Off topic, but really shouldn’t be political or divisive...

For all the sludge the US has been dragged through for the COVID response, we have developed the 3 most viable vaccination solutions and given 1 shot to nearly 30% of the population...most of the wealthy nations of Western Europe are around 11%.

Its always pointed out when we embarrass ourselves,  so lapping the rest of the world a few times over on this should be worth at least a golf clap.

58 minutes ago, RememberTheKoy said:

 

Thankfully Sirianni seems like a very strong and confident leader.  

Riiiight 

10 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

Off topic, but really shouldn’t be political or divisive...

For all the sludge the US has been dragged through for the COVID response, we have developed the 3 most viable vaccination solutions and given 1 shot to nearly 30% of the population...most of the wealthy nations of Western Europe are around 11%.

Its always pointed out when we embarrass ourselves,  so lapping the rest of the world a few times over on this should be worth at least a golf clap.

Agreed.

1 hour ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Sure.  The owner has a say.  He says when the GM is hired and fired.   The trouble seems to be that there's not a single vision within the organization... too many cooks ruins the soup.  So, while I may have a naive interpretation according to you, this 'collaborative' effort where they all hold hands and pull a name out of a hat based on who's turn it is to make the pick.   This isn't kindergarten.  Someone needs to be the grown up in the room and make the final decisions and when those decisions are almost all bad, that person needs to be held accountable.

 

The idea that they couldn't take another shot for a ring by making different moves, without overpaying for the wrong players... lots and lots of the wrong players is what's naive.  You seem to think that the only way that they could 'take a shot' was to over pay for the likes of Desean Jackson, Alshon Jeffery and Malik Jackson.  That's not true.  There were plenty of other options that they could have made.  And many of those moves would have cost less than the move made by the Eagles.  And let's not forget that the draft day moves are a completely separate discussion and has nothing to do with the 'taking one more shot' philosophy.  Or are you suggesting that identifying players that are raw (Reagor) or completely inept (JJAW) are 'good' win now moves?   They aren't even good win eventually moves.  They are just BAD moves.  

The owner literally has the final say on everything. By your own standard, Lurie is 100% to blame for literally everything.

You can say the GM has the final say, except we all know that's not how it works. AR had "final say" on all personnel matters. Yet when he wanted to sign Vick, he had to go to Lurie for permission. So imagine relative equals like a GM and coach and how their relationship works.

As far as the vision, that's exactly the point -- the "vision" over the last few years was Doug's. He was the one lobbying for a short term approach. He wanted veterans re-signed to help in this cause, which is something you're placing on Howie. The vision changed after several years of this vision failing and the coach being unwilling to change vision. Again, Lurie said as much in his press conference.

So let's be a little more realistic here. The owner, coaches and GM get together and come up with a plan. If the head coach says Alshon Jeffery is absolutely essential to his plans to win a super bowl, then the GM is going to go out and execute on that imperative. If the coach says he has to have a deep threat opposite of him, then the GM is going to bring in someone like Desean and Reagor to fulfill that function. If the OL coach wants crazy athletes, then the GM is going to bring in someone like Lane Johnson or Jordan Mailata. If the DL coach wants shorter guys who are good against the run, then the GM gets someone like Barnett. Coaches have a vision of their own, preferences, demands, systems, schemes, etc. and the GM has to factor all of this into his choices. He can't just say, "to hell with the coaches, what they're telling me they need and want, I think this guy is better." THAT would be a dysfunctional vision.

 

4 hours ago, Original Sin said:

I said I wanted to see a high 4.5 , he ran a 4.51
 

 

Benjamin St-Juste

 

@Benj_Juice

 

 

Show me another DB at 6’3 200+ with a 3.96 shuttle and a 6.63 L drill

Both those times would have been 1st place times in 2020 draft

1 hour ago, ToastJenkins said:

Collaborative can very quickly degenerate into committee with weak leadership

howie is a weak leader. So is lurie now, apparently

It absolutely can, but most often it's necessary. How many head coaches are capable of running an entire organization effectively? AR is one of the greatest of all time in this regard, yet we spent over a decade on these boards complaining about the Eagles personnel failures. And how many GMs can churn out new great head coaches? There are only a handful of really talented ones at any given time, and they usually don't become available if they're good. So most often, even if a rigid hierarchy might be preferable in theory, in practice it's not going to work better than a division of labor and collaborative effort.

5 hours ago, greend said:

Thanks I actually don't feel real bad. Which is why I waited until today to get tested. 

Be safe.  CDC guidelines suggest even though you have the virus, only about a 3% chance you can pass it. If asymptomatic would seem with a mask you could still do your hog hunt.  

