11 minutes ago, HazletonEagle said:

yes... FAR too many people do not allow for a reasonable middle ground. They see you as either 100% with them, or call you a racist. There is no room for any other opinion but the one they protest, and riot for. No matter how closely your views align with theirs, if youre just 99% with them, youre an enemy under attack. And that is completely unreasonable. 

The Saints all need to watch Dr Z talk about the moral foundation theory. And then the rest of the country should too.

When you cant say that you 100% support their message but disagree with the riots,  you will be attacked. That cant be. The world cant change when people are like that. When you say you agree with Kaep that we need work on equality but feel that his method of prostesting was disrespectful, you will be attacked and called racist. That cant be.  Change cant happen that way. 

You mean, like when you say I'm wrong because I don't think kneeling during the anthem is disrespectful?  Where is your reasonable middle ground?  Is "wrong" your middle ground?

52 minutes ago, Utebird said:

So the " majority" of his teammates that are speaking out against Brees are unreasonable  but the one guy that doesnt is reasonable?

That makes sense😒

Couple of issues that I have with what is going on right now and I think the Brees deal of what is going on here ties into that. 

This whole movement of if you are white that you should shut up and beg for forgiveness and repent for your white privilege is straight out of some Orwellian order and it's not something that I am okay with doing. I don't think lumping an entire race of people into one hole and pre-judging that they are inherently or systematically flawed is a solution to anything. The same way that I don't lump all Blacks, Asians, Mexicans, etc into one bucket. 

This needs to be assessed on an individual basis and there would be a greater outcome if people focused on themselves and not an entire race of what they can do better to educate themselves and enact better practices.  

There are 330 million people in this country. Lots of smart, progressive, understanding, rational, and intellectual individuals of all races and backgrounds. And then there are those that will argue with you that 2+2=5 until the sun goes down. I don't associate myself with the latter. So I don't need someone lumping me into that category when they do not know me personally, my values, my practices, or my beliefs. 

Brees seems like a smart guy and has done a ton for his community. I don't think he's some closeted racist with a KKK hoodie hanging up in his closet at home. I don't think he got off on euphoria watching what happened to Floyd. His opinion on the anthem is his opinion and what it means to him. It doesn't mean he's against social justice. It doesn't mean that he's a racist. It doesn't mean that he suffers from "white privilege". It means that he has a different opinion on the matter than others do. 

@BigEFly cut off the top of elephant garlic, dowse with EVO,  roast for 40 minutes ar 400,,then combine with mascarpone cheese and smear on good black bread.

heaven!

39 minutes ago, dawkbleedsgreen said:

 

@Utebird Agree, thanks for speaking up.

@Diehardfan I really don't like to get political on this forum and I don't have anything against you personally, but please just think twice before posting stuff like that. I also implore you to do a bit more learning -- this video would be a good start https://www.instagram.com/tv/CA-S25nCFn2/?igshid=cha8v1pkpv96 and better explains the life experience of many African Americans, and especially many black players in the NFL. I'm really sorry if you don't have an Instagram (I couldn't manage to find this video elsewhere), but I'm hopeful this could give you a different perspective on that "white privilege" that other minorities like myself frequently experience and why I think it would be helpful to condemn the kind of rhetoric that Drew Brees is putting out there. He's supposed to be a role model after all.

Hope this doesn't offend any of ya'll -- we're all one family in Eagle nation (and this country) and I truly believe that.

Appreciate the reply. When I get home I'll take time to watch it and appreciate the link.

Just now, Utebird said:

I agree its not a black and white issue, pun intended their is a lot of grey area and right now i think is not a time to point to the grey areas i think its time to listen and those who feel misunderstood marginalized victimized or violated need to be heard.

Drew brees isnt hearing, he isnt listening, hes talking.

I agree with that.

The other day my mom posted on facebook a meme that was reminding not all police are bad. It didnt support the officers that murdered Floyd. And it didnt say he was a criminal. Nothing specific about that incident. At the time of her post 3 police stations were burned and at least 1 cruiser destroyed. Since then, countless more crimes against law enforcement. No doubt a timely reminder.

Personally I wouldnt have done it. I dont post that stuff on facebook. I hardly post anything at all. Part of me says, that wasnt a super smart thing to post right now. Another bigger part of me says, she should be allowed to and it doesnt make her a bad or immoral person.

But the very first reply from a cousin who is black was half nice, but kinda half not nice basically calling her naive. My sister piled on and said something about police murdering black people. My aunt who is a retired state police took exception. It was so much craziness from an innocent post which honestly was an important message as you begin to look at the long list of attacks on police that have happened since.

