breaks rarely seen. He’s my favorite player on the Birds, stop being mean to him!

5 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/10/20/travis-kelce-on-restructuring-freeing-cap-space-i-think-somethings-in-the-air/amp/

Underlined it mentioning twice. I don’t remember the exact words of Travis but it’s  from one of their pods near the trade deadline.

Very decisive answer, thank you