1 hour ago, TEW said:

So let's be a little more realistic here. The owner, coaches and GM get together and come up with a plan. If the head coach says Alshon Jeffery is absolutely essential to his plans to win a super bowl, then the GM is going to go out and execute on that imperative. If the coach says he has to have a deep threat opposite of him, then the GM is going to bring in someone like Desean and Reagor to fulfill that function. If the OL coach wants crazy athletes, then the GM is going to bring in someone like Lane Johnson or Jordan Mailata. If the DL coach wants shorter guys who are good against the run, then the GM gets someone like Barnett. Coaches have a vision of their own, preferences, demands, systems, schemes, etc. and the GM has to factor all of this into his choices. He can't just say, "to hell with the coaches, what they're telling me they need and want, I think this guy is better." THAT would be a dysfunctional vision.

 

This depends on the relative power of the players. AR had more power than Howie, due to his resume, until the dream team imploded. Then it became apparent that AR was better as a coach than a GM.

Chip basically demanded power after gong 10-6 and making the playoffs. Lurie decided to give him enough rope to hang himself.

Howie had the power in 2016 and 2017, but once Doug delivered a SB win, he was a co-equal. So when he wanted to keep players who helped win a SB, Howie probably deferred.

After falling short a couple years, Howie and Lurie decided Doug was over his head and started curtailing his authority, both over personnel and coaches.

Right now, Howie has more pull than Sirianni, but that's only an issue when the GM and HC have different agendas. In this case, Sirianni was brought in to preside over a rebuild, so he probably has similar priorities as Howie. Sirianni (and his assistants) will influence the draft board through their preferences for types of players, Gannon liking tall DL and long CBs, for example. When there's general agreement, the draft board is set and Howie can just work off the board and not have coaches lobbying for specific players.

Man, it's a shame Andy, Chip, and Doug had to get in the way of Howie's success.

21 hours ago, Utebird said:

Why who else at 12 is head an shoulders above Paye? it's not like he's some scrub player or drafting him at 12 would be a huge reach, most mocks have him going highest at 10 and no lower than 15, which seems about right for him and most available players in that range.

Unless chase drops to 12 there will be a bunch of guys at 12 with very similar grades and it will just come down to team preference.

If howie doesn't love any of the player at 12 then trade down.

If they love Paye or horn or smith or waddle or say Parsons then pull the trigger.

 

I imagine that trading down isn’t as easy as some believe but right now that’s the play IMO. I mentioned the idea before and probably will again of the NFL turning the draft into an auction of some sort maybe done in an orderly fashion by assigned position even miscellaneous as the last auction. You would only be able to trade future draft picks ( capital ) for current player(s), player(s) for player(s) or a combo. Anyways think it would be more interesting and would be rid of excuses of teams picking the players you wanted. So everything has a value assigned by both acquisition ( draft capital ) as well as salary cap costs, I guess allowing for a bit of draft capital carryover from year to year. For example Lawrence might go for 3200, Wilson for 3000 and Paye for 1050. I guess the more draft capital spent on the player should be reflected in his salary with a threshold for 5th year options. The dark web

10 hours ago, NCTANK said:

i had it right before Christmas. it wasn’t any fun but i’ve had worse bouts of the regular flu. i ate a few zinc gummies and took my EmergenC daily. you got this brother 👍

Thanks, I actually feel just like I have a mild cold. I even went for a run on Wed. I'm guessing the vaccine at least lessened the symptoms. 

9 hours ago, DeathByEagle said:

I am in the pharmaceutical field. Its actually normal that you get symptoms a day or two after the shot. It normally only lasts 24 to 48 hours. Your doctor is correct. The vaccine is not meant to prevent you from getting Covid. You can still get it and carry it and give it to others. It lessons the severity of the virus and to keep it simple, prevents you from kicking the bucket. 

But your symptoms are normal after getting the shot. It will past in a day or so. 

The 2nd shot was March 13th. 

8 hours ago, eagle45 said:

@greend hang in there.  Even if you didn't hit that 2 week post-vaccine point, it really should kick in your favor to prevent the worst of it.

Thanks and it seem that you are correct so far.

6 hours ago, BigEFly said:

Be safe.  CDC guidelines suggest even though you have the virus, only about a 3% chance you can pass it. If asymptomatic would seem with a mask you could still do your hog hunt.  

Thanks but so far the outfitter says no. 

13 hours ago, Original Sin said:

I would take Marshall over Bateman 

Missed it by that much ... 2” and 20 lbs, kinda BS

12 hours ago, austinfan said:

He wasn't defending Howie, he was defending the personnel group - the scouts were making good evaluations - that's what he meant by identifying the right players.

Just because you get lucky one year with your picks, doesn't mean your personnel group are doing a good job if they're mis-evaluating the majority of top players.

You should go back and review their evaluations of all the players (not just the ones you picked) against how those players eventually turned out as a check.

For example, there are five QBs at the top of this draft, if the scouts say correctly evaluate 4 of the 5, they're doing a good job (even the best group will have misses). If they only identity two hits/misses and are totally wrong on the other three, you're not going to feel comfortable drafting a QB in the future.