Yeah, maybe she should let them have the floor to themselves right now. Maybe.... But if they let a very neutral post just get buried with everything else on facebook itd have been a much more brief and relatively unnoticed distraction. It was not a post that needed to be beaten down. It said nothing against what their message is. Arguing on the extremes and painting her in to a corner only creates more division. Not only that, but if they didnt just assume it was in defense of those police and asked her opinion theyd find she fully stands with them on their issue. It was all completely needless. 

Lastly, and most importantly, maybe if they are empathetic enough they can consider which issues hit closest to home for her. She may completely support the message of racial equality. 100% but as a non-black woman who never was and never will be black, who had a father in law, brother, and sister in law with careers in state police and military the safety of police in times like this are at the forefront of her mind while watching riots break out. Thats her life experience. Its completely reasonable for her to have that order of priority in her life to worry about police right now, and it should not cause her to be seen as a detractor to their cause. 

15 minutes ago, WentzFan11 said:

No way? People don't like when you take the middle ground on the question: Are you racist?

thats not really ever the question. Thats the accusation. Your post is exactly the kind of harmful dialogue that contributes nothing to the cause of racial equality. Its counter-productive. 

14 minutes ago, MediterraneanDiet said:

he's getting hammered because he is saying kneeling is disrespecting the flag, country, heritage, freedom.  Two points: the kneeling isn't intended to disrespect any of the above but is intended to symbolize acknowledging inequality, racism, and the brutal outcomes of them.  Secondly, just like Brees's grandfather's served, so too did most of his teammates grandfather's, uncles, etc.  It's not unique.  But his tone is one of -I sing the athem and place my hand over my heart to honor my families sacrifices and if you kneel you dishonor the sacrifices of your family, the flag, the countey, heritage and freedom.   Its so pathetically arrogant and disingenuous.

I took it to mean during the anthem. Why would it be taken to be about kneeling in the street?

1 minute ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Take the political and racial bickering to CVON.  There’s plenty there.    

The discussion is quite a bit better in here. CVON is nothing but the worst of the worst when it comes to political "discussion". Its nothing but trying to create "gotcha" moments, proving you are smarter than the other guy, quickly putting each other in to a box labeled with some stupid political term that they think is a clever insult like "trump bot" which they say at least 5000 times a day. Etc.. I can go on and on.

You really cant have a discussion there. A true discussion has never been had in CVON.

14 minutes ago, BDawk_ASamuel said:

Couple of issues that I have with what is going on right now and I think the Brees deal of what is going on here ties into that. 

This whole movement of if you are white that you should shut up and beg for forgiveness and repent for your white privilege is straight out of some Orwellian order and it's not something that I am okay with doing. I don't think lumping an entire race of people into one hole and pre-judging that they are inherently or systematically flawed is a solution to anything. The same way that I don't lump all Blacks, Asians, Mexicans, etc into one bucket. 

This needs to be assessed on an individual basis and there would be a greater outcome if people focused on themselves and not an entire race of what they can do better to educate themselves and enact better practices.  

There are 330 million people in this country. Lots of smart, progressive, understanding, rational, and intellectual individuals of all races and backgrounds. And then there are those that will argue with you that 2+2=5 until the sun goes down. I don't associate myself with the latter. So I don't need someone lumping me into that category when they do not know me personally, my values, my practices, or my beliefs. 

Brees seems like a smart guy and has done a ton for his community. I don't think he's some closeted racist with a KKK hoodie hanging up in his closet at home. I don't think he got off on euphoria watching what happened to Floyd. His opinion on the anthem is his opinion and what it means to him. It doesn't mean he's against social injustice. It doesn't mean that he's a racist. It doesn't mean that he suffers from "white privilege". It means that he has a different opinion on the matter than others do. 

Honestly this kind of goes back and touched on a little earlier on here where some people use white privilege in a way that does more harm then it is helpful cause they use it to be belittling or make a white person feel bad about being white. That’s not what you are supposed to do to when talking about it. Use it in a way to enlighten someone on it or show you them what they can’t see in their avenue of life. But there’s a small minority that uses it in the wrong way 

1 minute ago, HazletonEagle said:

The discussion is quite a bit better in here. CVON is nothing but the worst of the worst when it comes to political "discussion". Its nothing but trying to create "gotcha" moments, proving you are smarter than the other guy, quickly putting each other in to a box labeled with some stupid political term that they think is a clever insult like "trump bot" which they say at least 5000 times a day. Etc.. I can go on and on.