So obviously somebody is messing up. You cited a draft performance evaluation I think  done by PFF that rated our drafts as 30th while draft capital came in at 26th so not even average. Should come in at least at 22 if they were good. Gotta do a better job there. Maybe 3 more hits instead of misses like Sidney " toothpick leg " Jones, paltry Pumphrey and Omar Sharif Miller is the difference. Splash trade up for Wentz then the career changing injury, the best laid plans 

1 hour ago, greend said:

Thanks but so far the outfitter says no. 

You doin it the right way with dogs and knives 😬

8 hours ago, garingovt2000 said:

Both those times would have been 1st place times in 2020 draft

Yep , said it before  , he along with McNeil are 2 of my fav defensive players

he has the size and movement skills 

41 minutes ago, The guy in France said:

You doin it the right way with dogs and knives 😬

Most likely not at all

Sewell pro day today. Will he run a 4.39?

 4.8s

12 hours ago, Alphagrand said:

The hierarchy for solo male artist (rock music) flows:

Billy Joel > David Bowie > Elton John > Rod Stewart > Tom Petty > Bob Seger > Jackson Browne > Bruce Springsteen > John Mellencamp ..... the rest .... although I’m sure I’m forgetting some in there 

Nice list. You forgot Warren Zevon.

Not so high on Elton and Rod myself (even though I'm British!), I'd have Bowie/Bruce 1a and 1b, followed by Petty/Browne/Seger.

Not sure if Tom Waits also fits into that 'rock music' category (he might be in a category of one!) but he's my GOAT singer/songwriter.

Bowie , Bruce and Joel , not a fan of even a little 

13 hours ago, Alphagrand said:

The hierarchy for solo male artist (rock music) flows:

Billy Joel > David Bowie > Elton John > Rod Stewart > Tom Petty > Bob Seger > Jackson Browne > Bruce Springsteen > John Mellencamp ..... the rest .... although I’m sure I’m forgetting some in there 

 

2 minutes ago, Couch Potato said:

Nice list. You forgot Warren Zevon.

Not so high on Elton and Rod myself (even though I'm British!), I'd have Bowie/Bruce 1a and 1b, followed by Petty/Browne/Seger.

Not sure if Tom Waits also fits into that 'rock music' category (he might be in a category of one!) but he's my GOAT singer/songwriter.

Can’t have this discussion if Boz Scaggs isn’t included.  And, regardless of the operatic drama of the music,  gotta put Meat Loaf in any top 10.

10 hours ago, TEW said:

The owner literally has the final say on everything. By your own standard, Lurie is 100% to blame for literally everything.

You can say the GM has the final say, except we all know that's not how it works. AR had "final say" on all personnel matters. Yet when he wanted to sign Vick, he had to go to Lurie for permission. So imagine relative equals like a GM and coach and how their relationship works.

As far as the vision, that's exactly the point -- the "vision" over the last few years was Doug's. He was the one lobbying for a short term approach. He wanted veterans re-signed to help in this cause, which is something you're placing on Howie. The vision changed after several years of this vision failing and the coach being unwilling to change vision. Again, Lurie said as much in his press conference.

So let's be a little more realistic here. The owner, coaches and GM get together and come up with a plan. If the head coach says Alshon Jeffery is absolutely essential to his plans to win a super bowl, then the GM is going to go out and execute on that imperative. If the coach says he has to have a deep threat opposite of him, then the GM is going to bring in someone like Desean and Reagor to fulfill that function. If the OL coach wants crazy athletes, then the GM is going to bring in someone like Lane Johnson or Jordan Mailata. If the DL coach wants shorter guys who are good against the run, then the GM gets someone like Barnett. Coaches have a vision of their own, preferences, demands, systems, schemes, etc. and the GM has to factor all of this into his choices. He can't just say, "to hell with the coaches, what they're telling me they need and want, I think this guy is better." THAT would be a dysfunctional vision.

 

The coaches should have inputs to the players they want.  Most GMs are not football person.  This is where the scouts come in.  Coaches want a certain type of player, scouts identify those players (coaches would also know certain players), GM executes and acquires the players.  Often the roles of scouts are not getting enough credits in the process.  GM can easily override the scouts or takes the credit of building the roster.  GM should and must take the blame if things do not work out.

1 hour ago, The guy in France said:

So obviously somebody is messing up. You cited a draft performance evaluation I think  done by PFF that rated our drafts as 30th while draft capital came in at 26th so not even average. Should come in at least at 22 if they were good. Gotta do a better job there. Maybe 3 more hits instead of misses like Sidney " toothpick leg " Jones, paltry Pumphrey and Omar Sharif Miller is the difference. Splash trade up for Wentz then the career changing injury, the best laid plans 

Actually on a small sample like that, the variance means that we could be above or below average drafting. Say Mailata becomes an pro bowl OT in two years, we'd suddenly be above average. There's so much noise in draft picks (was Dillard a good or bad pick, a torn bicep is a bit unpredictable).