You really cant have a discussion there. A true discussion has never been had in CVON.

I’ve had them. Just ignore the people with drive by comments.

6 minutes ago, Diehardfan said:

I took it to mean during the anthem. Why would it be taken to be about kneeling in the street?

I did too.  Where do you get the street from?

14 minutes ago, MediterraneanDiet said:

You mean, like when you say I'm wrong because I don't think kneeling during the anthem is disrespectful?  Where is your reasonable middle ground?  Is "wrong" your middle ground?

When the roles are reversed and someone says or does something deemed to be racist even if it was never meant to or never should have been taken that way, the perp is expected to issue an apology and often has their livelihood ruined. Just because someone said they are insulted. And again, the perp is expected to apologize. And often has to.

So in the case of Kaepernick its extremely hypocritical for him to have done this. Millions of people are insulted because they took it as an attack on the military, flag, and country. And he never apologized for having potentially, even unintentionally hurting anyone. Nor have any of his supporters ever admitted that maybe he should. Or even that maybe he did insult anyone. All you kneelers or kneel supporters have ever done was pretend that its not true that he insulted anyone, and state it was never about the flag or military even though millions will always say that they felt it that way.

Hypocritical. And wrong.

4 minutes ago, HazletonEagle said:

The discussion is quite a bit better in here. CVON is nothing but the worst of the worst when it comes to political "discussion". Its nothing but trying to create "gotcha" moments, proving you are smarter than the other guy, quickly putting each other in to a box labeled with some stupid political term that they think is a clever insult like "trump bot" which they say at least 5000 times a day. Etc.. I can go on and on.

You really cant have a discussion there. A true discussion has never been had in CVON.

I popped in there for a bit out of curiosity. It’s an absolute cesspool. 

1 hour ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Honestly i can’t stand Tom cruise but major props as les grossman. He nailed it. 

Exactly.

I HATE him.

But, THAT, was absolute gold!!!!

1 hour ago, bpac55 said:

Is this where they hunt Ice-T?

No, suspense mystery thriller about a rich guy getting probably the greatest and craziest bday present ever.

It's absolutely awesome.

2 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

I popped in there for a bit out of curiosity. It’s an absolute cesspool. 

yeah. the sad thing is I know next to nothing about politics and even the most basic political terms are right over my head but I have completely demolished them in debates a few times even with that disadvantage. Theyre dumb and easy to F with. Fall for every trap. Even so, I dont find it entertaining to be in there. To enjoy that style of posting day after day really requires you to be a genuine D.

16 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Heck of lot easier to season cast iron then a mortar and pestle.  Cast iron you just bake in the oven with oil.  Mortar and Pestle you have to grind rice and water in it over and over until it’s smooth and the crevices are filled.   

Yes, but once you’ve done that you have a great tool, No one who uses spices seriously goes without one. Crush your spices in it, bloom them, and you’re a kitchen god,.

22 minutes ago, HazletonEagle said:

thats not really ever the question. Thats the accusation. Your post is exactly the kind of harmful dialogue that contributes nothing to the cause of racial equality. Its counter-productive. 

No, it's not an accusation. If you're okay with cops killing unarmed POC and you can't separate the protests going on with the looting and riots then you are a racist. There's no discussion to be had.

Bwahahahahaha. 

Probably not that funny if you haven’t seen Happy Gilmore. 

By the way, I read something today about singer Halsey being half black/white. I never knew that. I guess she received criticism from the black community for never speaking out on issues to support her black heritage. 

She said she is white skinned and does not suffer from the same injustices based on her skin color and can not really fully understand those experiences that people have had to endure. 

Then she said she feels black though she has white skin and having white skin is something that she "came to terms with" and accepted as part of her. And was confused when she was younger whether she should like TLC or Brittany. 

Ummm... that is a completely racist statement to make. Why cant she like both? Why does she have to like one that she sees as the same race as her? Or choose the one with the same skin color? 

This is the type of racism that black people are raised with. Sorry... but its true. It goes both ways. They are racist too. 

No one will ever make big deal about her statement because white people wont complain about it. Its ok for her to say something racist as long as she is speaking as a (half) black woman. That is also a problem that needs to be addressed. But wont. Because we would be racist to bring that up and make a big deal of it. 

7 minutes ago, WentzFan11 said:

No, it's not an accusation. If you're okay with cops killing unarmed POC and you can't separate the protests going on with the looting and riots then you are a racist. There's no discussion to be had.

This again is another example of the worst kind of dialogue that is completely counterproductive to the cause of the peaceful protesters. Your posts do belong in CVON. They are complete trash that make it impossible to move forward with any meaningful discussion.

30 minutes ago, BDawk_ASamuel said:

Couple of issues that I have with what is going on right now and I think the Brees deal of what is going on here ties into that. 

This whole movement of if you are white that you should shut up and beg for forgiveness and repent for your white privilege is straight out of some Orwellian order and it's not something that I am okay with doing. I don't think lumping an entire race of people into one hole and pre-judging that they are inherently or systematically flawed is a solution to anything. The same way that I don't lump all Blacks, Asians, Mexicans, etc into one bucket. 

This needs to be assessed on an individual basis and there would be a greater outcome if people focused on themselves and not an entire race of what they can do better to educate themselves and enact better practices.  

There are 330 million people in this country. Lots of smart, progressive, understanding, rational, and intellectual individuals of all races and backgrounds. And then there are those that will argue with you that 2+2=5 until the sun goes down. I don't associate myself with the latter. So I don't need someone lumping me into that category when they do not know me personally, my values, my practices, or my beliefs. 

Brees seems like a smart guy and has done a ton for his community. I don't think he's some closeted racist with a KKK hoodie hanging up in his closet at home. I don't think he got off on euphoria watching what happened to Floyd. His opinion on the anthem is his opinion and what it means to him. It doesn't mean he's against social justice. It doesn't mean that he's a racist. It doesn't mean that he suffers from "white privilege". It means that he has a different opinion on the matter than others do. 

If one is  white one automatically benefits from white privilege whether one wants to or not. Its a social construct with 1000s of years of reinforced ideals. Simply saying i choose not to benefit from my whiteness isnt up to an individual, its inevitable.

The fact that people cant see that or realize that is the problem.

One can choose to not purposefully exploit ones "whiteness" for ones own benefit but that doesnt exclude one from the inherent benefits that will ensue from being a white male.

6 minutes ago, HazletonEagle said:

By the way, I read something today about singer Halsey being half black/white. I never knew that. I guess she received criticism from the black community for never speaking out on issues to support her black heritage. 

She said she is white skinned and does not suffer from the same injustices based on her skin color and can not really fully understand those experiences that people have had to endure. 

Then she said having white skin is something that she "came to terms with" and accepted as part of her. And was confused when she was younger whether she should like TLC or Brittany. 

Ummm... that is a completely racist statement to make. Why cant she like both? Why does she have to like one that she sees as the same race as her? Or choose the one with the same skin color? 

This is the type of racism that black people are raised with. Sorry... but its true. It goes both ways. They are racist too. 

No one will ever make big deal about her statement because white people wont complain about it. Its ok for her to say something racist as long as she is speaking as a (half) black woman. That is also a problem that needs to be addressed. But wont. Because we would be racist to bring that up and make a big deal of it. 

POC are taught that they are "less than" growing up, and you're confused why someone who is half white and half black was having an internal struggle?

36 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Take the political and racial bickering to CVON.  There’s plenty there.    

You exhibited restraint for a time, but then you just couldn’t help yourself.

Ive never agreed with the anthem kneeling.  Many of these guys are millionaires, many of them have huge platforms, they dont need to go to their place of work and send political messages and attract attention to themselves during the national anthem.  It's counter to the standards literally every normal person is held to every day and it's counter to the idea of teamwork and comeraderie. 

And now there's an insane double standard that's out of control because of social media and this cancel culture that's ruining free speech. 

Vic Fangio had to apologize for saying that he didn't think there was racism in football.  What??? That demands an apology?   Does that mean if he said the opposite, like "Racism is rampant and utterly ubiquitous throughout all levels of football" that he'd be given a promotion??

Now Drew Brees saying he doesn't support the kneeling and it's open season, because we all must think alike. If Drew Brees never does a single racist thing in his entire life, he's still the enemy because he didn't fall in line and protest hard enough for some guys who probably use the N word every day of their lives, or call other black men uncle tom, or who have openly said racist things about white people or asians or whatever.

And I hate Brees, f these guys for making me defend him

I know many of the players and Lurie have commented, but please just keep this ish away from the last vestiges of an outlet from society that exists right now

1 minute ago, WentzFan11 said:

POC are taught that they are "less than" growing up, and you're confusing why someone who is half white and half black was having an internal struggle?

Im confused why she should think she should like TLC if she is black, or like Brittany if she is white. Thats racist.